How would you make Skull Face a better main baddy?

How would you make Skull Face a better main baddy?

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You don't. You remove him and make Zero the main baddy.

More screentime. Even just turning some tapes into cutscenes would be nice
Actual conversations between him and Venom instead of awkward car rides

Give him some screen time and actually have him fucking do something.

>actually have him fucking do something

This.

/thread

He did a really good owl impression

B-b-b-but muh language

give him a boss fight

And not kill him off like a little bitch at the end.

That's precisely the point, there's no boss fight, and you don't even kill him, you just finish him off.
Revenge is never satisfying.

Make him predictable and basically a very evil dude who does evil things to be evil, basically, give him the Call of Duty treatment, that's what the MGS fanbase deep inside wants.
Then again, I think the MGS fanbase isn't intelligent enough to understand even a Call of Duty campaign without discussing it for months.

You show the players why he was basically the cleaner and second choice to Big Boss during mgs3

They talk about him doing that shit, but never see why, we only see him walk around and shit.

Also hes the only villain in the series to not get a boss battle. Why not have him fight Venom, then make him his bitch, then we fight him again later.

Huey was the main bad guy.

>Revenge is never satisfying.
So does MGSV.

Then MGSV has fullfilled it's purpose.
You got a revenge story, enjoy.

You mean a well written villain or something that people in Sup Forums would like?
Because if you unironically like any MGS entry it's obvious you don't care about good writing.

Yeah, it's filled it's purpose of being shit and forgettable I guess.

Kojima?

Don't worry, you will automatically praise it as a post-modern masterpiece the moment Death Stranding comes out.
People here actually defend MGS2, so you will all obviously love MGSV in the matter of time.

So you wanted a satisfying revenge where you murder all the buddies yourself and own the world?
You should play Mafia 3.

He did do something.
He almost had the world by the balls.
But you stopped him.

>boss face
>skull boss
>boss skull

>Hiring Zero's voice actor
>Not even rendering a model

I mean how can they keep blueballing us from seeing Zero again?

It's so sad that this scene was relegated to an audio tape.

youtube.com/watch?v=bmboNvsF9YA

>Hiring Zero's voice actor
They hired some literally who.

>I mean how can they keep blueballing us from seeing Zero again?
And show it when?
Zero has been a vegetable for about 7 years by the time TPP happens.

I would have cut out that directly.
Zero should have stayed in the background.

Venom didn't care about Quiet.

I will point out this fact in every single mg/s thread until all mg/s discussion dies.

>You don't. You remove him and make Zero the main baddy.

Not quite. Keep him as a minor antagonist and make Zero the main baddie. Have him work for Zero, actually. And, for fucks sake, give us a bossfight against him.

It's one of the cardinal sins of game design to build up an antagonist and never let the player fight him. It just doesn't work. Even if you think you're making a point with it, don't. The only time that ever worked was the first Bioshock.

remove him entirely from the game and have him be a faceless myth

Really speaks to people's idiocy when they compare MGS2 and MGSV in this regard.

Give him a better squad than the Skulls, give him a boss fight with a western gimmick that doesn't reuse Ocelot's gun spinning (maybe a horseback gun fight), make it clear all the evil shit he did so that beating him is cathartic.

Liked everything else about the game, but Skullface's big moments were all kinda anticlimatic (and as a result all the characters related to him such as Man on fire). Maybe that was the point, especially since Venom maybe wasn't completely aware of everything Skullface did.

Honestly Skullface should have been another operative so you can see hints of him following you around as he supposedly did (make frogs his calling card that'd be a nice throwback) then he knocks off a random Volgin esque character who thought the language virus was just another chemical weapon to take over his army near the end.

Have him act like he did in Ground Zeroes
By giving him more screen time, removing the weird mask, and making him do fucked up shit.
(Reminder that he had Paz raped while Chico watched, and later made Chico rape her)

Make his goal and into something understandable and a relatable threat, instead of abstract and conceptual like "destroying a language".
Make his motivations not childish and stupid.

>inb4 but revenge IS childish and stupid, zomg 2deep4u

Or this.
It just kind of took the fart out of everything that Zero and Snake were actually on such friendly terms all along.

He really just needed more screen time. You hear so much about what he's doing through word of mouth via the game, but you never see it.

The cutscenes where he introduces the skulls and the metal gear is so fucking good.

youtu.be/9tDHN-mspbM?t=127

do you mean this one? It's probably one of the best scenes in the game imo. But as a whole the game has so many great singular cutscenes that I wish went on for another 10 minutes.

Yeah this one. I love how unafraid or unimpressed skullface is of snake, metal gear has this cheesy habit of making the villains jerk snake off and talk about how big of a tough guy he is, skullface never does this. That and the actual encounter with the skulls going around killing soviets makes this cutscenes so fucking great.

>i'll see you in hell, "Boss"

did skullface know that he wasn't snake? or was he mocking him because he just got the upper hand on him?

Nah, Skull Face died thinking Venom was the real BB. He's just being a sneery jagoff.

>the bad guys main objective was to sell nukes to everyone and have a magic mineral dissolve them whenever he wanted
>also use a magic parasite to stop the english language by killing anyone who spoke it

Skull Face shouldn't have been the main villain, he should have been an early Boss, only responsible for carrying out Zero's order to destroy Motherbase. Zero should have been the main villain, Kojima was too pussy to do it though.

Certaintly don't ask Metal Gear fans, they wouldn't know good writing even if you trained them for their whole life

>game wasn't Venom, Chico, Ocelot, Kaz, Huey, Eli, and Skullface hunting down Cipher/Big Boss and devolving into inner conspiracy against each other

Show don't tell.
Hearing Kaz talk about Skullface in the tapes doesn't give a good motivation to kill him.
It doesn't help that a lot of the plans are revealed on tapes AFTER you kill Skullface.

Before you attack OKB0 Skully had like two actual scenes: GZ and WHOOOO.

>Show don't tell.
Kojima really stuggles with this part.

He does, but he was better at it before MGSV.
The exposition dumps had a better framing before. Tapes just don't cut it.

Give him more screen time. Everything in MGS5 can be fixed if you just make the game longer.

>these people are allowed to play MGS
Now I'm just sad

Remove his hamburglar mask

He looks so much better without his gay little mask. His mask made me think about him taking it up the butt the whole time I saw him. It ruined everything.

It actually would have been satisfying if there was a boss battle, though.

And if also if he fleshed out some more so we gave a shit about whatever he was doing. Compared to MGS4's Liquid-Ocelot, Skull Face was meh in every way.

Him saying he was in MGS3 pissed me off. I was like "Oh so you aren't going to ruin just this game? You have to ruin the others as well?". The feeling of isolation and everything being up to Snake becomes hollow when some burns victim and his friends are supposedly behind you the whole time. It felt like they forced that part of his character to try and build him up.

>skullface never does this.

Neither did Liquid Ocelot or Solidus, Mr. Fanboy. One beats the crap out of Solid and leaves him for dead. The other treats Raiden like the child solider he used to be.

God damn, say what you will about the writing of the character but James Horan's voice is pure sex.

Why did he wear the mask anyway? What was the in-universe reason and what was the WHOAH META reason?

they should have made him a boss fight

all the boss fights in mgs5 are fucking stupid trash. It's stupid the most memory boss is a little kid.

A LANGUAGE OF NUKES

memorably*

The mask was to hide the effect of the parasites, basically he didn't want anyone to know he was a carrier.

more screen time in combination with more edginess of the ground zero tone

The mask was just there to make him feel more mysterious. I thought it was a cute touch. If you want some meta, here you go
cowboy hat and boots = ocelot
jacket = kaz (literally the same jacket, different color)
horn mark on the head = big boss

>all the boss fights are trash
>so add another one

Give us an actual reason to want to take him down and put that event in the same game, not in a prologue that comes out a year before the full game.

Well, don't make him look like Zorro.
Fucking Kojima

yeah one that isn't just fighting and hiding from metal gear again.

or running away from volgin

That's probably not actually the reason. I'd bet dollars for donuts that Kojima added it for no reason at all.

It made him look stupid. Also they made him fucking goofy in general after GZ, where he was much more of a monster.

I didn't dislike tpp entirely but the tone shift from gz to tpp is so fucking jarring, and it's probably due to all the missing content. The whole second chapter of the game is just grinding for cutscenes

>Give us an actual reason to want to take him down and put that event in the same game, not in a prologue that comes out a year before the full game.

To be honest that would kind of defeat the whole theme of the game: Revenge is hollow.

Kaz talks about "I'm going to make them give back our past!", but there is nothing to get back, what's lost is lost. He'll never get his arm or leg back, Miller desperately wants his payback to be glorious, but reality doesn't really give a shit about how you want your tale of revenge to play out. Which is also why Huey is ultimately the one to finish Skullface off.

The Phantom Pain is a deglamorization of revenge.

What are all the boss fights in MGSV? There weren't that many.
>Quiet
>Skulls
>Sahelantropus
>...

punished chico was supposed to be a boss but was cut during pre-production
there was also supposed to be a second metal gear battle that was also cut

>bait and switch protagonist
>divided community on release
>rushed development
>removed content
uuuuh

So those three bosses are all there is.

You know absolutely 0 about what chico was supposed to be. stop assuming

I guess you could argue that sniper skulls could be considered a boss fight, the devs certainly think so, but as a sane person yeah that's all there is
His unused concept art is in the latest artbook

>sniper skulls
wut?
You can just walk around them.

>i have too many options

That doesn't mean they aren't a boss fight.

>implying boss fights aren't part of Metal Gear

why? is it too video gamey for you?

The original guide book has some commentary on the development and apparently they thought of every skulls encounter as a boss fight that you could choose to engage in or not.
I like the idea on principle, it's like the original deus ex boss fights, but it would have worked a lot better if every skulls encounter wasn't the same exact thing except for the snipers one which is really just 4 dumber quiets in a different arena

Because nobody cared who he was before.
Pottery.

Have him kill someone close to the main character, someone we actually k ow instead of a big number of soldiers we don't know like in GZ. Give him a proper boss fight. Let him taunt the player a bit and make him more intimidating.

Also it completely ruins the twist at the end. Big Boss says "you're Big Boss too" after the game literally told you that he didn't accomplish shit.

underrated post

IRL that's fucking bullshit though

That's the whole point of the fucking character. Big boss is a legend that's been so blown out of proportion, did you not play mgs 1 or 4? All of the snakes are dudes that have been turned into super heroes in the military world.

MGS fans are so overly attached to a character that they'll forget major fucking themes of the games they put on a pedestal. It never goes into detail about how XoF helped snake or whether they took any of his thunder. All it says is they gave covert assistance, that could be literally anything.

No, it's not. If someone murders your mom, and goes to jail for the rest of his life, or gets the chair or whatever, at the end of the day your mom is still gone. You still have to deal with what you're missing and it's always gonna affect you and mold you.

And considering how a lot of Sup Forums clings onto the past so heavily when it comes to something as stupid as a video game, I would wager actual trauma of that nature would be something they would never be able to overcome.

Biggest problem with this concept is snake has been dealing with this stuff since mgs3 and earlier, and venom wasn't differentiated enough as a new guy for it to have any impact. Basically this game would've been better if it wasn't an mgs game, or had just been a straight up spin off

I'm going to reemphasize my idea (if they wanted to go the route of someone following the player in MGS3) that the frogs you collect should have been their calling card.

Honestly it shouldn't have even been Skullface, Skullface could still be built up and remain as the main threat but turn out to be a bitch later (though I still like the idea of a horseback boss fight). His motive for destroying languages is enough, you don't need to make him Snakes rival or whatever too, just make him the Volgin

Snakes rival (who leaves frogs all over the place) maybe they have control over animals, like Aquaman on land? You're in a fairly boring boss battle on even footing when outta nowhere BEARS

Idk I still like the game but they gave Skullface way too much backstory for the minimal part he played. If that was the point it was a bad one and could have been fulfilled just as well by having a henchman in the background that takes over when Skullface goes down so it's not just "wait your boss is dead why are you guys still here". Or just give Zero a bigger part in the story Idk.

(Also Eli and fireman were kinda boss fights)

Skull Face should have been a Villian like what we saw in GZ, actually menacing and doing evil things we actually see. Too much of MGSV was preparing to fight an enemy we saw so little of.

We should have been fighting in an increasingly dirty covert war against Skull Face, forcing Venoms to do more and more morally ambiguous things to keep fighting, make them sink to Skull Faces level and actually become a demon. The methods needed to defeat Skull Face should have been so extreme that Venom became ireedible in the process. You should have engaged in torture sessions on skull face's people just as bad as what they did to people in GZ. Maybe it would have been too extreme to actually put in a game and still let it sell, but Venom should have actually used child soldiers to help fight Skull Face, as a turning point into officially going too far.

V was advertised as a fall from grace and "going even deeper", but Venom felt like a generic video game altruist.

I liked that Zero only featured in the final tapes. It was a nice reward
give him better lines

No, you're still wrong. Vengeance literally is a great feeling. It won't always bring back the past, but it sure feels like closing the page on a book and enables you to move on.

Make him Moonwalk from time to time.

and I'm sure that you, a poster in a malaysian tapestry gazing picture board, have a lot of experience in revenge over murders and torture.

He's not the main baddy. Its relatively clear that his early is what leads to the real conflict, the internal problems of DD and how the risk of missing strain starts to move them to the totalitarian control they wished to avoid.

hoo

Does Mafia 3 confirm whether Joe survived Mafia 2 or not?

we're talking about the feeling of revenge, not the act of it. i have not murdered anybody. if you feel like thinking "i bet this guy is just talking out of his ass and being edgy" then i can't stop you.

You need a reality check. Good intentions, imagined or otherwise, do not make up for poor execution. Everyone knows that "The reality is no match for the legend" was a theme of the games ever since Solid Snake said it to Meryl in MGS1. That doesn't make Skull Face any less of a poorly fleshed out villain. It doesn't excuse the lore rape of shoehorning Skull Face into MGS3 (Did he come in on his own rocket too?). It doesn't win points for falling flat.

The only thing Skull Face does in MGS3 is collect those stupid, stupid parasites, which the series would have been better off without as well. Everything about Skull Face being there cheapens the series in one way or another.

you are talking out of your ass, these people are crippled and all sorts of fucked up, mentally and phisically, what the fuck do you know?

That event was in the game, via a flashback after you rescue kaz

Plus i'm not sure what you're trying to prove with that image since in both GZ and TPP you watch your entire base get detroyed, your men slaughtered, paz gets blown up, miller loses half his body, chico dies and you wind up with a chunk of rock in your face. i think that's enough to hate him.

I wouldn't, I'd just make Act III about Para-Medic and her merry band of troops tracking down Eli so you have to compete with them instead.