Can someone explain to me how exactly this is bad for dota 2? Like isnt having more choices for your character better?

Can someone explain to me how exactly this is bad for dota 2? Like isnt having more choices for your character better?

Just more reasons for the community to report you for playing within the meta.

they're just mad because it's different

Haven't touched dota 2 for a full year now, the hell is this?

Also is it true that icefrog is leaving?

It's becoming HotS, they have wells now too
/d2g/ defends it because of Stockholm syndrome mixed with some cognitive dissonance

It looks like it makes the heroes too strong at each milestone. I imagine playing a solo lane or having a support like Lich backing you up is going to make you a lot more powerful than the enemy very rapidly.

That is just a guess though. I have not played dota in two years.

But...what is actually wrong with those things?

Its too unbalanced, not for individual heroes but some heroes clearly got better talents than others.

Too focused on stat buffs from 10-20, but most of them are clearly "you have to pick this" because the other is just not viable. Like getting 150 damage on Lich. Its neat as fuck, maybe one out of ten pubs you can go this and have fun dicking around but you could lose because you could have gotten 120 gold/min instead

Also all the -respawn timer and gold/min seems random as fuck. Why does Puck get/need 300 gold/min at LEVEL TWENTY FIVE aka like 40 minutes into the match?

A much more polished and overhauled version where each level matters, and some shit heroes get actual useful talents to make them not as shit would be good down the line. Its also a case of "my heroes didn't get shit, why the fuck did that already good hero get an extremely good talent"

It's not bad. The hud is bad.

Nah since everyone has it it's not really op

>mfw 1 second cool down poison touch
>mfw poison touch stacks now

How is this not the most broken out of any of the changes ever? Literally infinite stun. This would be like if a fighting game created an infinite combo as an intended feature and solely for one character.

tho it feels good since I'm a dazzle main lul

It's not.

You aren't allowed to take good things from other games because DotA is meant to be the dissident MOBA that hipsters play even though it's the only one that's even half as popular as League.

warcraft 3 also has moonwells.

How often does Dazzle get to 23 now?

What's bad about it?

Basically Icefrog is apparently upset by other people making clones so he took the best aspects of them and made them better.

Autists are raging because they can't deal with change. Literally every patch in the last three years has been "hurrrrr dota = lol = dead now"

Hidden alot of information behind holding Alt
Shop is inferior functionality and look wise
Night time indicator is shit
Item and skill bar is way too small
Health bar is actually hard to see at the bottom of the screen and it is also really small

Not the person you're replying to but it's a bit too small at some points without the option of resizing like how you can resize the minimap

>This would be like if a fighting game created an infinite combo as an intended feature and solely for one character.
Fighting games are 1v1. Dota is a team game. One of your other four teammates can fuck up the guy doing the chain stun, in a fighter you couldn't.

Congratulations on making the single most retarded comparison I've ever seen on this website

The problem I anticipate is that if you play support this change just fucks you, having to deal with enemy carries is already a fucking nightmare and now they'll get some massive steroid injection at level 25 which you're never going to see, so it's nothing for your benefit and only ever something happening to you.

thanks

Its not, they could BKB out of it as there is a small delay

Look at Shadow Shaman. Literally 8 second shackle into INSTANT hex into 8 second shackle. You cannot BKB out of Shaman's perma disable

No, its not. Your old trash HUD was bad. League got rid of that garbage after a year.

Isnt there an open for HUD Scale? If not another reason why Valve is retarded. Thats just basic shit.

it's bad because it adds nothing of value. the choice made is either not a choice at all because one talent is obviously better, or the choice impacts your play style so much, you are locked into a particular role.

>It's becoming HotS, they have wells now too

Talents and wells aren't the reason why HotS is bad though.

Yup, cores will assfuck supports hard

>be like level 20 at 50 minutes in as support, get some shitty +200 health talent
>level 25 enemy Spirit Breaker charges across the map in 5 seconds with his +500 speed talent

Seems good

this is a mockup of suggestions by anuxinamoon. only thing it's lacking is hp/mana above skills.

Yea, except you also need to be standing there like an asshole for 16 seconds praying nobody stuns you. The shackle is fucking awful when do you EVER get the change to utilize a challenging ability for that long? Same shit with the new CM aghs, as if you ever get people in your ult for that long.

It's just so arbitrary. How does leveling up give Crystal Maiden, a ice wizard, to get 120 gold per minute? It's a good gameplay choice but it's unintuitive and harder to memorize. You can understand Monkey King's tree hopping ability because of he's a monkey. You can understand Medusa's Mystic Snake because she's a snake lady. But things like additional gold or xp or magic resistance are random.

>Your old trash HUD was bad. League got rid of that garbage after a year.
>league babby

The choice boils down to a strategic one, short term vs long term, push vs farm, tank vs dps, it allows you to adapt to the flow of the game, stop spouting retarded 3k memes you dumb nigger.

change is bad dude

>tfw you don't have to buy food or make your hero use the toilet after x amount of time
>tfw you don't have to buy ammo for ranged heros

>Why does Puck get/need 300 gold/min at LEVEL TWENTY FIVE aka like 40 minutes into the match?

The whole tree feels like an answer to snowballing.
A Puck who's on a team that's doing well? Not gonna need that gold. Obviously.
A Puck on a team that's doing shit, with zero map control? That gold could be used for a last-ditch push.

One of the biggest problems DOTA, and really, MOBAs as a whole have always had, is how half the games are decided before the halfway point.
Giving options to players regardless of gold and teamfight wins is a massive step in the right direction.

is this a good time to hop into dota 2?

Played league for thousands of hours so I know the basics but never wanted to learn all the heroes and items in the game

Hud was actually a big issue for me too. It was too big and overbearing for the sake of it. Everytime I asked why it was like this, everyone gave the old "balance & because it was like that in WC3" routine.

>/d2g/ defends it because of Stockholm syndrome mixed with some cognitive dissonance
No, people who bash it without playing it are just retarded.

Sorry m8 but all my supports get an early trait to get bonus exp

Wait, so did they just get rid of stat upgrades for this tree thing? I was trying to prss alt+u to upgrade stats like I always would and it just didn't work.

Jesus fuck lad you just went full retard, I mean how the fuck does Crystal Maiden, a ice wizard, get gold per minute in the first place?

She obviously uses her ice power to sell more icecream cones to the creeps, dumbass.

I don't play dota2 but this looks just like the Heroes of the Storm character customization/talent system

Now is a good time yes, going to be a lot of new shit going on so you wont get shit on for being new and learning so much.

This is shit. Plain stats were far better. Now it's just fucking casualized like shit and will cater to league kids.

you think it's better to decide your role half way through the game than to adapt freely while the match is being played out? before this, you can adapt easily. but now, you are stuck with your decision and cannot adapt efficiently.

also missing amount of xp needed numerically seen by default, otherwise looks good

>the choice impacts your play style so much, you are locked into a particular role.
>Play as a WK against AM or Ezalor
>Now have an option to pick a talent that removes mana cost from ulti
>"Durr locked into a playstyle"
Are you a legitimate moron?

This should be the default and then the current one should be "minimal hud"

I used to have mods to make hud icons larger because I have poor vision, this update is a nightmare for me.

It really isn't. On HotS, the talents replace items, but on Dota 2 it's mostly just some stat boosts and bigger skill buffs at level 25, which you only reach at over 40 or 50min into the game as a core.

>Pick bonus exp
>You're weaker in fights than cores/supports that pick combat talents
>You die more, get less exp
Seems like a really dumb choice, the exp talents seem to be aimed towards push strats to offset the usual exp issues with it, not to try and get your supports to higher level at the cost of useful stats/abilities.

>making game-impacting decisions between various buffs is more casual than brainlessly adding +2 to each stat over and over again

You don't get that until level FUCKING 25.

this is a better time than there probably ever will be. maybe download and play through the tutorials which I hear are pretty good now and then play when the patch comes live tomorrow

same unga change bunga

My biggest gripe is with the HUD. DOTA HUD always reminded me of WC3 and this new sleek modern style seems so out of place.

WAIT WHAT

Is this a real meme-patch FOR REAL NOW?

And what does that have to do with locking you into a playstyle?

>even more options
>casualized
wut

obviously that situation would apply to the first example i made, which is that the talent choice would not be a choice at all, because there is an obvious best one.

This patch is going to be so much fun

because a lot of that shit is
>more damage
>more attack speed
>more stats
>more move speed
>cooldown reduction
>death timer reduction

With one, maybe two actually unique talents for most heroes. Obviously free bonuses like that are good, but it just seems so half baked. They should have ripped off the part where hots actually has good talents, though theirs started off shitty too so maybe in the next year or two they'll actually be refined into something good.


also my favorite hero Bristleback got some pretty mediocre talents in comparison to a lot of other heroes

Same as buying an expensive item, you usually enter the game with a plan, a strategy, and pick talents around that, adapting on the fly is as much your handicap as it is to the enemy, this adds a layer of depth where you can potentially adapt your talent choices to punish greedy talent picks by enemy cores etc. It adds much more strategic options like holding your talent point to counter the enemy choices etc. etc.

Or you can be a 3k scrub and worry about making the wrong choice and having to live with it, boohoo.

>OD can't steal int anymore

What the fuck were they thinking?

as a nostalgia fag as well I agree but at least custom huds still work.

it's as good a time as any

which means it's a bad time. don't get into the game. save yourself. RUN! RUN! RUN!

Isn't this good.

Can't you pick something to counter the matchup? Like you would with items?

haven't played a MOBA in like 3 years

>Be bristle picker
>Whine about things being bland
Am I being memed here?

Picking a talent requires sacrificing a point spent on an ability, you don't just get the talent at level 10

>obviously that situation would apply to the first example i made
No, it doesn't. 0 mana ulti wouldn't be an auto-pick over 20% lifesteal boost. Stop talking out of your ass.

If anything talents will provide a new way to balance heroes without fucking up their core ability values or related items.

There isn't any depth to it at all.

Before I could for example play as Antimage and level up stats early game, now I'm FORCED to take a fucking stupid ass shit skill point now and I have to wait for level 10 for two shitty options (one which ALWAYS outclasses the other)

Talent system stifles choice, and makes the game so much more casual. Choosing stats used to be such a significant point investment, and you needed to weigh it against leveling your siklls. There were several situatioal builds that level stats over spells, and i think it being a pretty deep system was showcased by the fact that the vast majority of those stat builds were created at a high level. Now with this stupid LoL shit system you lose all of this.

It isn't rocket science but you're a retarded Sup Forums valve apologist kid so whatever I guess

You won't to make that choice until the very end of the game

so basically the new strategy is that there would be a plan of talents to pick from the start of the game? doesn't seem very adapting to me.

>through the tutorials which I hear are pretty good now

That's good to hear. I'd appreciate the game telling me about the UI and other elements I have no idea about.

That's because it was. Everytime I asked why it's like that, it's because Valve/Ice Froggers said they wanted to make it as close to the mod as possible with graphical upgrades.

The hud was a "balance" issue apparently. You'll be able to scale the minimap I know for sure, not sure about the hud. At least the useless shit is gone from the hud now.

that's my point, I love the hero but it'd be nice if he had something more in his kit, which this talent system could have added

>I'm also 3k mmr!
Don't forget to leave out the important bit, retard.

fuck off retard, the pros knew what they were doing when they innovated the stats build on certain heroes but i guess you're too much of a 2k scrub to understand why it's such a huge layer of depth and why the talent system is fucking garbage
this game will be fucking dead in a month, everyone who actually likes dota will be completely alienated by all these changes, anyone who likes this garbage is probably already playing shit like LOL or HotS anyways so why would they move to dota? icefrog fucking ruined everything since 6.81

Any idea if people still take non-ranked games seriously? That's always been my issue with a lot of MOBAs. The casual mode slowly seems to become Ranked Lite.

>Choosing stats used to be such a significant point investment, and you needed to weigh it against leveling your skills.

That's bullshit and you know it.

There was ONE optimal way to level a character that worked in 99% of cases, and there was zero reason to deviate from that.
Now with the tree, you still have that, but you also have the chance to actively adapt to the ebb and flow of the match on the fly.

>this game will be fucking dead in a month

Yea, there's a plan, and when the enemy fucks with that plan like they're supposed to you have the option to adapt through items but not talents, items and talents or talents but not items, rather than having every adaption being only through items you now have three options of adapting.

Say you have a really shit lane that sets back your push strat, you can adapt and go for the late game, take talents that speed up your farm rather than improve your push and transition, it just adds a whole new layer of complexity.

>giving every hero situational decisions isn't worth sacrficing the couple of edge cases where you'd take stat points before all your skills were maxed and do it the same way every time
Why not just be concise in your posting and just type "I'm a retard" instead

if you don't think that 0 mana ulti for that situation is auto-pick, then refer to example 2 where your choice just restricts your playstyle because if you didn't get items for right click, the lifesteal doesn't do much at all.

some do, but not all
I play unranked exclusively just clowning around and have a ton of fun, and have been doing this since I started playing in 2011
if you don't take the game seriously yourself you have nothing to worry about

Everyone already hates the patch and are saying they're uninstalling the game retard
Best case scenario maybe 20% of the playerbase (brainwashed valvedrones) will stay, but the rest will all leave because they know this game has been ruined

>M-muh stats build
Which was innovating using very limited tools, which is now expanded upon.

But keep talking 3k, you're literally just regurgitating third-hand information.

see you and those other 5 dudes you're calling "everyone" next week

Alright, I'll give it a shot.

Will matchmaking at least try to match me with people at a similar level / games played?

Last time I tried I got thrown into a game with people who had 2k+ wins. Didn't go too well.

but pros like the patch

OD still can with Orb, and he can steal them for 140 seconds at lvl 25.

ok, in the way you mentioned, yes it does add a layer of complexity because you can change your mind and adapt through talent choices. however, i feel like once the talent choice is made, you are restricted in your playstyle to your choice.

[citation needed]
Besides, if they said anything against the patch they have valve watching over their every move so they're basically forced to say they like everything lest they want to be banned from competing

>Everyone
>Patch isn't even out yet
>This shit happens literally every patch
>It's always the same loud chimps rambling on about things changing and then never actually leaving
I believe you user, no, really, tell me more, tell me again, this story is so original!

not sure how it's on low levels, but it does try to match based on your skill level, with the 3 tiers being normal, high and very high I believe
everyone still has a hidden mmr for unranked modes

You aren't forced you dumbass its a choice,
now you get to sacrifice spending a point on a skill so that you can level talent instead you moron

i pretty much only play unranked and most people don't even talk. just mute players so you know they're fags if you match with them again.

>Everyone already hates the patch and are saying they're uninstalling the game retard

Literally fucking no one not on Sup Forums hates this patch.
Outside of Sup Forums, the biggest complaint anyone has is about the team display screen before every match, and how it doesn't really fit with the tone of the game. That's fucking it.

The skill tree and HUD and especially the backpack are praised across the board.

If a legitimate backlash occurs from THE PROFESSIONAL COMMUNITY it will be removed. That is yet to be seen and DotA doesn't balance around the 99%

>you didn't get items for right click
>you
Did you miss the part where it's an aura? Even if you're not going a right click build, your other cores would appreciate the sustain.

If you're not up against a mana burning lineup, there's not really much point in picking the free ult anyway.

How do you fix Invoker?

Am I being baited here? OF COURSE some talents will be auto-picks in certain situations, the point is that one of them isn't better than the other in 100% of the cases and it's left up to the player to decide which they're going to choose when.
>if you didn't get items for right click, the lifesteal doesn't do much at all.
>What's an aura
So you are a moron.

>[citation needed]
>M-my bullshit doesn't need any citation, but yours certainly does!
Holy shit nigger did nobody ever tell you not to go full retard? There have been dozens of analysis of the patch notes so far and it's unanimously been enthusiasm with some questioning of certain heroes (bulldog not liking furion talents)

Is the hero changelog up yet?