"low skill ceiling"

>"low skill ceiling"

I keep seeing this criticism tossed around on Sup Forums, why? Nobody has perfect aim.

Is aim not considered skill?

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I've got you in my sights

you dont have to aim in overwatch

>does body shots
You do more damage if you aim for yourself

There are games that reward aim much more than overwatch does. Also aiming in this game is pretty easy with everyone's predictable movement and locations and the generous hitboxes and the weapons that aren't really sensitive to it.

not when you have huge slow moving hit boxes

anything with a high skill ceiling gets nerfed

>widowmaker
nerfed
>genji
nerfed
>mccree left click
nerfed

fucking joke game

This is bait

Zenyata?

I see that too OP but anytime people are asked to post their rank they turn out to be platinum and below shitters
Same shit with csgo
Everyone says it's easy but I've yet to see someone who says that post anything above mge

are any of you even GM? lol

come back when you can aim well enough to carry with mccree or soldier or even tracer

>individual skill matters in overwatch

love this meme

blizzard does their best job to bring everyone down into the same homogeneous pool of mediocrity

>muh forced 50

>cancerous hero that can counter his counters
8 seconds of Dragonblade was bullshit and you know it.

the meta is 3 tanks for fucks sake. skill does not matter.

what does this have to do bringing others down? every competitive game has a meta

almost all of the hitscan characters and some projectile characters as well have a fairly high skill ceiling due to the extremely erratic nature of movement in this game
obviously hitting some brick shithouse like roadhog is easy but if you put 2 soldiers against each other without rockets, the ttk is low enough to where the person with better aim is going to win 9/10 times

because the difference between a "good" reinhardt and a "bad" one is almost non-existent. these characters rise to the top and become meta, thus, nothing fucking matters.

It also halves his reload time so it can help a bit.

>there's no difference between a reinhardt properly positioning himself with shield and knowing when to ult, shift, and e than there is a reinhardt who shifts into 4 people

anti-overwatch posting just gets more and more retarded

>come back when you can aim well enough to carry with mccree or soldier or even tracer
You can't carry with mccree,soldier,or tracer if they have a DVA Rein Roadhog and/or Zarya

One of the fucking developers hate me today.

>on 8th game
>all having some shitty fucking Hanzo main

They actually think they are good because they don't die and get no kills.

>stand here
>right click
>you're now a good reinhardt
>press Q sometimes to move past chokepoint

lmao epic skill play what a game

Yeah, thats a dumb thing to say user

This. Tank meta shows how shitty this game truly is. Take roadhog's hook. He can insta-kill any dps or healer in the game by simply pressing Q and that's it. It requires zero skill and that's all Overwatch is. Abilities and ults instead of skill. It's a dumbed down copy of TF2 but everything is much worse.

lets see your grandmaster rank bitchboi (you're probably gold)

Sure, if we're comparing bronze-babbies with plats.
Why must it always be extremes on Sup Forums just to uphold some illusion of difference in opinion?
is right, the percieved skill required for playing Reinhhardt is incredibly low, same with a lot of other heroes.

Which is exactly why the hitscan heroes, who actually have to aim, keeps getting nerfed, because the game wasn't built around skill-requirements, thus heroes who can increase their damage output dramatically through having better aim can completely unbalance the game if the player using them actually knows how to aim.

>Being proud you can carry with broken characters excluding mcree sinces hes shit now
Kill yourself some of us like playing characters that actually take a brain to play.

Implying you can't head shot the shit out of either of those characters as mcree
I regularly survive roadhog hooks as lucio

nerfed

There's absolutely no movement options whatsoever. If it's not in the character's kit, you can't do it. There's no reward for getting good with characters.
Once you realize the game is basically just a first person moba, it dawns on you that matches are never really different from one another. All it ends up being is waiting for ults, which are the real game changers considering a lot are basically just free kills most of the time.
The game rarely takes into account player skill, aside from aiming, and if you're being dragged down by your incompetent team, oh well, hope you like seeing that big red DEFEAT displayed across your screen.

>I regularly survive roadhog hooks as lucio
Probably a roadhog that doesn't know LMB+melee.

after a huge buff

>Implying you can't head shot the shit out of either of those characters as mcree
You can head shot them. Of course. Since you're just a shitposter you just ignore
>DVA being able to eat bullets or your flash
>Roadhog hooking you before you can kill him
>Rein blocking anyone from you shooting them
>Zarya shielding herself or the person you're shooting with a shield

No, a well timed pushback does wonders, mcree is also very capable of surviving after being hooked unless surrounded

>No, a well timed pushback doe..
You get stunned from hook, e.g. it's not you being good that makes you "survive" his hook, it's him being bad.

Why can you shoot through your teammates?

Why do so many characters have infinite ammo grenade launchers?

What's cancerous is that you get good and your reward is to be nerfed by blizzard.

So you're complaining about tanks having abilities to counteract dps? Because if you're team is good you'll have shield broken and DVA's defense matrix on cooldown. Multiple characters survive being hooked.

>Tank teams counter tank teams
insightful

How is that what I implied? I said tanks counter dps, which gee wouldn't that make sense? DPS poking the tanks is what breaks shields/puts cooldowns up.

>Genji
>Jump around like an autistic sperg and escape with shift that also refreshes on kill that even only gave you 1 point
>Skill

cherrypicking activated

>Tanks counter DPS
Yeah. If you have several Tanks it counters all the dps you have making the meta Tanks vs Tanks.

Other games

>Players gets dominant with a weapon
>Fucks everyone up
>Man i guess i just have to get good so i can beat him
>Everyone gets better

Overwatch

>Player gets good with a character
>Fucks everyone up
>Everyone runs to the forums to cry to blizzard
>Blizzard does a knee jerk update nerfing the character
>Everyone continues being a baddie

hitscans get nerfed because it was a mistake for them to exist. they become the most reliable DPS and blizz just scratches their head wondering why. pharah was high tier for 1 patch, every single meta has been dependent on mccree outside of the 2-3 patches where he was trash tier. the ability to click a guy and reliably do damage is simply too good in a game about building meter and picking people off when you have useless fucks like hanzo and junkrat that can completely fail to kill a lone support

True, blizzard needs to do something to balance out the disparity in comp play. However, I think at some point the problem only exists at the highest ranks. We all aren't grandmasters and in lower ranks trip tank can still get stomped by a balanced team with good dps.

if u see a full health tank and engage him in a 1v1 as mcree ur so awful lmao

heres what you do if you find yourself in a 1v1 with a tank as mccree

roadhog: actively maintain distance and poke him down with left clicks while strafing left to right to dodge/bait hook. once he is low, get closer, and when he goes to heal u flash him out of it -> fan -> roll -> fan. if u roll to flash him ur doing it wrong, wont kill him, and will get hooked and DIE

winston: keep distance, save roll for when he jumps on you, poke him with left clicks until he tries to run away then Kill that gorilla

dva: wait out defense matrix, keep medium disance, kill mech, dva pop out, flash -> take the time to aim a headshot, fan is not guaranteed b/c qt korean girl is small

zarya: do w/e you want as long as you force her to shield before you flash. strafing randomly to avoid lazer

rein: throw flash above the shield, walk 2 steps forward and fan into his head, then roll back and wait for flash again. if u roll to flash ur bad and he will hammer u before you kill him

ur welcome man i hope u can stop bein so fuckin bad soon

To be fair genji was the only character with any kind of depth only because of ledge dashing, which was patched out some time ago anyway.

By that reasoning Bastion and Mei would be nerfed into the ground by now.

As a Zarya player in GM, McCree is fucking bullshit, man. Either I shield before he flashbangs and I'm dead, or I try to wait out flashbang and he just kills me anyway.

they dont touch those because they'd have to fundamentally change how those characters played. too much work.

Thank you, you put more effort into a rebuttal than i was willing to.

>guy gets good with hero
>fucks everyone up
>ow philosophy is that you have to counter him
>no conceivable counters because the character's high skill cap and or kit allows him to mitigate being countered
>design philosophy falls apart because heroes like mccree genji zarya rein lucio have no solid counters making them consistently meta
>let them keep their retarded kit but shit on their numbers to tone them down
>either garbage tier or still too strong after nerf
fixd it for you

The games heavily flawed. The Tank meta is just one of them.

The meta is being a team of tanks. If the only way you can be of any use is to pray you find a shitty tank far away from a healer/tank you are fucking retarded. What looks good on paper doesn't transfer well when you have a team of competent players or a team of fucking retards
Zarya isn't a usefull fragger. You shield and you shield yourself until you're powerful enough to act as a stable dps or use your ult

Low-skill cieling is playing a hero like Reinhardt, where aiming is almost neglegible.

That's not really why the meta is 3 tanks though. 3 tanks + soldier does more than enough damage to not warrant taking 1 less tank. And 3 tanks makes Ana + Lucio healing even easier.

It's not like Reaper is suddenly shit, the third tank just does his job well enough and synergizes well with the other bullshit.

Again, get good. You should watch high level zaryas. They are able to coordinate enough to be stable dps from the get go. Plus the threat of a bubbled zarya puts a lot of characters off from hitting her until it goes down.

>Lowering bastions damage would require changing how he is fundamentally played

They should have kept it beta playstyle, he might be playable now.

>That's not really why the meta is 3 tanks though
It is. Thats why a team of mostly tanks vs a team of less tanks win if both teams are equally skilled.
>A tank is really good
>Can't believe you're saying tank teams are the meta
Kill yourself

i was replying to a post about mccree not being able to 1v1 any tanks

i agree he's pretty bad vs 3+ tank lineups because his ult takes too long to charge up to anything meaningful vs all that hp.

Because of Ana, not because tanks counter damage dealers.

I didn't say they were OP did I? I said they were more viable than you are leading anyone to believe. You said she isn't a reliable fragger. She can reliably kill some characters. Mcree is too long range for her bullshit unless you are tits with her launcher. Eat shit.

Well see if I keep your bitch ass alive, then. It takes some work to know when to drop my shield to chase after flankers so they don't run you into a building for you to trip in your high heels and get gang raped.

well skilled friend

The nice thing about Paladins is that the tanks are useless enough that there's typically only one per team, and then their job is capping the point. The game revolves around DPS.

t. Ambivalent on whether I should buy OW

Damn, that guy is good.

McCree can't 1 v 1 a tank unless he
>Flanks a tank that is alone
>The Tank decides to push and fight instead of using many of their abilities to leave or run for a health pack
Ana is one of the many many reasons why this game is so fucking flawed. Ana is not the big part. She is under the huge category of "These characters are designed like fucking garbage" Which covers almost all of the characters.
>You said she isn't a reliable fragger
>She can reliably kill some
>Some
>Reliable
>Reliable being the same thing as situational
Literally lmaoing at you. She is extremely useful but she can only net in the huge amount of kills if the other team is mostly dps since Tanks counter Dps.

that game sounds like shit

>hey dude we need a tank, can you switch? you were the last to pick your hero,

>but they don't do anything but sit on point all game..

>yeah but we need one

Aiming is undeniably something that can boost your ranking, but that's basically it.
The only other important thing is knowledge about what to do, when to do it, team comps, etc... whatever.

I don't want to play a game where the difference between an amateur and a grandmaster is marginal aiming ability, but a lot of knowledge and experience.

I'm not going to say it has a low skill ceiling, because clearly there's good players and bad players. But I just really wish those good players and bad players were distinguished by combat mechanics that take hours to master. Not knowledge.

Isn't this from that guy that got caught using Aimbot? That's not you poser.

>silver rank, the post
These are probably the same people that say "MOBA's are just 4 buttons on the same map, how hard can it be?"

This, fucked hit boxes. aim crutches like stuns or ultimates or just regular abilities and weapons are fucking pathetic

This,.. This is autism.

>hours of knowledge instead of mechanics

This is retarded, you have to understand all of the characters mechanics to get that knowledge. Meaning its' the fucking same.

first off, 1v1 implies ur both alone and no one else interferes. second, ur wrong. he beats every tank 1v1.

No, he was using Aimbot. Got caught.

No, it's not retarded. Overwatch has a complete lack of battle mechanics.

Compare it to something like TF2 which has rocket jumping, trick stabs, strafing, air blasts, etc... and lots of weapons like the atomic bat shit that allows you to jump 3 times with scout.
Those are fucking combat mechanics.

By overwatch knowledge I mean "I'm not going to blow my ult right now, but instead wait 2 minutes."

>Aiming is undeniably something that can boost your ranking, but that's basically it.

No

Knowing how to play a class well = x

Teammates who also play their class well = y

Teammates who are shit = B

x + 2(y) = Rank Up

x + 3(B) = Rank Down

The golden equation is just having two/three buddies that are good to help carry

Yeah that takes loads of skill to do bucko. Keep telling yourself w+spamming m1 = skill.

Taimou is some crazy asian, you're thinking of Enumbre

Tanks are only shit now because they buffed wrecker.
>>>>>>>% more damage on shields
150% was good enough christ

blizzard defense force deploying in 3...2...1...

Whats sad is that something like rocket/conc jumping would just be patched out of overwatch for being an "unfair exploit". The game has no fucking depth.

This is what I'm fucking saying. In overwatch knowing how to play a class well is more strategical than it is tactical. That's why people complain the skill ceiling is low.

...

>"I'm not going to blow my ult right now, but instead wait 2 minutes.
And this is how I know you are bad and don't understand the mechanics.

>rocket jumping is a mechanic
>doesn't understand how to use S76 to get to vantage points

>trick stabs
>doesn't know how to play genji as a flanker

>strafing
Wait? You don't know how to go left and right? Or is it you are just used to people not being able to aim?

>airblasts
Hello Lucio.

No
Normally you have bullet spread and longer reload time

If I didn't have situational awareness you wouldn't be able to play whatever shitter character you play and get away with it so easily. I also gotta lead firestrikes, scatter enemies off of points, and make sure that my earthshatter is very very obvious so you glue eaters don't miss the opportunity.

In most of the games I'm in, the payload wouldn't even be moving if I wasn't Reinhardt because sticking to the point seems like a foreign concept to most players.

>comparing TF2 which only has you aim and use items to boost your stats over other players
>vs equal playing ground and understanding game mechanics available to everyone

If anything TF2 is the no mechanic low skill ceiling. Especially since you can P2W with items.

>bullet spread
>he doesn't fire in 4 shot bursts
Look everyone, it's a silver shitter.

That hasn't worked for a while

>comparing 76's "rocket jumps" to tf2 rocket jumps

rocket jumping in overwatch is complete garbage anyways, you only get about 2 more feet of height.

Your skill in every video game is determined by your reaction time. Aiming comes after that in FPS and its easier to aim better when the games literally slower for you.

The difference between 250ms (human average) and 190ms (top 10% of humans) doesn't sound meaningful, but imagine you're playing OW with 250ms reaction time and someone on the other team has 190ms. You both have 50ms ping, but you're going to be 60ms behind him. Basically doubling your ping.

humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime


if ur not 190 or under, stop tryin to be good at esport titles lul

Literally every one of your points is complete bullshit.
Grandmasters in Overwatch talk about what they're thinking, and one of the things they talk about is when they want to use their ults.

Clearly Overwatch doesn't have rocket jumping to any sort of depth.
Genji doesn't have anything similar to a trick stab.
I'm talking about air strafing. Not to mention Overwatch added deceleration when you're in the air.
It's a lesser point, but clearly Pyro's airblasts could do more than Lucios.

people used to laugh at TF2 like they laugh at OW's """""skill""""

but the game is now 10 years old and the kids grew up and now dominate every conversation

>hasn't worked for a while
Except it currently does, 4 shot burst with a gap between means no bullet spread.

It was 3 before they buffed him after his initial nerf.

>he doesn't know you don't need rocket jump for S76

And the silver shitter shows himself again.

>tfw 230ms pleb

now i can blame my teammates and my slow ass retard brain for why im in silver

pharah pulse bombing herself adds some insane movement options when you know how

bastion tank and soldier can rocket jump

Mei wall to transport less mobile chars to higher points is a thing, too

Lucio wall riding effectively