Is "Playing to win" a problem?

Why do I have to do the game's content? Just let me enjoy the same things as people who actually earned it

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>Dark Souls is hard
I want this meme to die.

I play games to lose.

>playing to win

I...this has to be satire right? Right?

>playing to win
Why and how else can you play a game?

It is, but it becomes only slightly challenging once you understand how the game works and you have a decent build. Hard to learn. Easy to master. Weird curve desu.

Playing for FUN

But how can you have fun if you don't win?

Perhaps a better question to ask is "How do we solve the 'Playing to win' problem?" and to answer that question I offer you a simple yet elegant solution. Simply do not incentivize winning.

Feels like these writers write the most bullshit stuff so they can keep getting their salary. Fucking pathetic

Dark Souls games do have an easy mode. It's called grinding until bosses become trivial.

>Easy mode
>Dark soul

Normies.

the challenge is part of Dark Souls
it's like saying every novel should come with a dumbed down version

>is "Playing to win" a problem?
People who don't keep telling me it is.

I don't see it.

That's why I hate MMOs now.
It used to be : The more you play, the better you get.
And then if you had 5000 hours in, you would one shot the guys with 200 hours in.
Now everything is locked behind weekly shit. Everything is slowed down so Stacy can have fun playing a healer.

that guy probably writes for polygon desu

You can only grind so much until you start getting diminishing returns.

Maybe they don't know it already exist it's called magic

>Playing to win
What else would play for? What the fuck? Even if you're playing for "fun" your still trying to complete an objective, hence trying to win.

sounds like you need to play black desert online

If only there was a game that played itself for you so you could just watch. I would play that game to death.

Same. many, perhaps most, good games make losing fun

scrub mentality shit.

I can beat Dark Souls but I have yet to beat Megaman 2 or SMB3. And I've tried.

It does have an easy mode, it's called being a faggot magic user and having summons with you.

It's clickbait that's supposed to enrage people. That's how journalism makes money nowadays.

>heavy rain
>life is strange
>gone home

there you have your "vidya"

Yet there's all these faggots watching twitch.

Didn't that lead writer from Bioware have that same mentality? Helper was it? She wanted a game where you could skip the combat aspect of Dragon Age towards the "story".

It's true that especially in games like Dark Souls, the strat that wins most is not usually the most fun one. Use backstabs and the longest spear in the game for example to win.

It's not so bad in Dark Souls III.
It's not actually very effective unless you're clearly underleveled. Your player basically always moves the same way and swings their weapon the same way and you'd have to level plenty of vigor just to be able to take an extra hit from boss for example.
Summoning is the real easy mode.

This.

Or maybe you should play a different fucking video game. If you don't ENJOY playing a game, maybe that game isn't for you.
m.youtube.com/watch?v=0la5DBtOVNI

>Helper was it?
Yes, Hamburger Helper was her name. She's fired now.

Dead Rising has a similar curve. The established fans shit on you if you point out how bullshit some of the stuff in the game is for a new player because they've forgotten what the game is like before you know what to get and what to do to basically be untouchable.

Don't forget that Dark Souls already has considerably little rewards for winning in PvP for example.

But the most effective way to win is rarely the only one. Most games allow you to play the way you want and still be able to win. And no matter how "fun" you find a game, if you don't win, you will ultimately have less fun, than a player who might have been a bit more frustrated along the way, but actually won.

paying $20 to take you directly to the credits screen.

The challenges of Dark Souls are part of its story, as much as the unreadability of Finnegan's Wake is part of its story.

Cliff notes for Finnegan's Wake, let's plays for Dark Souls. Either way unless you have direct contact with the material you haven't actually experienced it. Dark Souls is not unplayably hard, but the persistence and resilience it demands are more important to its story than any piece of lore.

>Not understanding that scrub mentality is actually aiming to win, but holding yourself back because you see going all out as being too tryhard
>Not getting that this is perfectly compatible with playing 'for fun' when nothing is at stake

This is such bullshit, if anything Souls games need a hard mode, so that experienced players don't need to go for naked SL1 runs to challenge themselves.

>playing to win is bad
>"lol what a tryhard"
BETTER FUCKING MOTIVATION THAN VERGIL

I thought Dark Souls 3 *was* easy mode.

Playing to win / trying hard and being a tryhard are completely different things.

Why did you feel the need to single out Dark Souls 3 in particular? Do you honestly believe that the previous games were any harder? Or are you just trying to fit in?

Typical liberals

Dark Souls 3 has an easy mode, to activate it you can pick Knight as your starting class and use straight swords.

What website is this on

Please don't tell me it's "gaming" journalism

user, i still don't understand what the fuck term tryhard supposed to mean
"wooow you need 4 people to take me down, fucking tryhards" - team based game
???

This, that dude quietly topping the leaderboards isn't a tryhard. The kid who trash talks every opponent he kills while using what the meta says is the best equipment probably is, regardless of where he's at on the scoreboard.

>if anything Souls games need a hard mode

Agreed. DS2's bonfire ascetics, bonus rings and champion's way were the closest thing to this so far. What the game really needs is some kind of extra challenge covenant that effectively enforces the kinds of build restrictions that people would normally do.

its not hard, its frustrating. Thats the key philosophy of the series

If it's too hard then why don't you just pick an easier game? DmC for example.

Tryhard is for people who blindly pick on the meta based on win rate alone or what some "pro" said. They lack any critical thinking and reinforce their shitty habits on others by being insufferable. Tryhard is a dumb word though.

>Why did you feel the need to single out Dark Souls 3 in particular?

You move faster and enemies aren't any more agile to compensate.

The only idea they had to make bosses "hard" was to add slight delays between their wind ups and their strikes to throw off your dodging. Ass soon as you work this out, everything is trivial.

Maybe the previous ones just felt harder because they were new and unknown. That's definitely a possibility.

It isn't and never was. The devs just wanted to make a satisfyingly difficult game they themselves would love to play. The difficulty meme is just a side effect of the general shit state of the industry at the time the game came out.

Go play 10 Billion Wives

Took me about a week of "playing" but I beat it.

I got to that Illythril Dungeon or whatever its called in DaS3 and quit, was I far in or what? I just got bored, made another character, got to the same point and got bored again, the way poise and attack spam in this works really puts me off in the same way BB hasnt much variety to playstyles either.
>make flamethrower build
>its complete garbo, its a fast way to get killed because of its movement speed and doesnt cause enemies to flinch when hit despite doing minimal damage
Was so dissapointed.

why there isnt a movie mode in games where you dont even play and just watch a full walkthrough?

Shut up, Hamburger Hepler

Youtube? Why even purchase the game if all you want to do is watch it, just watch a playthrough.

Imo in difficulty
DeS = Das > Das2 > BB > Das3

So yes, relatively speaking Das 3 is easier, maybe not by much though.

>historical accuracy is bad waaaaaaaaaaah

This depends on the game. In Dark Souls here for example, there certainly are weapons that are outright better than others.

>got bored
Sure, "bored"... uh-huh.

>do actually good
>use metashit
>people still complain you're a tryhard

Clearly the Team Fortress 2 community agrees.

>tierlists
>objective
Gave me a good laugh.

nope the game expects of you to die over and over for petty reasons. Its mechanics are specifically designed to stall your progress. They wanted you to keep banging your head on the wall over and over until you feel the satisfaction of breaking it. Personally I do not find that enjoyable at all, I just think the gameplay is addicting.

So, like a movie or a Sup Forums series?
or... Sup Forumsnime?

MGS3 Subsistence had a whole extra disc that was gameplay footage and cutscenes spliced together to form a feature film

What?

My point is more that it's about the personality of the individual than anything, at least as I understand it. I think it's one of those words where everyone has their own specific definition, like hipster.

Dark Souls III is faster and you lose balance in one hit for most part but other than that it's easier.
For people used to dodging or playing fast action games these don't affect the difficulty much, but everything else has become easier.

Demon's Souls is by far the easiest in the series

>tierlists
>not indicative
Found the real tard.

I'm sorry, user, personally I just find you lack adequate skills to play video games.

Woah now. DS2 is far harder than DeS.

DeS is the EASIEST of the Souls games because it came out before they realised how broken some of their mechanics were.

Magic is so ridiculously, unfairly OP that if you use spells like Firestorm you'll just one shot most of the bosses. How can that possibly be a challenge? Even if you don't use Firestorm, Soul Lance or whatever it was called does redonkulous damage.

You can perpetually have up either the Super Defense Spell (I forget the name, great Barrier) or Second Chance. Yup they cost a lot of mana, but that's not an issue when you can get full mana instantly by drinking one of your 99 Spices. Even taking damage isn't an issue because your 99 Dark/New Moon Grass heal you to full HP faster than drinking Estus ever would.

The way Spell Slots worked meant you could easily mix spells as you wanted, I beat the Old King at lv60 odd on about my third attempt.

It's fine if it's your favourite Dark Souls game, but it's definitely, definitely not the hardest. The DLC in 2 is harder than anything in DeS, same with the Abyss/Manus fight in DS1. I haven't played 3 so I can't really compare.

Fucking lefties shitting everything up. If you can' t keep up, get lost.

Ive beaten every single souls game several times without summons. You may enjoy wasting your time but I find no satisfaction in that. Nothing wrong with that.

Making things easier would only devalue the game and make ones accomplishment meaning nothing.

It feels great for one to accomplish something working hard at it and thinking outside the box. If one thing isn't working try a different tactic.

This basically.

I didn't know iFrames exist in this game until read it online. Now add that fast rolling gives you plenty of those the whole game changes.

My first play through was done with careful blocking and a very shitskilled character and completely blind.


People who call Dark Souls easy are just really egocentric and forgot how they started or just read guides before even playing and are the real shitters.
I'm glad Nioh's coming to teach them again.

>inb4 only died once yaddiyaddah
Sure.

Again, I'm very sorry, but I didn't waste any of my time playing those games.

By playing Animal Crossing

Or Dwarf Fortress. Making a perfect shut off fort isn't fun.

There's absolutely nothing frustrating about the Souls games. You lose > you start over, not a big deal. The penalty for losing is literally nothing at all 99% of the time, maybe a slight treck back to where you died, which is never longer than a 1 minute trip. If you think these games are frustrating then it means that you have lived a sheltered life and know nothing about video games.

>Year old, shitty click-bait article released intentionally at the time of DS3 release to rake up clicks from morons.
>Sup Forums fucking still brings it up and freaks out about it.

You people are just scrapping up the bottom of the barrel to look for shit to get "outraged" about, aren't you. This is beyond sad.

>I'm glad Nioh's coming to teach them again.

Le 720p 30fps meme.

I hate articles like this because they miss the point of Dark Souls' difficulty. The whole game sets out to create a depressing atmosphere with the predominant emotion being hopelessness.

The difficulty is there to reinforce that while also showing off the power of your main character. They might not be the strongest or most-agile but they have a tenacity that is unmatched by anything. They win not through skill but through perseverance.

That's the whole point of the Souls franchise - to persevere int he face of seemingly-impossible odds. If the game was easy, it would just be another hack-and-slash ala Amalur.

Why do you care about the content if you'll only experience it in a dumbed down state the developers do not intend for you to play? They gave you the content and carefully balanced the experience they wanted to create, if that doesn't appeal to you for whatever reason find a different fucking game instead of demanding everyone cater to you.

>Didn't that lead writer from Bioware have that same mentality? Helper was it? She wanted a game where you could skip the combat aspect of Dragon Age towards the "story".
Nothing wrong with it. Video games have way more to offer than just "combat" and forcing people through stuff only 12yo enjoy is not really great.

>waaaah knights with straight swords are OP waaaaaah
No shit, they were the fucking tanks of their day.

There are so many other games that guy could've played and enjoyed the difficulty scale, but no, he has to come to a game that has a slightly higher difficulty curve and whine it doesn't fit his skill level.

You have no idea what you are talking about, don't you?

>Easy mode

It's called summons and magic.

Good for you. I consider dying and then running to the boss skipping every enemy a waste of my time.

Not him but the only thing that really makes DeS easy in my opinion is that enemies have less HP and they deal less damage.

Other than that the faster enemies and lack of poise make the game rather unforgiving.

I never felt like I just had to keep leveling in DeS, but from DaS2 on it always felt like the best use for souls as soon as I got them. I don't think the actual combat in either is significantly harder than the other, especially since DaS2, while fixing lots of "exploits", rewards DPS and landing the first hit on enemy more than the other games.
But the actual stats are what make DeS easier.

Dark Souls is very easy if you start playing it these days, because every single retard on the planet knows that you're not supposed to run into the middle of enemies and do combos like it's fucking God of War
Also, dying two or three times to a boss does not mean the game is hard

It's like going to a ferarri dealer and asking to have a ferarri that doesn't go too fast. Also they have made a easy mode it's called summoning

>I didn't know iFrames exist in this game until read it online.

I had the same experience. The game is completely different when you play it without knowing about roll2win, as you end up being extremely cautious in approaching enemies. The experience is far superior IMO as the game legitimately has more depth this way as there's no formulaic way to get past attacks, so you end up approaching everything differently.

What really irks me is when people say "iframes are obvious" and the justifications they give is "you should know from other games that have iframes".

At the time demon's seemed cryptic as fuck. Maybe my difficulty rating is just curved on experience. I probably can't objectively argue das3 as easiest in the series.

>Nioh
60FPS, the only thing that matters.