Why do people think modern FE is shit

Why do people think modern FE is shit

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It's become MOBAGE waifu cancer like Granblue Fantasy. They put more emphasis on spending microtransactions for anime girls than making compelling gameplay or story.

>Awakening's "story" and shitty gameplay
>Fate's lower than shit quality story
>Shitty My Avatar, forced shitty children gimmick and waifu cancer stuffed to the brim in both
>Recently turned into mobage shit
Admittedly, IS actually showed they know how to fix FE's gameplay with Conquest so there's some sliver of hope. Story is getting worse and worse though. Fates has the ability to make Awakening's story actually sound good in comparison.

They were okay but flawed. Echoes has a lot of potential and nicer art plus is coming out fairly soon.

We're not talking about the mobile game, just Awakening and Fates.

I haven't even played them, but I can't shrug off the notion that if I do play them I'll regret it. I don't know why, I don't even have any negative feelings towards them.

How is Awakening's gameplay shit? It's the only FE I've played, but I found it to be really fun. The story was pretty good too. Nothing too amazing, but it was interesting enough to keep me interested. I liked all the characters and how they all interacted with the support convos too. Good game all around IMO.

Pairup is centralizingly overpowered, no reason to ever not, and not utilized by the enemy. Every map is the same rout the enemy shit. Grinding is necessary to get the right skills for good children, but grinding breaks the game.

>Oh neat a lava cave these are usually good maps.
>Its just a big rectangle with some spaces you should leave on a unit on.

Awakening is fun but its map design is pretty lacking compared to other FE games. You could also argue that support convo quality dropped a lot in Awakening and Fates due to the "everyone can bone everyone" system used (not nearly as bad as what Radiant Dawn had though). Pair-Up also destroys game balance and Fates did the right thing by splitting the offense and defense parts of it, as well as letting enemies use it.

Honestly if you liked Awakening I think you would like Fates too. Birthright is the most Awakening-like of the routes, but I recommend trying Conquest since its map design and balance is leagues above Birthright and Revelation.

i like the music ,what is really bad is the cast of characters,radiant dawn and path of radiance units are far far more appealing and very underrated, stefan soan vackle backstory have more potential than the one from chrom and corrin , i can see how they will pull a time convergence like this new zelda on the new fire emblem wii u , telling us more about the origins of the laguz and that war from the past

youtube.com/watch?v=8MKsTw4Ni0A

youtube.com/watch?v=tBb1EsfnII4

I dig it

Most of the time people I talk to don't think the new FEs is bad, whether they played the old ones or not.

Personally I fucking hate awakening and fates, I'm not even going to pretend that Heroes is a legitimate FE game, but it is definitely a product of what happened to the series.
Ultimately Awakening isn't a terrible game, faults here and there, but I looked at it like a huge red flag for what was to come, the waifushit, the unneeded power creep of lategame stat caps and ability minmaxing, fucking children genetics.

Fates continues to cash in on the waifu-trash popularity of the previous game, except they couldn't even keep half as much of the decent maps or characters in it, along with attempting new mechanics that failed badly like new weapon balance and turning the weapon triangle into a pointless mess.

I don't know how I want to feel about FE anymore, I would like to support it enough that it wont die, but I don't want to support the direction that its going. Would that they use the formula for Path of Radiance again, which by their own admission was 'trying to make a good story driven FE', but for some reason PoR and RD are not being recognized and all the limelight is on Marth and Awakening/Fates.

Like fuck, Ike won the popularity poll for the mobile game 1st, AND 3rd, and he wasn't in the fucking launch.

Basically came to post this.

Replayed PoR and RD a fuck ton, played Awakening once and was done with it for good. The pairing system felt like cancer to me.

Wait for Echoes and FE16 on Switch.

Same shit, they put more emphasis on waifus and relationships than making actual good gameplay or plots development.

>Awakening
Very boring map design where most maps were rout the enemy
Pair up being fundamentally broken.
Every unit can be OP, but this isn't the first game to introduce grinding either.
Robin met with varying results. I didn't mind it, others apparently did.

>Fates
Splitting up the game into 3 with the only way to have all 3 routes on a cart without dlc being the limited edition is super jewish.
Everything about Corrin
Kids make no sense and are obviously only there to ride off the awakening horse.
>Birthright
More boring than awakening maps somehow.
Just boring in general, that game puts me to sleep. Generic everything from plot to characters.
>Conquest
The game that made me change my mind about stories in video games. I used to think it didn't matter at all, now I think that if the story is so completely pants on head retarded, it becomes hard to motivate yourself to play it.
>Rev
Didn't play.

Not to imply they'll be a change for the better, but I think it's too soon to call doom when these are on the horizon. Echoes at least shows they haven't forgotten about older games, even if it's fucking Gaiden.

I agree with you, and Echoes seems like a radical departure from the new formula in ways that surprise me (from what we've seen, no skills, pair up, and many of the Gaiden features intact - for better or worse. I fear it won't sell well, but we'll see.

I wont hold my breath, even if its a remake of an older title when times were simpler.

What I want to see going forward are new FE titles that keep the quality control. No retard lords and retard politics of Awakening.
No mary sue plotlines of fates.
No fucking multi-multi-multi class swaping.

I agree with you, though I'm fine with limited class swapping for replayability purposes and fun gimmick builds - using it to stack the most broken skills in the game has gotta go though

>Designs went to shit from simple yet semi unquie or fancy but sitll has restraint to keep it overly so to ludicrous overwrought over the top nonsensical designs
>The story somehow managed to get even worse even though few before hand ever pretended that the old games' story were any good, but it shows just how bad the story was in the recent games for people to be nostalgic for the older games whose stories were, at their absolute best, inoffensive
>Waifufaggotry galore to the point it is actually sufficating
>Self-insert with the personality of a wet noodle that everyone fawns over
>Forced Children mechanic that has the fucking gall to copy FE4 while keeping Gen 1 characters around, failing absolutely in understand why children were present in FE4

What gimmick builds exactly? Off-optimal abilities and classes?
Because if that's so, there is something to be said for how some classes are just straight up worse or bad, instead of just different.

Uhh...fire emblem has NEVER had a compelling story. The gameplay from awakening and fates are still great. It's the same shit yet a little more casualized to make it accessible.

I'm in the same boat. I'm hoping Echoes borrows more from the era that inspired it and that the Switch game takes several pages from the Radiant games. I don't dig the new formula and wasn't even able to finish awakening. I finished conquest but not birthright and I didn't even buy invisible kingdom. Having the story follow dull morons for all of the 3ds games is unappealing and pair up is still too strong and putting magic in a triangle with bows and kunai was a mistake, mages are so awful in fates.

Class swapping with actual in-world reasoning would be nice. Maybe just an alternate class.

>tfw tomes are strong against bows
>all bow users have high res growths
Whats the fucking point.

>Grinding is necessary to get the right skills for good children, but grinding breaks the game.

I agree with the rest of your post, but I've always been ticked off about the way people talk about grinding in Awakening. Seems like people default to grinding, which I don't think is fair. People don't dismiss FE7 for having exploitable arenas that can let you get your team to 20, and give you loads of money.

People did use to do that to Sacred Stones, which also had grinding, but nowadays they don't talk about it.

>mages have low def and are typically slower than archers

Awakening gameplay is one of the worst in the series and above all tries to be Disgaea more than Fire Emblem, Fates is the same for 2/3s of the content.

The story is also good in a few games, the characters are generally always good as well. Until you get to awakening where everything takes a sharp downhill spiral.

I love how when awakening came out all the faggots defending it were like NO ITS JUST ONE GAME TO MAKE MONEY THE NEXT GAME WILL BE REAL FE AGAIN and look where we are now, we literally have a fucking skinner box mobile game with no content, no depth, focused entirely on pandering to lonely weeaboos.

I hope to god the FE2 remake is good but I have serious doubts

Not him but I have similar opinion.
Grinding in awakening/fates is different than grinding in 7 and arenas fundamentally because of how the game pacing works.

Arena abuse is not a legitimate necessity, and 99% of the time its just savescum cheating.
FE7 presents the option, but it is not remotely needed to progress, while offering some method of getting more weapons and exp, particularly for those low level characters you get later on like the adept and the recruit.

Whats different about FE7 to Awk/Fates?
FE7 doesn't have haphazard difficulty gaps, the preludes can be gained anytime from having your characters dick eachother, heres a mission thats 15 levels over your MC.
There is incentive to grind out all your supports, higher and higher stat caps and level caps, and desu it feels as if grinding is a lot slower than it was in FE7.

It really doesn't have to do with the fact grinding is present, but the feeling of HAVING to grind.

>and desu
How did I make that typo.

t.b.h is filtered to desu.

I agree with you too. I dare say Awakening L+ is impossible beat without grinding.

>Seems like people default to grinding, which I don't think is fair
The game is literally designed around it. You get children at a point in the game where you should be running around with promoted units and it gives you like 15 level 1 units again that are STRICTLY stronger than their parents and then you get the skill system which encourages grinding through classes and then you have literally unlimited resources and level ups (to this day I cannot believe the devs misunderstood fire emblem so much that they thought this was okay) so the solution to any map that is hard is just grind until your stats are good enough.

The level design is even based around this. There's nothing like bringing in Nino or a peg knight who is vulnerable but playing smart and babying them up into being a monster. The maps are huge wide open places which make that kind of playstyle incredibly risky and the fact they can be grinded at no risk for an unlimited time makes it pointless. Main story maps you just make your meatgrinder deathball and clump in the middle of the map and let the reinforcements from all sides present in 90% of the maps just kill themselves.

Class swapping should be a limited affair.

No turning my pirate into a mage, or my cleric into a wyvern rider. You should be able to reclass like once using a special item that you get a few of, either to make up for a deficiency in your roster or just for shits and giggles.

Maybe make it so that beating the game on hard lets you have unlimted reclassing or whatever as a reward, but being able to reclass any class on a whim is stupid and just feeds into min maxing. I played FE12 and I never reclassed except once on my Avatar because he needed more speed and Cavaliers had a better speed growth than his original class. I did it for one missing then swapped him back to the original class I gave him. It felt dirty, min maxing an already OP character like that.

Green stats should be something really nice to look at end game, because you got a full strength speed swordmaster and he's wrecking shit. When EVERYONE has all green stats, even knights having capped magic, it just loses all meaning.

fucking this

Grinding is the antithesis of what FE is about, because it removes the need to be thoughtful about who you give EXP to and pick your units well.

On the otherhand, because of limited EXP I always turn into a powergaming faggot and refuse to "waste" exp on characters I don't plan on taking to the end game. It's incredibly irrational and I attribute it to my mild OCD, but damn is it annoying to get into a position where I HAVE to use my prepromote or the shitty unit the game throws at you on turn 1 in case you got your good unit killed late and need a replacement, cause that's like, 1/10th of a level from someone else he just stole.

Help I wanna get off this ride

Oh but unlimited grinding is indeed the antithesis of FE and I hate it and it's an awful alternative to the limited exp.
Arenas should only be on maps with a time limit if you ask me.

I really think they dropped the ball on the class changing. There are so many characters that can't remotely use their own alternate class, or their alternate class is just flat out better than the one they started with.

I would have so much more love for the new games if the alternate classes were viable and had alternate sprite art, ala Ike becoming a lord.
>Camilla can become a sorceress
>CAMILLA IN SORCERESS GARB MMMMMMMMM SIGN ME UP
>Its flat

I kinda like the FE4 system, where each character can fight in the arena a certain number of times ensuring that everyone gets SOME EXP, and no limited deployment meaning it isn't like later FE games where half of the roster never sees the light of day

This is why I ulatimately despised Fates. Awakening pushed this stuff, but it had a clear goal for what it was trying to do. But with Fates, it's pretty obvious that the original draft was about the other royal siblings and just Nohr and Hoshido, but then they added Corrin to the mix for the sake of a player avatar, added Azura to try and make her a new face of the game like Lucina was for Awakening, and then tossed in Lilith and all of her dimensional fuckery for the sake of My Castle and the children units. And then they proceeded to put all the focus on these additions instead of fleshing out the original story draft that they hired a new fucking guy to make for them to begin with. (If they even did any work on it at all, since in Japanese, the nations don't even have proper fucking names)

This is why I have shaky hopes for the new game on Switch. They could get all the talent to make a Path of Radiance tier world and plot again, but then everything else that gets in the way of good writing will get dumped on top of it and bury it under all these bullshit gimmicks like online connectivity and baby dimensions and skill minmaxing and not to forget whatever Outrealm bullshit they decide to pull for the sake of cheap fanservice that only serves to water down whatever experience the game's setting could have granted by itself. (Like Awakening characters being here for no good reason.)

Because its literally waifu sim with battles thrown in.

Story of fates was garbage and awakening was barely better.

its all down hill thanks to this waifu shit.

Forgot image.

...

You know what grinds my gears the most about FE?
How the game (almost) always gives you three Pegasus Knights with a triangle attack.

I've only ever used all three in one game, FE12, because the three were actually all great AND available early on. All the other games either give you the Pegasus Knights one at a time or one or two of them just suck balls, and sometimes both.
It's really hard to justify bringing more than a single Pegasus Knight because they're very hard to raise relative to other units, and even with levels are still extremely fragile, so unless they're exceptional units they're just benchjuice.

Kinda hate it honestly. Pegasus Knights should be good (fast flier with spears) but have to deal with having absurdly low Con and getting one shot by archers even if they're 5 levels up over the archer until you get the one Delphi Shield the game gives you near the end.
So Pegasus Knights are either OP or useless, no in between.

Yes, but you don't have to use the kids. There's a bunch of stuff in Awakening you don't have to use that will break the game in two, like those shops you can summon where you can buy rare stuff like brave and killer weapons.

I agree the map design is bad, but it isn't related to the grinding; you could grind in Sacred Stones and make it into even more of a cakewalk than it already is.

And using Nino in FE7 is optional too; in the same way using Seth in in FE8 is optional. Using Nino makes it harder for you, and using Seth makes it easy for you.

Playing these games efficiently to beat it in the lowest amount of turns just isn't fun for me, and neither is grinding or utilizing mechanics that will make the game play itself for me.

Camilla should have come with berserker as her second class because it really fucking sucks marrying her to arthur every run because I refuse to use wireless features to get her to A+ with Beruka, which also means that Camilla naturally absorbs a ton of exp given that arthur can't hit the broad side of a barn nor take a hit, so Camilla has to be the one in combat.

God damn Beruka sucks as a name.

speaking of which, I hate how pairup makes it so that some units (like Charlotte) basically only see use as stat backpacks for Royal characters

But is it though? I've tried to beat Awakening with a no-grind playthrough, trying to make things "fairer." I got up to Chapter 19, Walhart's first map, but I dropped it due to lack of interest, since Fates had come out.

So I'm not experienced enough in Awakening, but from what I played, I didn't feel the need to grind out supports, or use the exp and money dlc.

I just feel that as bad as the map design is, there might be something of merit in Awakening's gameplay, and everyone just grinds and ignores it. But like I said, I haven't played enough to test it.

I wouldn't make any assumptions about the original draft; who knows what Kibayashi's original plans were. I've heard that Gooron was always a part of his draft, and everyone hates Gooron.

IS does it sometimes, but they don't put the work in. Odin has unique colors as a samurai and swordmaster, for example.

Her name is supposed to be Belka. Why does the english localization turn it back into romaji. Treehouse wears pants on their head.
Charlotte is my favorite character in Fates, its hurts my soul that there is no good axe characters aside from MC.
It shows extremely hard once you reach the lategame. Just like how Fates becomes godawful in the lategame where every enemy has a silver weapon and massive str/skill/speed regardless of their class, disregarding all the fucking ninja masters and staff wielders that fuck your formation's ass.
I thought most character get unique colours regardless of class? If they don't then wow ok guess it runs deeper than I thought.

Oh I don't doubt there was still some dumb bits in the original draft, but I just can't shake the feeling that Corrin, Azura, and Lilith don't belong here at all. Almost every inconsistency and plothole you can find in Fates is ultimately traced to these three and Valla. Their designs are so drastically different from everyone else for no given reason besides special snowflake statuses. Everything to do with them gets forced for a short moment and then gets forgotten and the rest of the plot forgets those moments ever happened. I swear the royals were probably going to be the real protagonists, possibly in a Radiant Dawn style progression where you switch parties frequently or get to choose routes of who to play as like Sacred Stones, or maybe a combination of both. Corrin sticks out like the biggest sore thumb in everything here and if you just removed Corrin, Azura, Lilith, and most of Valla itself (Anankos can probably stay, just leave all that curse bullshit out) then we could have had something really wort salvaging here.

Daily Reminder that Awakening saved Fire Emblem from Nintendo killing it like they did with Metroid and F-Zero

The Beruka-Belka thing was pretty weird (not the worst localization thing though) but I still found the autistic assassin cute and useful even though she is pretty much outclassed in Conquest by Camilla from the start.

The whole Valla thing was really poorly handled, and the game might've been better off without the "almost everyone is happy" route desu.

How well did FE12 sell in Japan? It might've been that if Awakening bombed internationally that Nintendo might've just kept FE for the true Hoshidan Nihongos and not for the gaijin scum.

>redhead
>long, braided hair
>green eyes
>respectable armor
>butt capes
>axe
Holy shit. I'm usually not much of a waifufag, but she ticks all my boxes. Is her game any good?

Most units do get unique colors for their base class, and one of the promotions. There's a couple who don't, I think Hisame doesn't have a unique promotion outfit, but could be wrong there.

Its pretty lame though; Selena only gets her signature red outfit as a Bow Knight. Promote her to a hero, and she gets the generic blue. That's a downgrade from Awakening, where she got red as both a Hero and Bow Knight.

And generally, everyone only gets it for the base class, not for the reclass. Takumi's another one; he gets Sumeragi's outfit as a Swordmaster.

And they messed up in Awakening too at times; Gregor lost his green palette no matter what class he promoted to, which was super lame.

Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn are two of the best in the series.

She's one of the main characters in FE9 and FE10, and yes, many people say they're the best in the series.

She's Titania, and she's one of the best units in the games.

Primarily because of the waifushit. The game gave way to an autistic matchmaking simulator because the only way to resurrect the dying franchise was to let virgins fap to it.
Above means the cast can no longer consist of interesting characters, but must instead consist of marriage material
Stupid, impossibly stupid plot contrivances to let you use your kids from teh future.
Above means no late-game recruits at all.
Pair-Up is overpowered, and frankly ridiculous. That sort of thing literally belongs in Disgaea, not Fire Emblem.
MyUnit fucks with the immersion, and basically only exists so you can fuck your waifu
All characters can endlessly reclass, making choice irrelevant since everyone is going to cap everything anyways
No matter how good the shitty models get, they will never be as good as the GBA sprites.
(Tell me ONE model animation as good as the Paladin Crit)
Fates
>Instead of making one game with a fuckton of content, let's make three games that the goyim must buy!

>warrior turning into a tornado crit animation
Why did we ever go away from this?

Fire emblem would have gone the way of advance wars if it didn't pander to the waifu obsessive culture that permeates through japan and weebs in this day

nostalgia

...

yes her game is the best and she's the best

You're right, FE has been and will always be shit. Thanks for the insight.

Here's a game that is everything that Fates tried to be, but far superior.

You guys should play this.

I feel your pain
I have a soft spot for them and always keep them on my team for killing blows to up their levels whether I know they're going to be useless or not
They either need to buff them to make up for the weakness to archers or nerf the strength of the archers to them, it's not like you won't already have deadly mages to fuck you over

Honestly I'm not sure, Nintendo seems awfully fickle about what IPs they push that aren't Mario, Pokemon, and Zelda.

The GBA/GC games did just fine it was the shitty DS remakes that nearly killed the series when they should have continued down the path they carved out for themselves

>The GBA/GC games did just fine
No, the DS games sold more.

I thought pair-up was garbage and never used it, why wouldn't I want to move with two units? I also didn't bother to grind because who has time for that shit

as a result, the game was really fun for me. I think most of the hate comes from how easy it is to break over your knee, but if you just don't do that, then hey. It's like punishing SMW for being able to beat it in 6 stages or use the cape and fly over everything. You're not really playing the game, not really experiencing it, certainly not the way the designers intended. Yeah, they left in those obvious exploits of the system, but just DON'T, and then it's all good.

>The 3 knights triangle attack in 6

Why make 3 shitty characters and give them a triangle attack

for what purpose

(Wendy can sometimes be not shit)