Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks

Were these really the worst Zelda games? Do they get a pass for all their flaws just because they used the Wind Waker artstyle?

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No, they were still better stories with more innovative gameplay than Minish Cap and Skyward Sword.

Phantom Hourglass was good. Spirit tracks tried to be phantom hourglass and failed. They aren't the worst Zelda games.

Most of the flak they get is for the forced touchscreen controls.
Once the romhacks that implemented actual button controls came out, those games went into very solid 7/10 minimum.

SS had a decent story apart from the Demise retcon-type-thing.

>liking phantom hourglass more than spirit tracks

Temple of the Ocean King is the single most brilliant dungeon in the entire series and none of you fucks will ever get another thing like it again.

Nah, they come after Skyward Sword on that list.

I did have a lot of fun with the Phantom Hourglass multiplayer though.

Phantom Hourglass was bad. I had no desire to do any of the optional content or even replay it.
Spirit Tracks was decent. It fixed the problem of having to go through the same dungeon over and over and had a slew of other fixes.

>fucking flute puzzles
>Tedious train riding
>tears of light bullshit

Spirit tracks had too many flaws. I really wanted to like it and I do still think the story was interesting but it wasn't very good

I genuinely enjoyed it despite everyone else hating it. People always complain about going back to the same places, but I like the feel of having shortcuts based on the last items you got.

This

Is Spirit Tracks Zelda one of the better Zeldas of the franchise?

>Play spirit tracks
>Key item requires you blow in the mic every time you use it
>Stop playing spirit tracks

That's the definition of a bad gimmick.

dungeon designs in PH was top tier

>doing the same dungeon 35 fuckin times
This is the single flaw that tears down phantom hourglass to SS tier

ST is objectively worse than PH

>and none of you fucks will ever get another thing like it again.

Yes, I can't even call it Zelda.

I played Spirit Tracks with cheats that made the train go at like 20x speed and even then it was barely tolerable. The train somehow managed to be even more of a glorified level select menu than Wind Waker's sailing.

> tedious train riding

How is that any worse than sailing in Phantom Hourglass? It makes 80 percent of the map worthless because people will always attempt to draw the fastest route.

The Train Overworld is unironically my favorite Zelda overworld in the 3D games.

While I agree the dungeon was a bit too long, I genuinely felt accomplished when I beat it and it was very clever at parts. The same dungeon essentially played as a different dungeon depending on the items you had.

I'm still pretty salty about Minish Cap, because the version they released for Europe/Australia was based on an earlier build of the game and had a fuck load of bugs that made it impossible to 100%.

>objectively
>rolling is done by double tapping instead of circling at an extreme like in PH
>central dungeon no longer has a time limit, no longer kills Link when it runs out, each floor only needs to be explored ONCE
>train cars have set locations, where ship parts were completely random in PH
>first game where Zelda gets to do something, and is a great companion instead of another Navi reskin
>objectively

>all the faggots who complain about the controls

Git gud doesn't even apply when there's not much to git gud at.

WW
PH
ST

Trinity of SHIT

See that's where you're wrong, I really liked the exploration aspect of the sailing. Finding new islands was great. But being forced to see the same shit over and over in ST was agony. Especially since dying sent you back to your starting point

There's a patch for EU version on romhacking.

I liked looking at the environments in ST. Only time I felt the same in PH was the DS island and the Whale one.

Spirit Tracks is my favorite Zelda despite its tedium with the controls. I enjoy trains, it has great music, also has the best Zelda/Link relationship to date.

I loved spirit tracks and the sacred duet leading into the final boss battle and the music was one of the coolest moments in video games.

What do you think you're doing posting this sick filth

>hand holding
YOU SICK FUCK

>and none of you fucks will ever get another thing like it again.

the tower of spirits is basically a second attempt at a large central temple of the ocean king-like dungeon, except infinitely less tedious and with good music

daily reminder that this nauseatingly lazy piece of """music""" was 90% of phantom hourglass' soundtrack, including the temple's

youtube.com/watch?v=mjRxMqAak4s

I just wish there was more to do on the train. It got soooo boring

Is this blue board appropriate?

>ww
>not SS

>hear the first 2 seconds
Oh god, that gave me PTSD flashbacks right away

MODS

>missing out on this glorious motherfucker
>That boss fight where he's possessed by an eldritch abomination

and for comparison,

youtube.com/watch?v=cFicX8wzCNM

i'm so glad phantom hourglass' composer was gunpei yokoi'd

Phanton Hourglass is awful. Even worse than SS. Spirit Tracks is alright once you get used to the controls.

>people bitch nonstop about how tedious and terrible it is to repeat it after every dungeon
>go in expecting the worse
>pretty decent dungeon gameplay
>phantoms are a pretty okay invincible anyway, can temporarily disable them
>go in for repeats
>you can fucking teleport to the last place you left off
>new items and weapons turn a 15-minute dungeon into a 2-minute stroll to next area

I will never understand people's contempt for it. I get that Spirit Tracks made it way better but just having them all be different levels of a tower but it's still absurd that people bitch this much over basically nothing.

Worse Zelda games than PH and ST?

There's a lot. Faces of Evil, Wand of Gamelon, Zelda's Adventure, Adventure of Link, Triforce Heroes, Four Swords, Four Swords Adventure, Link's Crossbow Training, and even the original Legend of Zelda.

You make good points but the drawbacks of ST were greater than the highlights. It was the opposite for PH which is why I think PH was better.

This game deserved to be more popular. I'm upset that phantom hourglass and trains(even though they're the coolest shit) turned so many people off this before they even gave it a shot.

Linebeck was legitimately the best part of PH.
>tfw he was shafted from HW

Don't fucking talk to me about spirit tracks right now Sup Forums.

>Decide to sell PH and ST in complete packaging/manual/cart on ebay for some extra cash
>Put on bid, get about $65 for both together
>Buyer asks me to ship it out this week because they have some chemotherapy session and they want it for the hospital
>Say i'd try my best but no promises
>Gives me this cancer sobstory I never asked for
>Ship it out in a simple cardboard box and packaging tape just before Valentines
>Come home today
>Seller has asked for a refund
>Read notes
>Items were damaged on arrival
>Leaves me this huge fucking essay about "You need to learn how to pack items" and recomends a bun ch of high quality fed ex boxes and prices, and this high performance tape, and a list of post offices
>Her complaint is that the box was broken into and this wasn;t safe, So I need to refund for damages
>Ask her if the games play and are intact, and mention the fact that the item was used, and I need pictures for proof.
>"As I am currently being treated for cancer and just had surgery and am a great-grandmother I am not able to take photos. I do not have the equipment or know how."

Bull fucking shit. I know Ebay sides with the customer, but unless shes posts some fucking proof of those games not working I'm not giving her a single fucking cent.

This is wrong

Ghost Zelda is best Zelda.

>handholding in a Zelda game
YOU SICK FUCK

DELETE THAT SHIT

Ghost Zelda is my waifu.

>this music
I tried to repress this memory

Both of them deserve to be buried, forgotten, and never spoken of again unless it's pointing out how no Zelda game should be like them.

youtu.be/GXfM9lgzr0M

> phantom hourglass' composer was gunpei yokoi'd

which one? Wikipedia lists two, and they're both still contributing to games.

i wholeheartedly agree

phantom hourglass is, in my opinion, one of the worst mainline games (zelda or otherwise) that nintendo has ever developed, it's an insult to zelda and entirely unworthy of being the direct sequel to a game as stellar as wind waker is

spirit tracks, on the other hand, takes all of oh ph's poorly implemented concepts and mechanics, fixes them and fleshes them out, has a much better plot, a much better companion, better bosses, a far more interesting overworld, better npcs, infinitely superior music, etc.

i genuinely don't understand how it's possible to prefer ph

youtube.com/watch?v=R7FxKCsz9Fg

You rescued her, right?

>Were these really the worst Zelda games?
Yes. Even CDi have humor value going for them.

Also, Ghost Zelda is almost as overrated as Tetra. She's a whiny caricature of a shit.

Hysterical!!! My sides!

>a far more interesting overworld

Yeah, but the travel method sucks dick compared to PH.

I wish I could agree but the main part of ST (the train) was just so terribly done. If there had been something to do I might have liked the game more. Also fuck the flute songs

youtube.com/watch?v=5W_bFLwB0WY

objectively superior to ph's """overworld""" """"""theme""""""

I really wanted Linebeck being represented in Zelda again. The campiness of the Toon Zelda games are one of the reasons I like them a lot. Tetra, Linebeck, and Ghost Zelda really made those games for me.

Fuck, this takes me back

I liked both PH and ST. I thought ST was better since the temple of the ocean king was redundant. Not sure why these 2 get hate though unless you tried to emulate them.

best music from PH

youtube.com/watch?v=1yLO6w7HDLE

I'm glad it got a Smash Bros remix
youtube.com/watch?v=ydpz1RSPeDs

So good. If only I had a boat

A FUCKING WHALE

Ghost Zelda is such a magnificent bitch, I love her.

Im a little pissed they didnt at least have a maraca to substitute the chug chug

bruh what? ST's overworld theme is great and all but you can't top this shit

youtube.com/watch?v=O8oLQzGQplY

youtube.com/watch?v=7plKQ4T0980

i mean listen to how terrible this is

a completely unimaginative, uninspired, cheap, lazy knockoff of wind waker's glorious overworl theme

see

It's mostly a knockoff of the Great Sea's theme, ST's is better for being a lot more creative

now let's compare boss themes

youtube.com/watch?v=B0sves087iU

PH gave us the best boss theme of the entire series
youtu.be/nZ6pz2iXBQ4

vs. this shit

youtube.com/watch?v=UGSxZBe6Uic

how could anyone POSSIBLY defend this garbage game

>people in this thread arguing over music because they know both games are fucking terrible outside of that.

>thread turned into PH vs ST

We can all agree Bellum >> Not-Ganon though, right?

All Zelda games are dogshit, zero challenge, not engaging, simple puzzles

Wrapped in cutesy elf pixie hero wrapping paper

Aside from the music and artwork, it's Nintendo's weakest franchise

>get a free pass because they use WW art-style
more like a Zelda game gets a free pass if it doesn't use WW's art-style. See TP which has even easier dungeons and bosses than WW but gets praised for whatever reason, still trying to figure that one out.

This. Grow up and buy a real game, like Horizon: Dawn of War

The polarization and the timing of these comments are great

You should've bailed the second you got the cancer sob story.

Oh yeah, Bellum was a much better boss than Not-Ganon. Dunno what they were thinking with that.

I'm replaying them starting with Phantom Hourglass. See if they still hold up

How can one man's taste be so wrong

my vote goes to 4 swords
fuck that game

I think we can all agree on that. Freeing Linebeck is one of the best things I've done in the franchise.

youtube.com/watch?v=bhH0ERkZlfk

this is far better

It'd be better without the backbeat of farts

I like the Great Sea theme in WW and I really like this over world theme in ST. Good shit.

Honestly, that's not even in the top 5

Minish Cap was better than both Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks. It felt like a 2D adventure game; the DS games felt like a constrained mess with ugly and dull textures and annoying menial tasks throughout (Temple of the Ocean King being the biggest offender).

I like it, but it doesn't really feel 'Zelda'

youtube.com/watch?v=CMD8dd0xPHk

find me a piece of music in ph that even rivals this majora's mask-ish composition

i dare you

As someone who just did, They don't. YOu'll be pulling your hair out by the third visit to the Temple of the Ocean king. It's like Sup Forums turned off the bad parts in their brain and only remember the good. Retrecking the same temple grounds 4 times is not fun, or engaging.