Daily hotline miami 2 hate thread.
What the fuck were the devs thinking when they wrote the plot?
What was the purpose of so many characters who do absolutely nothing? Starting with the actor who dies (fun fact: A majority of people didn't even understand he was dead for real because of how poorly directed the scene was) 2 levels in. How did they fuck up so hard?
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>What the fuck were the devs thinking when they wrote the plot?
Thy thought they were like Quentin Tarantino of Vidya
I just can't get over how they made the executions feel so buggy in the 2nd game
>playing hotline miami 2 for the story
>implying the story is that bad as far as games go
W E W
>Daily hotline miami 2 hate thread.
You lie, there's literally been zero Hotline Miami threads for months now. You probably only made the thread because of the sale going on.
The story is terrible, there are way too many characters and most of the arcs save for Beard's are literally pointless. But even then, the gameplay is also terrible because of all the restrictions they included this time.
I've been making one for 3 days actually
Why play HM2 when you could play DEADBOLT?
hotline 2 is an all round improvement on hotline 1, apart from the executions are just a tad slower which makes them feel shit. other than that everything is a direct improvement over hotline 1.
>way too many characters
Not an argument
>gameplay terrible
It was alright but I get the complaint about the levels being too big. But still it was a fun ride.
>le everyone dies so nothing mattered lol ending
fucking trash game.
>tfw this is the exact same plot as the first game
hmmmmmmmmm
>Not an argument
Yes, yes an argument. Having too many characters in such a contrived "space" is absolutely terrible for storytelling purposes, especially when most of these characters don't actually provide anything in terms of plot. Let me fucking repeat this: There's a character at the beginning who's entire purpose is to die without doing anything else, he is never again mentioned or referenced in the film, he is simply killed off both literally and figuratively. Then the game tries to introduce other group of characters as protagonists and it kills them after 5 minutes, again without achieving anything on the grand scale of things.
Not at alll, hm2 throws around a bunch of restrictions and shitty mechanics like the reload from the soldier levels, hm1 had much more freedom
Sorry meant game* instead of film (I was thinking about the in game movie) and 5 missions instead of minutes.
>Yes, yes an argument. Having too many characters in such a contrived "space" is absolutely terrible for storytelling purposes,
If given enough care a large cast of characters can be a benefit.
>don't provide anything in terms of plot
Isn't that the point though? That what they do ultimately doesn't matter?
Again I'm not saying the plot is that great, but when it comes to video games the plot of hm2 is fine.
The plot is an absolute masterpeice imo
>A majority of people didn't even understand he was dead for real
That's exactly the point of Hotline Miami as a series
You can barely tell what's real and what's not
In the first game the phone calls were not made clear whether it was real or not
Beard's campaign was unclear whether they were delusions (because at the end of each mission he kept saying things like "mowed the garden" and "went to the store" implying he might be in real life)
It's not clear whether the Russian racism was justified or unjustified by Jake
It's not clear whether Richter really was the hero he made himself out to be or whether he was just lying Usual Suspects style.
It's not clear if the writer is a good guy or a bad guy given the bonus level.
It's not clear whether anything is real or not or whether you're on the right side or the wrong side, it only matters how hard you fight.
>What the fuck were the devs thinking when they wrote the plot?
Who the fuck cares about that shit when you have bombass music and awesome gameplay.
I skipped every dialogue in both games t b h .
>If given enough care a large cast of characters can be a benefit.
They were not given enough care, they were just thrown in there, the game didnt know what kind of story to tell.
>Isn't that the point though? That what they do ultimately doesn't matter?
Again I'm not saying the plot is that great, but when it comes to video games the plot of hm2 is fine.
No, fuck off with that, that's an excuse to mediocrity "LMAO THE PLOT IS TERRIBLE BECAUSE NOTHING MATTERS BUT ONLY IRONICALLY XD!" theres a fuckload of games with better plot
You kind of have to care when youre forced to watch cutscenes constantly, have to do stupid shit in the levels because of story, and are locked to 2-3 play styles per level because of the story
No the first game's plot was you figured out nothing matters and you don't' die.
>implying people play videogames primarily for their award winning narrative
Thats bullshit to excuse mediocrity. The fuckload of characters were just thrown in there because the writers didn't know where to take the plot. You could remove every single arc on the game except Beard's and it wouldn't have any impact on the game world in general. It should have been a prequel focusing on beard
Gameplay is still shit because it's inconsistent as fuck and horribly balanced.
You can say the exact same thing about the first game
Its okay if you don't understand the story brainlet, we can play cooking mama instead
Wasn't the point of the game that people get caught up in the little things, and they miss what's important? Doesn't seem particularly nihilistic to me.
>hating on Cooking Mama
I'll fite u irl
>Wasn't the point of the game that people get caught up in the little things, and they miss what's important? Doesn't seem particularly nihilistic to me
Really makes the brain function in a way that can be described as contemplating a position put forth by another human being, which in turn makes you realize something you never even considered.
No you cant. The first story has a consistent gameplay mechanic: Masks, and every mask in available on every level and MOST of the standard masks are balanced and level design is balanced around them so you can always maintain a reckless playstyle.
HM2 has a fuckload of inconsistent mechanics that restrict the player.
There are 4 guys who have absolutely no bonus skill (The actor, the nameless mobster, pardo and richter)
There are 4 different skills akin to the first game which are only available for 4 levels (the fans)
There's a HORRIBLE weapon selection that FORCES YOU to keep that weapon for the entire level while giving you an extremely slow amount of ammo that can only be reloaded once you're completely dry, and you only get 10% of the ammo you had at the start. Also the levels are not balanced around this limitation and you'll totally need the gun to clear them
Theres 1 guy with 3 skills from the first game, 2 of which are pretty much useless (jake)
theres one guy who's only mechanic is to not being able to use lethal weapons, again levels are not balanced around this and you NEED to adopt a "bait and switch" playstyle where you just peek a door and bait enemies 1 by 1 into chasing you
and theres 1 guy who is a rehash of the 4 fans.
All of these mechanics are scattered across the game and locked from each other, it's a game with no identity
Ok I'm just going to be blunt, I don't care enough about the story to find every single character inconsistency or plothole, as it's a mess to even comprehend the order in which the events of the story takes place. And I don't go into videogames based on the premise I'm going to get a good narrative, when that narrative is only a framing device for the gameplay to take place. And I agree with all your points, I just don't care enough to think about the implications of them, in a GAME. If I wanted to play something that had a good story, I'd do that. For everything else I could care less.
The post you quoted has absolutely nothing to do with plot, it's listing actual gameplay limitations
k
Things like "mowing the lawn", etc are most likely code phrases, not a reference to actually mowing the lawn. This is a common practice when speaking via radio where you fear that someone may intercept it.
This conversation is about two years too late. I didn't mind HM2, and the music was good. I'm way into the entire presentation and aesthetic though, and I won't pretend that doesn't heavily affect my opinion of the game.
Yeah this. At his last level he even says "fuck it" and drops the code talk and directly requests for an medical evac. You'd have to be a retard to even believe that he might have been hallucinating
If you have been making these threads for the past 3 days, and nobody (including myself) saw them - it means it didn't matter enough to get people in and comment.
You are trying to force your "hate meme" upon us.
Give it up user.
Consider the following scenario:
>War vet is crazy and having delusions going off constantly
>Delusions to the point where doing menial tasks like going to the store or mowing the lawn he's half in reality and half in dreams
>One day he enters a store and kills everyone
>Half-dead kid he murdered lie on the floor
>Kid is unable to speak
>Delusional Beard thinks kid is his comrade
>Says on phone "I need backup"
>Helicopter comes and he thinks it's to help him when in reality it's either the police or news
>His last moments are him delusionally believing that he's in a convenience store just like he always wanted
>(Of course as we know in Hotline Miami 1 none of that is real - he probably never even made it there)
>The bomb represents his impending doom when reality crashes through the door
I'm not saying that this is what happened per se, but I'm simply saying it's one possible interpretation that the devs intentionally thought out.
Hotline Miami is supposed to be dream-like and confusing and multi-interpretational depending on whether or whether not you use all the context clues.
They're so annoyingly slow, like when Pardo stomps on a guys face he slowly puts his foot on his head and the guys cranium just fucking explodes. Jake, Mark, and Pig Butcher's executions we're quick and they actually made me feel like I was curb stomping someone's head in. Also, why was bashing a guys head in with a pipe/club/bat etc. so fucking slow in the 2nd? In the first it was really quick and you really felt like you we're pounding some rooskie's head into dust. I fucking hate the 2nd one so much thank god for the level editor.
Loved 1 - couldnt get into 2. the simplicity of 1 was its charm. 2 is shit.
...
I just don't see what that would add in comparison to simply seeing a known character going through the war that set off the events of the games.
>"the writers"
literally two guys who did the whole game
"I can only play Tony"
the post
There is absolutely no indication of beard being insane. you could give this argument for the plot of every single game in existance. "Deus ex human revolution is just a mental fantasy of adam jensen's as he dies from the initial sarif attack"
funny enough, tony was the only guy I never used. so try again, faggot.
Faggot dufuq r u talking about. Do you seriously give a fuck about the story in a goddamn arcade game? Yeah it was confusing and not the best, and they constantly jumped back and forth in tine, but the whole game is 8bit in style, making it very difficult to tell a story when you can barely tell what people look like. And the scene where the actor gets killed with the prop gun is pretty clear about what's happening, you'd have to be pretty oblivious to not understand it, and how did u know that most people didn't understand it? Did u take a poll of people whole played the game and spammed left mouse button through all the cut scenes? Idk why anyone wouldn't skip all the cut scenes
it was a mash of all the ideas of plots they had for HLM sequels. so (the story) was shite cause it was a bunch of different games
I didn't think they were buggy at all, tho definately annoyingly slow, they'd always cancel out my combos and I'd have to play around them to keep my combos, wasn't very annoying after I figured it out tho. I was one of the people who climbed the leader boards, I got in the top 100 in a few hard mode levels
>There are 4 guys who have absolutely no bonus skill (The actor, the nameless mobster, pardo and richter)
"I need a crutch because I can't do the level otherwise"
>There are 4 different skills akin to the first game which are only available for 4 levels (the fans)
Seems to me you need a skill, tony maybe
>There's a HORRIBLE weapon selection that FORCES YOU to keep that weapon for the entire level while giving you an extremely slow amount of ammo that can only be reloaded once you're completely dry, and you only get 10% of the ammo you had at the start. Also the levels are not balanced around this limitation and you'll totally need the gun to clear them
>theres one guy who's only mechanic is to not being able to use lethal weapons, again levels are not balanced around this and you NEED to adopt a "bait and switch" playstyle where you just peek a door and bait enemies 1 by 1 into chasing you
Some levels are objetively easier with Tony or The Son with knuckles, since you can kill both the big black guy and the katana guy with little movement.
My point that you can only play tony still stands
>HM
>Can play most levels with whatever mask you want
>HM2
>Most levels have you forced into a playstyle
>No option to replay any level as any character once you completed it because lol fuck you why should we uncheck a box and let you have fun, just care more about the story, the ending's worth it.
How can you hate HM2, "Intermission" alone is as good of a story if not more than the first game.
I really liked all the little connections of the second game, and didnt mind the ending since it blends so well with the main menu. Expecting a very complex and long story when the first game already tells you two janitors made up the USA nationalist club is just dumb.
Also Martin (the pig), was there to show how Jacket had become an infamous assassin, "The Masked Maniac" as the press called him, having movies copy his animal mask motiff and the fans turning into vigilantes inspired by him, he died, nothing wrong with that.
Everyone else also ties into Jackets post HM1 shockwave, Pardo wants to be as famous as a murderer, Evan tries to write a book about the masked murderers, Henchman and the Son are taking back the illegal narcotic market from the colombians after his father gets killed by Jacket and colliding with the Fans.
Eventually Evan while investigating the masked murderers with some of Pardos help finds out about Ritcher and Jake
Beard is the backstory that leads to HM1 and background to Jacket.
Then the ending happens of course, but remember about half of the cast was already dead for other reasons.
Meele the whole level in one go is only so much fun. Every leve in HM can be done with variety, alas some choices are more difficult than others
R u retarded? The story is irrelevant and the gameplay was amazing, some of the best gameplay ever, it was very fast paced but it still worked (which is normally a problem in fast paced games, because it makes it too difficult to actually do anything), also despite it being 8-bit, it still had a way of immersing you in the game whenever you beat people with blunt weapons, it made you feel like you were actually beating someone to death.
Why the fuck do you keep mentioning melee?
Why can't I go to Hawaii and nunchuk soldiers to death?
Why can't I assault Russian dealers on their turf with a flamethrower?
Why can't I do a Pacifist prison break-out?
>And the scene where the actor gets killed with the prop gun is pretty clear about what's happening, you'd have to be pretty oblivious to not understand it, and how did u know that most people didn't understand it? Did u take a poll of people whole played the game and spammed left mouse button through all the cut scenes?
It actually wasn't because up until that point everyone's deaths had the same "Realistic" effect to it so there was no way to tell that his death was real. And no, I didnt poll all the players but I did discuss it with several people and they all got to the same conclusion.
>"I need a crutch because I can't do the level otherwise"
Crutch? No, those level are still super easy, hardest levels are evan's (playing pacifist) and the soldier.
You're just a faggot who's trying to blame me for having fun. Yeah im such a shitter because I expect the main unique appeal of the game to show up in every level, right?.
>Seems to me you need a skill, tony maybe
How is this indicative of playing tony? playing tony is boring, I used corey most of the time, even if I rarely used the dodgeroll.
>Some levels are objetively easier with Tony or The Son with knuckles, since you can kill both the big black guy and the katana guy with little movement.
Not the levels where you cant use them, faggot :,)
>My point that you can only play tony still stands
I literally criticized tony's playstyle throughout my entire post. Tony/evan/beard forces you to abandon the recklessness and just bait and switch enemies, just stand at a door frame until they come running at you, move the side and kill them when they give up the search. thats the slowest the game gets, why the fuck would you still insist that i like playing tony?
Guess what dumbass? Literally none of the story mattered, that was the whole point, they had all these characters out just trying to survive and help themselves, killing whoever they needed too. And by the end, the devs made the entire story irrelevant by killing every single character in the game, rendering the whole story pointless, they did that on purpose
Exactly the same as in the first game except this time around you're restricted to specific playstyles. See why I say its shit?
Maybe because it was done by two guys who couldn't think of how to balance every single scenario where you could cheese the whole level and feel cheated for the lack of challenge.
Maybe they put restrictions to build levels where you need to think your approach, even if by trial and error, to give the player a challenge and maximum satisfaction.
Maybe the game is not for everyone, but I did love the challenge.
tfw I only purchased it as a fuck you to the aus government.
They didn't do it on purpose, they simply ran out of shit to write.
>There are 4 guys who have absolutely no bonus skill (The actor, the nameless mobster, pardo and richter)
-Pardo has perfect aim, just like Rick in HM1
-Henchmen starts with silenced pistol, sorta like Richter in HM1
-Everyone moves a bit faster and combo windows are longer than default in HM1, so every character are half-Graham and half-Zack.
-(I might be wrong, haven't played HM2 in a while) Pig butcher can take one bullet hit like Rufus in HM1.
You do know that Evan goes into berserk mode if you ground execute kill 2 enemies with your fists?
Does anyone have the physical release?
All tru, and I learned to like the "restrictions", gave a challenge for the gameplay and made it more interesting, I assume the devs did that on purpose because some masks might've been overpowered in different levels, like the swans would be crazy if you could have them every level
>Not the levels where you cant use them, faggot :,)
There's two levels where you have to fight kata guy and big black guy with the son.
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Maybe Hard mode was to much of challenge for you kiddo, go back to playing tony.
Maybe you should get your closeted homosexual tendencies checked first, it can get worse as you get older.
The special editions with the vinyls looked pretty sweet, wish I could have gotten one.
>not liking the Pulp Fiction-esque style story
I'd agree that some character's feel pointless, the journalist and Jake (again) but the major players in the story have some interesting interactions.
I really enjoyed Richter, Fans and the Son's playthrough
>everyone dies so nothing mattered lol ending
>playing a game for the story over gameplay
they did this because they didn't want to leave any opening for a sequel.
>Yeah im such a shitter because I expect the main unique appeal of the game to show up in every level, right?.
Tony player spilling everywhere.
Your "I'm terrible at this game so that means the game is bad" is showing
>soldier and pacifist are the hardest levels
No they're not? You just think they're hard because they force you to change your play style and that triggers your autism. And you know that the pacifist can still kill people and play normally if you execute two people, after that they are some of the easiest levels. I would say the prison level and maybe a couple of Richters other levels are the actual hardest, or at least in hard-mode they are
I actually found Dead Ahead Hard Mode the most difficult. Goddamn four hours to finally get it done.
>Explicitly mentioned "playing evan as pacifist"
>"LOL WHAT A SHITTER YOU KNOW YOU CAN KILL 2 PEOPLE AND IT GETS SUPER EASY?"
>restricted gameplay
Oh no I'm being forced to act outside of my autism comfort zone. I HATE NEW THING
They are forcing you to switch your play style and give you a challenge, it wouldn't be very fun if you just choose the singular best mask and glided through all the levels like that, now would it?
Exactly, this guy gets it
> trial and error
Literally one of the selling points of the game, it's extremely difficult and you're not expected to survive, it's why you respawn immediately
>I used corey most of the time, even if I rarely used the dodgeroll.
"I never made it to Hard mode" Get to Death Wish hard mode boy
>stand at a door frame until they come running at you, move the side and kill them when they give up the search. thats the slowest the game gets, why the fuck would you still insist that i like playing tony?
You do know you can throw things right, you can also knock two or three enemies with one punch if they're relatively close. Don't blame tour lack of skill kiddie.
The story in two was great, the gameplay kinda sucked though. Too much of a focus on guns and more long corridors made it really frustrating.
Hotline miami 2 had a lot more objective flaws compared to HLM1 but the atmosphere and plot devices felt so much more developed and realized
Guns were fag shit in the first game and the 2nd looks focused on it. If I can't knife/katana through everything barring boss fights I ain't playing it.
The ending was a metaphor, they didn't "run out of shit to write" they were made famous from hotline miami, they wanted to make another game and make it better but they didn't want the only thing they did to be just hotline miami, they didn't want to overuse the genre until it becomes a shell of what it once was, they didn't want to create another assassin's creed or call of duty. So they vaporized every character in atomic fire and just fucked everything up to tell their audience that they are done making the games
GIt gud
>tell their audience that they are done making the games
>even though they made a mock-up for hotline miami 3 already
:^)
Yeah I honestly had to skip that one. The 4th screen just takes way too long and stopped being fun or interesting.
>>le everyone dies so nothing mattered lol ending
you mean real life?