What is it about TES that divides Sup Forums more than anything?

What is it about TES that divides Sup Forums more than anything?

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oblivion confirmed best TES

>what is it about a game setting that makes individual cultures and their societies unique divide /humanity/ more than anything.

Its the level scaling.

Is there any way to actually play the travels games? That and the old Doom RPG phone games are on my list of games I'd like to try again.

The level scaling was the worst thing about oblivion ( morrowind & skyrim both had it but it was more subtle).

Thankfully there was good mods to remove it completely or reduce it depending on your tastes.

It's a series that has a lot of possibilities, but the devs make sure to water is down for the lowest common denominator.

I basically got oblivion & skyrim knowing I'd be modding it to get an experience closer to whey I wanted.

If the base game is made to appeal to the casual that's fine by me as long as its highly moddable... I just hope tes VI stays that way and they don't try and jew the mod scene.

>oblivion confirmed best TES
This. It's pretty much axiomatic at this stage.

I feel like whoever is making the elder scrolls games are out of touch with game development. They genuinely feel like shit mechanically, to the point where I feel like it's a bunch of old dudes who barely have a grasp on game design spaghetti coding shit together and hoping it all works out.

>(morrowind & skyrim both had it but it was more subtle).
I still think Skyrim did it wrong. Unique quest rewards shouldn't be leveled. Also it would be kinda cool if a super bandit marauder murderboss looked different from a regular bandit.

Because the games have been dumbed down since Daggerfall and Oblivion and Skyrim babies are absolute mouthbreathing retards.

They have better gear, like steel plate or carved, but of course, not glass or daedric.

>to the point where I feel like it's a bunch of old dudes who barely have a grasp on game design spaghetti coding shit together and hoping it all works out.

That's Morrowind's development in a nutshell, you had a bunch of people with no idea what they're doing constantly going against each other while trying to make sense of the ramblings of a madman druggie and create a story out of it.

Because Morowind fans are absolute cancer.

Mmmm...
Overall I indeed think this is the case but subjectively I prefer Morrowind for the setting.
I just don't like the roman-medieval blend in Oblivion and I don't like the viking/nord setting a lot more.

Also you can thank Ken for removing the jungle out of Cyrodiil

fpbp

I don't think romans livng in a jungle would have been a good idea though.

Why?

Jungles are cheap gimmick to make things "weird". Nothing wrong with the environment of Cyrodiil in Oblivion. It was superb

What was shit was the absence of differentiation between Colovians and Nibenese.

Vivec

It was certainly a better idea than LORD OF THE RINGS: Elder Scrolls edition
To the point where the best parts of Oblivion is the original contents, like the Daedra beyond the obvious spire shapes

Fans of the older games are pctards

Fans of the later games are preteen consoletards

I dunno, I just think it would looks kind of bad.
Maybe if the Imperials aesthetic was a bit more developed it could have been good though.

Because they're genuinely terribly games that you can genuinely have a lot of fun in. Neo Sup Forums doesn't have the intelligence to handle that kind of cognative dissonance.

Plus normalfags love the games and act like they're hardcore roleplayers for liking them so that doesn't help either.

The "I MUST BE RIGHT" crowd just KNOWS due what they think is cold logic but in reality is process of elmination that any new game will be set in Elsweyr, Valenwood or Black Marsh. The latter being more annoying since morons try to claim it as Argonia.

Then the skub vs anti skub vs radiant skub circlejerk fights are always apparent

best lore, story, magic, and world
>morrowind
best quests
>oblivion
best xboxhueg map and ability to do anything
>daggerfall
best melee
>skyrim

prove me wrong, you can't

And a final reminder that Douglas was /our guy/.

>Jungles are cheap gimmick to make things "weird". Nothing wrong with the environment of Cyrodiil in Oblivion. It was superb
I agree with the jungle but while the environement of Oblivion is not a problem, I don't really like the Imperials aesthetic.
A very tasteless blend of medieval and roman aesthetics IMO but this is highly sujective and it don't makes Oblivion a bad game at all.

>best quests
>oblivion
>prove me wrong
quest compass

>Maybe if the Imperials aesthetic was a bit more developed it could have been good though.

What do you mean? Do you mean to imply that because they wear roman-style armor with roman-style aesthetics that they aren't jungle-y enough for you?

>Neo Sup Forums doesn't have the intelligence
>cognative

>playing melee in a game with magic

>playing magic in a game with melee

>frogposter
>self-awareness
Pick only one.

>game levels up with you
>boring realistic setting
>Dumb quick travel system

>It was certainly a better idea than LORD OF THE RINGS: Elder Scrolls edition
Fuck you for reminding me that Lord of the Rings will never have an open world rpg in the style of The Elder Scrolls.

reading this makes my brain hurt. Douglas Goodall sounds like an idiot.

I remember this from RPGcodex a few years ago.

He was the proto contrarian shitposter before Sup Forums managed to grow out of DESUDESU posting, a man all shitposters should strive for.

>Do I always choose the sarcastic response?

did this man predict fallout 4?

Open world games and RPGs in general have a tendency to encourage nitpicking over things like stats,loot and scaling.TES is highly detailed and therefore encourages high levels of pedantic analysis.

will tes ever have a sense of scale ever again?

"genuinely terribly games that you can genuinely have a lot of fun in"
Nonsense.
Except "so bad it's good" games, there is no "fun bad games".
There is only games with flaws normaly considered unacceptable that are good for other aspects.
The Elders Scrolls are good because they are the most genuine openworlds despite their (sometimes) bad graphics, poor gameplay and unpolished releases.
Altough I agree that neo Sup Forums has a less good opinion on them because of cognitive dissonance, they are too overly "self-conscious" to enjoy a game fun with flaws considered unacceptable in most videogame standards.

on that bright side, it'll never have an open world RPG in the style of the Elder Scrolls

The next game should take place in Thras and you can only play as a Sload

Daggerfall is the closest any dev has ever gotten to replicating the Gygaxian experience.

old games are too complex for normies
new games are to simple to be interesting

>Daggerfall
>complex

The problem with the series is that they never manage to put all the good stuff in one game. Every installment is a step forward in some way and two step backwards in another.
Since everyone has their own preferences in game mechanics you get really fucking angry fans arguing about which is the best TES.

yeah too complex for your typical "rpg fan" these days

>best story
>morrowind
Lore and story are different things. Morrowind's main story was boring if it's all you did. It only has any meaning when you've read every book and asked every faction their side of things, at which point it becomes very interesting until you realize that you have no impact on it and can only choose to kill Dagoth Ur or not do the main quest at all.

>ability to do anything
>daggerfall
Can't kill or steal from any major NPCs, can't charm and then talk to enemies, can't summon, can't command, can't make custom potions, can't repair or enchant your own equipment (only NPCs can do that for you), can't persuade NPCs, etc.

>best melee
>skyrim
Can't even attack while jumping or swimming.

Here's the real list:
>best lore, magic, and ability to do anything
Morrowind
>best side quests
Oblivion
>best class creation, main quest, faction system, and dungeons
Daggerfall
>best stealth archery
Skyrim
>best story
Redguard

I think this complaint segues into the penultimate complaint nicely: Learning about TES is more fun than playing TES. The lore has outpaced the gameplay in many respects. You can enjoy TES without any story or lore connections because of the autistic nature of how its played. You can sneaky stealy bow and shooty or huge guts smash or its magic I ain't gotta explain shit. Thats all well and fun until you open a single lorebook or talk to any npc. Some mook did it better than you and did it by explicitly breaking the "world". Your a good thief? Greymantle has influenced empires. Your a good paladin or fighter? Pelinial would make you doubt your righteousness and the Redguard can do nuclear fission. Your a good mage? The stars themselves laugh at your tricks.

The lore blows away anything and everything you will ever attempt. And it does it in enough style that you know you're not shit.

Skyrim did have a lot of scales.

>Lore and story are different things. Morrowind's main story was boring if it's all you did. It only has any meaning when you've read every book and asked every faction their side of things, at which point it becomes very interesting until you realize that you have no impact on it and can only choose to kill Dagoth Ur or not do the main quest at all.

Yes. Exactly. Achieving godhood is likely an hours long process that no one was willing to teach you in any case (and for good reason). There was no other outcome if you choose to enter that chamber. Either die or destroy the heart.

As for "there's no choice in all these quests, you choose to do it or not". EXACTLY. There are more than a handful of quests that are entirely sociopathic. The fighters guild's numerous examples of threatening people for protection money or the murder of innocent people because someone somewhere put a bounty on them. "Why can't I report these people or enact positive change?" you ask. Because Morrowind is a terrible fucking place. The Dunmer WORSHIP DAEDRA for fuck's sake. Their culture is built on anacro-capitalistic ideals. People are willing to hire you to do a job. If you don't like the job, or think that the job conflicts with your character, simply don't do it. In fact, they should leave Morrowind.

>Some mook did it better than you and did it by explicitly breaking the "world"

Sometimes I feel like the player character is an idiot.
Mankar Camoran used Merhunes Razor to alter his nature and become a Dragonborn. When I get the same artifact I can only use it to stab people.

Whats wrong with LOTR Online?
Beyond that: So far, Elder Scrolls is Elder Scrolls. Its a unique series, for many reasons, beyond the willingness to do the workload needed to even copycat it.

>you choose to do it or not
At least if you didn't like a job you could murder your employer. In Skyrim I can't even exterminate those filthy werewolves that lead the Companions.
They are still waiting for me in their secret cave.

>Level to like level 5
>Join mages guild
>Find a quest
>Enter my first "low level dungeon"
>End up reloading an earlier save, just to travel back to town, to buy Recall
>Set Recall on Entrance
>Clear the gigantic mess
>Get quest objective
>TP out
>Some later generated dungeons are 20-30x in size
It doesn't get more Gygaxian than that.
It was fucking amazing.
Even more so, that the shitty automap actually worked for navigation, to some degree

>skyrim
>more subtle
Still shit level scaling.

There are/were also an infinite amount of Mankar Camorans, so its expected. There's even one that sucks your dick for sustenance. I'd like to see some sort of metalore thing happen on screen. Watch the empire transform and here Septim's "I do this for you Red Legions, because I love you" actually voiced. Watch a reenactment of Vivec's story from the 36 sermons done in Dunmer theatrics. See the Numidium make Landfall.

Nothing exciting ever happens POV for the player, thats the problem with TES.

Arena still has the best combat.

>mfw you could actually parry an attack

Not disagreeing, oblivion just had it the worst.

Random bandits suddenly running around covered in glass armor was so damn immersion breaking.

Bandits in good armor was fine.
Being unable to earn wealth, to buy said armor was worse.
Instead of having some agency, you wait for NPC's with the next tier of gear to spawn.
And it gimps a lot of things.

It's basically a schism between the actual fans of the series, the older players who started with Arena and Daggerfall, and the younger teens on Sup Forums who started with Morrowind and are only fans of that game in particular

>Bandits in good armor was fine.
You understand that glass armor is something that costs tens of thousands of septims to have made, in universe, right? In Tribunal it took, what, around 100 pieces of raw glass for a full set and 50k-ish drakes?

If I remember correctly: 2000 for gloves, 3000 for shoulderpads, 10.000 for body, 8.000 for legs, 2000 for boots, helmet was 3000 or 4000.
So 35k-ish.

there's no way to access the whole world even if you play every elder scrolls game? how fucking stupid

Arena and ESO.

>Play Arena
>Can't access Cyrodil
>Play Oblivion
>Access Cyrodil

No, just Bethesda not knowing what's good about traditional RPGs. (or just not willing to care about)

>"[...] Arena and Daggerfall were way ahead of their time, perhaps too far ahead of their time. I felt Morrowind was a step backwards [...]"
>-D. Goodall
>Bethdrone arguing about how great [Oblivion/Skyrim/TESVI] are and why you should buy them

>not enjoying TES at its best as a modded survival simulator with dungeons thrown in for the hell of it

Well his Commentaries seems to imply that using his Paradise to be reborn was necessary. (At the very least, he was in Paradise)
A bit how his disciples are reborn just like Daedroth if they are killed in Paradise.
Paradise is destroyed when Mankar is killed "normally" (Probably because Mankar is like a sigil stone/ his daedric plane IS him yet he he still not a Daedra) so you don't have the opportunity to use the Razor in that way.
Mankar is also calling Mehrunes Dagon "Mehrunes the Razor" so maybe he used the teachings of the Mysterium Xarxes or Dagon himself instead.

Because it's long-running and popular. Most of the younger Sup Forums audience started with Oblivion or Skyrim and are surprised when they hear older fans of the series claim that Daggerfall or Morrowind are better. It's natural to get defensive in that situation because most people's first open-world Bethesda game really resonates with them, and to suggest that there's been a superior experience all this time that they missed out on is blasphemous.

It will stay divisive for as long as they keep making new games, but which games are generally considered the best and worst will continually shift forward as people age into and out of the target demographic.

could never bring myself to play that damn game because the characters all looked like mongoloids

Face mods are up there with level fixing and script extenders for TES mods. Essential.

>Daggerfall covers the least land of any mainline game
>has the largest map

I think morrowind is the superior game but oblivion is more pleasant to play overall once you mod out that scaling.

I don't know which one I should shill.

To be fair, most of its players are mongoloids as well.

>survival simulator
>combat is horrible
>everything else is done in menus that pause the game

nah

It's because it's a shit series that attracts nothing but casuals. You're either a shit-eating casual or you aren't.

Oblivion ruined the franchise as a result of its excessive level scaling. It wasn't even playable without mods.

DF probably has the best controls in the franchise. Once you remap, and if you stat your character right, you can fling yourself across chasms and do a mid-air roundhouse. It's fucking balls to the wall. Doomguy tier combat.

>sitting in a tavern, sorting through inventory, planning what to do next etc
>some NPC gets up and starts "sneaking" through the middle of the room
>he tries to pickpocket another NPC
>fails
>the two start beating the shit out of each other
>other NPCs lose their minds and run around screaming or join in the fight
>the thief dies
>all the NPCs go back to sitting around eating with a corpse just lying there

And that's why I love oblivion

Every time a thread starts people argue over if Oblivion or Skyrim are the worst.
youtube.com/watch?v=wm6FpvcOvC8

Oblivion is really charming. Despite the potatoes, despite the fundamentally broken game mechanics, it's a world you just want to be in.

Maormer WHEN

...

It's a quirky charm, for me it's the random/silly things the NPCs do/say.

Honestly, if they went back to the Iliac Bay, back in time, and featured sea-elves and sailing, the game would sell like fried chicken and waffles. The pirate motif is something they haven't really exploited despite being consistent with the world building.

Arena has Cyrodiil. It's just that it's only the Imperial City.

That's some hardcore autism, is it a TV show?

>teso maormer are just high elves with white skin
>no chameleon abilities or shimmering body

Pretty boring desu.

>Get the Skeleton Key from a guy who used it to hack himself to have every possible skill he could have all at once
>Player character only uses it like an unbreakable lockpick

I swear the Dragonborn is a neanderthal

>become the Archmage
>go to Riften and talk about magic with Wylandriah
>all dialogue choices are you having no idea what she's talking about

I just want the weird shit they write about in the in-game books to be explored a bit more, instead of just making it a typical antiquity/medieval fantasy game.

>TES games will never compare to the lore
It hurts

>Stealth Archers

Holy shit.

The lore of Elder Scrolls is so batshit crazy it works.

>Oblivion- wanting to join the mages guild
>have to get written authorization from all the guild halls by doing various tasks before you can even become a acolyte

>skyrim
>PSSSST... hey kid! you wanna join the mages guild dont ya? here cast a fireball... dont know it huh? here ill teach ya it... now cast it...good job kid! you are now officially in the mages guild!