M-muh balanced gameplay!

>unpredictable top light / zone attack 50/50 (near-guaranteed hit by one or the other every single time)
>running heavy (fine on its own but essentially a 33/33/33 as reasoned below)
>running heavy pseudo-feint (locking onto target) into top light / zone attack 50/50

>unbreakable shoulder bash vortex (if / when the stage allows, which more than half 1v1 stages do depending on which side you get)

>shoulder bash cancel into:
>guard break (untechable if the opponent attempts to dodge the charge, further complicated by the below mentioned mixups)
>top light (near-guaranteed hit if the opponent predicts the cancel and is expecting to tech a guard break or guards for the zone attack)
>zone attack (near-guaranteed hit if the opponent predicts the cancel and guards for the top light, or is expecting to tech guard break)

>non-canceled shoulder bash connect (by virtue of expecting any of the above and not dodging) into:
>top light / zone attack 50/50
>guard break, albeit techable
>environmental instant death, albeit rarely

>any feint into:
>parry if the opponent falls for it (fair enough)
>top light / zone attack 50/50

>any ill-gotten (as reasoned above) successful guard break into:
>environmental instant death
>wall throw (fair enough)
>throw into dash back into running 33/33/33 (as explained above)
>top light / zone attack 50/50

Put all together and this is pure cancer, but when you're maining any character without a perma-guard it is quite literally broken once you get past rep ~5 and start running into """gud""" wardens.

The skill, timing and risk required to pull off ANY of the above described mixups is disproportionately low compared to what it takes to counter them, more often then not it will literally come down to luck.

>inb4 hurrr a general-AI running at 666^666 gorrilion teraflops/μs could counter with XYZ!!1!1!!
>l-look mom, d-deus vult XDDDD

Other urls found in this thread:

youtu.be/7KXcnbmmTXM
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

>THERES PEOPLE THAT TAKE THIS GAME SERIOUSLY

Not to even mention the cancerous ledditors and souls autists who never play any of the other characters and unironically believe they're gud at the game by virtue of maining an unarguably broken shitter character designed in all likelyhood as promotional streamer bait.

That assertion being based on the fact that the warlord's headbutt cancel has been removed, meaning jewbisoft was evidently aware of the imbalance caused by canceling unblockables into guard breaks.

For what its worth I got it as a gift.

ubisoft doesn't give a shit, Siege was an anomaly

the general tends to agree that warden is kinda nuts, last I checked

hell, I stopped playing warden because of the sheer amounts of cheese in his pockets

Beta: Warden is the underdog, only true patricians play him!
Release: Wow fucking cancer go play a class that takes skill.
What happened?

no way

Servers just went down, Ubishit fucking up yet again

Am I the only one here that fucking hates every Asian class in the game? I swear this game is making me more racist than /pol ever could.

cockroach main

your tears are delicious.

I'm sure they are, cuz I'm salty as fuck!

Shitters refuse to learn how to dodge out of his vortex.

>B-but muh 50/50

His zone and top light are well within reaction timing, and the vortex is punishment for allowing yourself to get hit which can still be escaped 100% of the time.

...

I main Warden and Valkyrie.
Valkyrie is fun, but how am I supposed to choose her over Warden when it takes 4 hits for a Warden to KO and about five thousand for a Valkyrie?

Dodge out of vortex, lose half your stamina, he steps forward and restarts the vortex except now you have no stamina. You fucked ether way if they insist on doing the broken shit.

>escaping equals punishing

and what happens when the warden just keeps doing the vortex over and over and you cant do anything but run away? how are you going to win the match?

>Pick warlord or Shugoki
>Tank through hit and fuck their shit up
I'm a shitter and even I can get around rep 4 to 5 wardens. Speaking of which why is matchmaking such shit on ps4. my highest lvl is 16 yet everything game I am is rep 3 or 4 with epic/legendary gear

Maining Valk is hard, it feels like every single class I play is better. The buff helped so now I can do more then a single light to hit people atleast.

Most
youtu.be/7KXcnbmmTXM

He can only restart it if you allow him to land a hit on you user. Why are you allowing him to do that?

Good every class needs offense at least on Warden's level since every other matchup is just a turtle fest

you can initiate shoulder charge without landing an attack you fool. you're saying "just don't get hit".

You were punished for being hit that's why. punish the attack he uses to start it up with next time.

>he shoulder charges
>dodge or trade with it
>get free hit
wow so hard

If he even attempts that shit he won't be right up in your face. So backstep and either watch him use the charge and stop harmlessly right in front of you and smash his face in. or watch him whiff the GB attempt and if your quick back towards him you get a free GB.

Basically, people realized you can use his clearout as a normal move, and realized he's the only one that can cancel a shoulder bash.

The earlier alphas, when people didn't understand the game, people were mainly concerned about move versatility. But now that it's become clear that 90% of the moves in the game are useless, the game is more about who has a 50/50 or an unblockable vortex. And not many people have those.

>playing brawl
>teammate leaves immediately
>other dudes respect a 1v1
>... until the execution where I'm literally defenseless
>this is still somehow honorable

Just fucking gank me at that point, don't feed me your psuedo honor bullshit

Former Orochi main here, Shugoki is the most fun way to play the game

The amount of tears I get from baseballing niggas off a cliff, delayed heavy combos, and backbreakers are fucking delicious

I only play as Knights and, to a lesser extent Vikings because if given the choice I'd prefer to play as a white character who isn't a girl.

I think I can safely say all gamemodes in this are cancer.
gear stats are broken as fuck and class balance is abysmal so you'll consistently run into PK's Warden's and Conq's in 1v1's
The game could be great but ubisoft is just being awful.

if the opponents doing a long execution or has more HP than me I'm going to guardbreak interupt it. You preach honor and yet wish to heal.

The other night I dueled a warden two reputation ranks above me and I was playing as lawbringer and won. He looked a lot like the guy in that pic. He was really good and gave me a run for my money but ultimately I thrashed him 3/4 times in elimination.

Worthy fuckin adversary.

Theres always some faggot that says this.

What game are you supposed to take seriously? Or let me guess: youll just say "no game should be taken seriously"? Than whay is supposed to be taken seriously ever?

Theres no reason not to take a game seriously, ever. You can play and have fun and all that shit just as well or at the same time as you olay seriously. Playing "for fun" (aka: being a worthless player, or just generally doing nothing of worth in game or for the team if its a team game) is for people lower than mongoloids.

You can play seriously, and should at all times, and still have just as much fun/etc.

>why so salty?
>quit being such a tryhard
>why do you even care if we win?

Seriously I don't understand why people act like this. Why would you WANT to lose? It's a game: the object of which is to win. That's the whole point.

I always play games where I end up carrying a team of shitters with zero skill and zero common sense, who dont put forward any real genuine effort, and people honestly wonder why this is frustrating...I just don't get it.

If you canceled his and did it yourself then its unfair, just let him heal you pussy.

>tfw outplaying rep 6 Wardens as Kensei
They can't even get mad because they have twice as many tools as I do.

Same, but damn if it isn't a pain in the ass. You can practically never use the unblockable or helm splitter and almost always have to fake it or your ass gets parried. Fuck Wardens.

you sure? kensei can cancel his unblockable into a dash you know

I got no trouble against warden as nobu. I interrupt his approach/GB with a bleed enough times and he stops trying to cheese, only to realise that's all he's ever done so he ragequits.

Kensei really is the most reliable counter to wardens. A good Kensei will give the very best wardens a run for their money.

I get it sometimes, if you have a bad game and all your team mates are being cocksuckers saying your not even trying, gets old quick and nobody wants to deal with raging autism every day in a video game of all places

Don't understand why people bitch about warden. Never have trouble fighting them because I've played as one and know how to counter their shit. What they need to nerf is orichi just so fuckers will stop fucking playing him.
IM SO FUCKING SICK OF FIGHTING AGAINST ORICHI GOD DAMN IT

Orochi is just a slightly more complicated 50-50 class. Same shit as wardens basically

Because no one is playing this shit game anymore so they have to match you with someone

then play a real fighting game instead of crying that your party game is unbalanced

sage
reported
called the police

>Play Lawbringer
>Have to play perfectly by dodging, light attacking to interrupt, parry and anticipate every enemy move
>Moderate damage for a fuckton of stamina drain
>Can't swap stances fast enough to keep with the assassins
>The only true strength is to be the cheese king if the enemy opens up to be mangled into a wall/abyss
>No buff in patch notes

The law suffers.

This

>Honor

What a pathethic excuse to be a bird of prey. Truly the faggots call.

The smash thread is 2 threads down

This patch was just shit leftover from the betas. There was no way we were getting major class overhauls in patch 1. I imagine all the class balance stuff is exclusive to the second patch.

Lawbringer is pathetically slow, though. His main issue is that he's a character that excels only in depleting stamina in a game where having no stamina doesn't really matter.

How can people claim honor when you main
>Shugoki
>Orochi
>Nobushi
>Peacekeeper
>Conqueror
>New Valk
>WARDEN

Accept the game is about killing the enemy as cheap and fast as possible because it's a team game. There's a duel queue for fucks sake.

If it helps, they have stated that your 4v4 is strong but 1v1 is weak. They want to buff your 1v1 without making you broken in 4v4.

>depleting stamina
If Shove did 1/3rd of Stamina damage I could teach Orochi spammers the meaning of resource management

Sadly this isn't the case.

>dodging

Why though? You stay in top stance and you'll interrupt everything with a light attack. Your light parry gives you an undodgable, unparryable, unblockable heavy for a third of their health. Only bad thing they did was revert back to the easy counter guard breaks. Now he can't gb spam.

I don't give a shit about honor, I'm just more than happy to fight someone 1v1 because I can beat about 3/4 of everyone I fight, though I won't hesitate to double team someone if they've done it to me or someone else

Nobu, conq and valk are still honest. Law is cheap because he's so weak he needs ledges

>Gank people
>WOW YOU HAVE NO HONOR WHAT A FAG LET ME 1v1
>"Go to the Duel queue
>*Anxiety rises*
>xXxFagucCixxXX has left the session

There IS a duel queue.

Wouldn't matter anyway. Lawbringer relies a huge amount on parrying and guard breaks, while his GB range is the worst in the game. A stamina broken anything can just back off, and LB has no way of catching them because of how slow he is.

But anyway, his standard 50/50 is GB into side heavy (guarantee), shove, then the 50/50 is GB or Long Arm. Unfortunately the most you'll get out of that sequence is two heavies before your stamina bottoms out. Then it's back to overhead lights as your only option.

The core problem with LB and a lot of the cast is how the game heavily prefers 50/50s and unblockables on offense, because of how easy it has to be on defense for the whole system to work at all.

They dropped the ball primarily on one thing: combat is binary and things either work or fail completely. You don't slowly wear people down and break their defenses in For Honor. You just either deal damage or reset. And that's where 90% of the problems are coming from.

Delete peacekeeper.

>They dropped the ball primarily on one thing: combat is binary and things either work or fail completely. You don't slowly wear people down and break their defenses in For Honor. You just either deal damage or reset. And that's where 90% of the problems are coming from.

There is truth in this. The game rewards overly defensive play because attacking most of the time is super punishable, so the more I watch high level play, the more I see it being a turtle match. The reason why Conq and Warlords are so strong is largely because they can punish defensive play with a guaranteed hit if their headbutt/shield slam works. The others either have really telegraphed defense punishes or none at all so they have to rely on a mix-up game.

What are you talking about? Warden was at the top of pretty much every beta tier list

I chalk a lot of it up to their advisors being fighting game faggots that think plugging in standard footsie mechanics will work in any system. Even one where every attack rebounds and deals nearly 0 damage.

You think a stronger chip mechanic would balance things out?

It's not that they want to lose, it's that they know it really doesn't matter if they do. I always play to win but if my team's losses, no big deal.

No. You have to alter how parrying works first, since otherwise high level play will always orient around it.

Second (and this part you can't fix), attack combinations have to string together more often with more effects on the third or second hits. More importantly, they have to persist even if blocked, even against superior block heroes.

You'll notice now that no one uses standard attack chains. They just don't work. The thing everyone relies on is stringing together vortex chains that have unblockables, guarantees or GBs in them.

You fix that problem by giving more power to attack chains and making them have secondary effects that can do things like drain stamina, bleed through blocks and so on. But make them optioned on the second or third hit so you can choose to go for faster low damage or guaranteed effects or slower high damage, and so on. And have stamina mean something in the process. But you can't do all that because it would involve changing how animations string together, which is a pre-alpha issue that takes years.

A lot of people are saying to basically destroy the ability to defend yourself. For a game about stances, that's a terrible idea. Especially one with defensive, slow characters that attack 25% of the speed some others do.

Basically, the game is fucked. Either place the game in the hands of Assassins or Tanks. Make stamina mean something and make parries only stagger if the attacker has low stamina, or something similar. Not a lot you can do.

Ubi confirmed that Law will be getting buffed next along with Raider.

Interesting, what if parrying only guaranteed a free light attack?

Parrying guarantees a free guardbreak that can't be countered, so that's essentially a free heavy

>undodgable

Uh, no.

That unblockable heavy is fan-goddamn-tactic, and has been the deciding factor in many matches for me.

But it is most certainly dodgable. And it has cost me dearly when I missed.

If parries couldn't lead into a guaranteed GB, heavy or shoulder block, etc? Only a single light hit? Wouldn't matter. The game is all about guarantees. It would just make the game even slower, since damage output would be even worse.

Look at it from the perspective of the attacker, assuming your opponent doesn't WANT to attack, can perfectly tech a GB and will parry anything you throw out. What do you do? Answer: nothing. Feint so your opponent will just stare at you because they don't want to attack? Guard break into being teched? Throw out an attack and be parried into guaranteed damage, no matter how small?

That's why people accuse the game of being too defensive. Plus even if you land the first hit in an ordinary attack chain, the second can be blocked normally.

Yet if you fucked over defenses in For Honor, the game would be polluted with nothing but assassins (primarily Orochis, I guess) all spamming attacks as fast as they possibly can. It would just turn into a terrible 3rd person action game.

That's what I mean. Offense play is punished heavily because instead of trying to sneak out heavies, you can just parry-GB-Heavy.

What if a parry only gives you a free light and that's it, everything else is not free and just mind games.

>Pick Knights because they're the coolest and usually the archetype I float towards
>End up liking Raider and Kensei the most

Then the question becomes, how do you make defensive play rewarding, but not to the point that it is more preferable over offensive play?

This game is still alive?

This post is pretty close to the mark. Anyone who thinks FH has any competitive potential is delusional. The game is fundamentally broken.

The devs should have taken cues from Chivalry and Mount & Blade - especially with regards to parrying. Currently, there's no reason to ever combo because it just makes parrying you completely braindead. Instead, the devs should:

a) Introduce stamina drain on blocking and actually make running out of stamina do something - y'know, like chivalry.
b) Make landing a parry allow you to execute a faster but not guaranteed attack, along the same lines as ripostes in Chivalry or chambers in M&B.

Basically, all of the guaranteed damage for sitting around and parrying/GBing all day is fucking bullshit.

Barely, I give it a month or two until its pretty much dead

I've never had people dodge it. I just assumed they were stuck in a no animation state after getting a light parry.

It's hanging on. Soon it will be "alive" like R6S is. Essentially life support fueled by paying people to stream their game.

If you parry a LIGHT, I believe the LB's top heavy is guaranteed.

Siege has excellent daily peaks for a FPS. I don't know why you would come to the conclusion that it's dead.

>after a lot of tedious work finally drain someones stamina
>they keep literally all of their defensive options and are just as hard to hit
>even fucking better, they can tech guardbreaks are parries now too
No that's fucking GREAT, nothing like having no stamina be nothing other than a short fucking rest for the opponent

Also consider defensive heroes, who can't mindlessly spam R1. The game has to be rewarding for them, too.

Some people want to tighten up things like parry timing to the point that it's impossible for 90% of the population. But that's not really a solution. It's just elitism. And it won't change actual upper level player behavior, since they already had that timing. It would just ruin the game for most people.

My solution would be:

*remove rebounding from basic blocks (but keep on improved block characters like Conqueror)
*make parrying break attack chains only and lead into no guaranteed anything unless the attacker is exhausted
*if someone is parried below a threshold of stamina (TBD) they automatically become exhausted, but otherwise they're safe
*blocking heavy attacks now drains a lot of the defender's stamina
*when stamina is depleted and a hero is exhausted, they cannot parry and they have no i-frames on dodges or rolls, and cannot block heavy attacks, and take large chip damage through light hits

Something like that. Basically, parrying is fucking up most of the game. Stamina not mattering is fucking up a very large part of it. Attack chains just resetting is fucking up some of the rest.

This of course doesn't include all the vortex and 50/50 shit that's going on right now, which I assume will be fixed, since that's basically a "big 4" problem.

I hate to keep making the same comparison, but running out of stamina in Chivalry was a death sentence. It was also a good thing because it resulted in a risk-reward mechanic for weapon types. Mauls and Double Axes were slow, had mediocre feints and lacked range but they had great drags and obliterated your stamina if you tried to go blow-for-blow with them.

It's just the strangest fucking thing, as of right now stamina as a mechanic simply does nothing

Like as a game designer you don't just implement something that has zero impact on the rest of the gameplay, and yet here we are, there had to be a version of this game that made stamina management actually important.
Perhaps slowed your guard speed, or I don't fuckin know, not let you parry every attack anyway

If they slowed your guard speed, everyone would simply play PKs and spam guard switch + light attack.

you are like little babby

None of this will be changed because the playerbase is full of shitters and mongoloids. If you were to post that on the main subreddit right now, you would immediately be drowned out by 'git gud' posts.

Anybody who has ever played a melee game before, whether it was Jedi Knight, M&B, Chivalry, or whatever, recognised the core problems with the gameplay systems the second they started playing For Honor.

You retards fell for Ubisoft shills because you are functionally retarded. That is why no one talks about this game a day after release and numbers are dropping like a rock. Take this as an opportunity to learn from your mistakes and think for yourself.

If they slowed it enough any character would get away with it, and then not draining yourself out would actually be important

It would also buff lawbringer who is the king of robbing people of their stamina, currently a useless characteristic

>changing the unblockable into an uninterruptible
free heavies bois

What if they removed the combat wheel and the game was more about making your animations hard to read with mix-ups?

The only thing this thread was good for was a sweet warden pic, git gud u faggot

>unpredictable top light / zone attack 50/50 (near-guaranteed hit by one or the other every single time)
Keep guard to the left whenever in neutral and the light attack is slow enough to parry if you're expecting it.
>running heavy (fine on its own but essentially a 33/33/33 as reasoned below)
So play the dodge game.
>running heavy pseudo-feint (locking onto target) into top light / zone attack 50/50
This is retarded.

>unbreakable shoulder bash vortex (if / when the stage allows, which more than half 1v1 stages do depending on which side you get)
Dodge backwards and play with some distance. Shoulder bash actually has very little range unless charged and if it is charged it's the most telegraphed move in the game.

The rest of your post is just complaining about basic offensive options that all characters have and many have more along with other simple mechanics in the game like environmental kills.

TLDR; You are bad. Very bad. Don't know what you are talking about and just want to cry because you are bad. So git gud.

nice meme Sup Forums poster
the game isnt dying at all

Do you guys play the 4v4 big battle modes or do you guys prefer duels?

>Dodge backwards and play with some distance. Shoulder bash actually has very little range unless charged and if it is charged it's the most telegraphed move in the game.

You know Warden can cancel into guard break to catch your dodge, right?

Yes, so dodge backwards as I said if you are playing range correctly both the shoulder bash and grab should wiff. Then punish the grab with what ever the fuck you like.

I'd rather have brainless fun than the extremely repetitious duels, you play a couple high level duels you've played them all

I just rotate between the 3 main modes.

Except that guardbreaks get extra range if they catch you dodging, you didn't nullify the 50/50, you just bet on half of it