Why was he called The Man Who Sold The World?

Why was he called The Man Who Sold The World?

because Kojima wanted to please the hipster audience
"Oh Bowie xD Such classic! "

Because Kojima liked the song.

I'm still fucking mad.

It was a stupid twist.

Mainly because Kojima liked the song. The lyrics of the song suggest a meeting with a doppelganger (Venom). "Oh no, not me/We never lost control".

Are you trying to imply that only hipsters like David Bowie?

Kojima sold the world by making me spend 40 quid on an unfinished game

well, liberals, junkies, art college students and people who watch TMZ also like Bowie.

I like how it portrays Big Boss as a manipulative dick. It's a stupid twist otherwise, though, and even if there's room for thoughtfulness with that story the game itself mostly wastes that potential.

Overall I think I prefer it to the heavy-handed "Big Boss goes Evil" thing the trailers implied. It's definitely a clumsy story in a game with clumsy design nonetheless.

A lot of people like David Bowie. The guy was an extremely famous pop artist.

Who's your favorite musician, user?

Everything about MGS is stupid.
Only autists unironically think this franchise is worth anything.

It's always handled its themes heavy-handedly but there's still a coherent thematic vision that operated in an interesting stylistic way, regardless of how contrived some of the plot specifics get.

The stories also usually complement the gameplay pretty well.

>Who's your favorite musician, user?
I don't worship or listen to "musicians". I hear baroque music about 4-5 times a year.

No, there's not, it's a series of terribly written games that try to end up pushing some high-school thesis-tier message.
And the gameplay?
MGSV stands out for being the first game to not be clunky as fuck in the entire franchise.

It was the boss who caused mercernary armies to spring up over the world.

In doing this, he sold the world, making the fates of peoples and nations just another commodity to be bought and sold.

*tips Gramophone*

t. anti-hipster hipster

Sometimes you give something a retarded title because it sounds really good in your head at the moment. Happens all the time.

>No, there's not, it's a series of terribly written games that try to end up pushing some high-school thesis-tier message.
Okay.
>And the gameplay?
>proceeds to reveal his shit taste
Neat.

You mean "listen to" you pretentious hipster faggot

>unironically likes this garbage franchise
>unironically thinks he can tell others have shit taste

Because that's the song that was playing when Venom Snake woke up. Big Boss labeled the casette tape that way so that Venom would know for certain that the one who sent him the tape was Ishmael, since Ishmael is the only survivor of the hospital incident.

Jesus, that's so easy to understand, I don't know how people don't get it.

Jokes on you game didn't use bowie version

Do tell about your great taste. What game franchises do you like, baby girl?

I only listen to music 5 times a year at best I don't see why spending money in analog equipment. Also the difference is minimal or zero.

>mission 11
>tranq some random sniper
>marker shows up
>have to either kill some random bitch or save her
>decide fuck it ill kill the slut
>cant do mission 49 or a side ops now
why is this allowed, im ogin to have to restard and watch that shitty dance now arnt i?

The cover was better t.bh

So you never leave your home, don't watch tv, and play video games without the sound?

nope
replay it and don't kill her this time

Why was it necessary to have Man on fire/Volgin in this game again?

...

>I only listen to music 5 times a year
Haha holy shit, I figured a lot of faggots around here just lie out of their ass for the sake of """winning""" an anonymous online debate but god damn you might be a legit autist.

Literally so they could add that song to the game. No correlation to the actual plot, or lack thereof.

you mean nirvana faggot

Sure, if you're into the sounds of a man groaning as his stomach struggles to process all of the semen he swallowed after he got his throat destroyed in a blowbang.

To make the trailers look better. A LOT of stuff was in the game just for that, like the scene where Eli/Liquid becomes double for absolutely no reason and in the trailer they make you think it's Solid Snake

He used to work in a globe shop.

>and in the trailer they make you think it's Solid Snake
I honestly thought it was a symbolic thing, like Eli thinking about the fact he has a brother out there somewhere.

It wouldn't have made any sense for Solid to actually appear, and I'm glad he didn't.

wow i realy wish i didnt follow your advice
>jet shoots rocket while doing a fly by
>gets chaffed
>does this 3 more times rather then shooting bullets and easyly killing them
>then gets sniped by what looks like a very standard issue sniper
why? i could understand if snake chain guned it down but a realy basic looking sniper is very unlikly to hit a cunt in a jet going at that speed unless you are a god a prediction

>It wouldn't have made any sense for Solid to actually appear, and I'm glad he didn't.

Sure, I agree, but remember the trailer? With Big Boss saying "Les Enfantes terribles, Zero called it"? They wanted you to think Solid was in the game, they wanted you to getl hyped and that's the only reason that scene exists.
This happens with many things in MGSV, like Volgin.

Big Boss pioneered the PMC culture that ended up turning the planet into a perpetual war machine by MGS4. after Ground Zeroes he realized the kind of cryptofascist arms race he was getting into,
and he did not decide 'this needs to stop' he decided 'I need to win'.
there's an undetone in the game that Venom is, beneath all the brainwashing, a better man that Naked. more decent.

the song is about someone in denial that 'the man who sold the world' is yourself, blaming a doppelganger. the game provides a different context, there really is a doppelganger, but the doppelganger is the one who discovers what a monster the original is. yet at the end of the day Venom chooses to be Big Boss to the bitter end. in doing so he accepts being a monster too

He traded it for MGO coins.

video games... there are many good music on video games.

I don't play the same game 4 times a year I don't understand how people can listen to the same music more than 2 times a year.

I'm almost an autist. Almost.

He plays into the revenge theme, as a kind of angry specter. But it's a little hackneyed and the game doesn't really justify having such a weird (even for Metal Gear) plot point.

Who knows?

>I don't understand how people can listen to the same music more than 2 times a year.
I listen to so much music it takes like ten listenings before I properly remember a song

it was something out of left field to keep people guessing

it would have worked better if there was a real boss fight at any point, and not just 'get to da chopper'

Oh, so it was an ESL issue and you meant to say that you don't listen to one piece of music more than a few times in a year. What you said made it seem like you were trying to convince us that you only listen to any music 5 times a year which would be an obvious lie.

>baroque
>good

Look at this woman lover! Look at him at laugh in pitty! I bet you don't even listen to λύρα, you fucking Σέλτιk βάρβαρος.

This sums it up really well. Also, I don't think Big Boss was really such a dick about Venom. I think he genuinely considered him a friend.

He just awakened after the coma, saw Zero had already everything planned, and decided to go along with it. What other options did he have?

Well, the short answer is "Kojima is a hack"

The answer somewhere inbetween is Kojima legitimately thought himself clever about MGSV's twist and having successfully fooled all of the fans, when the reality was the fans had figured it out almost 3 years prior at GDC. However, the idea was so retarded, that everyone who mentioned the concept was laughed out of any open forum. So we spent years talking about what ELSE it could've been.

He thought he was so cool he unironically made his victory music "The Man Who Sold the World", as if he'd pulled off the greatest stunt in history. The reality was pretty much the opposite. He retreated to a hugbox of ironclad proportions, and hasn't peeked his head out since.

He may never again, and god do I hope he won't

>implying that wasn't Bowie's shtick

It wasn't even a twist you dumbfucks. You could see your avatar in every mirror.

I just listen to the mainstream stuff like Bach, Henry Purcell and Giovanni Pierluigi da Palestrina.

Ah sure I understand your confusion. To be honest most of the latest games I've played recently like Nier, Horizon and Zelda have better music than what I used to listen on radio or mainstream artists like 10 years ago.

Because Kojima sold his integrity after MGS3

let's be honest, people wanted more memes, more cinematics, more drama, more emotional shit.. MGSV has all of that hence the 10/10 scores.

Did we play the same game?

>The lyrics of the song suggest a meeting with a doppelganger
It's much more than that, it's literally the story of MGSV.
The protagonist is forced into this huge scheme, without being aware of it and then he meets the person responsible for it and realizes they're one and the same.

*before someone say MGSV have less cinematics than MGS4 I have to remember you the first 2 hours of the game is a giant cinematic ''action'' sequence and then there is watching Quiet dancing, etc.

Because he's literally "face to face" with Big Boss

>more cinematics
>more memes
>more drama
>more emotion
>MGSV has all of that

What timeline do you hail from, interloper?

Why couldnt they just finish the damn game? If they did i wouldn't have minded the plot being all over the place.

Kojima is basically Japanese Tim Schafer. He does very little in the time he's given so naturally Konami got rid of his ass

Remember when we still had hope this game would be good? Man that was a bitter fucking pill to swallow.

Though I did enjoy stealing every AA gun I could get my hands on and then seeing them all over MB.

So Miller knew there were two Big Bosses but didnt tell Solid Snake about it?

To be fair Kojima at least don't spend too much money on his games except for MGSV:TPP because of the Fox Engine.
Instead of having a simple mother base he had to add tons of stuff even an autistic animal center

Still kind of mad we couldnt weaponize the bears

If MGSV had any of that it would have been as ridiculous and entertaining as the rest of the series. Instead we got Kojima trying to be pretentiously deep while forgetting he actually wrote a series about a fat guy on rollerblades loaded with explosives.

Fucking weird, right? Especially for a guy that wanted Big Boss dead so much? Who knows. Miller's a weird character in terms of the canon.

>he only listens to one, I repeat, ONE (1) Bach

How do you live with yourself, user?

Because he tricked the world into thinking there was only one Big Boss. He isn't selling the world off, but selling TO the world.

>I like how it portrays Big Boss as a manipulative dick
You mean a chickenshit coward who can't finish the war he started?

Fucking the greatest soldier in the world, who took down the previous greatest soldier in the world
Single-handedly defeats a rogue KGB operation and a massive nuclear tank on top of an elite paranormal black ops team
Constructs an army from fucking nothing
Saves the world from nuclear war by taking down a machine about 40 years ahead of schedule

And suddenly he needs to run away and hide while a "phantom" takes his place?

And now anyone can be Big Boss if they get brainwashed? So much for the greatest soldier. It's not even about genes at this point.
Apparently if you tell me I'm Big Boss, then I am just as good as Big Boss.

I hasn't been about the genes since MGS1 and most definitely since MGS2.

As a narrative theme, no.

But Solid and Liquid are created by manipulating "soldier genes" using Big Boss as a template, because he is the greatest soldier in the world.

So when Big Boss becomes a meme, instead of a gene, it basically retcons the entire reason why LET and the Genome soldiers happened.

>As a narrative theme, no.
>it basically retcons the entire reason why LET and the Genome soldiers happened.
Except that it was clearly the case. See: how the soldiers that have BB's genes are dumb as bricks and also laughably fragile. How Liquid is immortal yet he got his ass handed to him by David not one but three times. LET were successful because they had good memes, genes play a much lesser part than memes.

>See: how the soldiers that have BB's genes are dumb as bricks and also laughably fragile.
I think
Just roll with me for a second

I think that's just 1998 stealth gameplay on PSX

>LET were successful because they had good memes
Nah. LET was about genes. The S3 project was about memes.

There's no reason to clone Big Boss if his genetics have nothing to do with making a soldier like Big Boss.

>And suddenly he needs to run away and hide while a "phantom" takes his place?
Yes? He wanted to get started on Outer Heaven unperturbed. It's a bit of a contrivance to get the Venom plotline up and running, I'll admit, but I don't think it paints Big Boss as a coward so much as someone that couldn't be fucked.

I think this is interesting, especially insofar as it reflects on Skull Face and his bombastic act of revenge. While losing time and men was an inconvenience to Big Boss, ultimately he doesn't seem to give much of a shit and moves on to bigger and more dangerous things.
>And now anyone can be Big Boss if they get brainwashed?
He had all of Big Boss's memories. It's mostly a knowing reference to the player and the player's knowledge of Big Boss's missions, as is the idea that the Medic was "always their best man."

Like I said, it's a clumsy story in a clumsy game. I do think it depicts Big Boss as a dick, though.

>There's no reason to clone Big Boss if his genetics have nothing to do with making a soldier like Big Boss.
And that's what the other user is saying. The whole point of MGS1 is that our lives aren't determined by our genes. That's why Snake beats Liquid, even though Liquid has the stronger genes. He manages to just resist FOXDIE by refusing to be killed by it, signifying that his individuality is stronger than his genetic links to Big Boss.

>high school thesis level writing
>MGS2 predicts literally all of internet meme cultural impact in a single monologue

Well, I mean, at least it'd get an A.

Oh yeah, let's praise Kojima's ability to read what academics wrote years ago.

>Nah. LET was about genes. The S3 project was about memes.
Yes, and? That doesn't detract from anything I said.

>There's no reason to clone Big Boss if his genetics have nothing to do with making a soldier like Big Boss.
There is, the people that cloned him just weren't aware that the key of BB's success were the memes. As I already said that's established even in MGS1, where Meryl explicitly says that she didn't get the shots, and where you can deduce that Johnny didn't either from the explosive diharrea, and yet he has much better sense and intelligence than the niggers that got BB's genes, on top of also being stronger. And then there are the tirades from Naomi on how you should not let your genes influence your life, she even explicitly fucking says so.

I always thought that the gameplay was incredibly boring and not as challenging as the old games too, and imo that supports the idea that Venom isnt quite the real deal even if he thinks he is.

Just like how in MGS4, everybody thinks they can do CQC but they only know the basics.

>He wanted to get started on Outer Heaven unperturbed.
Venom didn't seem to have much of a problem.

I mean, he somehow got dicked by the easiest parasite to stop ever
Maybe BB would have gotten a pad of paper for the crew and not get them all killed

>It's mostly a knowing reference to the player and the player's knowledge of Big Boss's missions,
Yes, clearly. But memories don't make a man. The Medic didn't do that things BB did. His body hasn't endured the training, the survival, the punishment that BB has. He may THINK he has that experience, but his body doesn't at all.

If all you wanted as Big Boss being an asshole, we could have gotten that a million other, better ways.

YES, there is the theme that genes do not make you who you are in MGS1.

But the point is that LET was done because that was the intention.
LET is separated from the narrative theme of the game.

LET is a project to reproduce Big Boss by using his genetic code.
That's the reason why it happened. The conclusions that MGS1 comes to regarding that endeavor are wholly unrelated.

If it's really so damn easy to just brainwash someone into being someone else, then cloning on a genetic level is purposeless and had no reason to happen.

Surely a hugely powerful entity like the Patriots wouldn't have gone directly to genetic engineering, right? Obviously there had to have been some cheaper and/or quicker methods they attempted before coming to the conclusion that they could only hope to replicate Big Boss, rather than train others to become him.

It's short for "The Man Who Sold the World Tortilla Chips.

If you paying any attention in Peace Walker, it's one of the first things you develop.

>If all you wanted as Big Boss being an asshole, we could have gotten that a million other, better ways.
Maybe. That's not my point, though.

I didn't want more Big Boss prequels to begin with. MGS3 was enough for me. MG2 tells us all we need to know about Big Boss.
>But the point is that LET was done because that was the intention.
You realize LET was abandoned 8 years before TPP starts, right? I'm not sure how much time they spent on getting Venom ready for his awakening, but still.

>Academics predicted internet meme culture
> At the time the internet became popular in Japan, memetics was being attacked in academia

Well, I mean, I guess you might be right user, if by that I meant wrong.

The boss wasn't a man though..

You can assume he means BB considering be didn't capitalise "The Boss" like you did, and if you look at the context it's in.

>I'm not sure how much time they spent on getting Venom ready for his awakening, but still.
He's in a coma for nine years

desu i didnt know The Man Who Sold the Word was a Bowie song, i only heard the Nirvana version

What part of trial and error do you not fucking understand? And again, the conclusion that LES was shit was also part of the narrative. Giving everyone BB clones is like giving the first illiterate fuck that does not posses any of the skills nor the knowledge for being a good soldier top of the line equipment, and the genome soldiers were practically that, except that they did get training but entirely from VR.

And it's not even about brainwashing.

(You)

>And it's not even about brainwashing
How? Is that not what they did to Venom?

Perhaps it'd be more accurate to say that they overwrote his personality with someone else's
Somehow

Did they ever actually explain how they did that?

What I meant is that it was not necessary to brainwash someone for making them achieve combat abilities on par with BB, look at Raiden.

Raiden was a useless cunt though. The only person on par with BB was Solid.

Because something something intestinal sphincter maggots.

Congrats for missing the whole point of MGS2 then, retard.

M'LADY

Because he sold the world a lie