There are now loads of people on Sup Forums who think Demon's Souls is terrible but Dark Souls 2 is great

>there are now loads of people on Sup Forums who think Demon's Souls is terrible but Dark Souls 2 is great
>these people were probably underage at Demon's release and too young to grasp anything in it, or didn't even play it
>they think the Souls games are about being hard
We are truly living in the worst timeline.

It's just reddit and neogaf influx
don't worry they will leave eventually

Yeah yeah, ds2 is a piece of shit, who cares

I'm 30, Demon's Souls is good, but it's Beta Souls. Most bosses are mediocre at best, and there are so many broken mechanics in it that completely fuck up the game. Every other Souls game has improved upon Demon's, still a fun game, but it's outdated compared to the rest of the series.

Not necessarily a piece of shit but all the other games are better.

Only games worth playing

Des is shit

>there are people who think any of them arent mediocre jrpgs with some neat ideas and a great playstyle

From was never good. I want this meme to die already.

Bloodborne is unironically the best souls game

>From was never good
>he never played Armored Core, Otogi, or Chromehounds
underageb&

DeS hasn't aged well
doesn't mean it isn't great

And how many AC games are actually good in the franchise?

How about the current state of it.
Yeah such a good company.

Otogi is only alright compared to everything else at that time in the genre.
Never got to try chromehounds but it looked cool
I love their games but to pretend from isnt mediocre at best is a joke.

>still cant get a console game to run above 30fps
Its as bad as when ER a fucking PS2 game had zero analogue support in a first person game. They are good at designings games and the art is fantastic sometimes but they have the most awful programmers I swear.

Also the fact they cant seem to make anything better than das1 without screwing it up royally isnt a good sign.

I've never played the Souls game, but have them all in my back catalog. What's so bad about demon souls that I should skip it? What are examples of broken mechanics? I'm genuinely asking here. Backlog is huge, so don't want to sink 20 hours+ into a sub par experience.

DeS > BB = DaS > DaS3 >>>>>> DaS2

>And how many AC games are actually good in the franchise?
I enjoyed 2, Silent Line, 4.

>How about the current state of it.
They're confirmed working on one. Also, even if they weren't this wouldn't change that they were some good mech games.

I don't think they're an amazing dev either but I wouldn't call them mediocre. My standard of mediocre is different. I would call Vanillaware games mediocre before theirs, for example.

>DS3
>worth playing

>Drake meme

>I know when that beckoning bell ring
>That can only mean one thing

Ignore them. They don't even know what made souls good.
You can divide the series into two eras and one minor one.

>Era where world building was more important while everything else was made good enough
Demons Souls and Dark Souls 1.
>Era of multiplayer focus, PVP, invasions, and gank squads
Dark Souls 2 and 3. Dark Souls 2 even has a gank squad boss in Shulva DLC. If your build wasn't cookie cutter forget beating it.

>Minor era where world building was again the focus, though gameplay was streamlined as the Souls game engine was being modernized
Bloodborne. Unironically its a much more satisfying package than Dark Souls 2 and 3. PVP and online is much more improved in general because of a password making mechanic that allowed anybody to summon anyone at any level. So if you summon someone at end game they will get some advantage but the game will self adjust so as not to make the summoned person broken.

It's not on pc.

>there are people who waste time of their only life caring about stupid shit like this

The games arent mediocre for the most part, the devs are every damn time.

They are awful at utilizing technology and making sequels. Pretty good at everything else though.

I played through the Souls series through BB starting about a year ago (waiting for the GOTY edition of DaS3 to hit $30) and I think out of all them I like Demon's the best. Dark Souls 1 had all around better level design and BB had better combat, but there's just something about the world building and atmosphere of Demon's that really stuck with me.

Demons Souls lore > Bloodborne lore >>>>>> Dark Souls lore


prove me wrong

Make it DeS lore = Bloodborne lore and we good

Not him, but if you haven't played any souls then you definitely should play DeS first.
Thete are some missing movement options (like the little jump you can do after running and no falling attack) but nothing more than that.
Only little things like that that make it feel less polished (but not bad) and would make you appreciate DS and BB more.

I have a ps3

Cool. So play DeS first. Got it.

>need a cookie cutter build for the grave robers in shulva
>not just abusing how they never run off ledges to lead them into easy hits/combos
nub, i hate how people think the meta is now the only way to play the game and if something isnt OP as fuck then that means its total garbage.

Armored Core has the deepest FromSoft lore.

The fantasy elements in Demon's are more subtle than in any of the others. The rest of the series is more blatant, straightforward fantasy. I think that has a lot to do with it.

For me, being more subtle also made it feel a bit more refined in its design, too.

>The fantasy elements in Demon's are more subtle than in any of the others.

>Demons everywhere
>undead and skeletons everywhere
>shooting magic spells everywhere

How exactly do you mean the fantasy is "subtle"??

>fantasy elements
>subtle

>fantasy
>subtle

>Contrarian accusing others of memes

I feel more and more disconnected from the youth of today. I swear I wasn't this edgey when I was in highschool

The designs are plainer. Look at the available armors in that game as well as the environments compared to the ones in later games, or the enemy designs in general. They kept it at plainer concepts for the most part.

Are you stupid?
Its called low fantasy.

Okay grandpa, I'm sure your so much wiser than the rest of us.

Tell us how Froms amazing track record of ps1/2/and modern multiplats somehow make them anything more than mediocre.

Unless you think Kings Fields and Evergrace are technological marvels. They are fun, but thats it. Mechanically all their games are flawed as fuck.

Low fantasy is still obviously fantasy, retard.
Nobody has ever said "I can't tell if this is fantasy or not."

Demon's is my favourite.
I like Dark Souls 2 more than 3.

>he didn't grow up playing demon souls

Go read up on the differences between low and high fantasy and save yourself from going further down the rabbit hole of your own ignorance. Or learn the definition of the word subtle.

I was there when people were playing imported chinese copies of Demon's.

Souls was never all that great, the main appeal was that it was something mysterious and different. Now it's predictable and boring as fuck.

>go read up on the incredibly subjective and opinionated definitions of low and high fantasy then you'll see I'm correct

>grow up playing demon souls
>grow up
>2009

I'm too old for this place
Not really, i was hardly "grown"

this

I remember listening to the ost during free time on the sixth grade computers

You are a retarded son of a whore, you pretend you were here from Demon's Souls, you weren't, if you were you would realize that Demon's Souls was surpassed by every other Soulsborne game that followed it.

BB:TOH = DaS3:TFFE > DaS:PTDE > DaS2:SOTFS > DeS.

I don't take anyone seriously who doesn't agree that BB:TOH and DaS3:TFFE are the best games and products that From Software has ever made, don't bother replying.

Low fantasy: more emphasis on using rules from real life, real history and modern society
High fantasy: less emphasis on this

Nothing subjective about, you fucking ignoramus.

No doubt From is a design heavy studio.

But if you think good tech and lacking Design (like Witcher 3 or Horizon Zero Dawn) beats out phenomenal design with mediocre tech, well......

I dunno maybe that's the norm these days. If that's the case I'm just glad the PS3 wasn't my first console.

yeah but you could easily cherry pick and argue both sides so making fun of someone for not knowing the difference between such a broad and opinionated half term is fucking asinine

DS2>DS>BB>DeS>DS3

>But if you think good tech and lacking Design (like Witcher 3 or Horizon Zero Dawn) beats out phenomenal design with mediocre tech, well......

I never once said that. I said I love their games. I get bored by the typed of games you listed.

Thats no excuse that a company that has been around for decades cant learn how to hire a programmer properly.

Its a real shame that something so special can be overshadowed by its shitty community who will instead focus on a soulless husk of what the series once was.

So are you saying it's a terrible game because it's older then? Because the OP didn't really claim or imply that it's better than the other games in the series (aside from Dark Souls 2, which it is) just that it wasn't terrible.

Demon's Souls will forever be the most novel game with each and every single one after it being more predictable as a result, and it was great on release. This alone basically makes it impenetrable as a fantastic game in the series. Call it outdated, it was still great on release, and the real shithead who didn't play it then would be the one that disagrees with that.

Also, fuck Dark Souls 2. I had so little fun with that game even with the DLC. It has so much bullshit and it's insufferable to play through it again.

>So are you saying it's a terrible game because it's older then?

When did I say that you dumb son of a whore? I love all souls games, they are all 9+/10 to me, but people who are fans of the genre need to admit that Demon's Souls was surpassed by those that followed it, it doesn't mean Demon's Souls is a bad game, it is a god tier game, but those that followed it were better.

>When did I say that you dumb son of a whore?
Why did you reply so lividly then when the OP didn't even claim what you were bitching about?

>plainer designs = more subtle fantasy elements
>when you're a knight fighting fucking demons, slinging spells and eating souls
Forgive me for being blunt, but you're fucking stupid. The fantasy element in Demon's Souls is right there. It's obvious. What could be subtle about any aspect of it?

Don't skip it if you haven't played the others, you will inevitably play it at some point if you like the other games so it's best to do it before you have anything better to compare it to.

Its hard to pinpoint exactly what is worse about DeS, I think it's mainly just that everything feels much less tight and refined then later games. They really nailed the controls in DaS, but weren't quite there in DeS. Bosses also feel a lot less tightly designed.

Tower of Latria, Manta skellies, and a lava level with a demon boss followed by a dragon god all disagree.

Because these threads make subhuman cancerous animals post garbage rankings like this: Which is retarded. DeS belongs in the last spot.

>"subtle fantasy elements"
>"historically accurate"

I think his nostalgia is causing him to do some cherry picking. he probably really really likes 1-1 and 1-2.

But those levels are dragon palooza.

Especially 1-2

>tfw demons souls will always have an irreplaceable spot in your heart because it reminds you of your eldest brother before he left home

I know it means absolutely nothing when trying to speak objectively about games, but demon's soul's atmosphere is on another level for me

>you have a heart of gold...don't let them take it from you

>historical accuracy
>demon's souls
wew what kind of idiot is this guy?

It only seems that way because everyone's a seasoned souls vet. When it came out that game kicked everyone's ass cuz no one knew about I-frames.

While you're totally right, how does that make them a bad studio? Are their games any worse designed for it?

Sure it's not 60fps at all times, but every single game is smoothly playable.

>Some kids these days actually think if a game is 30fps it's unplayable.

>magic spells easily available
>miracles from God easily available
>dragons and shit flying around
>low fantasy
It's dark fantasy, low fantasy would be like Conan the Barbarian

>muh fps
Holy shit expand your mind.

I'm talking about how all the good shit in DaS1 was lost in 2 and BB, and how all the good things in BB and 2 were lost on 3. Only DeS to DaS1 was a clear step up in ability and even then DeS has a lot going for it that das wishes it had.

Their AC games arent mechanically special either, mostly just meh 3rd person action with big robots and sweet weapons. A few are fantastic for the level ideas, robot designs and bosses though.

Their ps1/2 games suffer even more from pure technological failure despite being the rpgs I love most from them.
I swear its always 1 step forward and 2 steps back with this company, and your a jerk for not noticing. They will never get better if they are constantly hailed as amazing and feel they cant do wrong.

It's like the difference between a fantasy piece by Donato Giancola or Justin Sweet vs. a piece by Paul Bonner or Gerald Brom, for lack of better examples. It's not that it's less obvious, but that it's understated in comparison, not as wildly high fantasy.

>tfw 90% of shitters on Sup Forums jumped on after ds2

That's the thing about demon's souls, at the time there really was nothing like it. It was dripping with atmosphere and seemed like it was this massive and mysterious thing with a million different mechanics working in the background as your world changed tendencies and shifted around you as you played

it was this massive throwback to games of the past where you had to figure shit out through you own perseverance, even though the game was breaking your balls every couple hours

the souls series as a whole works best when you know as little as possible, and playing demons souls when it first came out, there's really nothing quite like it

I've never done a souls game before, but I've started DS2 because it's on the PSNow thing. Sure there are some annoying moments, but it doesn't seem all that bad. Should I expect it to get worse as I progress?

>all the good shit in DaS1 was lost in 2 and BB
>how all the good things in BB and 2 were lost on 3.

Using B-Team fanfiction as an argument isn't super compelling. When people talk about the good work From has done, they're talking about Miyazaki's work (in regards to the souls stuff).

Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne are 3 of the very best games made in the last 10 years. How can you call a company that consistently puts out quality work "bad" in any capacity?

No its a fine video game.

Its a terrible atmospheric unique masterpiece though.

I loved the conan stories.
>There's literally only one wizard in the whole kingdom, and everybody is scared shitless of him.
>He has the ability to summon giant snakes or something.
>Maybe a random reference to some HP Lovecraft shit happening in the background

>people still obsess over InputDelay Souls

>DeS belongs in the last spot.
I'd put 2 below it. All of them are just enhancements of DeS, giving DeS points for being more original and novel, but 2 has major flaws as well which makes it a worse experience than DeS even now.

>it's understated in comparison
Nothing about Demon's Souls fantasy elements are "understated" in any way, shape or form. From the first second of the introductory cutscene before you even make your first character, the game makes absolutely no attempts of understating the fantasy elements. The only way the game could possibly get more fantasy-like is it if included the usual high-fantasy races.

>people

Okay well I find the osuls games to be boring after des and das1.

I enjoyed them a lot more when each RPG was a unique strange experience. Thats why evergrace is so good to me. Its awful at being a game but great at being this strange experience.

I also couldnt even finish BB because it was that boring. I dont play for muh atmosphere or muh lore.

>mfw des=das2>das1=bb>das3
Fight me

>DeS belongs in the last spot.

But fuck those asshats you meet in the bastille that dogpile you and explode, that was shit.

Duly noted, thank you user

>Nothing about Demon's Souls fantasy elements are "understated" in any way, shape or form
Compared to Dark Souls 1-3 or Bloodborne? Sure it is.

ds3 was such a disappointment if only for the fact that 90% of the locations were shit we've seen before

that's what deS was the best, when that shit came out EVERYTHING was new, and it was the most intimidating shit ever

Fucking how?

DeS and more fantasy shit going on than das1 if you dont count the intro cinematic.

>des=das2>[the rest]

I think the generational gap between us is simply too large. Enjoy your Sunday, user.

>manhunters aren't high fantasy
>maiden astrea isn't high fantasy

seriously what are you trying to argue

Dark Souls lore before AOTA and sequels > BB lore > DeS lore > Dark Souls lore after AOTA and sequels

>90% of the locations were shit we've seen before

Locations that were new to DS3 (not including DLC since I haven't played them)
>High Wall
>Undead Settlement
>Farron Keep
>Cathedral of the Deep
>Catacombs of Carthus
>Irithyll
>Untended Graves
>Lothric Castle
>Grand Archives

Locations in Dark Souls 3 seen in previous games:
>Firelink
>Kiln of the first flame
>Anor Londo

I... I think you need assistance counting, user. That's not how ratios work. 3/12 != 0.9

I like games to either be unique or actually have content, they are both fun. DeS is unique and fantastic, and DaS2 doesnt run out of content after 20 hours.
I graduated in 08 and das1 was my first souls game then des,2,bb,3

A lovely snapshot. and spot on. Demon's Souls was enchanting in its day.

There's a more cinematic driven explanation for things in Demon's Souls. It has a different atmosphere to it as a result. I also felt that Dark Souls 1 had much more surreal looking environments and all of the games after that became more focused on the abstract cyclical history concept and delivering more over the top armor and boss designs.

>I also felt that Dark Souls 1 had much more surreal looking environments
But it didnt?


DaS1 was more like basic medieval fantasy with some oddities.
DeS is far more surreal than basic medieval fantasy with some oddities.

>castle for the tenth time
>forest
>swamp
>shabby town with assets ripped straight from bloodbourne

no shit I don't mean they were literally ripped from the other games, but it's the same motifs over and over

this is the third game for fucks sake can we have some variation?

Considering DS2 good simply because there is a lot of shit to do (very explicitly shit content) is where we have our major difference I think.

Bloodborne was a fantastic deviation from the rest in terms of
>Lore (how this doesn't matter to you despite liking content for the sake of content sort of baffles me).
>Combat feel
>Aesthetic
>Boss and Weapon design

I'd be interested to hear about what -other- games you do like.

If From "has never been good" because not all of its games had 180 hours of content, you must hate a lot of dev studios.

I have this horrifying image now that you genuinely liked games like un-modded Skyrim, or The Witcher 3 simply because you could play for 500 hours of meaningless dull combat.

>say it isn't so, user.

Ooooh I misunderstood.

You must be pretty disappointed with the state of the gaming industry on the whole them? So much triple A shit is just copy paste

>Guy with weapon uses it on enemies.
or
>Character moves through world and experiences narrative

That must be intolerable.

What hobbies have you picked up to supplement that lack of satisfaction you get from any vidya?

I think user was talking conceptually, not literally

>castle full of hollows
>shanty town full of hollows
>poisonous swamp level
>catacomb with skeletons that turns into a natural cave at the end
>town with gothic architecture
>spooky library with wizards
>spooky prison with undead inmates

It's all shit that the series has done before, and better.

>Locations that were new to DS3
>High Wall
>Undead Settlement
>Farron Keep
>Catacombs of Carthus
Good bait

but ds2 actually has gimmicks and mechanics that deviate from the formula for fucking once

>ds3
>playing a swamp level for the 5th time
>literally nothing added to the formula, just more poison water that slowly pressures you to explore quickly

>ds2
>in an underwater shrine with restricted movement and projectiles shooting at you
>forces you to utilize environment and time your rolls with precision

ds3 committed the cardinal sin of playing way to fucking safe

>w-well other games are worse!

ds3 was fresh only if it's your first souls, which it evidently was in your case

>But it didnt?
It did to me. You're given shit for an explanation on premise / objective in Dark Souls at the start. It just throws you into some bizarre world.

>hurr my cherry picking
Replay-ability, something des,and das1/2 have in spades.

Thats why I hate BB and DaS3 the most, with 3 being the worst since at least BB as style and unique flair and didnt have awful dlc.

>i bet you like other shit games
I play all the games user, ALL the games. I can list whats been recent but I wont bore you.

>muh atmosphere
>muh lore
I care the least about that garbage, i'm here to play games not read games.

Eh getting squished and magically being bound to the nexus was way more surreal to me when i started des. Then you have areas like latria, the lower mine area, and shrine of storms that are way more surreal than most stuff in das1 except very few places like the crystal cave.

>DaS2 has replayability
What? Are you simply talking about different builds? Again, content for the sake of content is just something we disagree on. Who cares if you can go through as a spellcaster if literally all the environments and bosses are shit? Shit from a different angle is still shit.

That's why BB/Dark Souls1/Demon's Souls will always be leagues ahead of DS3 (which itself is leagues ahead of DS2).

>i'm here to play games not read games.
Oh... no one ever told you about environmental storytelling? I think you're playing the wrong series.

You can thank the PC playerbase for that one.