Have you beaten the original, without the use of passwords? Did you enjoy it?

Have you beaten the original, without the use of passwords? Did you enjoy it?
I was replaying Metroid the other day, because I got this itch and I found it pretty fun still, despite some really frustrating design choices and slippery controls. I hate how Samus kind of slides all over the place when hit and how you can't aim up after you've jumped.
Tourian is one of the most frustrating areas in any game to get through, unless you've collected every energy tank and stocked up on a shitton of missiles. There is barely any strategy to beating Mother Brain. You just sort of spam missiles while hopefully not getting knocked into the acid.

Anyway, what do you faggots think of this? I hear a lot of ''It hasn't aged well'' opinions from all over the internet. Do you agree?

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I got to Kraid and dropped it. It's just so much of a chore.

Yes. Like Castlevania, I rushed the last two areas. Turns out I could only miss like 5-10 missiles and still defeat Mother Brain.

Fuck, it was so tedious. 3D > 2D.

I played it back in the day but never beat it. Had virtually no appeal to me back then, I liked easier games like Mario

I replayed it recently and while it was nice to see how the series has evolved, I didn't enjoy it at all. Clunky controls, frame drops/slow down, boring environments. It's nothing anyone should play in 2017 unless they're specifically interested in video game history

Yes. Out of all the bad design choices, the most unforgivable is that you start at 30 health upon respawning after death and have to farm for health. Tedious as fuck.

I can't remember if it was Malstrom or Icycalm who popularized the "Metroid 1 is the best game in the series" meme but fuck them either way, Metroid 1 was a good game but almost every subsequent game has improved on it significantly.

No but I beat Kid Icarus for the first time recently. That was fun.

i beat probably a dozen times as a kid both with and without using bounce trick on mother brain

Even before Zero Mission, Super was basically a soft reboot anyway.

Tourian is easy as piss man
Freeze those metroids and then run away from them, you dont have to kill them

Played through it and beat it for the first time last year. Never really want to do it again. From what I recall, many areas look exactly the same as others in the vicinity. Controls are pretty slippery and the floaty jumps are awkward. The game was definitely more of a chore than fun.

The game is pretty fun and easy when you memorize the correct path.

I like the combat of the original NES Metroid, Bombs were useful, Missiles were king, and your beams were situational, awkward, and weak.

I can't think of a single argument why Metroid 2 would be worse than the first, other than that the game is segmented and the player has to defeat a certain number of Metroids before being allowed to progress. However, that's probably for the best. Having too much of a space to explore would make it even easier to get lost, seeing as how everything looks almost the same.

I've beaten every Metroid game without a walkthrough and I can safely say that the first one was the most bothersome. There were times where I'd wander around for hours, trying to find some bombable wall, or floor.
I also love how there are traps you can get stuck in for a while. Right around the place you get the bomb there's a straight corridor with two doors and you can bomb one tile in the floor where you drop down a massive shaft and the only way to get up is to painstakingly shoot out crevices in the left wall and awkwardly jumping up that way. It's really fucking annoying since the blocks regenerate quickly and you'll have to shoot out two blocks in order to fit Samus in. If you miss one, the hole you were making the jump from will have regenerated and you fall all the way down.

Yes, I beat it.

Hell fucking no I did not like it. It's the single worst game I've ever played. I'd play Other M five times through before I touch that game again. I only lasted five minutes in Metroid II before it became too much like the original that I turned it off and never played it again.

>Have you beaten the original, without the use of passwords?
Yes.
>Did you enjoy it?
No. Why did they have to make leaving Kraid so fucking difficult? Why didn't they include battery saves like in the japanese version? Why do you only start with 30 health, even if you use a password? Why are there so many repeating corridors? The game is just so fucking tedious it's not even remotely fun.

I don't really agree. I've memorized most of the game and can get through it without too much trouble, but it's still not a lot of fun to play. If knockback was reduced and you could shoot downwards it would go a long way to making this a lot of fun, but as it is it just feels slippery and awkward.

>'It hasn't aged well''
I hate this. I absolutely hate this.
Metroid has legitimate design flaws, which are NOT a product of the passing of time.
The core concept however is still fun in 2017 and hasn't aged a bit.
So I find the idea that Metroid hasn't aged well insulting. It has aged gracefully, but yet it remains some unfortunate flaws.

The flaws I dislike:
>some areas are explorable, but do not include any rewards, basically punishing exploration
>upon death a player has to grind back their health
>tourian is lame ; doesn't feature any exploration and the best solution to it is to just rush through and ignore all Metroids

I did a lengthy 47 minute review of the original Metroid about a year ago, if you're interested go check it out:
youtu.be/N1AVd_vd7lc

i loved metroid for the exploration and finding all the hidden missiles and tanks, never cared much for the optimal path.

I used save states on 3ds. Made it to mother brain before I just gave up.

>I hear a lot of ''It hasn't aged well'' opinions from all over the internet. Do you agree?

I legitimately don't think any NEW game has aged well. Maybe Mega Man, Punch Out and Mario 3 but nearly everything else is clunky, obtuse and arcadey in the sense that they were still being designed to waste your quarters. The SNES is the first timeless console and its no surprise nearly every memorable title on the NES has a SNES sequel that btfo NES originals.

Just my opinion though and I full expect to be shit on for it but having grown up with the NES I find it dreadfully archaic and simple.

I don't mind Tourian being linear. You've already done a lot of wandering around, so it's nice to have the final area just be a linear gauntlet to the final boss. It's a welcomed change of pace.

>The core concept however is still fun in 2017 and hasn't aged a bit.
Sure, it's just that in the meantime other games have come out that are a better execution of that core concept, which is why people consider the game to have aged poorly.

Same, after Kraid I lost interest to continue. I've beaten Metroid 2 and Kid Icarus but I don't think that I'll give Metroid 1 a try again.

This has to be bait. Don't tell you me you stopped on only the first game, the roughest Metroid of all. Play Super Metroid.

Yes, I did. No, it's pretty bad. Level 'design' is fucking non-existent and while kids in '86 might have felt dread from the game I've only felt tedium. I've played through Zero Mission for the first time last night and it was very good, the last segment was completely unnecessary and boring tho, really killed the ending for me.

Not in a long time, but yes. It was okay. Extremely dated now and it felt like it but I had fun with it. Probably will never go back to it though, some of its design choices were very clunky and just not fun.

I actually personally like Tourian being linear as well. It feels like the appropiate finale the a lengthy game. However, we must admit that a player in 1987, playing Metroid for the first time, may expect Tourian to be the biggest labyrinth of the game, bringing the concept to it's high-points. If you happened to be such a player , you'd without a doubt be dissappointed. Nowadays we know the Metroid formula pretty well and can expect a linear finale to occur towards the end, but for the first game it is an odd choice.
Every game ages and is eventually topped. Metroid has reached several peaks over its lifetime, so it's no surprise the original isn't the best of the bunch anymore. But I think if someone says the game did not only age, but age badly, they imply that the game may never have been good and was only impressive for its time. Which I do not think applies to Metroid.

Kickmaster. Pity we never got a sequel on SNES, would have been bitching.

When I first entered Tourian all I felt was dread. The music was really intimidating and the thought of having an area filled with Metroids that I had to wander around in for who knows how long just made me let out a tired sigh. I was really relieved that was not the case.

Tourian looks and sounds great, but there's unfortunately nothing to it. Samus gets send to Zebes to destroy the Metroids, but in-game the opposite is the best solution. Fighting Metroids only reduces your ammo at best, in a worse scenario you also lose health. It's much better to skip this endurance test and go for Mother Brain straight ahead. Running from Metroids isn't hard, seeing how easily they're frozen. That's why I dislike Tourian.

I do however like the escape sequence. It kinda saved Tourian for me.

>without the use of password
EZ
>without the use of a guide
fucking impossible

I've beaten it with cheatcodes because I never won against Ridley without them.

The escape sequence was a really cool surprise. When you expect a credits screen and are greeted with a ticking clock and the threat of game over, even after defeating the final boss it's quite a rush.
It really is a shame that the actual escape route is pure garbage. It's the same three or four platforms arranged in a repeating pattern. There really is no challenge to it and it's not fun either. The platforms are just really small and with the slippery nature of the controls, you're likely to slip off and fall down a bit.
I think it would have been a lot more interesting and fun if you were tasked to run back the way you came, while fighting or avoiding the Metroids, or at the very least have the escape route be better designed.

BEEP BOOP BEEP BOOP
BOOP BEEP BEEEP
BEEEEEEP

Can someone tell me how you are supposed to battle Kraid? Because I don't get it.
I just stand in front of him and spam missiles. It's fucking braindead.

Yeah, a couple of times. As for enjoying it, that depends on the area really. Most of Brinstar and Ridley are good, but Kraid and Norfair tend to rub me the wrong way. The bosses are all pretty shit, since the most efficient way I've found to kill them is just to tank the damage and spam missiles. Trying to freeze or dodge around Kraid and Ridley's projectiles are more slow and tedious than enjoyable. I just stand on top of Kraid and in the acid under Ridley and shoot.

The core idea Metroid has is excellent, and the series is my personal favorite, but man is the original rough around the edges. Some places you can wander into while exploring can be unholy nightmares to backtrack through, and so many enemies are just annoying or put in annoying locations. I think being able to be damaged during door transitions just flat out enrages me. I also just flat out don't like how stiff, slow, and floaty Samus is. She felt better even in Metroid 2, honestly. I have a list of complaints, but I still get some enjoyment out of it.

I beat the hacked versions that has saves, similar to the orginal Japanese version of the game. Having to start with 30 health after using passwords is fucking tedious and the difficulty curve is weird as hell in this game, Kraid's hideout is the hardest point in the game with everything afterwards being a joke except Mother Brain's final boss fight.

>The escape sequence was a really cool surprise. When you expect a credits screen and are greeted with a ticking clock and the threat of game over, even after defeating the final boss it's quite a rush.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
>It really is a shame that the actual escape route is pure garbage. It's the same three or four platforms arranged in a repeating pattern. There really is no challenge to it and it's not fun either. The platforms are just really small and with the slippery nature of the controls, you're likely to slip off and fall down a bit.
I whole-heartedly agree. Gameplay-wise the escape sequenze is nothing special, but it makes for a nice event at the end. Nowadays, in your average video game, it probably would have been a scripted sequence with many QTEs. And I'm not saying this to shit-talk modern games, but simply to compare what I feel the escape sequence could be compared to.
>I think it would have been a lot more interesting and fun if you were tasked to run back the way you came, while fighting or avoiding the Metroids, or at the very least have the escape route be better designed.
Fortunately, future Metroid games did exactly that. The fan-made AM2R had a wonderful escape sequence with a brutal and surprising ending. Fighting Dark Samus at the end of Echoes while the timer is running is amazing too. So is fighting Ridley in the tube reaching to the planet core during the beginning of Corruption.

youtube.com/watch?v=PSUuoN8qQAc

morph ball into him and spam bombs

Get the wave beam to kill the bosses

If anything, the first Metroid just makes me appreciate Super and Metroid II more.
Also, there are two ice beams in the game, right? One in Brinstar and one in Norfair I think. I think they put two in there in case you picked up wave beam after ice beam. For some reason they override each other.
But, what happens if you collect both ice beam pick-ups and then the wave beam? Are you just shit out of luck and unable to kill the metroids in Tourian?

>John Carpenter's Metroid

>without the use of passwords?
Do save passwords count in this regard? Because fuck me if they do.

all the bosses can be face tanked with enough tanks. hell you can morph ball bomb him all day without losing too much energy because you only get hit by one of the darts and the flying claw things never hit you.

>But, what happens if you collect both ice beam pick-ups and then the wave beam? Are you just shit out of luck and unable to kill the metroids in Tourian?
Ice-Beam and Wave-Beam respawn. You can switch any time, if you're willing to travel the distance to pick them up again.

I'm playing Zero Mission, it's my first Metroid game and honestly I don't like it.

Often I don't even know how to progress, I need a new ability and don't know where I can find it, so I go back and search everywhere. Lots of backtracking. And some things are just too well hidden.

I hope 2, Super and Fusion are better.

I wouldn't count using passwords for resuming where you left off. The game would be hell to play through in one sitting, without any guide.

Really zero mission, the one game that actually tells you where to go at all times?

Post more MP2 concept art.

>yfw unlock every gallery.

Here, just for you.

zero mission is the most straightforward one though

>the one game that actually tells you where to go at all times?
People keep saying this shit and it's just not fucking true. I don't know why everyone claims ZM holds your hand when it doesn't. The chozo statues are optional hints. The one statue that is forced on you is the first one right after getting the morph ball and all that does is show you where to find the long beam(though it doesn't tell you that) and teaches you what the statues do. Every other statue can be ignored.
That being said, they do exist and if you're lost you should use them if you feel the need.

It's a good game. Nothing will ever change that.

I didnt want to imply they werent optional but if its your first game I bet most people end up using them since the first one is mandatory, and they do tell you where to go.

Yeah just like how Other M is a good game, right?

you have the one with the creepy melting face?

nope. This game's too hard.

Yeah, sure. They tell you where an item is, but not how to get there. I think it's a decent alternative for people who get lost.
This is a GBA game after all, and it's nice to have some hints in case you forget where you were going when picking it up for short play sessions. It sure as hell beats locking you in a room and having a computer giving lengthy dialog and forcing you to get to the map marker before you're even allowed to leave the area.

Nothing can ever change how good something was for it's time but is it not possible that if the bar is raised by successors that the original can become less good in comparison? Something being "good" is just relative to everything else right?

Yes I do! Probably a concept of Dark Samus without her helmet.

fun game but i'll always remember it for the music.

I actually really enjoyed playing it for the first time without a guide. Finding all the hidden shit was fun. I just really hated grinding for health, and the backtracking wasn't fun either.

desu the original is kinda shite

and Metroid Prime and Super Metroid are some of my favorite games of all time so fuck yourself .

>You could unlock Metroid in both Prime and Zero Mission essentially giving you the game for free
>The Zero Mission version even featured password saving
>Nintendo still had the nerve to sell the fucking game on a separate cartridge without this feature

Oh god why cant you skip that shit in fusion
Makes replaying it so painful, gotta use the fast forward key in the emulator

...

I have Metroid unlocked in the original release of Metroid Prime. I have Metroid unlocked in the original release of Zero Mission. I have Metroid unlocked in the VC release of Zero Mission. I have a VC version of Metroid on my 3DS.

So I don't own Metroid for the NES, but yet I can play Metroid on my GCN, Wii, Wii U, GBA, DS and 3DS!

Funny, eh?

I think I got to the Ice Beam and that was it, I couldn't take that shit without a map, it was not fun. At least you can deal with Zelda's bullshit Wizrobes and Darknut hordes every room but in Metroid it's like running around as a headless chicken trying to figure out what the fuck to do as enemies hit you for 30+ damage and energy drops are low.

Even 2 is really rough to play nowadays, the screen space coupled with how every single area looks the same is a nightmare at times.

>Finding all the hidden shit was fun
Was it really though? Keep in mind, that in order to find everything you would have to bomb and shoot every wall, since there is no indication that they are destructible.
I like rewarding exploration and this game does that, but it also hides away so much shit behind way, way too obscure paths.

ENGAGE RIDLEY
MOTHER FUCKER

You are a big emperor...

Alright. I finished your video, user.
Overall, pretty decent review. There really is not too much to say about Metroid, but you pretty much covered it all. Flaws and positives. If I had to critique something it'd probably be the pace and format of certain sentences. I'm sure you could have trimmed the video down to 30 minutes just by wording things differently and cutting out some redundant or repeated statements. For example, calling attention to the round shape of the morph ball isn't exactly important.
Either way, good job.

early 2000s nintendo was slowly morphing into the cancer it is today

For you

The first Castlevania is actually good.

Thank you for watching my video and thank you even more for the critique, I sincerely appreciate both!
Maybe I'll get around to make more video reviews and continue analyzing Metroid, now that the series has finally returned. I will take your critique into account!

What accent is that, by the by? German? French?

[spoilers]Greetings from[/spoilers] Germany!

I need to work on that accent...

The first Castlevania is fantastic though.

You're welcome. Criticising other people's shit is easy.
What accent is that, by the by? German? French?

yes, thought I used the hack that gives it a minimap

the game is great: I love how easy it is to get lost, and the alien look of the landscape and creatures

German accent. Don't confuse a french for a german ; they may get pissed!
Damn, fucked that spoiler up good.

I'd have to agree, NES was my lifeblood and a huge leap from the game generations before it but it's a generation that really shows the limits of the time. Plus there were so many unplayable games that weren't Nintendo/Capcom/Konami developed that it rendered 80% of my 150+ game titles I had as a kid untouchable.

When the SNES came out and those first demo kiosks were hitting stores my mind was blown at how much of a leap it was. I think a similar comparison would be the Gameboy - GBColor/Gameboy Advance transition in gameplay and presentation improvements.

youtu.be/J9IbS0PiLXc

I like how the composer for Metroid II just went ''Fuck it. I'm making an ambient soundtrack for this GameBoy game.''
Pretty ambitious when you think about it. It definitely gives the environments a certain mood.

now that I think about it, the restarting with 30 health was pretty annoying. Mightve used save states after I had grinded everything back up. But the metroid area and the final fight against MB was fun as fuck

With maps, it's pretty good. Nowhere near as good as any Super-or-later sequel though, and didn't age as well as most NES classics imo, though it's still got some charm and the original Brinstar theme is one of my fav game BGM's forever.

My first attempt at playing it was on an emulator, and I made my own map in Excel as I went since that seemed like the most genuine way to play it.

Ended up not finishing the game until a few years later, after I dug up what I had built of the map and bought an NES to play it on the console.

I have a soft spot for fusion but I really find my self liking this track :
youtube.com/watch?v=u_DiwhVbTmE&list=PL71442F24C8795CD7&index=9
It's heroic but still foreboding and really instills me with a sense of adventure. When it kicks in at just the right time after a tense segment it really uplifts me.

Yeah, it's flawed but I did enjoy it.

I prefer Metroid 2 compared to this though.


Prime 2's Art is my favourite in the entirety of games, it's so damn cool.

>Climbing back up that stack of destructible blocks in the shaft before Kraid.

Man, fuck that room.

Making your own map in Excel seems extremely fun.
I'd love for a 2D Metroid to completely omit the map, but instead introduce some sort of drawing-feature, allowing players to map the environment themselves and even leaving notes, annotations, markers and so on.

Then again, thematically this would fit better for a Zelda game. It's kinda weird that Samus' suit wouldn't have some sort of advanced radar system mapping everything automatically. Link on the other hand may only have a pen and a piece of paper.
>Prime 2's Art is my favourite in the entirety of games, it's so damn cool.
Have some more!

While beautifully drawn, those fuckers are the bane of my existence whenever I replay Prime 2.

This so much. Metroid II soundtrack is underrated.

If you try to shoot them, they will go transparent, making them resistant to attacks.
Try to get close and force an attack. You may get a better a shot. Best solution is to try and have them charge at you. If you're standing inside a bulb of light and have that sphere super-charged with your light-beam, they will charge right into their exploding death.
That was one of my fav' rooms!
But I can see why someone would find it frustrating.
Anyway, I'm off for now. Have one more piece of artwork.

>I'd love for a 2D Metroid to completely omit the map, but instead introduce some sort of drawing-feature, allowing players to map the environment themselves and even leaving notes, annotations, markers and so on.
I'd rather just have what the 3DS Metroid is going to do which is throw on markers. Drawing your map is not fun unless it's a DRPG, and even then you're left wondering why it can't just autodraw the map for you and you just choose to place markers for notable spots.

Post the one with that lava dark samus.

The game hasn't aged well. The gameplay is slow and obviously the graphics suck. I would say just play Zero Mission, as completely revises the original and makes it better with new content.

Oops, forgot the artwork!

Alright, you mean this one, yeah?
I disagree with you on the quality of Metroid as I have stated above ; but I do agree that Zero Mission is a great game for a newcomer to get into the series.