Is this a legitimately bad MMO or are people just being unfairly critical?

Is this a legitimately bad MMO or are people just being unfairly critical?

What do people even want from MMORPG's now?

>What do people even want from MMORPG's now?

Ragnarok online woe

they want an MMO that isn't 99% grinding, 1% shitty PvP

>they want an MMO that isn't 99% grinding
Wrong. That's exactly what MMOshitters want.

Korean MMO players, maybe, but clearly not Americans. Otherwise BDO would be more popular in the west.

>was told to be a fun sandbox MMO with players being able to be traders/explorers etc.
>looked promising with best character creation system ever created
>some other company takes over now
>they want devs to scrap everything and turn it into a shitty grind MMO
>they release this crap
Why Koreans are so fucking retarded?

It's a top seller on steam alone. You're also ignoring the other two extremely popular MMOs that are nothing but 99% grinding and 1% shitty pvp.

well have fun with your pointless afk grinding, I guess

No, it's quite bad. It's just a korean grinder that's been dolled up with bells and whistles. You may enjoy it if you really want the experience of working an unpaid minimum wage job.

I don't play MMO trash. I'm simply pointing out the fact that this game is exactly what MMOshitters love.

but it isn't

It is. Those numbers don't lie.

I want pre-NGE SWG to come back. Particularly before every random jackoff was a Jedi

oh so that's why WoW is so popular, the game where you get everything you need thrown at you for doing the most mundane shit, got ya

>What do people even want from MMORPG's now?

For it to be a new experience.
Lots of people all playing a game at once isn't new. Exploring worlds isn't new. Quests with friends aren't new.
Every MMO is just a rush to reach endgame because everything before that feels like filler.
MMOs are often pretty poorly designed, the main merit of them is that you get to play them with lots of other people.

After a decade of the same shitty systems and tropes, you're going to be tired of it.
It will never be new again. Let the absolute turd of a genre die.

This guy gets it.

Not the same person but, do you know WoW is dying right? People that played MMO before are tired of grinding and new kids are into mobas

Exploring new worlds is new. Exploring new quests is new. What modern mmos need is a leveling system that takes its time but doesn't make you feel useless if you're not maxed level. Tough to do because that requires so much content to keep you playing and interested before you reach cap.

You might want to check SWGEMU. It's a pre-CU server emulator. Don't know if someone is developping a CU server emulator though, if that's what you want.

dying, no shit
it still eclipses trash grinds like BDO

>game where you get everything you need thrown at you for doing the most mundane shit
Just because WoW is more lenient doesn't mean it isn't a grind. There's nothing else to do in the game but grind, no interesting and branching quests lines, no depth to the gameplay mechanics, you'll just be grinding for gear/money or you'll be playing the shitty PVP.

There's absolutely no difference between these two games.

why are people so obsessed with pvp modes on mmo's?

EIGHT GODDESSES

>WoW is dying

My favorite meme. You're saying people aren't interested in playing a 15 year old game? Or is it dying because it doesn't have the 14 mil subs it had during peak of wotlk? I wouldn't call a game that has 3 - 4 mil subs "dying"

Because pve content is generally static and boring after you've run the same dungeon 100 times. Competition in pvp also gives people goals to work for, and drives them to get better gear or get better in general to compete.

Because MMOs sale themselves on player interaction and conflict is the best kind of interaction.

actual progression instead of mindless grinds with rng gear upgrade

By PvP "mode" the presumably mean the garbage that is instanced PvP instead of glorious world PvP/RvR.

>Every MMO is just a rush to reach endgame because everything before that feels like filler.
This is what turns me off of MMOs fast. I don't necessarily want to reach endgame instantly but I'd like the non-endgame content to be fun and meaningful. Just look at runescape, it takes a long time to reach max level in any skill but there's still a ton of content before you reach that point and the game doesn't make it feel like everything you've done prior to reaching a high level is totally worthless.

This. Amongst with lots of tiny little things both from RO and other MMOs of its era.

World pvp is generally garbage. I remember some fun fights on a pvp server playing wow but most of it was just groups or higher level players ganking anyone and that wasn't enjoyable for anyone. Camp people for 5 or so minutes at a quest hub or flight path, then move on to the next one by the time anyone had a chance to call for help.

But the handful of fights that were fair were exciting, and memorable.

it's a different world and a different playerbase now
mobas are in 2017 what mmos were in 2005, just deal with it

>looked promising with best character creation system ever created
Which it wasn't hilariously enough.

do you know why modern mmo's are shit?
cause there's no castles to conquer for your guild
i mean you fight other guilds because yes or because some coins that you receive
i miss lineage days where we would join to take a castle, this gave us a sense of acomplishment dude.

I play on a everquest progression server and it's more enjoyable for me than ff14 or bdo.

tfw no medieval Eve Online

I always just wanted MMO's to be like a normal genre game, but with thousands of players on the same server at the same time. Next game which is going to deliver in that regard is WWII Online which started in 2001 and now comes to Steam with a rather big revival and lots of work.

Anybody interested in military simulations should check it out.

What I want in crafting:

>RO War of Emperium for PvP, optional battlegrounds and arenas
>Wakfu importance of crafting and gathering, and the XIV intricacies of crafting
>Tibia style player housing where plots are limited, fixed, but not instanced like XIV making key locations very special and sought after
>Rift style world invasions and events that heavily affect the zones
>Path of Exile passive trait trees for trinity role jobs with active trait trees too

Err, what I want in an MMO as a whole.

No real endgame other than grinding.

Otherwise, at it's core it is a better game than most MMOs.

>Why Koreans are so fucking retarded?

Because that's what Koreans want. They want a shitty grind with pay 2 win god items in a cash shop.

I'd advise you to check out Mortal Online which is pretty shit (it's on Steam with unlimited trial) or Darkfall New Dawn which isn't released yet, but can be played on an Indev server.

fucking this
mmo's should be hard but should also have rewards for it's challenges just like eve online

>press button to auto run
>game locks you into the road and literally runs toward your objective
NEAT
>your character fucking smashes into literally every single NPC and cart and other player character, tripping all over himself and making the entire route completely unpleasant
WHY CODE THIS IN

>Because pve content is generally static and boring after you've run the same dungeon 100 times.
And yet the average MMO player hasn't even completed 10% of the dungeons/raids in their game of choice. The whole "PVP is more unpredictable" argument is made entirely by the kiddies who have exhausted all other content and have nothing better to do, and they make up an extremely small fraction of the player base.

looked up some guy playing it, spent something like 5minutes just to kill a single monster that didn't look threatening.

So what's a good MMO? I recently got into War mane WoW with my gf and it's decent fun.

This.
>b-b-but this mmo...
MMO's selling less than 10 million copies in the west need not apply

I don't disagree with you, especially with how pathetic people are on the wow forums. But some people just don't enjoy pve content. Not the people you would think would be interested in an mmorpg, nor would I build my game around those types but most mmos do, and they become profitable.

Game devs may start to care about making a fun and enjoyable game but the publishers quickly make it about the money and control the decisions. We won't get a "good" mmo until some autist wins the lottery and can completely fund the game on their own without big business up their ass.

When I was younger I thought this was a legitimate argument, but why does it have to be a MMO? MMO's are worth at everything they do that could be made in regular games which make more sense to play. You get recognitation even in games where it's only 5vs5 or MMO's don't even offer modes that make them MMO's and it's also just small scale. What's the point of fighting other players in a MMO? I think it's just players who wish to profit from having better gear. In other games this concept of my character is my gear doesn't exist, if I want to PvP I go play a game that is fair, offers great gameplay and thrive. MMO's only strength is RvR in the open world.

FFXIV is pretty easy to get into. There's an unlimited free trial up to level 35, so feel free to give it a try if you want.

The combat kills it for me. Slashing emptily, all attacks feel like aoe, and overwhelming particle effects.

Name three (3) active MMO's today that are better than BDO.

>Not dying
Strange that Blizzard decide to not make public anymore the total population of WoW and their loses like few years ago.

Strange that towns in the that were full of people at all hours are like a desert in comparison.

WOW IS NOT DYIIIING MATEEEES IS BETHAAAA THAN EVAHHJ!

Sadly when it comes to pvp there's just better options. Take BDO for example, you're gonna have to grind your fucking ass off just to reach the level where its even slightly fair and even then some no life 18 hours a day grind master is gonna still be able to dumpster you with his superior gear. Why bother grinding when you can just jump into LoL/Dota/CSGO and get a better pvp experience?

Do you shills just have a program that checks Sup Forums for the word mmo so you can swoop in? ff14 is just a big a shit show as every other mmo. It's got all the same problems, only in anime and catgirl form. Your game literally has an option to pay to skip the main story quests that lock behind all of the end-game content.

I want EverQuest Next.
BDO is just another Korean grindfest.

Lord of the Rings
Star Trek
EVE

I'm 26 years old, I feel great, not in as good shape as when I was 20 but I guess technically I'm dying.

China likes p2w, look at all there popular online games

Strange that profit margins are still readily available for potential investors because it's a public company yet you still cling to your fantasy that it's not being played anymore. Why is it still printing money, user?

He asked a question and I answered. I like the game, so I recommended it. Nothing else to it. If you feel the need to believe that the only people that like games are shills/bots, go ahead though

It's where people go to foster disappointment and destroy the game.
Everyone screams to nerf X. Then they scream to nerf Y. Then they talk about how the game sucks because the devs changed everything and how it was better when it was X & Y before they changed everything.

BDO is a shit game, these threads constantly pop up, which makes me think you are shilling at this point.

But to clarify, its shit because it sells itself as a sandbox when its really not, all you do in the game is farm life skills and farm xp/money at sausans or pirates, THATS IT. If its a sandbox then its a sandbox with 0 fucking content and a cash shop that has required items in it. Like the 40$ pets you NEED to have to be efficient since they rigged the game to make bodies despawn so fast you can't loot everything, and numerous other problems. People in gookland don't even have max gear yet because of how rigged this game is.

If you want a GOOD MMO play fucking FFXI, but since most of you would complain about the UI or the age of the game, you won't, so just keep wasting your money on trash where you basically don't progress or shit like WoW where your progress gets wiped out every 3 months to make sure you never enjoy your progression.

Because theres no fast travel, good time to go grab a drink

>All these shitty ass chinese mmos coming out soon
>It's all "ACTION COMBAT" garbage with cool downs totally ruining the action combat and mechanics we've seen plenty of times in every mmo since
>They all have p2w out the ass and tons of second life tier emotes

It's fucking korean mmos all over again. Someone give me a fucking mmo that's open world, boss for instances only and has decent fucking pvp with a REAL action combat system that doesn't require me to play it like a second damn job.

It's dead like every other MMO. There isn't an alive MMO in 2017. Just varying types of shambling corpses.

>EVE

Seconded. It definitely isn't for everyone, but the game's community-dev relationship is probably the most healthy in the industry. Add to that how unorthodox a game it is by pretty much any measure, and you have a very sustainable MMO.

>playing on and off since 2007

I mean, there is a reason that those games are incredibly popular because they do what you just mentioned. I guess mmos offer you more of a community with guilds and physical towns with other players around. That would be my guess. I don't dislike pve content in mmos, I like it more than pvp when there's no risk. But even you have to admit that farming the final raid or dungeon you've already beaten a dozen times isn't as enjoyable.

I like it because I can make cute waifus

...

I'm with you user. I fucking love mmo pvp but I hate the grind involved. I don't want to spend 8 hours a day grinding just so I can pvp for 30 minutes a day. Sadly though if I've learned anything it's that so many of these mmo players love their pve grind. It doesn't help that companies also use grind for content which is garbage.

Albion Online?

It is unfortunate and I think grind can be content but it makes up a majority of the content in modern mmos. Then again, it would be tough to come up with thousands of hours of unique content to keep players engaged just from a creative standpoint. Not to mention paying the people to come up with that content, the developers to code it, etc. I'll say it once and million times, we won't get a "good" mmo until some autist wins the lottery and has complete control over the direction of an mmo without a big business that's funding it controlling the direction.

There is a medieval Eve online, it's called Albion Online and came out last month.

>mobile trash with no where near a comparable economy or depth of gameplay
kek

Anyone else feel that retail WoW feels more like a chink knockoff than private servers? You enter Org and all you get is walls of chink runes in the trade channel and everyone wearing ridiculous, over-the-top armor.

You mean the game where people could pay extra to get a head start?

I don't know what realm you play on but trade chat is just shitposting in English, and everyone wears bikini armor, or an old tier set.

>progress gets wiped out every 3 months

So you're literally complaining about new contents replacing old contents? Are you autistic?

Yup, like in any other modern game. It's the best and closest to a medieval Eve that you're gonna get.

Last time I played was pandaland so my opinion isn't up to date. All I remember was everyone riding glowing dragons and trade chat being ~50% ching chong.

All I want is a new mmo to come out that made me feel the way I fealt went MapleStory was popular in the late 2000's, mmo's now have no sense of community like they used to, but that might just be because the internet has changed

That's okay. I'm not going to play a game that punishes you on death but lets players buy an advantage over you. It may be the "best" and "closest" thing we got but it still sounds like absolute shit on paper. And I'm just not desperate enough to settle.

It's because you've changed, user. You're not easily impressed anymore, you're a jaded adult now.

You don't have to play it, I just mentioned it since a lot of people in this thread seem to like Eve and the devs of Albion were inspired by Eve to make their game.
Other player's headstart only really matters if you're planning on playing the game from minute one anyways.

That's true. I haven't looked at an in-game shop to see what the real life gold currency gets you, but just shelling out 150 bucks gets you a horse to move faster, and a cart to move more resources than everyone else who doesn't shell out that 150 bucks. That alone is poor game design.

I'm only 18, but it's true that I don't get enjoyment from games for very long now but I hope that's just because games are garbage these days and not me being jaded.

>ARK is the dinosaur version of EVE Online due to server transfers
>My tribe alone has over 1400 members and control most of the servers now
>ARK servers getting wiped on August 29th so everyone will be level 1 again and the bloodbath will begin again

Well wouldnt you have guessed, everyone is a complete shithead when it comes to mmo's, just play whatever the fuck you like.
I like bdo because of the large amount of stuff that i can do, if i get tired of breeding my horses for money i can go get my musket and hunt a whale, i like the flashy combat it makes the grind seem like less of a grind, i like the idea that im always getting better.

But its not for everyone

P.s i havent spent a dime on it

Oh no it gets worst from there. You'll start only enjoying casual shit, then you'll play the fotm because your friends are playing it. You'll go back and try to play your favorite oldschool mmos like ro, or maplestory but you'll get nothing from it and want to die inside. I'm you 8 years in the future. It's inescapable.

You lose the horse and cart if you get killed while using it, and to use it you need to level up the relevant skills to use it first. There's no in-game shop, the only thing you can buy with gold is Premium, which is basically like Eve's plex. You can play without it, but it's pretty much mandatory because you get more resources while gathering and more fame when killing players.

Jesus, you know what's worst than paying for stuff in a p2w korean shitshow? Grinding for it. I can't imagine the level of autism required to put yourself through that. But you said it, people play what they like.

there is a difference between vertical and horizontal progression, you sound like an actual idiot, so here is the (You) you desperately crave

How sad it is, this is true. What was the last time you talk to anyone online even if they simply asked a simple question about your gear instead of just ignoring them. If you generally find talking on games to be a waste of time than grinding then you can't expect to enjoy the social parts of the game.

If you hate talking with little kids who are the ones most likely to be willing to talk then you can't go far in terms of Runescape when it come to socializing. Most adult players just grind it out knowing exactly what to do. It worth noting the group on /vg/ act much more immature "ironically" than actual kids who at least can pretend to be adults. Don't ever join a Sup Forums or /vg/ related MMO group, they fucking ruin everything.

It still doesn't sound ideal when you think about 10 v 10 pvp with 10 people being able to move more resources and move faster and 10 who can't. But the fact that you can lose those 150 dollar items on death makes me want to get people in it just to team and hunt people who have that shit.

>looked promising with best character creation system ever created
>half the sliders dont even do anything
>the others barely change features
>this is what qualifies as "best character craetion" in 2017
pso2 did better 5 fucking years ago WITH ps vita limitations

Yeah, /vg/ and Sup Forums groups are generally cancer. I feel like a lot more adults are playing mmos because it's the kids that grew up with them but any time I ask a question about the game I get, "google it" or someone links me to the wiki. Nobody wants to just chat or talk about the game like it's an adventure and learn things together. And a lot of the fault comes from wiki and datamining.

because even the shittiest player can win 1v1s in mmo pvp if they have better gear

Yeah, but I guess that's just a reality of modern gaming we have to come to terms with. Everything is monetized out the ass.