A boss with just more hp/damage

a boss with just more hp/damage
>artificial difficulty

a boss with more mechanics
>it's not difficult, you just need to memorize the patterns

what is true difficulty?

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>what is true difficulty

Boss gets faster.

Almost all skill in the world can be watered down into "he just memorized X" "he just did a lot of Y"

This too

True difficulty is having to come up with tactics to beat a boss

This is why all bosses are inherently inferior to human enemies.

A difficult boss is one that requires you to push the fundamentals of the gameplay/controls to its limits.

>it's not difficult, you just have to cheese it with this trick

This sentence is meaningless.

A boss with more hp/damage and mechanics.

DID SOMEONE SAY

CUPPA DUBBA NUB NUB

Resident Evil 4 is a perfect example of good difficulty mechanics.

Boss is controlled by a human

True difficulty is something that is on the surface easy to understand, but hard to execute.

All forms of incoming damage are complicated, but predictable.

Resident Evil 4 has pertty good dynamic difficulty, but that's something I definitely don't want in most games

When a boss adapts and learns from you and changes strategy based on judgement.
Basically a real person.

Cuphead has shitty hit feedback. When you shoot enemies and bosses it feels like you're not doing anything special at all.
Just look at what happens when you stomp a goomba in any Mario game, it's satisfying to see them flattened and that characteristic sound of them dying. In Cuphead monsters simply disappear without a good feedback to your actions. Bosses also don't feel like they're being hit at all, they just barely flash and there's barely any sound going on, you don't have to aim much at all, at least the first ones I've met.

This makes it a relatively boring and bland experience to me. It's just not clicking and this lack of hit feedback is a huge downside since the entire game boils down to avoiding things and shooting at them, if shooting things doesn't feel satisfying or rewarding, the game is kinda shit.

Beating games in general is just a moderately difficult challenge, real difficult stuff should be beyond that, speedmemers, competitive gaming etc

Ignore artificialdifficultyfags

Games were never meant to be "fair" since the arcade days. The machine cheated and you went in knowing that and persevering over the enemy despite that was considered an accomplishment

Fucking whiny manbabies

>only games you master in one try are fair
classic millennial meme, arcade games require something called practice

>read that in shake's voice

fucking incredible, Dana Snyder should do voicework for more cartoons.

>TL;DR game sucks cause no bing bing wahoo

>classic millennial meme, arcade games require something called practice

I'm not disagreeing that they require practice or saying that that's a bad thing but calling those precursors to microtransactions "fair" is horseshit

Mario has terrible bosses though.

Could you mouth breathing idiot stop making threads about this reddit tier shit game??

>TL;DR game sucks cause no woopee haha mama mia

>muh microtransactions
Another retarded meme, microtransactions are paying extra content not in the base game, in arcades you can access to all the content of the game just on one credit, don't make shitty excuse just because you suck.
Also tons of arcade games didn't even allow continues

Not since Galaxy

Emotional difficulty, the one that needs your heart to understand like the final boss of mass effect andromeda.

Words cannot express how much i love this image.
Its perfect on every sense of the word.

Could you stop being a baby?

but i didnt make this thread about cuphead, i was just inspired by cuphead's discussions

True Difficulty = A game I can beat

Bullshit Difficulty = Everything Else

It's always been this way and while some games do have badly made bosses most people use this as an excuse to not blame themselves for losing.

real life as a short guy

Excessive difficulty to Jew you out of quarters is a precursor to micro transactions now that people don't need to dump money into the machine to play. Reading comprehension

Stop giving it attention. Stop using that name. Stop using images from it. I'm sick of it.

then don't come to the thread?

Cuphead is a good game and just because a game is popular doesn't mean you have to hate it

So? At least stomping on things in it feels 10 times more satisfying than shooting anything in Cupbland.

I can give other examples if you can't wrap your mind around what I posted. Hollow Knight has great hit feedback as well, it feels great hearing the sound of bugs being crushed and bosses being hit.

Then how about you learn from your errors and watch other people play you retard, that's the whole point. Do you want the game to play and win itself or what?, the progression in an arcade game is all about your skills, not on the content as modern single player games

>infinite lives
>hard

>TL;DR game sucks because no yahoo it'sa me bwoop beep

boss gains a new phase/new moves

I wanna slap that question mark

you see, the bing bing you hear when stomping on things is a skinner box effect telling you're winning and it makes you feel good

In Cupbland shooting anything has no impact to it, no distinct sound, it's like hitting a dummy with a rubber stick, it lacks oomph and gives zero feedback to the player.

>TL;DR game sucks because no haha yippie yoshi wahoo

>what is true difficulty?

When the boss throws insults at you that hit home.

>a boss with just more hp/damage
>>artificial difficulty

No.
If a boss only has a small amount of hp and deals almost no damage you can facetank the boss.
If it has more hp and deals more damage you have to keep up for a longer time and actually show that your skill can beat the boss and not that your character can beat the boss.

No, YOU get out of my board.

I dont care if its good or bad, all I know is reddit loves it and that's enough for me.

A combination of those two things combined with the speed it happens.

>TL;DR game sucks cause no bleep bloop goomba bwoing

Most non-boss enemies in cuphead explode in a cartoony puff of smoke.

Most boss enemies follow classical shmup design of not actually reacting to any of your shots until they die (though I could see arguments saying that health bars provide a necessary form of feedback in shmups that isn't present in cuphead)

>TL;DR game sucks because no AYCAW WAHAH WAH HEREWEGOOO

>Boss is weak and has fairly easy moves to avoid
>You have to keep doing this for 10 minutes because of a massive pool of HP
You can't defend this.

They don't even have a good sound effect when they get hit. I feel nothing when shooting anything in Cuphead. Also the smoke effect simply isn't enough feedback, you need some good sound effects. This isn't a shmup issue, it's an issue of the game itself not being satisfying to play, at least for me.

I mean fuck man, even the hacking minigame in Nier Automata feels more satisfying to shoot than this game.

What's wrong with fighting a boss for 10 minutes?
It's not that long.

TL;DR game sucks cause HAHAH WAAAAAAAA zip zoop woooohoo hoo hoo!

>True difficulty is having to come up with tactics to beat a boss

This is literally the "memorized the boss" argument from the OP. You're tactics are just knowledge gleaned and put against the challenge.

Thing is, OP is a huge sopping faggot, because all of these components add up to difficulty, not any amount of a single one.

Bosses with more mechanics mean you have to memorize shit. Bosses having patterns means that you need to remember the pattern and act accordingly to take no damage. Adding HP to a boss doesn't make it harder, you just need to remember the pattern for longer.

>what is true difficulty?
Shooting to the beat of the music and killing the boss right before the music starts looping from the beginning again.

So, not Cuphead then? Because most bosses will run you 2-6 minutes as long as you aren't just sitting still dodging the first phase.

True difficulty is the opponent making decisions and tactics based on your actions. Just like the player has to do.

>Adding HP to a boss doesn't make it harder
Depending of the difficulty of the pattern it does, and forces you to be more consistent with it.

a meme

The hardest boss I don't lose to more than a handful of times.

You seem like you are moving your goalposts. The initial comment says " In Cuphead monsters simply disappear without a good feedback to your actions". The explosion is pretty visible and they do make a small popping sound. You can argue that this is not satisfying, but to say that it doesn't exist is disingenuous.

>this isn't a shmup issue, it's an issue of the game itself not being satisfying to play, at least for me.
I appreciate the "at least for me" but I'd argue that this absolutely is a shmup issue. Loads of classical shmup games don't have a particularly big focus on death fanfare etc. If you don't like that, it's fine, but it's more that you don't like conventions of a genre than disliking Cuphead.

What are you even talking about? The first stage of games after Cave Shooters are ceremoniously the "watch a billion explosions as you instantly kill popcorn enemies" stages.

Have you actually played the genre you are talking about or are you a retard who played some Euroshumps and thinks you know shit.

That being said feedback on enemies that get hit for a long time is generally flashing, which is seizure inducing.

This isn't a shmup issue, like I said the shmup hacking minigame manages to be more satisfying to play than the zero feedback that is in Cuphead. The SFX in Cuphead is garbage, for normal enemies and bosses.

The question is why you're so overly defensive over this game, I'm not even calling it shit, I'm voicing a valid criticism over it. Also plenty of shmups are quite satisfying to play, so no this is a Cuphead thing.

Artificial Difficult usually mean games with cheap deaths. For DS it's the number of ambushes you're at first taken by. Cuphead isn't Artificial difficult, the difficulty curve is relative to your skill at arcade style scrollers.

>TL;DR game sucks cuz no ba-ding ba-ding woop woop woop supah marioooo bruthas supah show!

Not true. I just beat the final boss of Danganronpa V3's RPG mode, and it was absolutely not a "true difficulty" fight even though it's all tactics and patterns. It was an interesting fight, but once you know the patterns and how to respond it's just "pick the correct move to minimize risk", no challenge outside of that, not truly difficult.

>Adding HP to a boss doesn't make it harder, you just need to remember the pattern for longer.
Absolutely wrong. Again, using the example of the RPG boss in Danganronpa V3, the more health the boss has the higher the chance you run out of MP on an important party member and get a guaranteed loss, and the more health it has the more times you have to pull a gamble like "Cast the status effect removal spell, which leaves you vulnerable to a crit if the boss attacks you this specific turn", each one of those is capable of ending the run. More HP can be difficulty as a fact. The fight took a full 20 minutes and more HP wouldn't just increase that time, it would increase the chance I run out of MP and increase the chance I die to an unlucky timed attack by the boss, since the attacks are semi-random.

Here's the final boss fight for reference, it's just using the right moves on Junko at the right time and hoping I don't lose to RNG:

youtu.be/W1FNQy-6HPM?t=2h37m46s

>memorised the boss argument
No it's not. By having a dynamic situation that requires you to think on the fly and thus develop new tactics for fighting it on top of avoiding patterns and attacks you could design a game that uses memorisation as pieces of the puzzle when defeating it. This still requires the player to be adaptable and think on their feet, resulting in a well balanced medium between knowledge and tactics. Increasing the difficulty of said formula involves adding more variety in possible scenarios within said game. The key is variety.
Roguelikes do this in a way by ensuring each level is different while maintaining some core mechanics that you can memorise.
>Tldr: find a balance between on the fly tactics and learnable mechanics and add more flexibility with each to increase difficulty.

>shmup hacking minigame
Nier is not a shmup.

Bosses that adapt to your playstyle

>Memorize all the patterns
>Do the thing you are supposed to do when they come up

Wow you sure did say a lot to try to hide the fact it's still memorization.

Damn this train boss is sorta bull shit?
Like there are times where I don't think there is anything I could have done with the golden horseshoe part, based on what the train did.

Fucking absolutely loving this game though. 10/10 presentation, gameplay, ost, shits just great.

are you going to say this isn't a shmup session?

>TL;DR game sucks because no plip plop yipeeeeeee bada bing boom bazow YAHOOOOOOOO OOMPH, Paisanos!

GOLLY GEE LAD!
You're a faggot

Get some reading comprehension retard.
Can you go into a Roguelike knowing exactly where to go and what to do? No.
Why is that? Because you need to explore to find the exit and you don't know the exact threats you will encounter on the way.
If you balance that with having certain mechanics, enemy types and other persistent aspects of the game (the memorisation aspect of it) then you have a balance that challenges both tactical DYNAMIC skill AND mastery of MEMORISATION.

>all those triggered cupcakes
wew lad did I just poke at the tumblerites wasps nest or what

>The developers are going for a Guinness World Record of 30+ bosses for a Run-and-Gun game to beat the world record of 25 set by Alien Soldier.
made me think

There is no such thing as artificial difficulty

Except for pure RNG BS like a mob spawning that is immune to fire damage and you're playing a fire caster.

no, i'm mostly just fucking with you. faggot.

>TL;DR taking the time to find everybody that "yahoo'd" me and calling them a tumblerite

>taking time
You mean just clicking on those numbers that appear right next to my post? Must be real hard for you people who think this game is the pinnacle of whatever I guess.

>Can you go into a roguelike knowing...

>Roguelikes taking skill

lol

>Boss is singing at hero/player during the fight
>Calls them out on all of their bullshit

i agree, but i feel like that alone doesn't make the whole game shit. just a bad mark on a overall good game.

and despite all of this you still think that "no bing bong le haha wahoo is still a valid reason to hate a game"

but shooting at things is like half of the game, if that doesn't feel good half of the game won't feel good

it's like making a racing game where driving is boring, it's a kiss of death to me

"True" difficulty is a mix of a lot of factors. Differences in health/damage between the player and boss can force the player to change up strategies beyond attrition.

>"To deal with the boss's super laser just pop a potion after he uses it and keep hitting him!"
>"When the boss starts charging up his laser you need to wall jump to get to one of the pillars to get out of line of sight. Be sure to take out the enemies that spawn so you don't get knocked out of safety. Later on in the fight you may need to parry the last part of the attack as the pillars start falling apart."

Similar shit with patterns. Some patterns are just "When the boss blinks red, get on the floating platforms. When the boss blinks blue, stay on the ground." Good patterns should be more than just simple reacting and should demand that the player deciphers the best way to mitigate it: be it proactive positioning, a certain chase/kite method, saving certain resources for certain moments and so on.

Games where you have to memorize patterns.

See Megaman

>Game is a bullet-hell disguised as run-n-gun

>everyone fails to see this


It became super clear to me the minute i hit Sunflower the fuckface that this isn't everyone's type of side scroller

i guess if that ruins your enjoyment of the game sure, but that seems more like personal preference than the game being objectively bad. i could see past that flaw and still enjoy it.

>Getting this mad that a game isn't press right and jump man

>Thinking Cuphead is a bullet hell

Are you stupid?

>I've never played a run and gun game.