What the fuck went wrong? Skyward Sword had a fuck ton of flaws...

What the fuck went wrong? Skyward Sword had a fuck ton of flaws, but at least it made a good attempt to balance difficulty. You had a limited inventory, and you had to choose between more potion slots, more passive buffs, and higher capacity for your ammunition. Healing was also done in real time. They undid that progress and said fuck it, you can have 3 pages of cooked meals, and there are items you can cook by itself that heal you to full and they're fucking everywhere. Feel free to press start and heal instantly whenever you want. Don't get me started on the defense system. Every point of defense is 1/4th heart of damage, which results in super inconsistent damage.

Then do a no Game Over run.

>sat about grinding for hearty foods and cooking
>goes out of his way to use the most powerful healing stuff
>pauses every time he gets a scratch
>IT IS THE GAME'S FAULT
If you did anything with hearty items but sell them, yoy are a casual and your opinion means nothing.

This is weak as shit since you can dive bomb onto fairies for free 1ups should you fail to press pause.

>every single zelda game has been smart enough to use a set amount of bottles to limit the player from stocking up on an unreasonable amount of healing items
>botw says fuck all that shit
Even if you don't go out of your way to cook a shit tonne of meals you still get fucking showered in food items that you can pause the game and heal immediately. Skyward Sword literally didn't pause the game when you did this either, but this does.

>hey bro its your fault for not balancing the game for the devs because they were too incompetent to do it themselves

Do a no healing item run. People have been doing personal challenge runs of games for longer than you have been alive.

YOU chose to pause the game and heal, not the devs.

The devs chose not to think through their healing system at all, despite having a perfectly good one present in literally every game in the series prior.

Do a three heart run. I don't know nigga. Or actually try a no game over run or a no fairy run. If you need a challenge you can easily make the game harder for yourself. The game gives you so much freedom that in the end if it's too easy it's your fault.

When is the Switch going to get its own actual Zelda? BotW is the Wii U's Zelda, and I want another game like Four Swords or Link Between Worlds

The fact that this is still the case in the paid master mode is bullshit. The satisfaction of pulling off anything difficult is completely gone when every other player can just cheese it with little to no effort.

>fight a group of enemies
>half of your weapons break

Then take their weapons or use the runes.

>hur hur just do a self imposed challenge
please stop

Old-style games like 2D Metroid and top-down Zelda are niche now and get less priority.

>try to fight a lynel in the early game
>perfectly capable of dodging its every attack and getting hits in
>still impossible to beat it because of the terrible gear system
love it, 10/10 game

That's not a response. You're complaining about things that aren't unchangeable.

What are you talking about?

>abuse optional grinding mechanic
>WTF WHY IS IT SO EASY? REEEE

Retard

I am doing a "no healing during battle" challenge but self imposed challenges are still dumb and you can't have a consistently good difficulty. It's the devs job to create that balance, I'm not the fucking dev. Hard mode was supposed to challenge the player but you still run into the same problems.

the game's gear system doesn't reward skill; attempting to fight an enemy the game doesn't want you to fight early in the game, like a lynel (which is literally on the great plateau in master mode) with the shitty glass weapons that deal 1-10 damage in the early game is practically impossible because even if you're skilled enough to not take a single hit and attack at every opportunity you simply won't be able to deal enough damage to come close to killing it before every weapon you can carry is broken.

>games should be balanced for me, and the devs should cater specifically to my standards of difficulty because I am in no capable shape to decide not to abuse everything

>Feel free to press start and heal instantly whenever you want.
You know games have done this for 30 years now right? Never hear anyone criticise Resident Evil for the same thing.

It requires far too much effort to make all these rules for yourself, and often times the game makes it difficult for you to try to follow it. And again, the difficulty can still be way too inconsistent even with self-imposed challenges.

>waah Pokemon is easy because I can just grind on victory road before the league
This is how stupid you sound.

When the game showers you with healing items and literally auto-equips the utter bullshit that is Mipha's Grace, even in the supposed "Hard" mode, there's a serious problem with the way the game is balanced. You don't have to grind out meals to exploit it when the game is broken from the start. It's even more of a joke when you start earning gear that for some god-forsaken reason is set to hard values and not percentage based.

Then why not try using the runes also? And you know better weapons are available early game.
No it doesn't. As someone who does self imposed challenges you have no idea what you're talking about.

you cant carry 100+ healing items in any resident evil

runes are fucking stupid

...

you know you can turn off the champion abilities, right?

I mean you don't even need to cook.
During gannon I just ate like 100 apples.
If they didn't balance it with inventory limit, they should had had a cooldown for how often you can eat.
But nope, I'll just eat 6 big plates of food consecutively.

Cooking wasn't fun, just tedious going through all the ingredients and working out what combos worked then repeatedly having to go into menu, hold them all, go to fire, repeat 20 times.

I like the open world, I can take the combat. Shines were okay. Dungeons were short but the mechanic of controlling the divine beast was clever.
Weapons breaking was dumb and didn't matter because enemies constantly drop better weapons, I'd have preferred to have a few weapons that you'd buy or make leading up to the ones you get for beating a boss and then further leading to the master sword.

I would have really preferred if there was traditional collecting hearts from killing enemies and cutting grass and if I'm got bottles, capture a fairy or get a potion.
Getting hearts from killing enemies is great because it keeps combat flowing and moving.

Your call, user.

if you're seriously picking up every single piece of food you find and cooking it, you're just grinding.

The game isn't forcing you to pick up materials, nor is forcing you to cook them. That is all YOUR doing. You're making the game easy for you.

>Then why not try using the runes also?
Because resorting to throwing bombs at a lynel eliminates every aspect of challenge or fun from the fight and would make the battle so fucking long and arduous it hurts to even imagine it.
>And you know better weapons are available early game.
And therein lies the biggest problem with the gear system. It rewards finding weapons scattered in mostly nonsensical locations over pure skill, and punishes a player for not going out of their way to get said weapons even if they are far more skilled in combat than a player that does. How the devs looked at this system and thought it was a worthy addition is beyond me.

8 months and still crying about BotW.

>spams x50 apples like a retard.
>the game is shit!

I quickly realised that investing in hearts is pointless because enemies either do 1 heart damage to you or fucking 10. Things like Lynels are like "lol insta-kill unless you have a fairy or 12 hearts"

Boosting your stamina to the max makes the game much more COMFY to play because you can climb any obstacle

I didn't say you couldn't, just that it's enabled by default, which sure says a lot about the devs' approach to balancing this game.

Bruh, you find hearty truffles literally everywhere. There is an entire region where those and bananas grow in abundance. Are you actually retarded?

it would be odd to obtain something that is disabled by default

>During gannon I just ate like 100 apples.
Imagine being this hopelessly shite at the game. Good job button mashing to eat all those apples to earn 1/2 heart each. Blame the game you stupid fuck.

What do you mean by "skill" and how do you propose that they reward you for it? Early in the game if you approach a lynel and can dodge their attacks you expect a powerful weapon to fall from the sky?

Honestly, I just raise hearts for getting the master sword.

Are you also going to bitch about the optional white tanooki suit in Mario games that appears when you die too much in a stage?

ironically, you complain about the cooking system but if you know how to use it it'd help you a lot with fighting that lynel. As much as people meme about the hearty foods, they're not massively useful because of what said. You should try making some attack up elixirs, even a fucking tree branch becomes a worthwhile weapon with a strong enough elixir.

yes, I want to do crazy stuff and do something with my million lives, but that shit screws my save file.

If cooking was tedious and not fun, why did you spend so much time doing it?

>What do you mean by "skill" and how do you propose that they reward you for it?
I mean how in any other Zelda game if I'm good enough to beat an enemy, I can fucking beat it. Here, I'm able to beat an enemy even if I'm utter trash at the game just by finding a strong weapon, and even if I'm great at the game I can't beat a strong enemy if I don't have the weapons the game wants me to have.
>Early in the game if you approach a lynel and can dodge their attacks you expect a powerful weapon to fall from the sky?
No, I just expect to be able to whittle it down, without my weapons breaking before the fight is physically possible to beat. There's no skill in this shit combat system; everything comes down to your gear. I'm not claiming Zelda has been a series with fantastic combat prior to this, but it's at least been successful for what it is - this game has more of an emphasis on combat than any other installment and it's an unbalanced joke, and that's without touching on the lack of any enemy variety, the un-downgradeable armor breaking combat even further, and the unfunny joke that is the flurry rush mechanic.

Mounting doesn't degrade weapons.

What does that have to do with anything I just said?

While BoTW is a great game, it is certainly the least-zelda Zelda game to date.

Because the weapons you want to use to defeat them don't have to "breaks before the fight is physically possible", quoting what you said, to beat if you don't want them to.

>Cooking wasn't fun, just tedious going through all the ingredients and working out what combos worked then repeatedly having to go into menu, hold them all, go to fire, repeat 20 times.
For fuck sake it's completely optional. The game is designed to give you choice. You don't want to cook? Fine. Eat raw food. Or earn meals by saving random npcs from getting raped. Or forget about food and buy or boost armour sets. Or offset your physical strength with powerful weapons. You don't have to do anything. You can play how you want. Here's a fucking shocker, you don't even need to fight anything if you don't want to, play it like Metal Gear Solid and stealth your way through the game if you want.

BotW isn't perfect but its pretty fucking boring listening to people trying to pretend the most redundant "complaints" somehow make the game bad.

the game clicked for me when i stopped thinking of combat as the main challenge

the main gameplays looking around the world and finding stuff, despite being action combat the enemies only exist to challenge how hard you explored, specifically how good your weapons are but additionally how many hearts you have from shrines, how good your gear is, and how much food youve cooked up

some games challenge tactics, others challenge time investment, others challenge personal skill, zeldo challenges how thorough your exploration is

that said it has a lot of isssues, specifically better stuff being in specific places that you can easily guess and abuse, the games not hard at all as a result really, but i can still vaguely see the idea and i enjoyed climbing all over creation anyway despite the combat

>fighting a lynel
>have no food left
>have to resort to eating 12 apples at once

>shitty gameplay
>shitty open world
>shitty graphics
>shitty framerate
woah that was hard

>Going into a Lynel fight without preparing first.

It's the game's fault! It's shit!

I just want varied dungeons with strong themes again man.

Nintendo need to stop thinking in extremes and work hard on both dungeons and overworld. Can’t have one without the other.

I liked cooking but did not like how there was no in game method of recording recipes. I wanted to experiment and get new meals I could come back to make later on but no menu of discovered recipes didn't make that an option.

>>shitty gameplay
lol
>>shitty open world
lol
>>shitty graphics
lol
>>shitty framerate
lol

I never said that, I merely joked that it's funny how Link can stuff 12 apples into his mouth instantly in mid battle.

Unless you realize how overpowered armor value is (and easily attainable sets have just as much of it). Though admittedly the game doesn't properly introduce you to that (especially given that there was no such thing in earlier zeldas)

do people really eat in this game for anything besides stamina, attack power and heat/cold resistance?
I feel like every since I've had mipha's grace I've needed it. Lose a bit of health just throw myself off a cliff to activate it and start it's cooldown.

zelda 2 says hello

>terrible combat
>three enemy types
>boring bosses
>no real dungeons

>Mipha's Grace; Lose a bit of health just throw myself off a cliff to activate it and start it's cooldown.
Millennials

Don't bother or you get responses like this

Ever since I've had Mipha's grace I have not needed food.*

>"Skyward Sword had a fuck ton of flaws, but..."
>Implying Skyward Sword is superior to ANY Zelda game
Even Wand of Gamelon and Faces of Evil have more merit because at least we got memes out of those

Might get a teaser near next year's e3 like how Skyward Sword was revealed. Wouldnt even be surprised if they began development while also working on Botw since it got delayed for so long.

I think Shrines are the biggest offender. Making 120 of them (well like half that if you cut out the ones that are comprised of a single chest and the "tests of strength), but still, they're a complete waste of resources. I wouldn't be surprised if scrapping Shrines netted us at least a couple more proper dungeons.

It also seems kinda silly for them to make the game all about exploration and open world traversal if they're not really going to capitalize on that for the campaign of the game. The campaign strongly directs you to each of the main 4 dungeons and they all have quest lines that are never exploration focused and just feel like standard open world campaign style design. Simply putting the Divine Beasts on the map as bosses the player could find their own way to without being forced along a quest line - that upon being beaten allowed the player to enter them and beat that dungeon would be a far more effective use of the open world design than what they went with.

Having some more traditional temples buried away in the mountains that players could stumble upon and have the satisfaction of finding for themselves would also be great. With every shrine looking identical on the exterior and few of them ever taking much in the way of exploration to actually find, and the inside of them being pretty much exactly what you expect just leaves the exploring feeling unrewarded. As it stands, BOTW doesn't really recapture the same feeling of properly exploring the world to find dungeons like the original Zelda did, it just feels like a watered down main Zelda campaign taking place in an overly large barren world, and the optional exploration to find shrines is hardly a good alternative with how mediocre the shrines are.

Yeah as soon as I realized the combat wasn't meant to be challenging I just used it to mess around and had way more fun with it than I did when I approached it like OP. Just doing simple shit like making updrafts then slamming a claymore right on some poor bokoblin's head or throwing a club at an enemy's face is just dumb fun and I love it.

For stats I normally just cook 3 stacked speed up or attack buffs but normally I just cook to see what dishes I can come up with.

It was actually a pretty ballsy move from Nintendo.

Any other company in Nintendo's position at that time would have played it safe and delivered the most traditional game they could make, anything for some good PR and a shot in the arm.

Instead Nintendo weren't afraid to take risks and threw most of the conventions of the series out the window. Who else would do that?

>I didn't play the game

eat shit faggot, there's a reason this is going to be universally the GOTY

nice hyperbole

>>terrible combat
Not the focus of the game. But it's fine.
>>three enemy types
Why are you lying?
>>boring bosses
Well thats objective
>>no real dungeons
The game is bad because it isn't exactly like the other Zelda games everyone has played a million times? Ok.

well they put it on the wiiu as well so it was not just as big of a gamble for them and open world games are almost guaranteed sales. That being said it was a relatively big risk given the development costs and time

If you think this was a risk, then you're insane. This was the safest fucking bet they've ever done. Just make a big empty world and pepper it with enough nostalgia to give people bullshit lore.

Hell, you can tell they rushed this to launch with the Switch since it's so devoid of any real variety. There are plenty of half thought out ideas throughout the entire game. Another half year of development could've done wonders for this game, but instead we get what we have now. Another boring open world game with Link and Zelda so we can say it's groundbreaking.

Ah fuck you aren't wrong there, it's #2 then.

>Not the focus of the game

Yeah, you're right. You can cook your way out of every mandatory fight in the game.

>lying about enemy types

The game is nothing but sleeping goblins that come in two different colors and sizes. The few times you do get variety it's the same guardian robots you find everywhere else.

>having no dungeons is good

Don't be fucking stupid. If this game had zero dungeons but a robust world, it'd be a good tradeoff, but we get an empty world and no focused story areas, too. Just a big 60 hour "see that mountain? you can climb it!"

>you can tell they rushed this to launch with the Switch since it's so devoid of any real variety.
Can you even hear the amount of shit you're talking?

Bear this in mind, Nintendo coded this game on a fucking Wii U - a goddamn toaster pile of shit which is literally 10 year old tech. There were limitations to what they could achieve and they STILL made an absolute mockery of every other open world game running on high end hardware.

Too much of the game feels formulaic to really make exploration interesting.
There's no interesting bosses to be found, just palette swapped Hinoxes and Taluses, both of which are pretty terrible bosses to begin with. Lynels follow the same format and while they are definitely the most interesting enemy to fight in the entire game, they're only really like that once, and you're guided to one in the questline for Divine Beast Vah Ruta anyway so you don't explore to find them either. There's also the Molduga, which is probably the most interesting boss you can find since it's actually region specific and you won't find it in any region other than the Gerudo Desert, but the boss itself really sucks - it's still better than the rest solely because it's an original boss you don't get forced to see in the main campaign, and you explore to find.

Shrines are the same, there's not really any shrines that stand out, and far too many mechanics and visuals elements are shared to keep them interesting for long. Almost all the variety the shrines have to offer is exhausted with the first four you find in the Great Plateau, with the only meaningful additions being electrical currents and fucking motion controls, the former of which is just a carry over from Divine Beast Vah Naboris, and the latter really would be better not present at all.

The biggest offender is the enemies themselves though. No matter which region you're in, the only enemies you encounter are Bokoblins, Moblins and Lizalfos. There are a few palette and weapon swaps but they're still the same thing over and over. There are no region specific enemies at all. The Chuchus and Keese both die in single hits and barely pose a threat since they lack any real moveset so I can't really call them enemies, but even if you do count them, they are again present in every region and only undergo palette swaps.
You know what you're going to find in every region before you even go, because it's also copy & paste.

>it's #2 then.
well yeah that's why it's called zelda 2, friendo
not him, but you're really reaching here. There are, literally, more than 3 enemy types. Sure, I'll concede that the enemy variety is lacking but you're blowing it way out of proportion. On a similar note, there are dungeons present they're just done in a very different way - I feel this would've been perfect if it had 2-3 extra dungeons done like Hyrule Castle. Also, name 1 (ONE) mandatory fight in the game

You're talking like if the Switch is a marvel of technology. It's the same fucking game except with a 720p portable screen instead of 480.

Coding an empty fucking field 40 times over isn't that trying on any hardware when you cover the whole thing in fog and 15fps.

How is this game making a mockery out of ANY open world game? How is this better than any GTA, RDR, Oblivion, Just Cause, MGSV? Just because it has characters you recognize? Is that really the only thing you need?

If the next Zelda game is a FPS will you say it's making a mockery out of shooters everywhere?

>tfw aonuma is going to make sure every zelda from now on is just botw again
fucking kill that hack already

How do you beat Ganon without fighting him?

>You're talking like if the Switch is a marvel of technology. It's the same fucking game except with a 720p portable screen instead of 480.
No I'm not. I'm talking about the fact Nintendo coded a masterpiece of open world game design on a fucking Wii U. Other developers should hang their heads in shame.

if this thread is anything to go by, you just cook

>they STILL made an absolute mockery of every other open world game running on high end hardware.
I really don't get this meme. BotW's world is nothing special, the main quest certainly isn't, the combat is mediocre and awfully balanced, the controls are pisspoor, and the game is a huge step back from most other Zelda games anyway due to lackluster dungeons and shamelessly low-effort shrines. At least other open world games succeed at what they try to do - BotW fails at being a good open world game AND at being a good Zelda game.

why would he do that in a boring game?

>don't play the game
This is literally what you sound like. Self-imposed artificial Difficulty is masochistic at best, and shouldn't be necessary but devs are garbage

Dying Light is the best open world game of the last 10 years

>BotW fails at being a good open world game

bad

Why is that?

>The game is hard if you set limits on yourself


It's bad design, and you're a drone

>the controls are pisspoor
nigga what, the controls are pretty tight.
Anyway, the reason people say the game's a technical marvel is due to the physics engine and interactive real-time shadows in an open world. It's been attempted before, but never as polished as it is in botw. You can knock the game all you like; however, it's undeniable that the physics engine in the game is extremely impressive from a technical standpoint.

>the game is easy if you grind

You think the technology in this game is any better than MGSV? Seriously?