HoI3 vs HoI4 Thread

Having a problem deciding between hoi3 vs hoi4. pros and cons:

hoi4 cons:
-feels much easier, although less so with the latest updates
-plane management feels retarded, you are forced to spread your planes over huge areas even if you only need support in a very small region
-can't store resources, literally fucking retarded
-volounteer only recruitment policy doesn't give you bonuses
-subs used to be too strong, now they are too useless
-army experience points needed to create division templates, literally fucking retarded

hoi4 pros:
-less bugs
-better graphics
-better UI
-effort trees allow for more possible scenarios
-support brigades
-customizable equipement
-more customization, with the high command, theorists, ministers, etc
-more intresting diplomacy


hoi3 cons:
-plenty of bugs
-plane management is fucking retarded, but in a different way: with planes chasing enemy wings right into their airports
-hardly any variance in political scenarios, diplomacy feels useless
-tech tree is basically a migraine factory
-hardly any customization

hoi3 pros:
-more challenging
-can create as meny division templates as you want
-can store resorces for later use
I can't think about anything else on the top of my hat (probably cos I haven't played hoi3 in a while), other than both games would greatly benefit from eliminating ahead of time penalties in tech research.


what do you think?

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I'm a hoi4 noob
what makes 3 more challenging?

I honestly can't tell you why exactly. I can only tell you that I never beat the allies as germany in hoi3, but I did on my second try on hoi4. but in hindsight it's probably because I played hoi4 with all the experience I accumulated in hoi3.

HOI 4 is incredibly casual, a joke.
HOI 3 is bloated, unnecessarily autistic.

Pick your poison.

I think Darkest Hour is superior to both.

This.

Darkest Hour if you want more sandboxy feel that trends towards the more traditional grand strategy.
Hearts of Iron 3 if you want much greater military mechanics for a game trending more towards a war game without properly becoming one.
Hearts of Iron 4 if you are retarded.
Gary Grigsby's War in the East if you have massive autism.

>Gary Grigsby's War in the East if you have actual taste and interest in military strategy
*

HoI3 + mods hands down.

These are both correct.

Do you want a game that at least tries to be a proper wargame, or do you want eu4 in a ww2 setting?

That's more or less what I said.

Last I heard the game was plagued by some game breaking bugs that never got fixed, notably that a single line of train tracks would transport infinite amounts of supply.
I'd be interested in trying it otherwise.

Rude.

i wanted to try war in the east, but I never did cos it only focus on the german soviet conflict and I find that limiting. is it really much superior to hoi? why?

exaggeratedly simplistic explanation, but still not completely false

why? could you please convince me of why dh it is better?

HOI2 Darkest Hour with the Grand Campaign

Lets you play from WW1 to Cold War (1914-1991) with all the appropriate events in between. It's in the middle of what said as well, detailed but not too bloated.

You will not regret it.

>i wanted to try war in the east, but I never did cos it only focus on the german soviet conflict and I find that limiting.
War in the West.
>is it really much superior to hoi? why?
It's actually a full-on war simulator made for a very niche military autist crowd, while HOI is more just a general GSG game.

Darkest Hour has insane replay value, while the game mechanics are quite simple but still very well thought out. It has a large collection of 10/10 mods, the diplomacy is great and the warfare is simple enough that it isn't a chore but hard enough to pose a challenge, especially if you play on hard or select weaker countries like France. Tech tree and tech teams is pure orgasm.

It allows you to play however historically or ahistorically you want, there is almost zero railroading. By the use of console commands you can very easily change Britain into a communist country and join the USSR, or play a german-alligned Canada or whatever you want really. There are also mods that improve the ww1 scenario, there are mods that let you play through ww1 and ww2, there are mods that model the cold war with nuclear weapons and NATO vs Comintern, and a ton of mods that improve ww2 making it a bigger challenge and improving role play.

4 is basically 3 without dumbshit micromanagement. For example if you want to add an artillery battalion to your divisions, you have to do that manually in 3.

Yeah, 4 is also 3 basically without any requirement for thought.

>if you want to add an artillery battalion to your divisions, you have to do that manually in 3
Only a brainlet would consider that a bad thing.

Only a retard would think that manually adding artillery battalion to 30 divisions is a good thing.

This desu, also the fact that you have to build all your division components individually for it to be cost effective (applies to black ice mostly).

No.
Only a retard would design a UI that forces you to do it individually to each one.

There's so many simple goddamn solutions to fix those issues, but none of the devs ever thought of them. Like a simple table of TO&E in this manner, where you can add, remove and modify whatever and multiple units at the same time.
It's amazing how close the game actually gets to being good, but falling so horribly short.

My biggest gripe is that you can only recompose 2 divisions at a time. Want to add 30 artillery to these thirty divisions? You have to add one at a time, which gets insane if you have many support brigades to attach and a large army like the soviets.
If they fixed that one thing the game would be so much better.

I would personally be willing to do it one-by-one, if only the UI was better and didn't require going through all those shitty unit menus.
It's like the devs just don't care.

Having played both HoI3 and HoI4 extensively, I can say without a doubt that you're better off with HoI3.

HoI4 is a parody of the series, it's the most streamlined and casualized pile of shit "grand strategy" you can find. It has so much shit streamlined, both from map size and provinces to army units, organization, structures and gameplay.

Naval and Air combat is completely gutted, submarines are waste of resources and A.I is non-existent.

I geniunely feel anger for having bought HoI4, like as if I was fooled, cheated. Atleast I bought the fucking game on a sale and not for full price.

>It's like the devs just don't care.
After suffering through EU4, HoI4, somewhat CK2 I have come to this conclusion too.
The merging units thing in HoI3 seems to me to just be a quick fix to cut corners. How do we stop players from making divisions with more than 4 battalions? Just force a limit so only 8 battalions can be selected at a time.

I tried getting vicky 1 up and running lately and it literally wont launch without crashing. Tried asking around and apparently everyone who were working at paradox at the time have all left, to me it feels like the enthusiasm that used to be there has dried up (you've got to be inspired when you name your engine after Clausewitz). Now they are dried up and money hungry, probably don't even play their own games.

4 with Kaiserreich

>Tried asking around and apparently everyone who were working at paradox at the time have all left,
Any idea on if they're working in some other companies now?

No clue, only thing I gathered was that no one currently at the company have any idea how vicky 1 works so no fixes are coming.

Johann is still around :^)

>DH with Kaiserreich
fix'd
but seriously OP, just get DH
you have plenty of mods and it doesn't railroad you like HoI3 does.
You can play through WW1, Interwar period, WW2, Cold War and even through some Alt History scenarios like Kaiserreich or even through a fucking Fallout universe.
Avoid HoI4 at all costs

What even made them leave?
Was it the same old tale, with the publisher demanding ridiculous shit that they simply got fed up and left?

>tfw I contributed a bit to MDS years ago
Still my favourite mod.

Why the fuck does paradox keeps casualizing games that are only played by autists in the first place? No matter how much they streamline them normies will never pick it up.

Greed, ambition and stupidity. Niche gamemakers think because they've struck success in their own niche they can expand from it and become popular.

naa its for autistic normies

youtube.com/watch?v=dRGUQKaqLaQ

Order of battle system. Instead of divisions commanded by a a single commander, you have Divisions belonging to Corps belonging to Armies belonging to Army Groups belonging to Theaters. Starting a game as USSR could take 2-3 hours of you reorganizing everything to these five levels.

I bet you enjoy mobilizing 400 infantry divisions that spawn in twenty or so waves to your hand organized armies every time there is a world war in Vicky 2.

I had a war take 3 hours from January->October and then vic2 crashed, and that's how I learned to increase the autosave interval when the game slows down.

My personal reason I hate HoI 4 is they dumbed down the political system, which is what got me into HoI to begin with. I want my sliders back. I want my ten parties back. I want my ministers back.

They seem to be having fun, I wish I had friends too.

do you wanna be friends?

Since this thread is here, is EU4 worth buying?

no

yes

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Buy the game, pirate the dlc.

>hoi4
>better graphics
>better UI
this is b8

What the fuck were they thinking with air warfare in HOI4? You can have an airbase right next to the frontline but it'll have piss poor mission efficiency because it's at the corner of a massive air region
It's a shame because production is handled way better than in HoI3, but there's all that other shit that makes the game unplayable

They said they're trying to fix air warfare for the next big update.

It's simple, always pick Darkest Hour

The colours and the map is just so comfy, I always want to start up a new playthrough when I see screenshots.

>Fallout universe.
The fallout mod is fucking magical, my nigga

It's simplicity done right, HoI2 tuned to it's finest
Also the mods are fantastic, who doesn't enjoy purging Eurasia from syndies as MacArthur?

It also has the ultimate form of Kaiserreich as a mod, that alone makes it better than all other HoI games

The only thing I dislike about DH is the controls, hotkeys, scrolling and such. I mean, the fucking pause key isn't even space and if you want to bind it to space you then can't use spaces in your army names...

I never played HoI3 cause I'm not big into autismo games but... HoI4's new update/patch is looking real good to me.

I had played for several hundred hours before I realized you could just hold enter to go through pop-up messages. Before that I would mouseclick through the great purge and all the ic spam you do as soviets. Fun times.

I'll give HoI 4 one thing, its incredibly bland and casual mechanics makes it good for quick fun online sessions with friends

HoI4 sucks full stop.
HoI3 is barely any better.

Don't think that's a bug but something to do with the game engine, think they mucked about with that in War in the West actually.

I was always afraid I would enter through multiple choice events, but apparently the game prevents you from doing that thankfully

Just use _ instead of space in naming your armies.

>HOI4
>better graphics

That map makes want to poke my eyes out,HOI4 is only good for Kaiserreich.

I'm too autistic for that. I just bound the Pause key to one of my mouse buttons and left space alone in the end.

I like hoi3's map

I just cant stop playing ck2 geheimnisnacht my negers

paradox self-publishes

Since people are talking kaisserreich, I just gotta love the sheer freedom it gives for almost every major power to go hardcore commie, liberal, or full on nazi

So which is the better? Hoi3 or DH Kaiserreich?

The casualization of HoI4 is kind of what I like about it.
It's nice just clicking the go button and watching your army sweep across an entire country in a week

There is no nazism in Kaiserriech,there is various form of fascism though.

You now remember East vs West.

How could I ever forget? Pretty sure that NDA lifts soon.

I wonder what went wrong during development. The leaked version is a bugged mess. It's still fun for an attempted playthrough though.

I can see two reasons, one is that the game had issues with a working economy and that they're hypocrites.

That mod is the shit, it's so slow though fucking hell