Shantae games

Shantae games.
What do you like/dislike about them, and how do you think they can be improved?

I dislike that all their effort goes into fapbait instead of working on actually improving the gameplay

I hate how they keep using shallow fetchquests with only the most tedious designs, followed by a flimsy ass world lore, and further straying from God in art style with every game.

fpbp
Shantae is a shit series with obsolete gameplay from an obsolete genre (2d platformer) that already had its heyday, only kept alive by thirsty waifufags.

personally, I think they had it nailed down to a T with Pirate's Curse.
Half-Genie wasn't as fun imo

The Shantae series is a bad example, but 2D platformers are hardly obsolete.

>Pirate's Curse is generally considered the best because the upgrades are simple and easy to use and don't break the flow of gameplay
>the best Shantae game is the one without the series staple of bellydancing and transformation

Now that's a good sign you've fucked up badly at some point

They're surely cute and look nice, but they don't have quite the amount of thought put into the gameplay itself as, say for example, Shovel Knight.
I'd also appreciate it if they let me play as the transformation I have fun with more instead of needing it to cross 1 gap then change back or suffer the inferior mechanics.

mobility was better, as well.
if they did something to make the dances more streamlined, it would definitely a step up.
personally I just want a remake of the original, but it'll never be done in a satisfying way

I still say the original is the best.

These damn sure aren't replayable. Although that's because of the fetchquests.

>further straying from God in art style with every game
?

What do you feel were the best 2D platformers?

Transforming has been improved a couple times, but the big change I want now is for transformations to be fun and viable, and not need to immediately change back to Genie mode if I'm having fun. They need to support players playing the way they want and the series would EXPLODE with replayablity and an elimination of the tedious "change, but then immediately change back" attitude.

Oh, but it could be, though. Remember, WF did mention wanting to make a 3D platformer.

But at this point, Shantae's marketability is shot all to shit and back. May as well make that Mega Man-esque MSF3.

This may surprise you, but the guy drawing art isn't necessarily the guy designing levels or coding the engine. There's room for both appealing art and thoughtful game design.

Uniquely Middle Eastern/cartoonish -> Strictly cartoonish with some Middle Eastern influences rarely -> anime portraits and absolutely hodgepodge world -> the fucking melting pot of time periods that was HGH soiled even harder with unfitting 2.5D and an incredibly generic cartoon style

Good games, but nothing extraordinary about (except Pirates Quest, that game was really fun).

well, it was nice having a genuine discussion on Sup Forums for once, but it's 1:00 A.M. where I am, so i've got to get some sleep.

>Shantae's marketability is shot all to shit and back.
HGH was underwhelming, true, but I wouldn't go that far. Shantae's visibility is higher than ever before, now that she has exposure on PC and now modern consoles. Recognizability goes a long ways. And the Kickstarter really boosted hers.

Hate that it was critical just before bed.
Just know that most of us love her and want to see the series shine bright for once.

It increased visibility, but advertising that you're a mediocre-to-poor game series doesn't increase the customer base at all. I think, at this point, they'll have to go 3D and modestly clothe Shantae just to get back on their feet.

>I think, at this point, they'll have to go 3D and modestly clothe Shantae just to get back on their feet.
They'll be fine. Shantae was never a huge seller.

>go 3D
How dare you.

>modestly clothe Shantae
Absolute heresy.

Unfortunately it means they'll probably have to return to the Kickstarter formula rather depend on a confident publisher. Crowdfunding is too unreliable for them to get a decent budget, so any resulting game will probably be comparable to HGH again.

Only played Pirate's Curse.
Holy smokes, the sprite work was beautiful. And OST was catchy as fuck.

Fine is not okay.
Great is good.

You can't sit there and tell me that it wouldn't be better received as a 3D platformer. If they insist on doing transformations by dancing and fetchquests, that's a lot like what Banjo-Kazooie or Super Mario would do, and they get praised for it (because it doesn't disrupt 3D flow).

Is it heresy? I think so, but I can guarantee you that her design is keeping a lot of people away. Because people are stupid.

wasn't Pirate's Curse being worked on during the HGH kickstarter campaign? WF usually releases Shantae games when they build up enough extra resources to do a passion project.

Pirates' Curse > Original > Risky's Revenge

Risky's Revenge is only that low due to the stupid fetch quests and how small it is. Was pretty much a step-back from the original in terms of gameplay.

I still need to play HGH, but I was waiting for all the DLC to come out after I heard that it was short as fuck.

I just want a new game on the style of the original, give me a fully interconected world and large dungeons focused on exploration, I don't hate any of the games but pirate's curse already nailed the stage based gameplay and making more games on that style just make them seem bad

Yeah, they make a bunch of licensed games, then use the leftover money to make Shantae and such.

>You can't sit there and tell me that it wouldn't be better received as a 3D platformer.
That's not a foregone conclusion. Shantae has always been 2D and it's worked well enough. The fetchquest garbage is the worst part about it, and I'd rather they ditch that before they switch genres just to make an unfun mechanic fit.
>her design is keeping a lot of people away. Because people are stupid.
That may be, but they will have to get used to it. If WF acted ashamed of her after all this time I'd probably lose all respect for them. They'd basically be admitting they are wrong for light fanservice and that is rare enough as it is. No, they need to stand strong about what Shantae is.
Which is fine, because I don't see this ever changing. Matt Bozon doesn't strike me as a ratings whore.

Fine is realistic.

>Like
Makes my dick happy.
>Dislike
Everything else.

I wish for bigger, better gameplay that expands on what made Shantae so great and is stuffed full of delicious content.

>this guy again

Honestly I think they're fine for what they are.

It's a simple platformer with basic but memorable core characters. Shantae is cute, which was the whole point from the start. The newer ones are pretty and fun enough for a simple playthrough, which is all anybody can really ask.

Not every game needs to be super challenging or deep. Sometimes you just want a series that's consistently been what it advertises: cute genie girl does cute adventures again pirate, or pirate ghost, or pirate king. Always the same town, friends, and basic rival.

that would be a great image if it was Rottytops.

Well, WF doesn't seem willing to do that. At all. If so, they may as well go 3D, it's for the best. Besides, it'd be fun to explore Sequin Land that way for once.

People don't get used to things, they ignore them. And after HGH and nigh-burning their fanbase after asking for Kickstarter money, they need some ratings (or in this case, sales).
And it has nothing to do with admitting wrong or some such. It's just that she's a half-naked cartoon girl, and that automatically gets associated with a very wrong crowd and entertainment style.

And this whole thing right here is how I know that they know this:
Plus the tongue-in-cheek dialogue Shantae has with Bran-Son.

I really like brown women

They should remake the first game, maybe then they would be reminded of what made shantae great
I also want more content, don't bother giving meaning to it, just add shit to collect for the sake of it, I hate how in the latest shantae games I actually have to purposely avoid collecting something to see the any% ending because they made it easy as fuck to do 100%

And bring back the huge open worlds, it could even be like order of ecclesia where you have multiple "stages" but each one is its own self contained world, it also would help when backtracking, it's way more doable when you're roaming a world than when you're replaying a stage

As it's been said in the thread already.
Original's dated.
RR is good mechanically, but its length and padding from backtracking weigh it down.
Pirate's curse has largely been the peak due to just raw mobility and progression feeling more meaningful than just situational dances.
HGH suffers painfully from it just being "stages" with no connected means, the fact that it feels about 2 stages were just cut out (Negaspace and the Genie Realm), and that transformations... as always, Transformations are largely situational. Monkey's got some better platforming but next to no combat potential. Elephant and Mouse are garbage. Spider is just Risky's grappling hook but worse. Bat is just a gimped Harpy which breaks stages. Crab and Mermaid were decent.

Shantae mode needs a bigger emphasis on the exploration front, and make your transformations worth more of a damn.
Risky mode should keep being a "challenge" of more limited campaign with a bigger emphasis on speed.

Well, they should be striving to make Great a reality, like every other successful business does.

Vague parental references and completely forgetting Risky's development from SatPC doesn't work out well with any of those core elements.

Wayforward is not a one-trick pony. They have other properties besides Shantae, as well as all the licensed games they do. If they need cash, they aren't going to change Shantae, they'll just do more licensed work and return later. That's their style.

As for that watch game, I don't feel like they're ashamed of Shantae, I think they just like Bolo and wanted to give him SOMETHING. And I mean, Bolo is pretty great, but prior to the friends expansion, he was entirely overshadowed.

I really disagree, I know a lot of people only got into shantae for waifufaggotry reasons but I genuinely loved the gameplay and I want them to do better like in the older games
I surely don't hate the new ones but I feel I'm playing it more for the characters than for the game itself, shantae having great characters and dialogues are almost a given, they really should focus in improving the gameplay

They could easily encorporare the transformations into pirate curse style flow. Her changing into a Harpie to double/triple jump then right back is no more ridiculous than pulling a canon out of her cooch

>is not a one-trick pony
I find that funny considering that most of their other properties start with the word "Mighty." Their "style" is flailing right now, and you're only as good as your most recent performance.

No, I didn't say they were ashamed of Shantae. What I said is that they know that the market is ashamed of Shantae, and adjusted for her design by giving her the hood and cloak. You cannot ignore this.

...Honestly, this.
Growth of the character in a means tied to gameplay.
Shantae to the point that she no longer has to do the full dance to go into forms, and they largely become just extra moves of hers.
Holy shit that's simple.

working on 1 and risky's revenge at the moment (i hate that part of myself that won't let me start anywhere for certain games) so i don't really know. everything seems in order so far. whenever i get out of this gayming slump i've been in, i'll get back to them.

Are you being dumb on purpose? They gave her clothes that resemble a more traditional RPG style, if they were trying to make her more modest she would be actually covered and not with that enormous cleavage

Also the mighty games couldn't be more different between themselves and all of them are highly experimental

That's basically how she'd play in Smash. Otherwise, you just have this boring brawler. I suppose the Specials could be the magic spells instead of the transformations, but that doesn't really set Shantae apart from any other character.

OK, there's definitely a tinge of agenda in your tone, here. You're saying you WANT them to change her? That they NEED to?

The only alternative is that you're just dead set on being told you're right in your assesment despite the fact you know full well they aren't going to throw their style, their approach under the bus just to get a few more points on Metacritic and appease the feminist blog... oops, I mean "reviewers."

I'm sorry user, that's just not going to happen. At the very least, they've given us no indication that they'd turn heel like that.

Put the dance on a minigame like the first game and done
The newer games have a big problem in the "there's nothing to do other than progressing" department, they're becoming so formulaic and linear that I feel the next one will just have a boss select menu like mega man

>the best Shantae game is the one without the series staple of bellydancing and transformation
no belly dancing or transformations, eh? shit. i liked having my tiny dancer. there goes some of the charm

I like that she looks cute

I dislike its not a hentai game

>how do you think they can be improved?
More porn.

Shit games only posted on Sup Forums because of whyfoo faggotry.
>How do you think they can be improved?
By gassing the cancerous weebs.

This. They gave Bolo a fucking SWORD instead of his trademark chained mace. So it's clear they gave Shantae a hood is in line with a more generic fantasy style instead of her usual Arabian feel.

That kind of attire is expected of the Fantasy Rogue trope! That's why they added it! Holy crap, you're dense!

Yeah, and not a damn one of them has been a major success. Hell, having Mighty in the title made the games come across as mighty uninteresting to start with.

Whatever. You want them to stay niche - I'm telling you that they won't survive the next crash or paradigm shift if they stay niche and don't have ONE franchise that breaks big. Then you won't have ANY more games from them ever.

Why do you want to gas yourself?

Go suck some AAA dick, retards like you are the reason DmC happened

To sell more and survive as a studio? Yes.

For what it's worth, I hope I'm wrong, and maybe people actually accept her design as-is but were just waiting for the gameplay to be good, or the story to be appealing, or the format to be right, or whatever the hell Shantae needs.

It'd be the smoothest implementation, but it would also amount to making her the same as every other platformer protag in a Metroidvania, just with a few flashier frames of ability activation.

I feel like true transformations can still work, but they just need to be all around more useful. All they have to do is remove the novelty forms like "bat" and give each of them more moves.

How's his voice in HGH?

I HATE DmC, and how DARE you accuse me of that garbage! That monstrosity was greenlit by out-of-touch suits that got flashbanged by buzzwords and sales memes.

If you don't want to acknowledge what EVERYONE FUCKING ELSE KNOWS ABOUT THE SHANTAE SERIES AND CHARACTER WHEN YOU ASK THEM, that's your goddamn business.

I truly hope you're just playing devil's advocate. Chipping away all identity just to be more "successful" and more "mainstream" is not acceptable, and no fan of a series should ever wish for that to happen. If they made her completely unremarkable and inoffensive just to achieve that, what fans would even still remain?

I haven't played it yet. Might give it a shot this weekend.

I can't wait for the next shantae game to be a battle royale survival game with character creation and crafting mechanics

I know I should be horrified by the suggestion, but I'd probably still buy it. That sounds too crazy to not give a shot.

They should just make an adult Shantae game

As much as I want to see official Shantae raunch, I guarantee there's no market for that. Unless it was made by one pervert in his free time.

>how do you think they can be improved?
Take inspiration from games like Wonder Boy III or Demon's Crest for transformations, where they aren't totally useless beyond having a single unique skill or attribute.
Have length and ambition on par with the original Shantae again.
Have level design and combat at least on par with Monster World IV, but with less linear progression.
cut down on fetch quests.
Delete HGH art style.

Wayforward's always been in a tough situation with the Shantae series, because past the first game, they've had to treat them as budget side projects. HGH is kind of an exception, because it wasn't treated as a side project upfront, but I think they hoped the KS would be a blowout MN9 type of success, WF's a decently sized company so they couldn't go on a limb with extra content the same way other indies could, like Yacht Club did for Shovel Knight.

With HGH it looked like they were hoping the big bump in production value from all of the stretch goals (full VO, animated cutscenes, etc.) would make up for planned concessions in gameplay. It definitely looked like they didn't want HGH to be bigger in concept than their minimum KS goal would have afforded, so stages were broken up, level design was pretty straight forward, and campaigns weren't very elaborate.

While I actually still enjoyed HGH, I think WF just needs to be able to to commit to more Shantae games without needing the crowdfunding route. Assuming they can feel confident in their ideal plans for the games, I think they could eventually hit a groove like they were starting to hit with Pirate's Curse. Hopefully their digital sales have been adding up these last few years.

I only played Pirates Curse but the writing could use an improvement. Most attempts at humor were the self aware type crap that's in everything now even though it's lazy and lame.

I agree with this completely.

I dislike that all their effort goes into making games instead of drawing Shantae porn

there isn't nearly enough fapbait in Shantae games, also some pregnancy mechanics would be nice

Never played a single game but I think the design is cute.

I want to lick Shantae's butt hole

>Self Aware Humor is Bad now
You still find ways to Surprise me, Anons

It's lazy and unfunny when something relies way too heavily on it. As an occasional gag it works, but when it's all you do, it's just mediocre.

i want to fuck risky
and when she tries to get away
i want to pull her back in
and fuck her forever more
and remind her that there's no escape

shantae's always had pretty silly jokes.

Thanks for beta testing.

Be prepared for Risky's Revenge

Not enough porn of Twitch and Vinegar

I've only play PC, but the backtracking is annoying; not the "backtracking core to metrovania" was annoying, but "backtracking to take on some arbitrary quest from some arbitrary NPC that is negligible to the plot" annoying.

The focus on tact less fanservice as opposed to world building and creating interesting characters that aren't one line troupes. Idk, I guess it's my fault for expecting more out of such a renowned platform.

>ultimate edition
What's ultimate about it?

everything

Final chapter and true ending.