>It is not our job to listen to users.
Based Kamiya telling it like it is. No matter how much you casuals bitch, whine, moan, and prattle on about how much you hate motion controls in games, they are not going to go anywhere.
Star Fox Zero was the best game of 2016, and I am anxious to see where the series goes next.
Then it's our job not to buy shitty games.
Which is exactly what happened.
Kamiya is a fucking idiot. He's wrong here, he's wrong about W101 being appealing, and he's incredibly wrong to think that his Bayonetta gun-shooting, T&A trash is any better than its equivalent in DMC2 (much less any other entry).
The average user does not know what they want and cannot design anything worth shit. His statement is right, and people wouldn't know good design if it clocked them in the head. Imagine if gamefreak LISTENED to people suggestions for pokemon. It would be unplayable shiet.
blocked
>It is not our job to listen to users.
I thought the 'Japanese Phil Fish' was just a meme, what a fucking tool
>Wonderful 101 is shitty
>Star Fox Zero is shitty
>Bayonetta is shitty
t.someone who's never actually played Bayonetta
Did you mash your way through DMC1 on Normal as well? And Kamiya is right to an extent, you know what happens when you listen to fans too much? You get dogshit like Overwatch.
>You get dogshit like Overwatch.
You get a massively popular game that has won tons of awards? Sounds like Kamiya is just salty over others popularity
I can respect a guy for sticking to his guns. It's just unfortunate when some of the things he seems to insist upon (Sylvia in VJ2 and QTEs in Bayo) are genuinely terrible.
>Popular
It's streambait social media popular. It isn't popular as an actual game.
Undertale won lots of awards too and no one tries to pretend that that game was good anymore.
and its my job to buy your shitty game
>It's streambait social media popular. It isn't popular as an actual game.
>Undertale won lots of awards too and no one tries to pretend that that game was good anymore.
Wow not only you're retarded, you're also delusional
Do not believe this user
It is known that the problems with Star Fox Zero are all Shigeru Miyamoto's fault.
Insisting on shitty controls
If the controls were so bad, and so broken... why did the game come out? And why are fans so willing to defend it?
The casual, furry audience who hate Zero don't want to admit that they simply do not know how to play this game.
>And why are fans so willing to defend it?
It was a time when the WiiU was on its last legs and the rabid fanboys who defended everything about it were starving for games
>Fans are divided over it
>Reviewers Trashed it
>Sales were a bomb
>Miyomoto made excuses
Tell me why it's such a good game.
user, what may be unappealing to you is appealing to others, now imagine a developer trying to listen to all the fans comments, not only are you interfering to the developers original vision, but in the process you may compromise the game itself, making it a mess due to it trying to appeal everyone's tastes which is why games have been suffering in quality lately.
I'm not saying that devs should never listen, but it is true that people don't know what they want until they are shown it and.
That's their fucking job, then, is to mix consumer feedback with actual knowledge.
Kamiya is incompetent at this, and it shows in his frustration which becomes a self-defeating spiral that results from his own stubbornness.
Yes, all 3 of them are trash in some regard.
W101 is an awful concept and mockingly inaccessible to its target audience.
Star Fox Zero lacked content, straight up ripped SF64's ending scenario, looked like piss in some instances (to the point it needed delay), and forced alternate controls in a series that has suffered greatly for it before (Command).
Bayonetta obviously has traction thanks to its style and appeal, but the core story elements that would otherwise have larger dark fantasy appeal and sales receive far less attention in favor of how close to nude they can get Bayonetta. Furthermore, a lot of B1's combat boiled down to either shooting a bunch of angels in a sphere lineup, or spam X or Y combo. Didn't play B2 because B1 failed to impress. B3, eh, I'll (unfortunately) be here forever to see the feedback.
>Fans
Furries don't like it. People who actually like the 64 formula loved it.
There's a reason you see Assault and Adventure shilled so much among those people. Those are the ones that had Krystal.
I had plenty of games to play in 2016.
>He thinks listening to consumers will result in anything positive
I can tell you aren't a creative person.
>People who actually like the 64 formula loved it.
Maybe because it was a rehash of 64 except with none of the good things about that game
>people who liked the 64 formula
No they don't because they hated the shitty controls they had to put up with
not that user, but imagine this, people are so reluctant to try out different control schemes for games that automatically call things gimmics, take for example Kid Icarus on the 3DS, aiming with the stylus is really fast and accurate, though movement required getting used to, yet tons of people immediatelly wanted regular controls for it.
Nintendo has always been about finding new ways to experience games, thus rumble was invented or brought to mainstream, analogue sticks, motion controls etc, most people just want the status quo and are afraid of trying new things, now I haven't played Zero cause I don't have a WiiU, but I would love to try out simply because of the experience of having to concentrate on 2 screens at once, its more like a challenge, I'm sure the game handles well since Nintendo is very picky about gameplay itself, I think the main problems is with people's ability to multitask which is another layer to the gameplay experience, kinda like playing a flight sim were you have to keep track of the airplane and all its gauges and controls at the same time.
at least that's my take on it.
We have seen how incredibly generic gaming has gotten - lining up with what you're talking about. Obviously it's refreshing to have games with style.
But style alone does not a game make. Might make a movie or TV show, but not a game. Kamiya and his crew need to really be listening to comments on the everything but the aesthetics.
Caveat: Don't listen to the fans about style when the franchise's concept and aesthetics show sales traction (whether that's niche or mass market sales traction, whatever's desired, whatever is the target market).
See
Starfox Zero would work if they just fucking made it possible to aim on the top screen and got rid of all the 360 aiming meme shit. Switching to the gamepad view and back in the heat of the moment isn't natural, especially because it can take a moment to find your bearings on the gamepad, and you'll straight up never find it in the all range space missions.
It should've just been Kid Icarus Uprising: Starfox and Gyro controls edition
>I don't know how to play the game, the post
It really isn't that difficult.
>But style alone does not a game make
Cuphead, for anyone who has been playing vydia since the nes era, cuphead is a nice game, though most of its appeal is in it's style, gameplay is very generic, but then again that kind of gameplay has been somewhat lost to time so its nice to have a game remind us how games used to be or at least teach new generations how games used to be.
I think games don't necessarily have to be ground breaking all the time though they should try and since we have kinda reached a point were being original is very hard it mostly comes down to style and in the case of Nintendo how you play the game via it's peripherals.
I really dont understand anyone who tries to sell Cupheads gameplay short. Does it take a backseat to the aesthetic? Yes. But it's also one of the strongest aesthetics the industry has had by pure fucking craftsmanship. Even if you don't personally like it.
But as you said, it's a style of gameplay thats been largely lost to time. With a metric fuckload of excellently designed bosses that have also largely been lost to time. On top of some good modern twists like loadout variety and a scoring system. Even little details like traversing the overworld are quite well done with secrets and skips available to you.
Tl;Dr Cupheads artstyle may rise above the rest of the game but it's not like the gameplay doesn't land somewhere in good-great
>>Star Fox Zero was the best game of 2016,
I'm more forgiving of it than most, but thats just silly.
What was its competition? Overwatch?
its gameplay is good yes, well basically it's perfect since the formula was perfected a long time ago, and it is a good game, I'm just saying that the game is mostly praised by its style rather than its gameplay and the only thing I can think that hasn't been done before in a 2D shoot em up before is the overworld itself, aside from that, we've all seen games like that before, not trying to knock it, just saying that for old players cuphead is just a good game that reminds us of the good old times. and for new players its mostly "hey look at that it looks like a cartoon and its fucking hard like dark souls"
Consumers indeed don't know what they want, and these guys often indeed know hetter.
Take a look at Splatoon's map rotations, for example. Million idiots want it to go away, not realising how much it increases variety.
It's been proven time and time again that if you give consumers full freedom, all they play is one map and two guns. Limiting it to same random maps for everyone at any given moment allows to mix it up and eventually get a taste of everything the game offers, and getting a random chance of getting one of two maps makes weapon a bigger consideration- gun A may be good on map A and you'd gladly use it on AB rotation, but if it sucks on C you'd have to choose something else for AC rotation. Or gamble and try to make that gun work on C, which is also variety as you'd never see or use it there in any other system.
>It is not our job to listen to users.
Maybe not his job specifically, but you can't expect to sell a game if you're ignoring any and all input and demographics and just doing whatever you want.
Typical Kamiya with his tough guy act.
I'm sure if the game didn't have rotation and instead full freedom you'll defend it for "trusting consumers to take the responsibility of experiencing all the game has to offer" and attack the players for sticking to one or two choices.
>Kamiya is a fucking idiot
Did Kamiya block you?
>>Star Fox Zero is shitty
Yes? It's a shitty remake that is worse than SF 64
>Undertale won lots of awards too and no one tries to pretend that that game was good anymore.
Fuck off, I don't care what the fanbase or the haters say, I still love the game the same I did 2 years ago
>we cant listen to you guys(raughs)
>your opinions are invalid(raughs)
>but give us money anyways(raughs)
>months later
>UUUUUH WHY DONT PEOPLE UNDERSTAND MY MASTERGENIUS MIND? WHY NO LOVE FOR MY GAEMS?(sweats like a pig)
Sure, the guy that makes the game should do the game the way he thinks is better. But not listen to fans, or being a dick, or not being careful with the words is a very big mistake.
I'd be a little taken back with what Kamiya said, but I realized that Platinum Games is really a boutique game developer not really interested in consistent mainstream successes (Bayo being their one exception.) They're less of an entertainment company and more of an artist studio. Look at their game list; publishers go to PG when they need to listen to THEIR user base and shake things up.
W101 was good though
He's right about ignoring users to an extent. But motion controls are still dogshit.
>Priss understan
Why are there so many plebs unable to understand what Kamiya meant? Its his job to surprise us, give us a little of what we want, and also give us a little of what we didn't know we wanted.
Mob rule leads to decadence.
A creator's only responsibility is to make what they want to make.
Just so you know, you're insane.
Although I understand his point, it still needs to be stated that it's not our job to buy their games.
>W101 is bad
The mark of a true plebian
Just popping in to take a shit on you. Another crap thread with crap reasoning posted by a crap person crapped out by his crap mom.