What went wrong, Sup Forums?

What went wrong, Sup Forums?

paper mario

Gimmick shit and too many minigames in every game past the first.

No Co-op.

Nothing, the series is still continuining trying new things without destroying the main gameplay

This is true dillusion

You have to be a fucking moron to completely forget the bullshit the first game put you through

Every Koopaling had a mini game, you had the Fucking Minecraft, the skeleton Puzzle, the surfing, I can go on

Too easy

Nothing, these games are pretty damn fun. inb4 genuinely stupid comments like the models are soulless, aka I have no argument but want to complain

You mean every game besides Partners in Time which surprisingly didn't have that many mini-games.

Yes.
The Koopalings all had a gimmick in how you had to get to, and then perform their boss fights. Some little mini-games throughout.
The issue is that, particularly BiS onward, the core game gets bogged down by whatever "Crazy twist" the adventure has to have. Bowser's actual insides were mediocre dungeons at best. Dreamscape was a fucking bore. Paper Jam was alright for the most part because it kept the real gimmicky shit to just a boss fight archetype.

I can't say that anything went wrong, especially since I've only played until Dream Team and none of the latter. I never got to experience Partners in Time, for better or for worse.

I guess I've just grown tired of the series, as stupid as that sounds after only playing three games. Either that or the way how things are often played a bit too safely. The remake looks ok, but at the same time, I'm not all that thrilled to ever get it since I've already played the original.

Even though I did enjoy Dream Team at a few points, I just never did quite enjoy it as much as previous entries. It felt more like a dragging task, if anything, although I believe I also somewhat felt like that with BIS as well (although I was surprisingly unfazed by its mini-games). Some of the characters' personalities were really goddamn awful too in DT and the gyro gimmick really got me frustrated as well, even though I tried my best to stay positive.

I kinda wish they tried to give Mario & Luigi more wackier adventures, like Superstar Saga/Mario + Rabbids kind of wacky. When the franchise feels limited to using the Super Mario plot and assets for plot, it often feels very repetitive. Granted that shouldn't make a plot technically bad, it's more the way how they handle things. There are so many ways they could spice things up and they just never quite did anything as zany as Superstar Saga. Dream Team was actually the closest I can think of, but it feels kind of squandered at the same time. Starlow feels way too forced as well and overcoming her stay, I never enjoyed her that much in BIS and neither in DT.

Post BiS models were trash. Should’ve stuck to sprites.

The 3DS games do use sprites.

Technically, they are sprites, I think. Unless they're actually stills from 3D models. Dunno.

I actually liked the graphics in Giant Luigi's battles, I hope next game decides to move away from the sprite thing and into something as similar as that for the Switch.

nonstop mandatory tutorials

TOADS
MORE TOADS
YOU LIKE TOADS?

Nintendo got lazy, and related their Mario RPG series to the same quality as their Party franchise.

Could they move it from traditional gameplay to something like Mario 64?

Still waiting for that Wario & Waluigi team-up

Nothing gameplay wise.
They've fixed a lot of the annoying shit, and the battles and boss fights keep getting better, but it seems like they've gone creatively bankrupt at this point.
Paper Jam is alright, and it has fixed issues like mandatory tutorials, but it plays it very safe and isn't anything really mind blowing.
They need to let the series take a break for a while since it seems like they don't have too many interesting ideas to work with.

Paper Jam and the Superstar Saga remake allow you to skip tutorials now.

Dream Team was the worst professionally-developed game I've ever played in my life, and I was a huge fan of the series up until that point. Was Paper Jam any better?

They're so easy I might as well play VN

Couldn’t agree more. Paper Jam was better, but don’t expect a story.

>hey this game is like paper mario just not as good
>battles become tedious quickly
>failing to dodge the same attack from the same enemy because you dont understand what the tell is
>game is extremely easy with no hardmode for players over age 10

Paper Jam fixes some stuff from Dream Team (no more gyro controls for stuff that used it, tutorials can be skipped mostly now, etc) but it has the most basic story as it's trade off.

Dream Team has a Hard Mode but you have to beat the game once to unlock it.

You are unwilling to accept the fact that you are impossible to please because you feel that change is bad and when it's missing it's a rehash.

Dream Team was already a pretty bad story. How can it get worse?

Dream Team was fine though.
Paper Jam is alright but it can feel extremely padded out with large amount of toad minigames, but I still prefer it to Partners in Time which carries over a lot of the flaws Superstar Saga has.
PiT is the only entry that made me want to drop the game while playing.

Stop repeating nonsense you heard other people say on the internet to sound like you're somehow above the rest of the board. Bowser's Inside Story changed a ton of stuff from the Superstar Saga, but it's generally beloved by the fanbase.

It's just basic I mean. It's basically Bowser and Paper Bowser try to kidnap Peach & Paper Peach the plot with stuff happening along the way.

I actually give Dream Team props at least had original characters like Antasma and new settings with Pillow Island.

...

But where does Colour Splash (or whatever the Wii U one was called) fit in?

Probably mid or low

is it worth playing the other ones if i didn't enjoy superstar sage?
i liked the gameplay somewhat but it was too fucking easy and it felt tedious as fuck to explore.

Not technically,they literally are sprites

Switch around PM64 and TTYD and it's perfect.

>is it worth playing the other ones if i didn't enjoy superstar sage?
Probably not. Most would say Superstar Saga is one of the best games in the series.

>>game is extremely easy with no hardmode for players over age 10
Please, you vastly underestimate kids.

Either give SMRPG and PM64 their own tier or drop BiS into mid tier

superstar saga is good until the Beanstar breaks after that its dream team tier

This. I enjoyed each new M&L more than the last but the series starts to overstay it's welcome. Paper Mario has it better IMO, even if everything after TTYD sucks at least there's something new going on.

Agreeable.

card tier

>I actually give Dream Team props at least had original characters like Antasma and new settings with Pillow Island

Yeah, I enjoyed that as well, it's such a shame it kind of fell flat. Antasma, as cool looking as he was, actually felt pretty underwhelming as a villain and a character just so Bowser could look better in comparison as a villain and to give him a redemption after being possessed so many goddamn times. The Pillo characters were actually pretty comfy, but then you had those... God, I even forgot those things' names, they were just so obnoxious and trying to act as a annoyance for the sake of stretching the plot even further, I'd just rather forget about them.

>want to replay Dream Team
>remember the giant battles

>>want to replay Dream Team
That's your mistake.

I used to love Superstar Saga but after replaying it recently I'm not sure how I feel about it anymore.
I ended up not having fun on my playthrough and started getting annoyed at stuff like the beanstar hunt, constantly shuffling through the bros. moves just to cross a small gap, and the bosses and fights just feel underwhelming due to how easy they are. The later games feel like they drag at some points but at least the battles and bosses are enjoyable enough for me to want to keep playing.
This is probably how I'd rank the series for now though it may change:
BIS>DT>PJ>SSS>PiT
they're definitely better than the ones in BIS with the mic shit.

What's wrong with PiT?

Weak story

It's too late, they missed their chance to have the fourth game star four Bros.

The babies

Nothing, aside from the story PJ was based. DT and PJ have the most fun bosses I've ever played. DT's OST was elder god tier too. Not gonna lie though, playing SSS + Bowser's Minions makes me hope that they take a simpler approach again. It's fun as fuck and one of the best nostalgia trips I've ever had. The new art style and music make it my favorite in the series. Only flaw is Popple's theme, what the FUCK where they thinking

I'd rank as: SSS+BM > Dream Team > Paper Jam > BIS > PIT

I found it pretty good, but the giant battles ruin it for me.

>they're definitely better than the ones in BIS with the mic shit.
BIS at least let you do some actual damage without turning every attack into a tedious minigame and using the mic wasn't nearly as annoying as the gyro shit.
Also, the battles in DT drag on while you can finish the ones in BIS pretty quickly if you know what to do.

issues that superstar saga had are actually done worse here.
>exploring is more tedious you need to dismount the babies to get to some areas, and certain abilities require you to dismount the babies, take control of the bros. again, switch to a specific bros move, use the bros move on the babies, and then finally take control of the babies to proceed.
>combat feels more repetitive since a lot of attacks share very similar inputs, and they even reuse a few attacks which have very minor changes like making the enemies stats lower
>tutorials are handled at their worst here since after they teach you how to perform the move, you're forced to get past some dumb obstacle course instead of letting you test out the move in the next major area you go to.
these are few shitty things it does, but i'm sure there's more.
the only one that felt like it dragged on for me was the zeekeeper due to the dumb gyro shit they're. normally i'm fine with gyro but that fight takes it overboard.

Between low & sticker tier.

I agree. I'd say Superstar Saga > BiS > Paper Jam > PiT > DT for me.

I did not enjoy Partners in Time that much but I was at least able to power through it and finish it. Dream Team was so boring I just plain quit halfway in.

for me it's probably
BIS=DT>PJ>PiT
not sure how i feel about superstar saga after playing the remake though it might be in the same position as BIS and DT for me.