MGS4 may be a movie but that doesn't mean it's not a masterpiece

MGS4 may be a movie but that doesn't mean it's not a masterpiece

dude nanomachines lmao

I liked piloting rex

How the fuck could REX bite RAY without crushing Snake who's inside its mouth?

snake...had a hard life

Big Boss coming back was dumb.

You only remember the last part of the game
Literally every thing before it was retarded and such a drag, the final parts are stupid but they are entretaining

It was a better story than V or Survive. We'll never see a remake so fucking enjoy it

>It was a better story than V
Nah.

Though MGSV retcons MGS4 in weird ways and Venom is a dumb narrative addition in terms of plot.

do you watch movies without sound? every line of dialogue contradicts and destroys the series cannons and the script is often flat out wrong when it's mentioning past events.

MGS4 is the worst in the series.

regardless on your thoughts on 4
solid snake > big boss
this is fact

lol no did you even play PW? Big Boss is sexy beach time fun

...

Anyone who doesn't think the Rex vs Ray fight wasn't one of (if not THE) best moment in the entire series is LYING.

MGSV retcons MG1, MG2, MGS3 and MGS4. Technically, you could say it retcons even MGS1 as it now makes it that Liquid and Psycho Mantis have known each other since they were kids.
Also, MGSV is much, much worse than 4 in the story department. It's padded to hell and back and the story could be summed up in a sentence, the main villain is a joke, the big reveal was found out before the game even came out, and it ruins just about every character that wasn't Kaz.

Ocelot was pretty decent, flowed real well with 3's version and showed how much respect he had for the real BB by how far he'd go.

There are some people, to this day, that still somehow are not aware that Ocelot was The Boss's son.

Except he had no personality, the lines he's given don't fit the character we've seen in 4 games, the VA is complete dogshit (it's just Troy Baker talking) and when actually competent actors like Huey and Kaz show up, he starts to sound exactly like Kaz for some reason and they're completely indistinguishable. This is especially fucked if you're trying to listen to a tape at the same time. MGSV is one of maybe two games where I'm frustrated just walking around because of that.

I mentioned MGS4 because of how much it completely upends the story we're told about Big Boss and Zero's relationship. Most of the other retcons are trivial. Even Venom -- though again stupid with respect to continuity -- is fairly insignificant.

MGSV is much more interesting to me on a thematic and conceptual level than MGS4, despite the sloppy presentation. Both are guilty of self-reference and fanwank, but MGSV has something to say on a level MGS4 doesn't.

And I'm not sure what characters MGSV "ruins" either.

...

Okay.

>MGSV has something to say on a level MGS4 doesn't
What did MGSV say. You can't say anything related to demons or revenge as those plotlines are trash tier in comparison to even PW's mess of a story, Quiet is a complete waste of a character, Huey has a plot but it's only there so Otacon looks like less of an asshole in 2, and Eli's story is incomplete, and even with the unfinished cutscenes, it adds nothing other than 'And then he left'.
Venom Snake is a non-character who just grunts at everything and sometimes says something, but everything he says is so stilted it makes him look unironically autistic. The 10 second long gaps between character's talking doesn't help either, and it makes Resident Evil 2's voice acting look amazing by comparison.
The worst part about this is that this is how Big Boss actually is now, as everybody is convinced Venom is Big Boss, so you can't use the mental clone excuse.
Ocelot is just there for fanservice, unlike MGS4 where he served a purpose (that being to cap off the Liquid Ocelot shit from 2). He doesn't look like Ocelot nor sound and act like Ocelot. He's just Troy Baker playing Troy Baker.
Kaz is the only character I'd say is still good, but it's somewhat brought down by V making him a blind cripple, when that was never mention in MG2 and MGS1.
Huey is just there to make Otacon look better. The Voice actor is perfect though, as he can actually act and emote.
Quiet just exists. She doesn't do anything or leave anything meaningful, and if you dig into her "character" it's just a drag on the theme of language that is grade schooler tier.
Paz might be good, I gave up before I finished all the Side Ops as the Quiet Exit mission just drained all interest I might've had.
Volgin shows up and dies. It's a complete waste.
Eli shows up and does nothing of value. Just there for fanservice. At least fanservice character in 4 did something for the plot to keep it going, Eli stops the plot and makes it lose focus

It kinda flowed in with how good he was "at pretending" and what not, also how the majority of the time he was playing "good cop". (when previous entries show just how far his "master interrogator" technique goes)
You're not wrong about the majority of his lines though. Troy did an okay-ish job at Ocelot DURING actual cutscenes, but outside of that on the radio, it was awful, it was like you said, just Troy talking.

>Ocelot is just there for fanservice
It was suppose to show how much his involvement in the series was. The part he played.

One could argue that the series was as much about Ocelot as it was with BB/Solid Snake.

Making Solid Snake crawl through the microwave room was unnecessary.

Other than that, it was good.

>It was suppose to show how much his involvement in the series was. The part he played.
1-4 already did that. Shoving him on a boat with the cast of PW wasn't required to do that. It would've been better if he only showed up for the prologue and key moments.
Seriously, what did V add to his character? He helped out an MGSV original character who is retconned to be in the least story heavy game that Ocelot isn't even in? He met Kaz and Huey? He jerked off on a tanker for a year with Not Big Boss?

>you can't make these points because I say so!
Okay. I still find Skull Face's relationship to Zero and Big Boss fairly interesting, even if his plans are mostly whatever and egregiously literal takes on linguistics as a theme.

I don't think MGSV has a good story. I do think it's more interesting than MGS4 or PW, though.
>this is how Big Boss actually is now
No? The differences between Big Boss and Venom are pretty apparent. Venom is a vague character made for self-inserting, but the differences are there.

MGS4 is a complete mess gameplay wise and has an incredible amount of stupid narrative decisions (nanomachines, your goofy fucking FOX codec crew being the illusive Patriots).

On the flipside it has some of the best moments in the entire series and sticks the ending incredibly well.

Friendly reminder that MGS3 was the last truly great Metal Gear game and Kojima is an egomaniacal hack.

REMINDER

The only people who don't like MGS4 are:

>adhd muh cutscenes
>mgs2 pretentious fedoras
>people betrayed by their headcannon
>newfags and reddit who go alone with nu Sup Forums

Forgot my image.

*along

>I don't think MGSV has a good story. I do think it's more interesting than MGS4 or PW, though.
Anything is more interesting than PW, but I can't see how it's more interesting than 4. 4 at least had a reason to exist and does an interesting take on Solid Snake's character as an old man facing off against an equally old Liquid, and how the world has changed following MGS1 and 2.
>No? The differences between Big Boss and Venom are pretty apparent.
You skipped the second part dumbass. This is Big Boss' character now, as everyone believes without fault that Venom is Big Boss. The only one who questions this is Huey in his introduction. Not even Skullface notices it.

>This is Big Boss' character now
But it isn't, because the characters act differently in the fucking game. The fact the ruse was effective doesn't change that. Venom is in fact different from Big Boss. That's what makes his decision to stay on board as Big Boss Lite to the very end a key moment in the story and a bit tragic and pessimistic.

MGS2 > MGS1 > MGS3 > MGS4 > PW > V

Just a little reminder for people criticizing the reveal of who the Patriots are in MGS4.
If every game after 3 hadn't been made, the prominent fan theory would've been that the Patriots are the MGS3 radio crew. The hints MGS3 gives are good enough, in addition to Ocelot's relationship with them and their strong connection with The Boss, a person who dreamed of her ideal world.
There's also stuff like
>Who are the Patriots?
>La-Li-Lu-Le-Lo
In short, even without 4, this dumb reveal still would've been commonly accepted

Believe what you want, the actual Big Boss had about 4 lines in TPP and in GZ he isn't much different.
And Venom isn't tragic. If anything, he only makes Big Boss look like an asshole.

>crawl through the microwave room

For the years that I've stood my ground about having a least enjoyed MGS4, that scene will always forever stay with me as the time I actually was taken out of the moment and thought "What the fuck is going on".

What's funny is that it probably wouldn't of even happened had my Father not said anything.
He had been organizing papers in a loft behind where I had been playing and occasionally looked up to see what was going on, and out of all the weird shit that went on in the game, more so for someone who had no idea what it was even about, it took that ONE drawn out scene for him to say "user, what the fuck are you playing?"

except for that shitty france level, but including its cutscenes, 4 was pure kino.
BANG!

but MGS2 is shit

>that doesn't mean it's not a masterpiece
Correct.
It's a ton of other stuff in the game that revokes its possible classification as a masterpiece.

I just wanna replay some sections but there are not any level selectors. Fucking why? WHY GODDAMIT?!

MGS3 suggests the DCI is the mastermind, but the exact involvement of Zero and the support members is kept pretty ambiguous. I agree the hints are there if you look for them, though.
It's not just the dialogue. Compare their behavior and worldviews.

Big Boss is presented in a light similar to that in the MSX games.

It's not so much it "added" to his character, but rather it "continued to show" what we knew about the character.
Granted, like you said, the key moments like his meetings with the real BB probably would have been for the best if that's all he appeared in.

>MGS4 is a complete mess gameplay wise

How so? Genuinely asking because I thought the camo stuff was really cool and made me wish to have something similar while playing V.

Why do you like pacman stealth over real stealth?

May i remind your stupid ass that big boss was a cyborg in mg2?

And that matters how? Does it make the retcons more obvious? Are you one of those retarded theorists that thinks Venom Snake is actually Grey Fox?

Which games are "real stealth"?

Chaos Theory

Venom is his own character, venom is what big boss could had become if he FUCKING UNDERSTOOD WHAT 3 GAMES TOLD HIM ABOUT THE BOSS SACRIFICE JESUS FUCKING CHRIST
The series was always full of retarded twists and complex "motives" of why characters suddenly go full retard for no reason

I like Chaos Theory but I don't think it's necessarily better designed than most Metal Gear games.

Splinter Cell is gay. But what I meant was why do you prefer the corridor stealth where they don't even hear your footsteps over the mechanically deeper ones like Subsistence and TPP?

>How so? Genuinely asking because I thought the camo stuff was really cool and made me wish to have something similar while playing V.
The game has sound mechanics, it's basically just MGS3 Substance+, but it shits all over itself level design and pacing perspective:
>Chapter 1 is relatively short, but overall is good and has a decent amount of Stealth.
>Chapter 2 is the best Chapter in the entire game and features plenty of Stealth gameplay.
>Chapter 3 shits the bed. It's mostly a tailing mission where you're forced to wait for the resistance soldier to slowly move his way across the level; there's incredibly little stealth gameplay since you're so focused on baby-sitting the faggot. The rest of the Chapter is entirely scripted action sequences.
>Chapter 4's stealth gameplay is lackluster because you're sneaking past tiny robots instead of proper enemy guards. There's also little stealth gameplay in the Chapter with it again being on action set pieces and boss fights.
>Chapter 5 has literally 1 room's worth of Stealth gameplay (where the guards are in 24/7 Caution mode already). The rest is just boss fights and cutscenes.
The game just lacks good stealth sections flat out.

Not to mention the main mechanic of "influencing an active war zone by choosing which side to fight on" barely effects anything in the game itself and there's always a clear good guy in every scenario. Also it's dropped after Chapter 2, like the rest of the gameplay.

The same reason people might prefer Mario kart over gran turismo, it feels different but still is racing

Why is this game stuck on PS3 again? Do we need even more powerful consoles to emulate it?

>stuck
It's the system the game was designed for.

you need motion detecting pads like dual shock but capable of rendering 1080 unlike nintendo so its playstation only until another company stops fucking around.

I'm not the guy you originally responded to as my ranking would be different.

Generally speaking though MGS3 and the games after it are pretty poorly balanced.