Are MOBAs dying?

Are MOBAs dying?

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We can only hope.

Nope
But Valve is.

No, why would an optional subscription service cause mobas to die? Personally I'm interested purely for the cosmetic rewards but I still won't pay for it.

depends on your definition of dying.

nope just dota because valve completely changed the game at the height of its popularity for no reason

I sure fucking hope so

Battle Royale games are pretty alright, but I sure as fuck hope we don't end up with tower-spam simulators like Fortnite. Seriously, sans the retarded building mechanic, it's an alright F2P game.

Building is the only thing that makes Fortnite worth playing.

It's on a decline and if that's your definition of dying then sure. Dota still has large numbers that it's still top 3 games played on Steam. I don't think it'll dip below 100k concurrent users for another few years.

Dota plus is a clear indication of them trying to keep people to stay. A subscription leads to you logging in. You logging in means you're more likely to play the game. It's like a shitty daily quest+logins that games do, but you paid $4 for.

from what i gather this is just Valve selling people in-game protips for 5 bucks. I mean, shit that you see just by doing a Google search or reading guides, they're selling for five bucks. Sounds like a fucking gyp to me, personally, but the really funny thing is all the ASSFAGGOTS autists flying into REEEEEE fits because they had to spend over 9000 in-game hours memorizing all the mindless banal garbage trivia and now scrubs will be able to GIT GUD at MUH META just by paying the fat bastard five bucks a month.

it's more than that, there's hero progression and new sets you can get with plus.
i make a shitton of steambucks betting on pro dota so i bought it.

you wish, they're making shitzillions with Steam still

>still pushing this narrative when most if not all people who bought dota plus are not satisfied with it

that's not true

OH NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

Who knows how many people really gives a shit about the stats about what people pick/buy against X. The stats about you doing X,Y, and Z nobody really gives a shit either. Look at inscribed gems for example.

The reality is people want the special sets and currently there are 6 of them. Along with the chat wheel. They both give people a purpose to continue playing for longer and it works to keep people coming back. It's why every modern game has tricks to keep you logging in even if it's for a few minutes despite you being extremely bored of the game.

valve started raping dota back in the reborn update in 2015. been slow downhill ever since.

standard practice in F2P games is to weed out the tightpurses with frequent cosmetics and gameplay changes, then when all they're left with is ignorant whales who will play anything they completely wring them the fuck dry. straight up beach the whales and fucking filet them alive. I'm talking tf2 $100 wedding ring cosmetics.

I'll be honest, I subbed just because I wanted to spam voice lines. Plus, I've got nearly 2000 hours in this game and it feels good to give them money.

Heck, I've subbed to streamers that I barely watched live because I spent a hundred hours watching their VODs.

>Dota plus is a clear indication of them trying to keep people to stay.

nigger I'd still be fucking playing daily if they hadn't done fucking 7.0 and completely raped the game for me. the only reason I stuck around anymore was for ability draft because normal dota became a mess but they even managed to break that with a talent system that literally punishes you for not drafting your own hero skills.

With this valve has saved vidya by ruining ASSFAGGOTS
I can only hope artifact fucks it up even more

Also they're not dying in a million years you idiot, their business model is the singular most sucessful and jewish business model there is
Creating a subconscious dependency and going from an unnecessary middleman to an omnipresent part of the industry.

>I've got nearly 2000 hours in this game and it feels good to give them money.

jesus christ what the fuck is wrong with you. the entire game is designed to milk whales with severe addictive spending issues and you want to reward them for it? literally selling compendiums that encourage you to spend hundreds of dollars for virtual hats, disgusting abusive practices.

is the meme of icefrog leaving for 1.5 years and coming back and seeing the state of dota now and being disgusted true ?

icefrog was paid a lump sum to leave silently under the legal requirement that he never updates wc3dota (cutting out competition) and that he never disclose his employment status with valve.

>he never disclose his employment status with valve
Why would valve care? his only known employment was with them, and it would be asinine to assume anyone else would be stupid enough to get him to make a new ARTS/MOBA/DOTA this late in the race
See: LotR moba, Infinite Crisis, etc

I bought the compendium, but didn't buy any of that currency stuff. On average, I've spent about 20$ a year on Dota 2 since the release. Compared to other games I've bought over the years, some new, some on sale, Dota 2 is far ahead of the curve as far as Hours played / $ spent goes. Far second would be the Civ series.

I do care about the issues that plague gaming, but as far as issues go, Dota 2 is far from the worst. Its monetization schemes are all designed not to give a disadvantage to non-paying players, and most cosmetics can be bought for cents on the Steam Market.

>an in-game guide means DotA is dying

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I'd imagine they thought talents would keep the game growing and bring in new users. In reality, the balance for talents is still silly and drives people away since it's another avenue of complexity to the game. I wonder if it's even Icefrog's idea since the balance changes of them are insane. Nobody picking X talent? Fuck it, double the benefit. In comparison to regular balance change of "X is doing too well early game? -5ms" something so insignificant not even 10minutes later, but had a massive impact very early in the game. I rarely play, but I occasionally watch tournaments. The dota pro circuit is suffering from too many matches for me not to give a shit anymore

That being said, it still doesn't change the fact that they currently want people to keep logging in and now with a purpose of challenges and hero levels.

dota 2 is past its prime. That said, it's still gonna be around for years to come, don't worry.

Heck, series like Civ and Paradox games are far more egregious in their money-grubbing schemes, with ridiculously shallow DLCs being sold for 15-30$ every couple months.

>Bulldog showcases the addon that gives team perfect, if not very good pick/ban guides
>DotA implements it for jewcoin
I'm gonna assume the site Henrik went to is shut down now?

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I'm so fucking glad MOBAs are dying. They are the absolute antithesis of fun in every aspect.

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>Why would valve care?

for the same reason candy companies run those retarded commercials of chefs making it in a kitchen, or milk commercials show an 1800's idealized farmyard.

pretending icefrog is the one balancing gives it a false sense of quality and a figurehead for the players to look to. they can just say "well if icefrog wanted to do this there must've been a good gameplay/balance reason" instead of "valve wanted to simplify a confusing or high barrier gameplay aspect to cater to new players aka new money".

God, I hope so.

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Only dota

MOBAs as a genre are fine

Dota is dying because it's stagnating

The only way Valve could get me to come back to Dota 2 would be to bring back pic related.

I had 300 games with Skeleton King but once they released Wraith King I played him once then never again.

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I would argue the opposite. It's changing too much, to frequently

there was a string of patches where the rune spots were swapped like 3 times, and no the bounty runes give 0 EXP, which is odd, considering the entire point of them was to compensate support heroes for body guarding river/ jungle for mid or jungle

dota 2's monetization schemes are designed to take advantage of and encourage people with dangerous spending problems. I've personally met someone who's spent over $1k on EACH compendium, not even counting all the other dota shit he bought, while living in a trash apt. barely able to feed himself.

it's a disgusting, morally bankrupt practice, and the ONLY reason they don't sell items that disadvantage f2p players is because they know they can't get away with it yet. they don't give a single metric fuck about that.

will never happen because china got spooked too hard

>In reality, the balance for talents is still silly and drives people away since it's another avenue of complexity to the game.

it's more that they thought stat ups were too confusing for new players and wanted to replace it with something that they would instantly recognize from other mobas like hots (which the talent idea was stolen from)

it was done with the purpose of simplifying the game, not making it more complex. instead of taking into consideration raw stats and how they might increase your survivability or mana supply as was seen in heroes like juggs who would actually take full advantage of it, now every few levels you get a choice to do A or B which is very simply laid out and explained for you. you don't have to understand stats or numbers or any of that confusing stuff.

That sounds like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic to me

Nope.

techinasia.com/china-doesnt-censor-skeletons-the-truth-about-game-censorship-in-the-middle-kingdom

It was 100% because of Blizzard.

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>Building is the only thing that makes Fortnite worth playing.

Building is the only thing that makes it not worth playing

they keep changing it because they realized the fucked too much up, and without icefrog they don't actually know how to fix it. plus they see bleeding player numbers and are trying to bring them back in.

>MOBAs are dying

gee I wonder why

youtube.com/watch?v=iOMs2t8eOMw

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Dotas biggest issue is the godawful rank and queue system, the current patch is fine, It's fairly flexible.
But fuck man, 10 minute queue for solo queue when i'm the same rank as 50% of the player base is fucking dumb.

>you don't have to understand stats or numbers or any of that confusing stuff.

Ah yes, +2 on all stats. Very confusing. Very complex.

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>Dotas biggest issue is the godawful rank and queue system

It's actually the shitty, deliberately-sluggish gameplay

>sluggish gameplay
uh... what, its almost too fast past right now, that's the problem that league has currently though

How on Earth you can sit there and argue, straight-faced, that talents are somehow less complex than a +2 passive stat boost is beyond me.

Now tell me what those stats do for each hero and why it matters. Its math and people hate math. Would new players rather wonder if the .15 mana regen would allow them to get off their second cast of x skill, and if that would merit delaying a skill up, or would they rather just choose a flat buff every few levels?

>sluggish
most games can be knocked out in 15 minutes

Any game company wishes they had a playerbase with as loose wallets as Dota 2 players.

>new players

Like Dota gives a shit about them when half of the mechanics need a wiki to explain

Its not that it gives +2 stats, it's that +2 stats is completely different on each hero and you'd also have to understand not just what those different raw numbers entail, but if they're even beneficial which will vary from hero to hero and build to build. Even a retard can understand "+500 attack damage".

t. I actually work in product design and we have lengthy discussions on this kind of crap. Normal people fucking hate numbers.

And thats why they've spent the last 5 years simplifying various aspects of the game to be easier to understand for new players. I'm sure theres a list somewhere of the many dozens of things they added or removed.

>it was done with the purpose of simplifying the game
I'm sleepy so bare with me, but I did mean to say that. It was meant to ease up the game since you got a nice stat boost related to your hero and particularly your role. Help you familiarize yourself with the role and hero, but it's still another choice upon choices upon choices that still makes the game more confusing for new people. Why would someone new play Dota? They have to learn

>hero
>team comp
>positions
>the map
>items
and the list goes on and on. Talents are another to that list. Whether or not it devolves into an obvious choice, it's another choice in the game of choices. stats were shit design and not even complex at all. It showed that many heroes had poor skills that stats were a better choice.

>he never disclose his employment status with valve
No way this is true.

Dude, no.
It was almost universally inefficient to skill stats early game for almost 50 patches, stats AM and dumb shit like that has been over for ever. Stats builds and skilling stats early was really only used
>to spam spells early on a small pool of heroes
>for clutch not die by getting a small health boost when getting ganked
Many talents require more math to understand, because shit like 25 strength on Kunkka also factors into his status resistance.

>jajajajajaja at the beginning of the video

Yet dotards are still in denial that there are no peruvians in game since the matchmaking changes

>ASSFAGGOTS might be dying
>It might be replaced by an actually more shit and dumb genre
Truly there is no good in this world

Valve wants to be able to parade the "balanced by icefrog" label on the game. Losing icefrog would damage the brand and risk the death of the game because it would lose credibility.

You're acting like most of the talents don't have "confusing" numbers. And said numbers have way more variety in their impact. It's 100x more complex than +2 to all stats.

Not him but you've been browsing /d2g/ for too long, you've bought into the ridiculous conspiracy theories. If Icefrog was legitimately gone and Valve was pretending otherwise, it would get leaked very very quickly.

Icefrog is a guy so secretive it's not even confirmed its just one guy. They could easily just get rid of him and parade the name recognition. Dont kid yourself.

I'll never give respect to mobashits for only having one map

HotS has way more than 1

his real name is abdul ismail. That was mentioned in a court document, guinsoo mentioning his name, and the anonymous valve employee 'truth about icefrog' blog.

It hasn't been a secretive for years now.

>look it up
>it says it's a rumour despite appearing on valve's software, credits, on a magazine issue, mentioned by Tryndamere(Riot ceo) and on a california court document

Why is it still called a rumour then

people want to believe in the mysterious figure? i dont know

>With this valve has saved vidya by ruining ASSFAGGOTS
assfaggots and assfaggots-likes are already on the way out, battle royale meme games are the new trash.

>2 stats is completely different on each hero
>do i want 38, 26 mana, and 2 damage, or a skill?

kys you fucking retard, you have to be trying to appear this fucking simple minded

Hots will reign suprene
SLOW AND STEADY