Perfect Melee Combat

On this triangle, where would your perfect combat be located?

Personally, I mine would be halfway between Arkham's flowing (but easy) combat and DMC's stylish combat..

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I like the middle between DMC and Dark Souls

bam ham does not belong here

>Bamham
Someone post the webm where he just keeps pressing X and the game practically plays itself.

I liked Killer is Dead's combat (and to an extent No More Heroes'). Shame the game had any levels. Though I prefer stylish since I like playing with whatever I want and not just using the most optimal set up

What game would that be? Like Dragons Dogma and Monster Hunter?

Jesus Christ you fucking ingrates
Just because you don't like a certain style of combat doesn't negate its status AS a style of combat.

found it

Attached: modern gaymen.webm (640x360, 2.43M)

I agree with this faggot, but more leaning on the dmc side, stylish action combat is 10/10

No but it does mean its shitty, you can still like it if its shitty just don't pretend its actually good
lmao
m
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About here. Dead centre, I like combat to be intuitive and flowing, with good feedback like in Arkham, but with enough flair to keep things interesting, DMC style. Above all though, I want solid, heavy combat with impact like in Dark Souls: While I have respect for what DMC and Arkham do with their respective combat systems, I feel like I'm hitting opponents with a fish.

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I know people love to shit on Bamham because of this webm, but:

1. He's not doing any damage
2. That's like getting a D in DMC

>practically plays itself.
That's the point of it saying 'flowing' you moron. The fact that it gives the impression that it plays itself when it actually isn't is part of that style of combat.

It isn't a style of combat, it's just a point between utilitarian and aesthetic that is really badly executed. This triangle should be a line.

Where ever Dark Messiah is.

>the middle between DMC and Dark Souls
So somewhere between slow, thoughtful combat and childish combo mashing? That's really vague.

Single player Vermintide with much fewer enemies and added spike traps.

Does Vermintide have a kick?

Honestly Arkham combat is an abomination and I much preferred when western devs copied DMC, albeit badly, instead of bamham. Now everyone copies dark souls and that isn’t much of an improvement because combat is just part of a game which is why this chart is stupid because you could find the objectively perfect pixel on this chart, yet if you put that combat in a game not designed around it, it’s worthless.

In the middle with no iframes, no lock-on, and no aim assist.

>Fighting the starter game enemies instead of the enemies you actually need to do special moves to defeat
Seems like a perfect example

Where does Bloodborne fit?

Exactly. The whole point of bamham combat is getting a high combo, and he's not even getting a combo at all.

Bloodborne isn’t vague at all though.

he's not doing any damage but he could get through that fight by stopping to press square every 10 seconds

It does have a shove but nowhere near hilarious as the kick

Ninja Gaiden Black

No, thoughtful combat that's still stylish is what I meant

God Hand in the middle of the triangle

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You need to add a third dimension, with shit and your chart on bottom, and Monster Hunter and awesome on top.

what exactly do you think utilitarian means? You know the souls series is full of flashy combat right?

Not only that but the fight will take much longer, and he won't get bonus XP because the combo will be shit

Too many judge game mechanics purely against challenge, when more often than not they're implemented to allow an otherwise tedious encounter to pass quickly and satisfyingly

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What I want is combat with auto-homing attacks like Bamham, but you can choose which attack to use like DMC. Then there's a better counter system that's a combination of Bamham's and DMC's Royal Guard.

Literally Bayonetta

The midpoint between Bamham and DMC is modern Kumazaki-directed Kirby games. They're very fast, flowing games where you run through the level pretty easily; only late/post-game levels and the boss rush provide anything resembling a challenge, but it's very enjoyable despite how easy it usually is. However, each ability you have has a long list of varied and useful moves that make each of them a unique gameplay experience, and from Triple Deluxe on they also give you defensive options that are actually similar to Smash's (Guard, dodge rolls, spot dodge, and a Sm4sh-style air dodge).

My ideal game however is the midpoint between Kirby and DMC, where the combat has a bit more depth and the enemies are more difficult, but the gamefeel of Kirby is present. Copy Ability Style Switching would be an absolute blast.

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Am I a retard for actively disliking it when a game's combat is stylish? I can't even explain why, I just know that I lose interest very quickly in stylish/extravagant combat systems.

All 3D melee combat is garbage.

>being too low test for SSSTYLISH combat

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Because it’s one of the first fights. Try that shit against late game enemies and you’ll die. The later games have some pretty tough encounters

I have a perference for tight combat systems where you're encouraged to use every single move you have all the time via difficulty. In theory it could be stylish (maybe "flowing" too? or does that just mean it's brainless and easy?) but in practice stylish combat requires a lot of complexity and with complexity come exploits, poor balancing, moves with overlapping utility, dominant strategies, etc. So yeah, utilitarian it is. The game that came close to combining the two was God Hand, but it was still chock full of exploits.

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Oh my fucking god this game was so good. Long combo into oneshotting a demonic tank was the best there ever was.

Be careful what you wish for. There is a reason all games with good melee combat liberally use iframes and it's not because of "laziness" or whatever.

thank you for posting this

Where does Morrowind combat belong in this triangle?

Its statbased and therefore not represented

It's just a matter of preference user. If it doesn't click with you then what can you do.

As far as I'm concerned, what you're telling me is "I hate having fun" but do as you please.

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Put Ninja gaiden black in the center

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FUCKING THIS

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I was about to say, "where the hell is God Hand'? This game fucking rules.

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I can't fucking stand Dark Souls so I guess I'm somewhere between Stylish and Flowing. (Flashy) I do love sims Bayonetta.

>flowing

this is literally the cancer killing video games

if the combat feels at all "flowing" it is cancer

>dark souls
>good combat

A curve approaching a point infinitely far away from all three corners.
*miss*
*miss*
*miss*

The problem I have with DMCs combat is you're not fighting the enemy, you're fighting yourself. Your only competition is improving your own skill to meets the games standard of a great combo, and while it's still a great standard a moderate level of understanding is more than enough to complete the game.

Souls got a bit more stylish in 3 and Bloodborne but most enemies are still either HP sponges or high damage dealers, it becomes as simple as reading patterns and attacking when you can to whittle targets down.

Bamham is trash, why the fuck is it even here? I don't even really know what to replace it either, Ass creed has a marginally higher skill requirement for a bit due to a stealth focus but even that had its problems.

Your point? all three of this games here are shit.

Same. Souls combat is straight garbage to me. I don't know how people like the slow, clunky shit but each to their own I guess. Godhand is perfect for me.

There is no assertion any of those example games are good, just that they are examples of purely flowing, purely utilitarian, or purely stylish combat, respectively.

Would I like GodHead if I liked Bayonetta 1 and 2 and DMC 3?

Even when people say some type of combat is shit or stupid, that's still a good contribution. It shows that you're passionate about video games, which is better than not caring enough to say anything.

As far away from bamham as possible.

>tfw no ps4 4k remaster
:(

Halfway between stylish and utilitarian. As far away from bamham as possible. That shit is fucking awful and it ruined the witcher 3

It's not quite as fast and fluid as those (absolutely not as fluid as Bayo), but it's just as deep and is quite difficult. It's more like an old-school beat-em-up with a behind-the-back camera. There are a few main mechanics:
>You choose what attacks are on each input, like a loadout; you can put any attack on any slot, although some are designed to be your basic Square string's combo fodder; you unlock, find, or buy moves as you progress
>Right stick is dodges; back for a backflip, to the side for sidesteps, and up for bobs and weaves in place that avoid all high/mid attacks
>You have super moves that you can also swap out by buying in the store tied to consumable blips on your HUD, and a super mode state where you activate the God Hand and just combo everything into everything else while being invincible, but this takes a while to recharge
>The better you do, the higher your "Level", from 1 to 2 to 3 to DIE; the higher your level, the harder the game is, so it's like a dynamic difficulty slider on top of the hard difficulty select when you start the game
It's got some charming character designs and some kickass music too, but the graphics are a bit substandard and the whole game feels a tad rushed and kinda janky.

Bullshit! Ultra failed attack!

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That works pretty well actually.

I'm wondering what could possibly be the midpoint between BamHam and Soulsborne though.

Came here to post this.

bump

QTE

Elaborate? I think you might be on the right track, but it'd be easier to get what you mean if you stated a specific game.

I don't think it helps that I don't quite get what OP meant by Utilitarian.

Mountain Blade

tossing my hat in for Zone of the Enders for flow.

Soulsborne is not a thing kys

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God Hand isn't on this triangle.

Where the fuck is God Hand you faggots.
Shit thread.

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I always thought DS's combat was way too slow and repetitive.

read the thread shitbrain

Read the thread before you post nigga

>The fact that it gives the impression that it plays itself when it actually isn't
Funny guy.

He's gonna be there for a while, because he's literally not doing damage to those guys.

Also, try that with a stun baton, sword or shield or, god forbid, a gun toting enemy and you'll find yourself dead in a few seconds.

A lot of 2D beat em ups are a better representation of "utilitarian" combat desu

DMC3 is both stylish and "flowing"
Remove Batman from the list and make it a straight line spectrum from Dark Souls to DMC

Win

Yakuza

Literally all the way into or even past the DMC3 corner
DMC3 is the best video game of all time.

Dunkey's opinion is shit, considering he didn't show any enemies that pop up later in game which make you switch up your combat style mid fight to take them down.

batman is fun but it feels like the game plays itself.

it's like a QTE battle system but you have the illusion of movement.

That's honestly probably dead-on.