Question for americans: If the H1B system could be completely overhauled in a way that only the best indians earning very good salaries would be allowed in, would you be for or against it? I mean very smart indians, the best of India ONLY.
No more cheap replacements ever, not even one mediocre indian would be allowed in, unless they married an american or something obviously. If they still "took our jobs" it'd be because they are literally smarter.
In Europe it kinda works like this, a minimum salary that is well over the average for locals is required.
Look I actually like diversity. Its wonderful having all these vibrant and unique cultures around the world. So let's keep it that way and stop trying to blend them all into an amorphous blob of dullness. Stay away pajeet.
Lucas Long
Diversity is about having the vibrant and unique cultures from around the world in one city, not away from each other kek that's the opposite.
They could stay and improve india, but America actually has the resources to poach them instead.
If it was like I said then this wouldn't be about cheap labor anymore but about legit competition. If other competent people are forcefully left out of the market you can't really pretend you deserve your success.
Adam Hall
>Very smart indians only
How many more American companies do you want with Indian CEOs now?
Liam Fisher
those ceos are probably puppets for PR
im talking about cs jobs
Ian King
the average salary of an H1B is around 80k.
Eli Wilson
exactly, that's the reason of this thread. they are mostly cheap trash. they shouldn't be allowed in unless they made 120-130k at least.
Jonathan James
How is double the salary of the average American "cheap trash"?
Ayden Lopez
>Diversity is about having the vibrant and unique cultures from around the world in one city, not away from each other kek that's the opposite. Monoculture is not diversity.
Leo Ross
>How about NO MORE immigrants? USA is literally a country made for immigrants.
Charles Gray
We have 320 million people in this country. We don't need to import talent.
Nathaniel King
Because it's not like your job at McDonalds.
Josiah Campbell
Are you upset because you're a neet and blame poo in loos for your unemployment?
Ian Sanchez
Immigrants were needed back when the number of agricultural workers was the limiting factor in the country's economic growth. That is no longer the case.
Luke Collins
How about you stay in India instead of running away?
You don't fit in well in American or European culture. Demand better conditions in and improve your own country instead of contributing to its brain drain.
Christian Phillips
>only poor people have aspirations A skilled work force shouldn't be forced to compete with cheap foreigners because the people the work force elected sold them out. If Indian programmers are so great, move your company there. Pay their taxes.
Christian King
That's not monoculture
Noah Perez
>cheap foreigners But they are making more than what your "skilled" workforce makes.
Michael Brown
*european immigrants
Everyone seems to forget that bit
Hunter Howard
They are depriving Americans of jobs.
Companies prefer to employ people on H-1Bs because those workers know that if they get uppity they will get deported back to whatever shithole they came from. American workers can speak out or quit without fear of deportation.
H-1Bs are essentially indentured servants. There is no reason for the program to exist other than corporate greed. America has 320 million people and the best colleges in the world, do you really think it needs to import talent?
Gabriel Ortiz
americans should give those "very good salaries" to their citizens and not to street shitters.
Chase Russell
Half of the post grads in American colleges and universities are foreign
Camden Wilson
das raycis
Asher Lee
>Sup Forums - Technology
Jaxon Turner
Only in OP's imaginary scenario that isn't representative of what is actually happening. OP is reframing the argument about immigration causing labor surpluses into an argument about fairness. This is called "teaching the controversy".
Adam Bell
They take college places and opportunities away from Americans.
Camden Adams
they are not. they're making more than our average not "skilled" workforce. Their salaries our below what a company would be able to get away with an American citizen. That's why we have them at all.
Angel Taylor
Lol no, Americans don't even make it to that level
Grayson Russell
So Facebook is abusing the H1B system by paying theirs 137k a year?
Christopher Evans
Exactly this. It's why raising the minimum H-1B salary will ameliorate but not fix the problem. The entire program, along with the visa 'diversity lottery', should be scrapped. It harms the vast majority of Americans.
Grayson Murphy
Or they can just find another company to sponsor them.
Charles James
You previously that half of American post grads are foreign, so that means that half of them are American.
Yes, if they would have to pay more for an American worker to do the same job.
Joshua Thomas
no... one of the main points against indians right now seems to be that they are cheap servants, like this guy said
if only indians making over 130k$ were brought, they'd be a very different demographic, the ones that emigrate would do so because they're actually wanted for their skills, so the problem would be over
Jayden Mitchell
Americans harm themselves
Stop blaming other people for your inability to hold a decent job
Zachary Bailey
that's because post grad is a waste of time unless it's medicine or a maters paid for by your company.
i'm over three years into a phd program and not a day goes by that i don't regret it.
Adrian Price
>So Facebook is abusing the H1B system by paying theirs 137k a year? How many H1Bs are being paid that much? How much would an American be paid for the same position?
Ian Ortiz
Facebook pays the average American worker around 120k. It's a fucking regulation for H1Bs to be either paid as much as an American in the equivalent role at the company or market rate in the area.
Cameron Jackson
There's no guarantee that they would be able to find such a company.
Would you really want to risk losing your job and having to go back to India, and even if you manage to find another company willing to sponsor you they won't really offer you much better than your current situation?
Elijah Reyes
You are reframing the argument. Nobody cares if a small amount of Indians work in America for about the same salary as American workers. This is not the issue you're pretending it is. These two things are not the same.
Julian Gutierrez
How about you FUCK OFF? I'm from Europe, and I can't even THINK of doing any immigration business with the US or Canada without tons of Pajeets from India and Mohammeds from Pakistan cluttering up the system.
If you're emigrating so much, why the fuck have you asked for independence from the UK!?
Samuel James
It is trivial to get around that regulation.
Yes, we should engage in a race to the bottom and earn the same as a worker in India in order to compete with them!
Not necessarily. A company would probably much rather hire an Indian on $137k than an American on $250k.
Aaron Murphy
And unless you are that hotshot making 250k a year there is no reason to complain about Pajeets.
Joshua Miller
Think about it. Every year we give 50,000 green cards to foreigners for the purpose of increasing diversity. Not because we have a labor shortage, or a skills shortage. Madness.
Elijah Gomez
If a company was paying an Indian $137k there's a good chance they'd also pay the American $137k
Jeremiah Jones
It affects tech workers at all levels above $60k. A company would rather hire an Indian on $80k than an American on $100k.
Juan Phillips
Try telling that to the hiring managers at my last company who interviewed 10 people in person who couldn't do a FizzBuzz tier problem. This meme that the American workforce is "skilled" is getting out of hand.
Jeremiah Taylor
The companies who pay Pajeets 80k don't pay Americans 100k. They pronbably pay them less.
Nathan Cook
every h1b working for a decent american company is paid that, they're actually paid the same as americans, they get hired because they're actually the best applicant from the pool, deal with it bro
>Not necessarily. A company would probably much rather hire an Indian on $137k than an American on $250k. that's an interesting argument. i honestly dont know, you may be right. facebook, google and the like are said to never spare costs when it comes to engineering so i think that's unlikely
in most of these arguments people cares about CHEAP LABOR and competition due to foreigners being CHEAPER and locals being therefore unable to compete. if only foreigners paid a lot of money are allowed in, the problem people complains about is over, whats so hard to understand mate
so you're in the same situation as indians but somehow think you're entitled to priority? haha suck it up
Cameron Wilson
This makes it so salaries can only decrease. If market rate decreases, I hire cheaper local workers. If there's a hiring freeze, I hire foreigners instead of improving offers and causing market rate to increase.
Jason Allen
You are frighteningly naïve.
If they want skilled tech workers then they should offer better conditions. Better salary, better benefits, better tools (i.e. don't force people to use Java), allow remote working, don't force them to provide out of hours support, ...
If you're not getting enough skilled applicants it's because the job isn't attractive enough.
Oliver Martinez
>assumptions
Aiden Walker
Did you miss the scandal about wage fixing among SV tech companies? Of course these companies will scrimp on salaries wherever possible.
Why would they pay more for a foreign worker than they would for an American worker? Unless there is literally no American worker available who can do the job, for example if you're after Leonid Pavel, then that course of action makes no sense at all.
Kayden Scott
>every h1b worker is paid just as much as an american >silicon valley companies that have agreed not to hire each others employees don't mind wasting money on employees >pretending the issue is about fairness for a few individuals instead of larger trends Assumptions the post.
Thomas Wright
The stupidity and fear mongering I'm this thread is outstanding
>muh jobs
Jose Jenkins
To put this another way: if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys.
Ethan Foster
Because there literally are no American workers who can do the job. All the good ones are taken by the best companies already.
Evan Reed
Then make them a better offer.
Lincoln Martinez
>Because there literally are no American workers who can do the job. All the good ones are taken by the best companies already. This meme needs to die.
Justin Nguyen
Why should I? Why should someone get 200k a year just for knowing how to do a FizzBuzz?
Landon Richardson
Why shouldn't they? The market has obviously decided that they are worth that much.
James Gomez
because otherwise you wont find anyone
Owen Scott
You mean the market limited to just those in the U.S?
Jason Perry
>Sup Forums thinks they're worth $250k a year
Jordan Nelson
It is disingenuous to insist that the market must be expanded to include countries entirely different to the US.
William Cox
>every h1b worker is paid just as much as an american if they actually want good h1b workers it only makes sense to pay them well. actually skilled indians can make that happen or else they work somewhere else, they're skilled after all
>pretending the issue is about fairness for a few individuals instead of larger trends whats this even supposed to mean?
india isnt that different, its a british colony too
Colton Brooks
>actually skilled indians can make that happen or else they work somewhere else, they're skilled after all Where else could they go? They can't simply waltz into any western country of their choosing. Their choice is often limited to being underpaid in America (but still vastly more than they would be paid in India, with the added benefit of being able to live in America), or being paid a pittance in India which is, let's face it, a shithole.
>india isnt that different, its a british colony too India *was* a British colony, and even when it was it was not comparable to the British Isles, Canada, Australia, or New Zealand. All those countries are essentially Christian and European if not Anglo-Saxon. India is not.
Wyatt White
stay and improve your shit country and stop taking away opportunities from home grown citizens
Charles Wood
Gandhi ruined everything
Jeremiah Martin
>literally spending my life trying to improve a shithole I won't have a chance to live in nah thanks, im not this retarded
Adam Russell
Go back to your country, eh?
Ryder Morales
i don't really care because i'm black and therefore have priority over them anyways
Asher Thompson
You're too retarded to have this conversation with me. For anyone else listening, don't fall for the meme. Construction companies love illegal immigrants until giving them citizenship comes up. Silicon valley loves Indians until giving them citizenship comes up. The appeal to a nation of immigrants is used to create a nation of indentured servants.
Jacob Turner
Sure, but we'll take back all the improvements we brought too.
Carter Walker
>america >full of descendants of poor, unskilled dumbfucks >BAWWW KEEP YOUR FERINERS OUT OF MAH MURIKA Dumbfucks.
Isaac Ramirez
Yeah, look how well that worked out for you.
Xavier Ward
If you are really that skilled, you should have no problem getting an O-class visa.
Matthew Allen
Fuck off we're full.
Lincoln Perry
Thankfully I don't have to fuck with visas. I have only migrated from one EU country to another. Stop me, I'm getting my citizenship this year.
Noah Ross
>We You didn't contribute anything to society
Adam Kelly
You don't know anything about me, friend.
David Butler
I know you haven't done anything important in life if you spend your days bitching on Sup Forums
Christian Adams
So much disgusting in one picture.
Jose Gomez
So, you're getting citizenship in another EU country?
Will that grant you any benefits? Can you not vote at the moment or something?
Carter Price
It's Saturday. I don't work 24/7.
Austin Wood
I only want white immigrants. I'm tired of the poo-colored people who all look the same and smell like shit.
Blake Stewart
Pretty much nothing except for voting rights. I love my current country and treat it as my own. I just feel I need to do it to feel complete.
Landon Foster
Sup Forums pls
Angel Smith
Fair enough. Mind if I ask which country and what the requirements were? I'm curious, I didn't think there would be any point in a citizen of one EU country getting dual citizenship with another EU country.
Eli Gray
Get a hobby, or do something productive
Easton Roberts
Poland > UK. Because of brexit I want to get it done faster, but I was planning it long before the referendum was announced anyway.
Requirements: >Live permanently in the UK for more than 5 years >Have no criminal record >Be of a 'good character' >Pass English Language test >Pass 'Live in the UK' test >Pay like a £1000 for the application and hope it won't get rejected.
I'm fine with immigrants as long as they have a job waiting here, a clean criminal record, no connections to terrorist organizations, and they can speak English well or are willing to take classes once here. Basically don't be a burden on the government and society and do your part to take care of which ever community you live in. It's pretty simple.
Brody Bailey
kek, i bet you're from spain or italy anyway. do you think you're any better than indians?
Parker Johnson
>only the best indians earning very good salaries would be allowed in They're already here lol.
Gavin Myers
...
Brody Davis
make it wider
James Ross
That's as far as it goes.
Anthony Morgan
when pajeets take this land through war and conquest then your retarded argument might make sense
Xavier Gutierrez
>wanting to live in a literal sharia caliphate
Josiah Young
>living on mainland No Thanks.
Evan Richardson
>please let us poo in your loo No Pajeet, build your own loo.