Primitive technology

This is the technology board, so why not a thread about this?

Here is the scenario:
>2000 people are sent through a time machine to the dino days to study things
>they can't bring anything but themselves, not even the clothes on their back
>they need to build everything from scratch when they arrive
(this creates an alternate timeline, does not interfere with ours)

How long would it take for them to create:
>steel
>guns
>electricity
>lightbulbs
>cameras
>cars
>computers
and eventually, a time machine back home

youtube.com/watch?v=ZEl-Y1NvBVI

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really depends on 2000 people sent back. if they're all millennials, never.

DAE millennials are incompetent??? XDDDDD

the best, most knowledgeable people humanity has to offer
(and obviously the most fit, to fight off the dinos)

This
If they are millenials they all starve to death withn a few weeks.
If they are all black people they stay forever primitive.
If they are all non-millenial germanic whites, they develop computers in less than 100 years.

They wont make into 30 days why even care?

One of the few good channels on youtube.

Too bad in his newest he's just repeting what he already did

if it creates an alternate timeline, what's the point of sending them back to 'study things'?
we won't get any of the information they get

Yeah he should stop building furnaces.

>germanic whites
>100 years
Yeah, like, germans had an ancient civilization, culture, developed sciences, drama, literature, music, e.t.c..
And they obviously create it again....
What's next? Nigs launching satellites?

>implying this won't turn into some lord of the flies shit

Agreed

>2000 people in prime physical condition naked in the jungle

Hopefully they won't made the same mistakes and stay forever in the bronze age, living in tribal cultures, the ideal for the human race.

Assuming we could survive most than just minutes, to primitive environment conditions, then
I bet we are competent enough to organize and manage to get resources and shelter in matter of hours, days to achieve a stable source of resources and protection, months to develop a fully serviced village with artisan industry, few years to achieve a manufacture industry based on basic technology, motor powered vehicles and basic telecommunication and electricity infrastructures, in 100 years maybe reach a post industrial rev. level and electronics.
But this is also assuming people aren't a dumb selfish monkeys when working together in threatening scenarios.
So most likely it will end in resource wars and massacre.

Germanics were still living in huts and beating each other to death with clubs when great civilizations had come *and gone* in Persia and India. Euros (incl burgers) are overrated. No wonder Blacks are winning out over them these days.

fucking snow niggers

...

And they went from living in huts to space travel faster than anyone else.

Is a one way trip, they get to study things for them, not for us

>living on easy mode instead of harsh climates

Standing on the shoulders of giants of science isn't that hard 2bh

Varg is one of the purest and most intelligent whites

>youtube.com/watch?v=ZEl-Y1NvBVI
>dino days

Youd die. Thats it. You werent meant to live in a biome that has animals three times your size with huge sharp things all over them.

>Most intelligent
Fucking lol. You're probably right but for the wrong reasons.

Even easier to not acknowledge those giants and tout superiority over other peoples for your own "accomplishments."

I like the question a lot. OP. for this reason. We do not yet know how to build a time machine. The answer, therefore, is NEVER! Because those people do not have either the technical knowledge nor the time to discover that knowledge. they would be dead before they discover the answer. We may all think we are very very smart compared to the smartest cavemen that ever lived but let me tell you, the only difference between most people alive in 2017 compared to those who lived in 1717 is that we use computers, have a more liberal attitude and carry smartphones. There are very few other differences. We are no nearer now to building a time machine than we were 10,000 years ago. The reason being that we have neither the technical capability nor the science to enable that

>a time machine back home

Thousands of generations would have died by the time you get to building cameras, they ain't coming back.

>butthurt

if you hand pick each person to ensure all bases were covered, most of that wouldn't take too long. good computers and cameras would take the longest. it all depends on finding the right resources, extracting them and refining them. with dinos running around and other environmental dangers.. it would take many years, decades even and if you lose the wrong person, you very well could be fucked.

...

they'll die anyway, just like the dinos

What about sort the 2000 people as anons from /g, /b, /pol, /k, /lit, you name it. Which composition would bring any hope of success? /k would take care of security, /g is quite hopeless in the beginning, maybe /sci would make it instead. What else?

lel, you can send back the entire staff of Nikon and related companies all the way from Nikon engineers, factory workers, to the miners that pull raw earth out of the ground, and they still wouldn't be able to build the simplest digital camera within their lifetimes.

Allow them to bring some books on the subjects, then maybe.

>"How long would it take for them to create"
>implying all of the they knew won't be lost by the second or third generation and they won't be starting from square zero
Modern individuals posses knowledge from a very narrow and specific domain. Most of it would be useless for them in that scenario desu. People that lived in tribes or nomads that had to depend on survival had a vast knowledge of many things. They didn't have one specific job until more organized societies emerged.
I think the real question is if they would be able to organize themselves in some sort of a society and how that society would look like. Would there be public education? Seems obvious to us, but what if they were so desperate they couldn't afford it? What if some group or a despot introduced slavery? Without a functioning society passing modern knowledge down would be probably impossible. And even then we should expect it would be very degraded and limited at best, not to mention losing all the domain specific information. But if they managed to pass down reading and writing skills that would be more than good enough.
Actually, we don't even have to guess how it would work out. It already happened many times in history. Take ancient grece as an example. They developed an advanced society that had no match until renaissance. People knew and were able to do things back then that make modern people rub their eyes in disbelief. But as soon as their society has fallen, all of it was lost. Or rather frozen for many years until sophisticated enough societies emerged that were able to embrace their lost knowledge. It's like that thing people say about industrial revolution: it wasn't a steam engine that introduced the age of steam, it was the age of steam that made steam engine possible. Ironically, steam engines were known to ancient greeks.

You don't need a time machine, just go to Africa

>steel
if they are aware of where they will arrive then pretty much instantly (6 months) using geography records if not then they would need to figure out their location relative to a historical ore deposit but iron tools would be cast in clay before steel production happens
>guns
shortly after the first metal tools are cast but before full steel production is underway (3 months) assuming the correct location to historically contain all the elements of gunpowder was crossmatched with ore
>electricity
full scale power production would not happen for years but crude hand cranks and lodestone/magnet generators could be made within 1 month given the correct starting location
>lightbulbs
pretty much within a week if you land near copper and sand since its just glass blowing, your failure rate would be super high and you'd lack electricity to power them
>cameras
2-5 years minimum it is just glass but accurate measuring tools would take time
>cars
no less than 10 years since you need to reverse engineer every part and tool that goes into one
>computers
depends on what you mean by computer lots of ancient gear mechanisms are computers but silicon processors would depend more on the colony thriving beyond its initial 2000 but no less than 25 years
>a time machine
how the fuck am I supposed to know? the secret to time travel could very well be lathering mayonnaise on your ass under the 5th full moon of a year while rubbing your tummy and patting your head

this

It's actually easy to guess what would happen, because:
>they can't bring anything but themselves, not even the clothes on their back
Yeah, good luck with that if all they had were ancient crops. Most of them would die of hunger in year one even if they worked their asses off on some shabby plantations.
Hunting is quite fucking hard and requires skill which none of them would have and it takes even more time. And you can only support a bunch of people that way.
Primitive people spent almost all of their time, from dusk till dawn, looking for food only to gather enough to barely survive. And they knew their stuff, unlike the people you want to send back in time.

Information of modern shit is almost useless in such a time. Knowing how a CPU is fabricated is useless if you don't know what berries will poison you and what leaves will be toxic.

hopefully they won't reinvent loot boxes and YouTube

>great civilizations had come *and gone* in Persia and India.
hey, a nog can run also.

You mean how long until they're all dead?
They'd be dead long before they create modern technology.

A CPU, sure, because even when you understand it it still takes really advanced machinery to actually build even full-sized working transistors. Other more recent understandings, classical mechanics for example, would be instantly applicable to varying degrees of utility and it could be interesting to see what they'd produce with the lack of infrastructure.

Due to the small sample of population, at least, 300-500 years. You are taking basic comodities at face value in your current time. The people sent would fight for survival as everybody else, they just would be more successful.

Would you like to try that again? Try to form a coherent sentence this time.

2000? Within 6 months half will be dead. And if you send them back in winter, they will be dead in 2 weeks.

So, you already halved your population.

Mining metal is a tragedy. First you need to find it. how long would it take? Years just for this? Probably you can do fine up to copper, but with iron? You are fucked. You can have 10000 slaves, but if you don't know where to search there is nothing you can do. To get most of metals you need trading. That's a super duper bummer.

But even if you know where to search, and you know how to mine, you still have to mine. And then do the smelt. AND BOY, you have NO idea how much energy it takes to work metal until you try yourself. You need A BUNCH, really a BUNCH of people designed only for chopping down threes. And...btw... who is going to plow the fields in the meantime? the most easy mines to access are in mountain regions.... THERE IS NOT FOOD IN MOUNTAIN REGIONS. STOP. This is is, you live on the mountains in the pre industrial era, you starve to death.

2000 people are nothing, it's simply too much work and odds just to get to iron.

>Knowing how a CPU is fabricated is useless
Sure thing but imagine everyone having understanding of electricity and radio

Why would they need iron immediately? Surely agriculture would be the primary focus on arrival, starting with more primitive tools.

You people have some serious issues understanding the time and the energy involved in doing even the most basic stuff.

To "do agriculture" you need a field. I don't know where you live in, but if you live in Europe (and not so many places, apart China, India, some part of middle east), fields exist because modern generations have inherited them from the previous ones... and the chain goes back to the Roman "centuriation" for most of Central Europe (apart Italy). The Romans managed to create fields out of forests and swamps with HUNDRED OF THOUSANDS of slaves, over the course of CENTURIES.
You know how south America gained massive amounts of farmland? With mechanized farming within the most recent centuries.

Even winning farmland from Nature is a fucking enterprise.

Oh.... btw... what are you going to plant in the field (which you don't have? You think you can make any useful domestic species out of while plants in one generation of people?

You guys should take a shovel (and pickax... i bet you don't even know what's it's purpose, you will know if you try), and try digging 1 cubic meter of soil. Tell me how much it takes then report back.

You mean med master race, Germanic snow niggers didn't invent shit.

Jesus my typing is shit and somehow autocorrection is even worse. Read through the typos of my autism, please.

Interesting scenario OP.

I'd think the first and most pressing priority, after they've found a safe place to live and have met basic necessities, would be the manufacture of decent quality PAPER so that they can write down everything they know about everything. This will tie up everyone for years, maybe the whole first generation.

After that priorities would presumably be finding sources of iron ore and coal. Once you have steam power everything is on autopilot.

Yeah, and that's really the question: How much would our modern understanding accelerate the course of technology? I dunno if you're making the assumption that the people would have to achieve it all within their collective lifetime.

Though if you were to say it's a very broad question that's insanely difficult to answer, then I'd agree.

Not true the abbos dealt with 20ft lizards and carnivorous kaaangaroos just set it all on fire senpai. Burn down an entire forest and build a fortified city center. I reckon ancient roman machines of ear would more than suffice to stave off any dino attacks.

this is all WILDLY optimistic.

Showing up naked, I'd be impressed if they ended up with a light-bulb within anyone's lifetime.

>Machines of war*

I used to be into alt-history forums, and the general consensus is that nothing could have happened much before it actually did.

All these "what if they had AK-47s in the Civil War?" type scenarios fall apart when you realize an AK-47 would have been impossible to produce, even if you had every last detail of how they were made, because of all the contingent technologies involved.

If you can name anything, at least in the past 200 years, that was invented/discovered more than a few years later than it would have been possible (given required contingent technology) I'd like to hear it.

p.s. re: OP's scenario, they'll be forced to be hunter-gatherers because there won't be any domesticated, high-yeild crops around (since those take centuries to breed into existence). Given a virgin planet they could do this pretty well, but it may require them to migrate a lot.

Ballista's? Longbows? Javelin's/spears. Forget ak47s and m16 what about medieval gear? Surely that could be produced an utilized.

What about the voltaic pile? I mean no doubt they couldn't build our modern technology in any reasonable time frame, but I'd like to think they could apply the principles in some way to make things more efficient.

Assuming they are not retards, they could make steel pretty fast.
It might not be a priority, so lets say 2 years after arrival.
Guns require very good manufacturing, so it will take very long compared to that.
Electricity is easier, if we assume 2 years to make steel, it would take a while to make the tools you need and electricity, but if there is 2000 people ~2.5 years.
lightbulbs might take 3 years.
cameras and computers require very precise manufacturing and they are not very useful until that is up and running.
Cars can be made relatively easy but I think fuel is a bigger problem.
It shouldn't take a month to make an animal driven cart.
You could probably get all that done with ~ 200 people, but I suspect you took 2000 people so there would be people to breed and people to teach the next generation.

And what would be the utility that thing? What would you "power"?

Crude tools, yes, but anything more advance than that I highly doubt there's enough of the right combination of talent and expertise among that small group of 2000 people. A lot of people nowadays think they know a lot about tech, but what they really know are just the end products, not processes involved in making them.

I'm sure you could have had a pretty powerful medieval battery, but what could you do with it?

Perhaps weld I guess, although that might require advanced materials beyond their capability.

Well I assume you'd start with fire to save the trouble. How precise does a brushed motor need to be? I really don't know. The point is if these ideas are available in that scenario, they would presumably be trying to find new ways to apply them that we just hadn't considered because we were already past that.

You're nuts.

Explain to me how you make useful amounts of electricity in 2 years with any number of people from scratch? You need lots of quality copper and iron at the minimum, plus all the stuff to shape/work it. That's the work of decades.

Also you're never going to have a (tungsten) light bulb without a huge and sophisticated mine. Under a century would be impressive.

>Ballista's?

Not even that, there was a show where a group of people attempted to build a large ballista using authentic materials, but end result was a weapon that couldn't even fire a bolt more than fifty feet.

How many condoms dose he need not to impregnate the girl with triplets?

I have made generators before, obviously high quality cobber and making a wire is what will take a lot of time.
But I don't see why getting a metal production up and running would not be of high priority, and once you have that, you can make a wire.
As for lightbulbs, I have only done primitive versions with a pencil, but I am sure there are ways to make one, I am not an expert in that field.

>the first bulbs were made with tungsten.

You'll need hard metal for bearings (plus good luck making bearings that won't wear out / blow up).

Low-friction bearings are probably the least-appreciated but one of the most crucial modern technologies.

It depends on what the priorities are.
When you make a hinge, you take a warm piece of metal, hammer an oversized nail through it to make a hole, and then you can use a smaller rod than the hole.
It will have a lot of friction, but if you put it under a large force like a water stream, you can make decent power rather fast.
Getting from 0 to usable takes a lot of time.
Getting from usable to where we are today will take longer, but if you keep your priorities straight, you can make a lot of things really fast.

I don't imagine any kind of electrical generator/motor is possible without low-friction tight-tolerance bearings.

Sure, you can (and people did) water-wheels and such with even plain wooden bearings if you're constantly greasing, but electricity, steam, and internal combustion are totally out without quality bearings, which essentially means you have advanced metalurgy.

Hey, brainlet, germanic is not the same as german, you massive retardo

Just the one he made from the stomach of a hog he killed in the forest and the used it entirely.

I'd argue never.
2000 people is way too small.
Part of the reason technology advances is because you need a shitload of lower class people doing your peasant work and manual labor, otherwise your scientists and engineers have no time to sit around inventing things because they're too worried about starving or freezing to death.

Sup Forumstards would die off quite fast

/r9k/robots would mostly die off, but a select few off them may overcome and if they do, excel magnificently

Sup Forumslacks will probably do best, as they are inventive, aware, cohesive

/k/ and /lit/ would probably do okay
Sup Forumsers will quite possibly do great

you are literal shit for brains

Anyone saying this could actually be accomplished needs to rethink what the immediate concerns of 2000 people would be. They have absolutely nothing. Number 1 and 2 immediate concerns are shelter and food. Unless you send back a group of people with the specific knowledge to farm, build houses, fight off wild animals, etc, they wouldn't last very long. You'd also need people who can treat injuries and deliver babies. You wouldn't be able to send many scientists and engineers, nowhere near the amount you need to invent any of that. Especially considering those engineers would need another very big group of people producing the materials they need.

Also, you'd probably have a fair share of people fighting over food/land/women/whatever. You need to maintain order, so you need to draft laws/deeds/marriage certificates, you need some form of justice system/police. You need a way to prove ownership of things, a type of currency or established barter system.

I could go on and on, point is, there is a metric fuckton of time and people needed to build something close to resembling a civilization, much less a modern one. You couldn't do it with 2000 people. You probably couldn't do it with 1 million unless you sent them back with specific tools and hand picked them in advance and designed a well thought out plan for them.

Probably smart Gen Xs and MAYBE some late baby boomers and early millenials

>steel
finding steel wouldn't be difficult, making steel quater as good as it is now would take years and years of research. think about it, finest medieval swords were easily breaking on impact, proper reliable swords like sabres are from 17th ceuntry

>guns
crossbow would probably be one of the first things they would make after figuring out proper material for chord. for proper guns, gunpowder might not be all that difficult to obtain (is it hard to find sulfur?), but those would be heavy single shot weapons because of low quality steel

>electricity
easy to generate, find to make use of. society needs years to start utilizing it, why would you waste your resources on power plant when you can just use candles

>lightbulbs
no reason to rush it

>modern shit
generations. transistor might not be that hard to re-invent, transistor measured in microns would need all of the modern technology to make


basically, halfway the process old modern people would die, new people wouldn't have enough knowledge or willpower to go forward, best case scenario would be late medieval society of people smart enough to read and write slowly inventing things based on books and other knowledge left by original travelers. which wouldn't be bad at all, with right mindset they would move forward super fast, knowing basic concepts like usage of pressure, other physics, or pieces of modern chemistry

Yes, I fucking want a general about this.

Really have been a lot into knowledge/tech rediscovery lately

>If they are all non-millenial germanic whites, they develop computers in less than 100 years.
optimistic, buddy

There is one problem: Humans need a sample about ten times the size to survive long-term (incest issues)

Like he said, also you would not image how comfy life is in a hut. They only needed military technology back then (which they had).

There is a story about how the gauls did not accept writing because they said that with writing the mind would degenerate.

In the end they were right. And with most science it is the same. This is why they were still living in huts (and after that were able to overrun the whole avanced roman empire full of degenerates)

...

Tbh, that was also historically the most difficult technique to master

The hotter the furnace, the more you can create. And what can you create without furnices?

On other notes, he should soon start smithing and then the next stage is carpentry. After carpentry follows simple machines. With simple machines he can make complex cloth. Guy will be running around in roman tunics in a few years

You millennials are completely naive about the amount of infrastructure and prior work behind modern amenities, and the sheer amount of physical labor and time required to bootstrap many technologies.

Take steel. Assuming that you don't have to worry about food, clothing, shelter, disease, wild animals, and you have all of the materials close by in easy to access form like you're in some kind of cooking show, then with the right knowledge maybe you can make a small chunk of crucible steel in a month. Take away the Convenience Store of Raw Materials and it'll take decades to travel around and find all of the raw materials, mine and process them, while still assuming all of the other things and that your pioneering are immortal so they won't die in a mining accident.

Not true.

Lots of parts of the world (the New World, Australia) probably weren't settled at first by more than a couple hundred people at most.

This is speculative evidence. We have recent evidence with the amish where this is NOT working out

The original settlers might have comprised a small number of people, but more came eventually. Also there were many "waves" of colonization, some failed altogether and others were only partially successful and were eventually "reinforced" by other groups. In the end, the people we think of as the first inhabitants of any place started a mix of many groups until they finally got the hang of things and homogenized.

People can survive as small isolated communities for LONG periods of time.

See: Tasmanian aboriginals, Andamanese

Even if you are right, to this there comes another key point: Races

Multiculturalism actually hurts the survivability of people, so the sample size needs to be increased the more diverse it is (there is a whole range of possible genetic complications from interbreeding. We can have this in a medical society, but not in the wilderness when most plant effects have to rediscovered as they have been forgotten already)

>Humans going back in time to eradicate the dinosaurs with simple machines and claim the throne of the most powerful species that has ever existed
Is this our endgame?

We are already the most powerful species (on earth) ever x49508485348058348

It's interesting to consider how helpless and useless humans are without our numbers and millennia of cultural advancement.

We won't know for sure until we fight the dinosaurs in an epic battle desu

All of this reminds me of this comparison of how if we would live in a fantasy world, we would be the orcs

There it is

I like how much of a drooling amoebas most of people ITT are to think that cars are in any way relevant in such scenario

They're one of the shittiest mode of transport possible because they require a massive amounts of resources to be spent on infrastructure.

You need human-propelled personal transportation like a bicycle and railway for everything else for maximum efficiency

...