FUCKING AMD!

FUCKING AMD!
If AMD wasn't so shit nVidia would have released the 11xx/20xx series already

small release intervals isnt good for the consumer

>amd finally recovers in the cpu market with decent competition and sales in Ryzen
>completely shits the bed with vega and loses entire gpu marketshare (outside of imacs and mining)
All they have to do is make an average product and produce enough of them

*Releases TITAN xp: Star wars edition*
*Releases GTX 1060 5GB-lul*
Heh nothin personnel AMD.

...

So you wanted nVidia to do an actual paperlaunch (like Pascal, but worse), given they waste their entire 12FFN capacity for the hueg dies?
>loses the entire GPU marketshare
That never happens. Even nv30 failed to do so.

It's simple, if AMD wasn't so crap nVidia would have other priorities. Maybe the Titan V would have just been the 2080 and launch of the series for example.
also stop using the "paperlaunch"-meme

Yes. 815mm^2 die would totally be a fucking consumer product!
Fucking Sup Forumseddit, you're so fucking retarded.

get used to it
best case, they will release a 300 series type refresh of vega in 12nm, worst case they will release nothing until navi
this may be another bulldozer, but for gpus and nvidia will charge you the highest ammount of money they can with the least ammount of effort possible, like intel did
gamers will get fucked and they fucking deserve it

No, nVidia will continue delivering expected performance gains at any cost.
They are not Intel, DIY consumer market is their biggest revenue stream, so they need to force people to upgrade.

They would obviously not include the huge tensor segment retard

That means they need to launch a new fucking die that has barely passed the fucking tapeout.
What the fuck.

This theory makes no sense. One of their main markets is scientific computing and the Quadro cards which have no AMD competition. They have an incentive to produce better cards regardless of what AMD does.

Quadro and Tesla barely give them any revenue.
60-75% of nVidia's revenue is consumer dGPU stuff, depending on quarter.

>not include a segment to begin with
>a new fucking die
lol Sup Forumsedditors
But we're not talking about the GPGPU segment retard

"Not include the segment to begin with" means laying and taping out a new fucking die you brainless moron.

No faggots, Nvidia has always said next-gen is 2018, AYYMD is irrelevant

AMD is very much relevant: there are only two x86 players on the market.

No they fucking won't
Pascal was a big performance jump because they went from 28nm all the way down to 16nm
They can not do that again just yet and the only way of improving performance is to build bullshit large dies, like they did with Titan V

If you think the Pascal series with its drip-fed 1080, cut-down Titan X, incredibly delayed 1080Ti, the insult to every Titan owner known as Titan Xp and Founders Edition was bad, wait until you see what they will do with volta/ampere.
They will milk consumers so hard, it will redefine what jewery is

>means laying and taping out a new fucking die
>being THIS linear of a thinker
lol Sup Forumsedditors
I guess I actually have to explain this to you. "To begin with" means Titan V wouldn't even be launched they would have used the production line to make gaming GPUs to compete with AMD instead of a Titan that competes with their own tesla products.

We JUST had an example of this where Intel hurried and beefed up their 8000 series because of competition, and you STILL don't understand it, lol.

This is all AMDs fault though

Hostory has shown, no matter what ATi/AMD does, nVidia doesn't care and gets away with murder

Their only market is gaming, everything else is a side project

>no matter what ATi/AMD does
Of course it doesn't matter if they're always second best
>gets away with murder
>making video game cards more expensive
Imagine being this emotionally connected to your favorite multinational corporation

FUCK NO
Gamers chose this outcome by supporting NVidias jewery, shitty business practices and buying semi broken GPUs like crazy.
EVEN IF AMD had a objectively superior product, everyone would just wait for NVidia to lower their prices and buy their cards instead.
Now suck it up and enjoy Jensen Huangs cock up your ass

1. see bottom >EVEN IF AMD had a objectively superior product
2. It's dumb to speculate on things we have no data on, just because you're emotional

>I guess I actually have to explain this to you. "To begin with" means Titan V wouldn't even be launched they would have used the production line to make gaming GPUs to compete with AMD instead
They won't do that, Pascal would be still competetive, given the die sizes.
>Titan that competes with their own tesla products.
It doesn't.
>
We JUST had an example of this where Intel hurried and beefed up their 8000 series because of competition, and you STILL don't understand it, lol.
CFL-S was always planned to have 6C. CNL-S was 8C, even, before it got canned.
Competition meme does not influence roadmaps even in the slightest.

Sup Forums is full of consumer whores - they want AMD to be competitive so they can buy their beloved Intel and Nvidia parts for cheaper. Sup Forums has virtually no intention of buying AMD ever. This makes ryzen in particular quite the quandry as it flipped the market on its head so monumentally you'd have to be retarded to ignore it. This is also why Sup Forums went into hyper damage control (particularly when coffee lake "launched") so as no matter what Intel (in this scenario) is never shown in a bad light.

Coffee Lake was never on the roadmap for 2017.

lmao
The 390 was objecively superior to the 970, yet everyone bought the 3.5GiB meme
The 290X was objectively superior to the 780, yet everyone bought the cut-down 780 instead
The 7970 was objectively superior to the 680 and most people bought the 680 as well
Just look up benchmarks and steam charts, noone wants to buy AMD and everyone likes being cucked by novideo

Im sorry you are mixing up the boards
Sup Forums is Intel/Nvidia and Sup Forums is AMD.

>implying novideo cares

> Sup Forums is AMD.

Only in /pcbg/ and even then half of the time anyone suggests using ryzen or polaris (vega is an odd one - competitive performance but is impossible to buy) the immediate response is always "lel AMD, go get coffee lake and a 1060 6gb!" regardless of what usage case there is.

>Pascal would be still competetive [because AMD is this]
Yes, that's the entire point of the thread. You finally got it after 10 posts, good job.
>It doesn't
they just changed their EULA specifically to prevent people prom buying Titan V instead of Teslas retard

Sup Forums is worse than Sup Forums, they're reddit fanboys. See pic

ATi didn't used to be second best and for some parts of history, GTX480/580 nVidia was absolute fucking garbage yet AMDs user base stagnated at the time and didn't actually increase.

No matter what nVidia does, no matter how shit their products are, it will sell that product to wilfully ignorant consumers.

Why didn't you include Nvidia's reddit in that screenshot? I thought this thread was about AMD's GPU division.

only problem was that the mining craze developed more money in the process than the gaming industry for the past years.

amd top tier cards had no other purpose than to serve the market with most money involved with and camouflage it as gamer to get some money headroom for their next project which hopefully produces more gaming cards for the average consumer again..

amd is not 100% at fault because architecture-wise, nothing much has changed and the raw number performance has always been bigger on their side..

one could say it's the a funny side-effect to those experts saying that the desktop market is a dying breed

>my opinons are facts
lol
It's an old screen. But just have a look for yourself retard. Redditors are still like 400% more likely to be AMD fanboys than nVidia compared to their market shares.

>Coffee Lake was never on the roadmap for 2017.
It was for a very, very long time, actually, since CNL-S was canned.
>Yes, that's the entire point of the thread. You finally got it after 10 posts, good job
Are you fucking retarded?
Companies don't accelerate roadmaps (that also depend on the fucking partners) just because.

Sup Forums is Intel & Nvidia

Only retards think Sup Forums is AYYMD HOUSEFIRES garbage

>Companies don't accelerate roadmaps (that also depend on the fucking partners) just because.
>We JUST had an example of this where Intel hurried and beefed up their 8000 series because of competition, and you STILL don't understand it, lol.

>restaurants don't accelerate cooking processes to prioritise customers with bigger wallets

>All they have to do is make an average product and produce enough of them
And drivers that fucking work. I bought AMD for the first time in 2007, that was my first mistake. In 2014 I decided to believe in them again and you know what they say "fool me twice, shame on me".

And it's a gigantic mess, with the actual CNL PCH boards not available. And that's considering Intel does not rely on it's partners (they do fab and package it themselves).

>And it's a gigantic mess
still proves you wrong m8

I don't talk in opinions, you can go and check data on every point I made and find out I was right you absolute fucking cuck

Guess Sup Forums knowsm ore than Baidu and Microsoft eh? Funnily enouigh Sup Forums is awfully quiet about the HEDT and serverm arkets precisely because Sup Forums. is full of vidya manchildren and don't know shit about serious business hardware deployments.

Proves me wrong?
They still didn't launch the platform.
>And that's considering Intel does not rely on it's partners (they do fab and package it themselves).
Now let's make Micron/Hynix shit out G6 two quarters earlier!

>check data on every point I made
>nVidia was absolute fucking garbage
lol he thinks this is a point

>Proves me wrong?
yes, everyone agrees the 8000 series was rushed and beefed up

And they still don't have the platform and some SKUs.
And that's fucking Intel that does everything in-house.
How the fuck would nVidia be able to shit out a fucking lineup WHILE relying on several vendors at once?

>And they still don't have the platform and some SKUs.
still proves you wrong m8

Kill yourself.

and that's when you know you won the argument

check the GTX480 reviews and every single reviewer would tell you that GTX480 and it's derivatives were garbage.

He has trips, you lost all of your arguments

None of you do need anything but 1050 Ti, the King of GPUs

...

The GTX 770 is faster than that piece of shit.

You know, a card that came out 4 years ago.

Is bigger = better? Retard on the line

Any proofs? Of course, not

>every single reviewer would tell you that GTX480 and it's derivatives were garbage.
>none of them do
>they actually praise it if you read the image
FUCKING FACTS!! I-IT'S NOT FAIR

Are you braindead or something? I'm not that guy who compare it argue. I'm just asked if bigger "value for money" means better and it's a serious question because I didn't care about consumer reviews before.

>compare OR argue
fxd

>jump into ongoing conversation on an anonymous fire safety course forum
>expect people to know who you are
lol

Bigger means that you get more performance for less money, with is not exactly a shock as this retard compared different generations to each other. This is like comparing i7-920 to Ivy and proclaiming that sandy is shit because reasons

power draw
power draw
launch performance

7970 was not matching until the Ghz edition and better drivers came out.

>power draw
>power draw
Did anyone care about that before Maxwell?

you forgot consoles faggot

Power draw only matters when Nvidia says it does.

nobody cared about NVidias power draw during thermi days and the only reason they care about it now is because they have one more excuse to buy their hardware
Keep jerking to Jensens leather jacket

>average product and produce enough of them
They tried that with the RX 480, and honestly it was breddy gud, but
a) fucking miners
b) they memed themselves with the RX 580, which isn't much faster, but has much higher TDP. The fucking thing eats the same amount of power as V56.

>The fucking thing eats the same amount of power as V56.

okay, almost. Factory overclocked 580s could easily use as much (or more) power as V56.
RX 580 was a mistake.

>nice bait thread

>Factory overclocked 580s could easily use as much (or more) power as V56
no they don't
the only way a RX580 can match a V56 is if you overclock and overvolt them like a retard for a +50Mhz core clock boost
undervolt them and you get perf/W close to Pascal
retarded gaming manchildren were a mistake

>Did anyone care about that before Maxwell?

Yeah, it was a huge running joke with Fermi.

But for the 290/390x, the problem wasn't power usage, it was the godawful reference cooler that made the card run at 100C.

>Yeah, it was a huge running joke with Fermi.
A joke. But people have been unironically trying to sell me on Maxwell because "efficiency".
Efficiency.

>undervolt them and you get perf/W close to Pascal
I know. I have an RX 480. I underclocked and undervolted the core and overclocked the memory to compensate, now it uses less than 100W measured with an amp meter at the PCI-E power plug.
Both 480 and 580, and seemingly any recent AMD card runs ridiculously high Vcore, but I'm talking about out of the box voltages without any tweaks, at which the 580 uses just barely less power than Vega.

it was a problem with fermi because as you hinted with amd cards heatsinks really weren't up to that kind of heat dissipation at the time, and as far as the 290x went even aftermarket and watercooled cards had ridiculously hot temps despite the huge improvements to heatsinks
arguably it's better than the situation we have today where the heat dissipation is still a huge issue but we also have cards undervolting and underclocking at the slightest bit of temperature, which is why I was glad that vega came with an integrated watercooler so that we might get some proper heatsinking for gpus comparable to what cpus have had for years now
t. still using an overclocked msi 290x that hits 94c when I uncap framerate

>The 390 was objecively superior to the 970, yet everyone bought the 3.5GiB meme
no. even to this day the 390 isn't faster than the 970. if performance is equal why would everyone go for the housefire, unknown brand, bad driver support, cuda-less alternative for basically the same price?

How many memes can you cram into one post user? You might have just set a world record.

whatever you say bud

Your own chart shows the 390 ahead of the 970 both at the stock clocks for thos particular cards and after both are overclocked to whatever those samples hit. The biggest differents is out of the box where the 390 has a decent lead (remember most people do not overclock).

i can't tell if you're retarded or just pretending but his overclocked was pretty poor and he even says this in his testing as he said not many people will have 970s which boost out of the box to over 1400 mhz so he overclocked accordingly. there isn't a single person in existence who has a stock 390 as amd never released stock variants and they were only available through aib partners who put overclocks on their cards, even if small. if you were to look at amazon charts around the time of the 970 and 390 the best selling 390 was the msi r9 390 gaming and the best selling 970 was the evga superclocked. both of those cards would have overclocks similar to the ones in the benchmark i posted and the msi 390 was actually one of the most premium models with an overclock of over 80+ mhz out of the box. the 970 would hit about 1380 out of the box.
stay in denial all you want but the 390 is not worth the purchase over the 970 if performance is the same for all those reasons i labelled before. what's next, you're going to tell me higher power consumption than a titan x is a special amd perk?

All that matters is that AMD is selling GPUs. AMD maintaining revenue for GPUs means they can keep pouring money into r&d and should the crypto bubble crash they'll be in a much better spot than if they had sold nothing. If anything miners are AMD's best friend. In a normal market AMD could never sell out like this and would have losses from unsold stock. Greedy gamers can't even see how this benefits the health of the company in the long run. If mining turns out to be maintainable then AMD will eventually turn up the production, if it crashes then they didn't oversupply and are in a stable position having sold all of their stock. It's win win for them. Gamers calling the products a failure is simply out of some narcissistic outrage because to them the world revolves around them.

Also the used market fears are just fear mongering. It's always existed and it's only a problem when an actual bad product, ie one that offers little to no benefit over the previous, is released. Even then it always increases marketshare which is a good thing for the brand. Studios would take it seriously if AMD suddenly gained 10% marketshare because of used cards

So what you are saying is you have to overclock on top of Nvidia's Boost technology to match a low clocked 390 (the HIS 390 is only clocked +20mhz over the AMD reference 1000mhz for the 390)?

I'm not interested in what amazon's best selling charts say as that is merely a measurement of popularity, not performance. The chart YOU provided is infact a measurement of performance and in that the 970 gets murdered.

>the 970 is superior to the 390!
>once you buy a premium model!
>once you overclock said premium model!

>11xx/20xx
at least pay attention to the shitty manu's that you like. it was never 11xx...

>claims nobody overclocks and that stock aib variants should be looked at
>ok so what are these popular stock variants the vast majority of these card owners are using
>ok here's some facts on those variants
>"i-it doesn't c-count anymore reee"

you mentioned it. keep crying about it.

>he chart YOU provided is infact a measurement of performance and in that the 970 gets murdered.

i didn't realise 4 fps was murder at 1080p across 22 games. just a year ago i was coming on to Sup Forums and people were saying even 10 fps lead for a 1060 over a 480 was nothing, no less murder. what changed?
also who said you have to get a premium model to overclock? you baiting or serious?
my friend actually had one of those msi 390s and with the full clocks set in the msi tuner facility thing he would average the mid 80s under load so i can't imagine how loud the fans are. meanwhile the 970 doesn't crack the 80's on the same msi 970 with a low fan curve.

>i didn't realise 4 fps was murder at 1080p across 22 games.

*After overclocking

That is the key element there user.

You mean Sup Forums?

no. both of those cards were bargain bin variants and we both know that. gainward is a literal shit tier brand and i'd never even heard of iceQ before that video. for around the same cheap price there is barely a 4 fps margin across 22 popular games (at the time of benchmarking). when pushed to the limit of what the benchmarker thought was good thermal/performance they were identical across both resolutions. judging by the 1060/480 performance there where at that time the 480 was 1fps ahead whereas now the 1060 is slightly ahead by a couple percent (pic related), i'd conclude that the 970 has probably closed that gap in current testing.

Just curious here, who gives a shit about power consumption? Everyone and their fucking granda's have a 600 Watt power supply and majority of people aren't overclocking, so why is there such emphasis on this? The only other part that meaningfully consumes power is the CPU and those have become far more efficient within recent times, as such, why is the only time power consumption ever mentioned, is when AMD is doing badly with regards to it?
AMD had more efficient GPU's that performed 10% worse but cost significantly less, but none of the tech press gave a shit and said buy Nvidia. When the 290 came out and shat on practically everything Nvidia had the only fucking thing I remember about it ironically is how much power it consumed, not it's performance.

update

How is oversupply a problem for amd? Wouldn't these skus be in the retailers end, meaning their problem now? What am I missing here?

>How is oversupply a problem for amd?
Dunno, paying for wafer starts you're not going to sell in the end is a bad fucking idea.
>Wouldn't these skus be in the retailers end, meaning their problem now?
The retailers need to *buy* said SKUs, and you know, they won't do that with oversupply.
>What am I missing here?
You're forgetting what happened to Hawaii.
Also it's not like AMD has any (ever) wafers to spare.

I see more AMD CPU's on Sup Forums than Sup Forums. Only gamers bought Bulldozer ironically, even though it sucked at gaming and was better at multitasking.

I can't stress this enough. It's been about two months since I traded my gtx 970 for an r9 390 with a friend who wanted cuda cores while I wanted freesync and I just can't fucking stand this piece of fucking dogshit driver support anymore. Literally the ONLY upside of this garbage GPU is that the menus in radeon settings look "nice" but that's fucking it. Luckily we settled so that if any of us wanted to switch back we would and that's exactly what I'm doing. Freesync can suck a fucking dick, got a gsync monitor on the way and it's better anyway.

The problem with power draw and AMD is the arch doesn't even need that much power, AMD is overvolting the shit out of everything. Shit reference coolers and horrible stock settings make AMD look bad to normies while Nvidia mostly works out of the box. Vega 64's stock settings are the worst I've ever seen in a GPU.

>AMD is overvolting the shit out of everything.
They do need to salvage everything from every wafer.
They don't have any choice.