/blindfold/

Welcome to the weekly Sup Forums jazz Blindfold Test thread. Every Friday and Saturday.

If you're new, the point of these threads is to have fun and encourage critical listening, discussion, and general enjoyment of jazz. All critical music listeners are welcome. The more participation we have, the more fun and successful these threads will be. In the interest of keeping the thread alive and bumped, any general jazz discussion is welcomed here as well.

For more information about how the threads work and listening suggestions, please refer to the pastebin: pastebin.com/UiCCG28N

THIS WEEK'S THEME: The Music of Andrew Hill
COMPILED BY: JTG

NEXT WEEK: ???
COMPILED BY: ???

If you missed last week's thread, DON'T WORRY. It's not too late. Here are the links for the mystery tracklist. Download the tracks, record your thoughts/guesses/evaluations for each one, and then come back and post them in the thread. Remember, people will be posting guesses and thoughts in this thread so don't read the thread until you have listened to the music and collected your thoughts in order to avoid spoilers. Track info for this week's tracks will be posted on Saturday, so if you see the thread is close to dying before then, give it a bump.

www2.zippyshare.com/v/MZ6m2GpK/file.html

Posting with names or tripcodes is encouraged as it makes discussion much easier.

1. This is pretty cool. I like the combination of guitar and bass clarinet. Oh and I recognize this one too once the rest of the band comes in. It’s from Black Fire. It’s a pretty cool version. The trumpet solo was nice and it was cool when the other horns started coming in too. This was nice. 4 stars.

2. I don’t recognize the tune but it seems kind of messy with the pianist banging on the low notes so much. It gets better towards the middle and the drumming is pretty good. This one was ok but I think I just mostly didn’t like all the banging on the low notes. 3 stars.

3. It sounds like there are two pianists. One on normal piano and one on electric. I like it once the trumpet melody comes in. I could see this being Alex Sipiagin. I am loving the piano solo. I guess it’s both pianists soloing together. Incredible drumming on this one too. I have a feeling this will be one of my favorites this week. 4 stars. Maybe 4.5.

4. I can hear how this is inspired by Andrew Hill but it sounds like the pianist is trying to make the tune more accessible. I didn’t like the bass solo at first but by the end it was actually kind of good. This one felt a little bit too long. There was some good stuff but overall it just felt kind of thrown together. 2.5 stars

5. This one sounds a lot older than any others yet. That piano solo was probably the most free sounding thing so far too. The trumpet player sounds a little bit like Freddie Hubbard. And a pretty crazy sax solo too. It sounds like the rhythm section doesn’t really know what to do. This one had some cool moments but felt kind of long too and I didn’t always get what the rhythm section was doing. 3 stars.

6. This one is surprisingly pretty. I like what the piano player is doing but the rhythm section could be playing more. Actually I like the bass playing. This one was pretty cool. 3.5 stars.

7. This one kind of reminds me of something Alex Sipiagin would do too. And I know JTG likes to put him on the playlists. Nice piano solo. I could listen to more of this. 3.5 stars.

8. I was pretty into this at the beginning but it just didn’t really seem to go anywhere. It just felt like it was a lot the same all the way through. The drum solo was ok but it was weird how the bass drum kept pumping all the way through. 2.5 stars.

9. This one was pretty nice but I don’t think I would ever guess this was connected to Andrew Hill. It sounds pretty different than what I’d imagine. 3 stars.

10. This is nice. I like how there are moments of dissonance but it’s still very pretty. I enjoyed this one a lot for a solo piano piece, but the ending was a little bit sudden. 4 stars.

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>1. It’s from Black Fire
yep

>3. I could see this being Alex Sipiagin
Not him but these are people who play with him often

>5. The trumpet player sounds a little bit like Freddie Hubbard
not him but someone along those lines

>7. reminds me of something Alex Sipiagin would do too
No Sipiagin this week. Though I'd love to hear him do some covers of Andrew Hill.


>10. I like how there are moments of dissonance but it’s still very pretty.
That's what I like about this one.

Bump

damn, that's what I call a lineup
amazing record, probably one of my favorite Jones recording. I don't even know how this kind of sessions gets overlooked over the time, but there a lot like this. there must be some kind of jazz scheme to keep them out of the general population's sight

this will be up 'til all day, right? I'm kinda busy right now but I'm willing to take the test later on. I love Andrew Hill.

I never listened to much of Hank Jones. Maybe I will check this out.

It will be up until tomorrow. Or if the thread dies we'all make a new thread tomorrow.

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Hank Jones has always been a bit underrated. I like his solo piano album a lot.

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Bumping this shit with my incomplete thoughts.

>Track 1
Guitar and clarinet is a nice mix. Really finely balanced duo playing between them too. I like how the guitarist mixes up his techniques - doing almost everything you can on a guitar in 3 minutes (okay not quite). Oh, once the bass comes in I recognise the tune. The trumpet solo is ace - for the first chorus or two he keeps ghosts of the melody in his playing, and slowly lets it go. Then just as he loses it, the guitar and drums start bringing back the rhythm bit. Feels a bit lame to pick the structure apart like that but it was some fucking grade A ensemble playing

>Track 2
I've listened to a fair bit of Hill's work and always struggled to grasp him as a composer, so it's nice to hear other people interpret his tunes and pick out the threads of what his songwriting actually involves. Not actually sure I know this piece but I can definitely understand it in the context of other stuff of his. There's something really primitive about everything in this track, doubly so when that drum solo starts, so in that regard it reminds me of Compulsion. It was pretty daring to keep the piano in that muddy register all the way through, and though there didn't seem to be an awful lot going on in he improvisations there the whole approach was worthwhile anyway.

I keep meaning to check out some of Hank's leader work. I've been listening a lot recently to Lucky Strikes and he almost steals the show there.

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desu i just learned that Elvin Jones, Thad Jones, and Hank Jones were related

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Is this a new release?

>Track 3
Other than the unusual lineup with two keyboard instruments - electric and acoustic - nothing jumps out at me from this. Anything of interest is lost in the flurry of notes.

>Track 4
The bass player here is laying down a pretty heavy groove, and this piano is great. Struggling to find words for it actually, I was enraptured through his whole solo. He did a thing I associate with Herbie Hancock where all of his phrases are pretty clearly distinct but also tied together at each end. Not that I'm saying it's Herbie - it's obviously not. This is my favourite so far.

>Track 5
I like this but there's so much going on, particularly in the trumpet and sax solos, that I'd have to hear it a few times to understand them. I think maybe the trumpet solo was a bit less interesting than the others - there certainly seemed to be more development from the sax. I like that vamp in the piano. There were times in his solo he sounded like two people playing independent lines, so maybe it's George Colligan again?

>5. The trumpet player sounds a little bit like Freddie Hubbard
>not him but someone along those lines
Guess I got the era totally wrong with Colligan then. Is it maybe Woody Shaw?

Yep

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bumping with an interesting article about Andrew Hill

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>Track 1
I guess this is two compositions combined? The guitar-clarinet duo melody I don't recognize, but it goes into Pumpkin from Black Fire when the band comes in.

The duet part had a pretty strong Jimmy Giuffre-flavor while Pumpkin was played with great confidence. I thought both parts were great.

>Track 2
Very percussive piano playing - this is a track where I wish I was familiar with the original composition, feels like you'd get more out of this that way.

I liked the transition into the drum solo.

Could this be Ethan Iverson on piano? Playing reminds me of him somehow and he's a fan of Andrew Hill.

>Track 3
The playing here seems a little low-key and restrained to me. The piano and electric piano work pretty well together.

I don't have too much to say about this.

>Track 4
This doesn't feel very exciting to me. I think I enjoyed the bass solo most.

One of those compositions where the chords and harmony establish a 60's post-bop feel, but the melody doesn't really stick.

>Track 5
This one sounds like a late 60's or 70's recording.

Pretty strong trumpet solo - I could see this being Woody Shaw, the sax solo goes into some very Eric Dolphy like places. Bass solo is good too.

Certainly one of my favorites so far.

>Track 6
The piano player seems familiar somehow, but can't think of what this reminds me of.

I enjoyed the contrast of the piano player being more lyrical and serene and the bass and drums being more animated.

>Track 7
I liked how this started in a little bit of a wistful mood - It's a pretty melody- but then they kind of lost me for some reason even though both the trumpet and sax players solo playing seemed pretty strong.

This one also has a pretty nice bass solo, I've enjoyed many of the bass solos this week.

>Track 8
Little bit of a vague start to this one... Starts building up nicely, though.

I really like when the theme comes on strong halfway through. Oh, I actually know what this is - this is Vijay Iyer's trio playing Smoke Stack from Historicity.

This track is kind of like an Iyer live set in one track in how it builds up from a knottier start to a satisfying finish.

>Track 6
This was a nice piano trio track. I liked the classicalish touches in the piano towards the end - is that from the composition or the player I wonder?

>Track 7
Really like the sax solo in this one. Didn't realise there were two basses until the solo came in, was a really nice melodic bass solo too. Not much to say on this track but I'll be checking it out for sure.

>Track 8
Monkish intro. Actually I was expecting it to pick up or lock into a groove or something when the rest of the instruments came in but it sounds like the whole thing is gonna be like this. I like it - especially the way the drums complement the really loose time feel - but I'm not sure I'm gonna be able to cope with eight minutes of it.

Was just about ready to lose interest when things started to calm down in the piano. This drummer is a badass, he's my favourite thing about the track. Weird how such an energetic and spazzy drum solo can feel so calm.

>Track 9
Really nice piano reminding me a bit of Paul Bley in the intro, kind of like an opposite of the track before it. I like how they keep touching on the edge of taking it to funky-bluesy territory then back off to the more relaxed feel.

>Track 10
Reminding me again of Paul Bley here. Sounds pretty good but I can't really pick out the composition at the heart of it - might appreciate it more if I recognised the original.

>Track 9
This one I certainly wouldn't guess is an Andrew Hill composition. If anything this has hints of the 80's in some of the playing to me, although sound quality suggests maybe a more recent recording.

>Track 10
This was beautiful - some moments of drama and maybe a little nostalgia.

FUCK OFF

>Track 1
I've heard this one, it's Nels Cline. McNeil Island & Pumpkin from the record where he covers Hill. It's a good track, I particularly like Pumpkin as it's one of my favorite Hill tunes but in addition to that I think it's a very fresh and interesting approach to the tune.
>Track 2
Usually I like percussive piano sounds but in here the piano gets a bit stale with one hand playing the same stuff over and over. The drum solo is pretty good though.
>Track 3
Wasn't too convinced at first, but halfway through it really picks up. The acoustic and electric piano duo is quite entertaining to listen to, I don't think I've heard it before.
>Track 4
More black fire tunes, this one's Tired Trade. It's a good rendition, but nothing really special. They're playing it more safely and that makes the track drag sometimes.
>Track 5
From the intro I'd say it's Symmetry. It's a pretty energetic version, the trumpet is very good, and that bass from six minutes on is wonderful. My only complaint is that at times the track doesn't seem to be too well put together, as if everybody's going their own way.
>Track 6
Not what I'd usually associate with Andrew, but a very pretty track nonetheless, gets better as it progresses.
>Track 7
Yellow Violet from dance with death. I like this tune a lot too, and this version does it justice, the horns are pretty great especially, but I like how all the members perform here.
>Track 8
This has pretty strong playing from both piano and drums, I really like it. It's also pretty consistent despite being a longer track. I'd really like to hear this one.
>Track 9
Nice interplay, they accomplish some pretty good melodies. Doesn't really feel like Andrew to me though.
>Track 10
Again not seeing Andrew here, and I really couldn't guess who's on piano either. But I do like this track too. Very creative solo playing and beautiful too. Really good honestly.

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You've got some correct guesses on the earlier tracks

Nice job on recognizing the tunes

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Bump.
Favorite Andrew Hill record?

I think Point of Departure has to be my favorite, but Black Fire, Judgement, Dance with Death, and Passing Ships are all very close.

On another note... this playlist was kind of tricky to put together. Despite his sort of underground popularity and influence on pianists, it was kind of tough to find covers of Hill's tunes.

Anybody have any favorite cover versions of Hill tunes that weren't on the playlist this week?

I love Point of Departure as well. He's one of those artists with a lot of great records that are very close in quality.
>Despite his sort of underground popularity and influence on pianists, it was kind of tough to find covers of Hill's tunes.
Yeah, don't think I've ran into many myself. I appreciate you putting together this playlist.

I was especially hoping to find some versions of the tunes from Point of Departure, but I think the only ones I found were on the Nels Cline record and they ended up being too long.

Anybody else planning to join in?

If not, I will probably post the reveal info soon.

I was going to post an interesting article from jazz.com where Vijay Iyer picks his favorite Andrew Hill tracks, but I can't get the website to load. So instead, here's Vijay talking about Hill from a 2007 "Before and After" which is JazzTimes version of the Blindfold Test

6. Andrew Hill
“Flight 19” (from Point of Departure, Blue Note). Hill, piano; Kenny Dorham, trumpet; Eric Dolphy, bass clarinet; Joe Henderson, tenor saxophone; Richard Davis, bass; Tony Williams, drums. Recorded in 1964.

"This is from Point of Departure. Andrew, Dolphy, Joe Henderson, Kenny Dorham, Tony and Richard Davis. What’s this called? I can’t remember what the song is called but I know this record very well. I think this is the second CD I bought. I love everything about it, the writing the playing, the way it showcases the ensemble, all the real creative approaches to improvising, the looseness of form. Andrew’s one of my heroes too, he’s a towering influence on me. There’s nothing about this that doesn’t inspire me. I get something new out of it every time. I got to know him a bit in the 90s before I moved to NY, and more so after I moved to NY. He was a real important person in my life. Tony is very sparse on this record. His playing is very contained but in a really surprising way, you know? Like his swells on the snare drum there. I love it. I love everything about it. I could go on and on about this record alone. I also like the way Andrew relates to the rhythm. It’s so mysterious. He played with ambiguity of time. It’s as if you hear his hands and arms but you hear it in time, moving in time. The first piece on there, “Refuge,” I transcribed. There’s something mysterious about the harmonies in that piece and the voicings in the way he arranged it for the horns. There’s nothing traditional about his choices. There’s his solo stuff from the 70s that I could listen to all day. There’s one called Verona Rag, which was a huge influence on me."

I knew Hill was a respected composer, but it never even occurred to me that there'd be more than a handful of versions of his tunes by other artists until you mentioned the idea for this theme a few weeks ago. So sadly I haven't heard any. These are all pretty great though so I'll keep an eye out for more in future.

>Track 1
Nels Cline- McNeil Island / Pumpkin
from New Monastery - A View into the Music of Andrew Hill (Cryptogramophone, 2006)

Cornet- Bobby Bradford
Clarinet- Ben Goldberg
Electric accordion- Andrea Parkins
Guitar- Nels Cline
Bass- Devin Hoff
Drums- Scott Amendola

This Nels Cline album is one of the only albums I know of that dedicates the entire album to the compositions of Andrew Hill. Almost every track is a mashup of two Hill compositions, but I picked this one because I think some of Hill’s most recognizable and popular tunes come from Black Fire, and this version of the tunes remain very recognizable while adding a pretty different twist.

>Track 2
Ethan Iverson- Strange Serenade
from The Purity of the Turf (Criss Cross, 2016)

Piano- Ethan Iverson
Bass- Ron Carter
Drums- Nasheet Waits

If “Pumpkin” is one of Hill’s most recognizable tunes, I figured this was one of his more obscure tunes, originally recorded on a 1980 trio album by Hill called “Strange Serenade.” Hill’s original version has a calypso feel, and Iverson’s version hints at that feel at times but never really settles into one distinct groove. This album was just released last month. Fun Fact- Drummer Nasheet Waits’ father Freddie Waits played drums on the original Hill recording of the tune.

>Track 3
Scott Colley- Smoke Stack
from Architect of the Silent Moment (Cam Jazz, 2007)

Trumpet- Ralph Alessi
Tenor Sax- David Binney
Piano- Jason Moran
Fender Rhodes- Craig Taborn
Bass- Scott Colley
Drums- Antonio Sanchez

Hill’s original version of the tune, from his album of the same name, featured two bass players, so I thought it was an interesting twist to feature two pianists on this version. It seems that not everybody liked the two piano format, but personally I think it’s really interesting and works pretty well.

>Track 4
Harold Danko- Tired Trade
from Escapades (SteepleChase, 2009)

Piano- Harold Danko
Bass- Michael Formanek
Drums- Jeff Hirschfeld

This is another tune originally from Black Fire. Danko has covered a few Andrew Hill tunes on his many SteepleChase albums, and I think he does a pretty successful job of capturing the sort of loose feel of Hill, but also adding his own sense of bluesiness to the tune.

>Track 5
Anthony Braxton and Woody Shaw- Symmetry
from The Iron Men (Muse, 1980)

Trumpet- Woody Shaw
Saxophones- Anthony Braxton
Piano- Muhal Richard Abrams
Bass- Cecil McBee
Drums- Joe Chambers

Most everything I found for this playlist was recorded in the past 10 years, so I definitely wanted to include this as it’s a pretty early cover version of a Hill tune. The tune is kind of obscure, from Hill’s “Andrew!!!” album released on Blue Note, and I think that this Shaw/Braxton version of the tune might be better known than Hill’s original. This was always a pretty interesting record, and I think Shaw’s playing is definitely my favorite part about this track.

>Track 6
Jason Moran- Play to Live
from Ten (Blue Note, 2010)

Piano- Jason Moran
Bass- Tarus Mateen
Drums- Nasheet Waits

Pianist Jason Moran studied with Hill, so I guess it was inevitable that he would pop up a few times on this playlist. Moran says that this tune, was written collaboratively with Hill while Moran studied and worked with him.

>Track 7
Ron Horton- Yellow Violet
from Everything in a Dream (Fresh Sound, 2005)

Trumpet- Ron Horton
Alto Sax- John O’Gallagher
Tenor Sax- Tony Malaby
Piano- Frank Kimbrough
Bass- John Hebert, Masa Kamagushi
Drums- Mike Sarin

Trumpet player Ron Horton worked with Andrew Hill in the last decade of his life and recorded on several of his later albums. “Yellow Violet” has been one of my favorite Hill tunes for a while, and appears on Hill’s album “Dance with Death,” recorded in 1968 but not released until 1980. The idea to use two bassists is also probably inspired by Hill’s use on “Smokestack.”

For those interested in more Andrew Hill covers- I saw that Ron Horton recorded an entire album of Andrew Hill’s music this summer, but I have no idea when that will be released. Hopefully soon.

>Track 8
Vijay Iyer- Smokestack
from Historicity (ACT, 2009)

Piano- Vijay Iyer
Bass- Stephan Crump
Drums- Marcus Gilmore

I would say Vijay Iyer is one of the more popular pianists today who seems to be influenced quite a lot by Hill. So even though I already included a version of Smokestack, I wanted to include this one too.

>Track 9
Walter Smith III- Aubade
from III (Criss Cross, 2010)

Trumpet- Ambrose Akinmusire
Tenor Sax- Walter Smith III
Piano- Jason Moran
Bass- Joe Sanders
Drums- Eric Harland

Jason Moran makes another appearance here, with another tune co-written by him and Hill. I agree with what most of you said, that this doesn’t really seem to fit with Hill’s typical style and it makes me wonder what process Hill and Moran used to write this tune together. Still, I think it’s a really beautiful ballad.

>Track 10
John Escreet- No Doubt
from Consequences (Posi-Tone, 2009)

Piano- John Escreet

This is another somewhat obscure composition from Hill’s “Andrew!!!” record. Escreet is one of my favorite young pianists, and I think this works pretty well as a tribute to Hill. I think Hill himself was pretty influenced by classical music, and though you may not hear it as much in his classic Blue Note recordings, you can hear it in his solo piano recordings, and I think Escreet uses that idea for this version.

First time I see this thread, it sounds like a solid, high-quality idea. Thanks bud.

John Escreet, a pleasant surprise. It's been a long time since I listened to him, I'll check this one out and some other from this week's theme.