Why is the genre being so "celebrated" lately as the most innovative thing in music since humans first banged a stick on a rock?
>Dem beats!
Usually basic 4/4 time and repeated throughout. Gene Krupa's drumming on a 70 old swing song will be loaded with more syncopation, polyrhythms, and tempo changes than anything a modern Trap producer can come up with in Fruity Loops.
>Dem Lyrics!
Okay:
"Wrists like Minnesota, trapping Coca-Cola Catching planes Anquan Bolden She got the hot box, know that's its stolen Large sizes, all type of narcotics Got a bankroll in that big body I love my Motorola, I love my Motorola I love my Motorola, I love my Motorola"
Yeah...
>Dem banging basslines
Same as the Krupa example. Any Jazz, Funk, or Soul bassist from decades ago will play something more interesting, which is why Hip Hop producers have to lazily sample it.
>It's not bound by rules, and can combine music from multiple genres to make a unique and interesting collage!
Already done better by artists like Shadow, Kid Koala, RJD2, the Avalanches, etc. And it's not like Hip Hop typically strives for that kind of complexity. It's usually a basic beat, an 808 bassline, and some sampled "accents" used for a bridge/breakdown (The Kanye Formula).
I get appreciating Hip Hop on its own simplistic terms, but the current trend right now is exalting the genre for its "forward thinking" nature while other genres of music struggle to keep up.
I'd agree if you were referring to TPAB. It made me sick to see people praising the shit out of it when GKMC was far better.
Evan Allen
>No Vanilla Ice Mind blowin' >He doesn't want to roll up the hootie mack
shit list desu
Christopher White
I'll worry about Hootie and the Blowfish later.
Almost done updating the 10s chart. It's taking forever and topsters keeps crashing.
Easton Morgan
White guilt + people are just trying to pretend that recorded music hasn't stagnated generally
Brandon White
This plus the fact that it is easy as hell to make. Hip hop also is a newer genre by comparison so it has more options for experimentation. But no one has been able to bring anything to the table since Kanye brought maximalist production at the beginning of the decade. But, of course, most rappers stopped doing that.
Aiden Nelson
White guilt.
Landon Hernandez
What is the most experimental hip-hop released in the last decade or so? When I ask I usually get shit like Atrocity Exhibition, which is still a pretty basic album structurally.
Matthew Morris
>all this autism it's popular because it's accessible and integrates seamlessly with pop culture. that's it
it's only called "innovative" by people who really aren't particularly into music (i.e. the average top 40 listener and the people selling it to them). trying to challenge that description on technical grounds just makes you look autistic
James Lopez
Aesop Rock, Twista, immortal technique... Dude, there is a lot of good rap.
I'm listening to Twista right now. Adrenergic Rush is such a good album.
Angel Williams
>Immortal Technique This is shit that I listened to in my edgy high school wigger phase. Grow up, dude.
David Long
Modern Hip Hop is pretty fucking gay Old School shit is were its at
Jack Robinson
>This plus the fact that it is easy as hell to make.
I mean, this was praised as one of the best songs of the year.
Looped pitchshifted beat with a microbeat accent riding on top throughout the whole fuckin' song. And lyrically, it's the same shit rappers have been rapping about for decades. The Club, women, money.
But it's so innovative for some reason.
Ryder Bell
Me too. I still listen. I have a very wide, diverse taste.
Aesop Rock is irrefutably amazing
Alexander Scott
>it's only called "innovative" by people who really aren't particularly into music
You haven't read all the Rock is Dead hit pieces and the like from music journalists? And in all those articles, they point to hip hop where the "interesting and innovative" music is happening.
Rock might be dead (I don't think so), but hip hop sure as hell isn't picking up the innovation baton. It's the same shit as it was 30 years ago. And as the guy alluded to, it was better. Paul's Boutique is loaded with more samples and variations than Trap album number 300.
Josiah Nelson
Yeah it really bothers me when people praise something for what it's not. Like, I love Weezer, but if anyone ever started calling them musically innovative, I'd think they're retarded. I'll give rae sremmurd this, that main chorus melody is nice.
Jackson Morris
>and the people selling it to them I'm sure you intentionally missed this part
it's just people either funded by the music industry or "journalists" cynically capitalising on hip hop's popularity by patting its audience on the back for listening to it. nothing to get upset about, it's quite inconsequential
Jordan Wood
Hip-hop is a very limited genre in terms of musicality. There is no reason to be musically smart in this genre, songs are vocally driven with a main focus on the lyrics. All you need to know is how to make simple rhythms and melodies then rinse and repeat for each song. This is why Hip-hop is the lowest form of music. As a art form it's fine, but to praise it as a amazing feat of music is laughable.
Jack Perry
>t's just people either funded by the music industry or "journalists" cynically capitalising on hip hop's popularity by patting its audience on the back for listening to it. nothing to get upset about, it's quite inconsequential
I can buy that.
Gavin Campbell
>Adrenergic Rush HOW THE FUCK DO YOU NOT KNOW HOW TO SPELL ADRENALINE
Wyatt Fisher
Fucking this. I'm a musician, and I just can't do it. Hip-Hop bores me to tears.
James Lewis
listen to dj screw his work was pretty amazing and I'm not talking about his chopped and screwed stuff either, guy was really good
Noah Thomas
>that track >niggers jumping around rapping about nigger shit like usual >praised as one of the best songs of the year >jump over to the metal scene >crackers like Hunter Hunt-Hendrix are writing entire essays and personal mythologies in order to explain the metaphysical basis for their aesthetic
Kevin Scott
Indeed. That's when smug journos write shit like this
>In part, hip-hop has been dominating since the ‘90s because, unlike rock ‘n’ roll, it can sound like absolutely anything. It was born in a culture of repurposing as a matter of necessity, and it’s not tethered to the instruments or traditions of any genre that came before.
it's laughably stupid.
Hip-Hop is "bound" by its rules like any other genre. If there's no rhythmic foundation to rhyme over or to dance/groove to (in the case of instrumental hip-hop, it's not really hip-hop.
But if you are going to expand hip-hop's boundaries so it gets to absorb genres like Trip Hop, Drum and Bass, Downtempo, Futurejazz, and Plunderphonics, then rock music should be afforded that same luxury, which these writers don't do for their sake of their "rock doesn't innovate anymore" argument.
Adrian Young
>muh metal dude, shut the fuck up
Connor Nguyen
I live in Houston. I'm so sick of hearing about DJ Screw. I don't care.
Noah Miller
The 10s chart is taking gosh darn forever to update. Also I'm having uploading problems.
Mason Howard
Metal is far better than hip-hop on every level, and you're probably a pleb, but Liturgy fucking sucks and HHH is an autist, so the guy you're replying to is also probably a pleb.
Julian Morales
I hate 98% of metal but it's still better than niggers getting paid and promoted to rap about nigger shit.
Nolan Scott
I mean cmon, you really can't be serious sure I really hate trap rap, but metal isn't better especially with those cringe edgy lyrics and usually muddy production. there is great rap(usually old school) and good metal but neither are better than each other
Logan Anderson
There's a lot of shitty, hyperbolic writing about hip hop, but this isn't saying hip hop doesn't follow rules, its just saying it steals a set of rules from another genre on a track by track basis, giving it wider appeal imo
Landon Parker
If you were to compare metal acts that were rated as highly as the nigger shit (which you can't, because nigger music is dominating Western culture currently), you would find metal that blows rap out of the water both conceptually and musically.
Charles Ortiz
>cringe edgy lyrics Shut the fuck up, I hate it that people feel the need to call anything dark edgy. You literally are the edgiest of edgelords when you say this shit.
Nathan Moore
>cringe edgy lyrics Maybe if you only listen to radio trash like Disturbed, or really generic thrash/death metal or something.
>muddy production Pleb spotted. A lot of that is intentional, and creates atmosphere. It's part of the charm. Besides, there's a lot of extremely well-produced metal out there.
This is going to sound really fucking cheesy, but Hip-Hop feels like a product. A lot of metal tends to have a spiritual aspect that most other genres aside from maybe shoegaze and dark ambient can't really compete with. If you take something like atmospheric black metal, it sounds like magic. You can feel the energy in it.
Robert Morris
uh oh, I think I triggered the metalfags
Brandon Green
This, but it's not even that it's dark. Some ambient metal and post-metal is fucking beautiful and uplifting.
Andrew Reyes
Good response
Gavin Baker
>its just saying it steals a set of rules from another genre on a track by track basis, giving it wider appeal imo
I agree with that. I just hate the implication that hip hop is somehow more "formless" than rock because of sampling.
Rock was very simplistic blues based music in the 50's, and just ten years later, came to incorporate everything from Free and Modal Jazz (Byrds, MC5, Zappa) to Musique Concrete (Beatles) to Electronics (Krautrock) to Noise (The Who, Velvet Underground) to Symphonic structure (Progressive Rock) to Drone (Can). .
Rock still adds to its palette today, which is why I find the boundary setting by these idiot journalists annoying.
Carter Thomas
This my friend is why you should always avoid and ignore the trendies of mainstream music journalism. No white guilt. Just trendy fuckbois. If it was the 70s they would be championing stadium rock.
Ayden Martin
yeah, and there is hip hop thays not all about being a ghetto nigger
Jack Torres
don't embarrass yourself kiddo
Ryder Russell
Metal artists are more versatile. End of discussion.
Burzum and Wolves In The Throne Room released ambient electronic albums. Alcest became a shoegaze band. Ulver dabbled in electronic music, folk, and even film scores. Darkthrone dabbled in Crust Punk.
You will never see a rapper do a complete 180 and release a fully ambient electronic album, or a Norwegian folk album.
When they try to be different, or make "rock" music, it's always cringey shit like Speeding Bullet or that one Lil Wayne album that had guitars.
Charles Turner
well it makes you sound hip to say Like I said:trendy fuckboys
Cooper Watson
you are the one embarrassing yourself, metalbaby
Blake Moore
you can also look at agalloch mixing industrial,modern orchestral,neofolk,blues,country,post rock,and 1970s prog seemlessly with multiple vocal styles and the more unique use of insturmentation on there albums. A favorite of mine when I get high is def The Mantle.
Tyler Jones
metal sounds extremely limited when you compare it to electronic music
though metal needs electronic instruments to help sound varied
Samuel Young
ok dear
Dylan Long
Hip-hop is just EDM with apes chanting over it. When you look up a hip-hop song on YouTube, one of the first suggestions is always "[song] instrumental".
can we calm the fuck down on the racism and homophobia please?
Christian Stewart
dude electronics are just like any over insturment. Its all in the context that you use them. A lot you can't do just on electronics alone. You can look at early Neofolk and see how much depth the acoustic insturmentation adds to get a feel for that.
Brody Diaz
Triggered?
Xavier Martinez
i hope you don't actually think this is good
m.youtube.com/watch?v=6Yinw2zjVm8 this was all done on very basic hardware by one 20 something in his bedroom. though this is kinda unfair since nothing has surpassed Experience yet
Benjamin Richardson
also pardon the shit spelling
Jaxon White
Did you forget where you are?
Aaron Jones
Not the guy you're replying to, but this is pretty cool. Also, I would have picked better examples for metal.
Easton Russell
well that was needlessly drawn out and boring desu you should have chosen an example that sounded less like retro 70s shit. I'm into industrial. I've heard enough shit like this. It's not gonna impress me. The germans were doing shit like this all the way back in the 70s.
Jacob Rogers
Hip hop is overrated but fuck metalheads are so annoying, they think they have the best taste and that their music is the only good one, while bands just keep doing the same and having the same boring sound with cringy lyrics for years. >youtube.com/watch?v=mUv8GxrqXPk
>If you do/don't listen to X then you're not TRVE >They tend to be liberals and open minded pussies but not with music. >Look at my band shirt I'm so special >If it has clean vocals then is not metal
you can't get better then Drudkh my dude. Very talented shit. Also Down,Nargaroth,and Electric wizard are all classic bands.
Isaac Taylor
ooohh, I seem to have struck a nerve. you jealous? should I mention that this was made in 1992? you get some masterminds behind an album with top notch equipment but get raped by a young bedroom producer
Gavin Scott
Not a lot of bands emote the way they do.
Robert Smith
yeezus clpping blackie death grips
Levi Perez
no not really Have you listened to Clock DVA? This isn't as unique as you seem to think it is. Idk maybe it gets better but its so fucking slow that its really kinda a drain to pay attention too.
Adam Diaz
Are you the rockist from that earlier thread?
Face it user, while hip hop samples everything from the most trivial song snippets, to jazz epics, to its own songs, to prog rock from the 70s, to turkish rock from the 70s, to swing from the 60s, etc etc etc it's sonic palette is much greater than rock.
It is forward thinking.
While Chance the rapper samples gospel music and actually arranges choirs (and I'm not a fan of his either) rock is stuck in a dumb caveman land of recycled pentatonic riffs.
Logan Cooper
this also just kinda sounds like sped up Kraftwerk to me.
Josiah Martin
>its so fucking slow doesn't surprise me that metal babies have ADD
listen to Jilted and fat of the land if you want electronic albums that really pushed the norm of music
David Ramirez
>pentatonic Have you listened to Animals as Leaders? seems like your points of reference for rock music end with classic rock friendo.
Daniel Edwards
Lol
Hudson Wright
You can have a fast song that is long dumbass you can also change speed change tempo put a few riffs in there and keep it interesting. shit that failed at.
Jason Watson
Most of The Drudkh songs are about 8 minutes but they change enough to keep the viewers attention. They've got the formula down pat.
Nathan Allen
you didnt make those, herbieanon did
Kevin Taylor
that's drudkh tho and the prodigy don't have a lot of long songs until you get to FOTL
Logan Clark
And Hip Hop is stuck in the same stone aged land of recycled 4/4 beats.
"Oh wow, [insert hack producer here] layered a pitch-shifted and time warped Coltrane sample over (yet another) 808 bassline and sampled Bongo Band, Winstons, Led Zeppelin, Billy Squier, James Brown drum break! How innovative.
Meanwhile, rock musicians actually play those Coltrane progressions and drum syncopations, and they don't sound like shit because they didn't have their tonality raped by a DAW.
You're a soundcloud hack who can't play an instrument, right?
Ian Rivera
the problem with electronic music is that it's usually defined by using only one instrument. It has a lot of the same limits something like acoustic folk has.
Jose Gomez
I am Herbieanon. I've been working on this last chart for 4 god damn hours. I can't upload images for some reason though.
Daniel Peterson
4/4 works well desu Idk why you nerds need to shit on 4/4 Love to see you try and pull off a format like desert rock or stoner rock without 4/4
Jacob Lee
>Muh sampling
Then by that standard, Dance music should eclipse anything Hip-hop/Rap related ever.
Dominic Brown
Hip Hop is fine and electronic music is fine and rock is fine but I'd say electronic music is the larger innovator at this point more then anything. That being said all perfectly fine formats. I'm not big on hip hop but I respect what it can do artistically.
Aiden Davis
ah you just werent under ur trip, i apologize man, i was just trynna look out for u :)
Joseph Sanchez
Funny thing is that a pentatonic riff is still exceedingly more complex than anything you'll find in a hip hop song.
Hip Hop's entire musical foundation is 4/4. And it still is.
And when it needs syncopation, it samples rock drummers. Lol.
Austin Kelly
how can it only be defined by one instrument when synthesizers can mimick any instruments or sound?
Parker Rodriguez
because they can't do it well enough for it not to be immediately apparent that it's a synth
Kayden Hughes
duh best electronic music sounds synthetic. mimicry is a shitty way to go. Use a synth like a synth.
Christopher Torres
Seems like RELEVANT rock music is my reference point friendo
Im an animals fan and they're just overly technical djenty prog. Tosin is a master at guitar but it's not exactly music that is relevant right now.
>Meanwhile rock musicians since play Coltrane
lmao since when? Rock musicians as a whole are knowingly less skilled than your average jazz musician.
I actually am a multi-instrumentalist who plays guitar and produces beats, among other things.
I like how you willfully ignore the lyrics of something like Lupe Fiasco's mural, which is full of clever punchlines and metaphors on a level you probably wouldn't even understand without many repeated listens without the help of rapgenius.
Don't listen to him, technicality seems to take precedence to him over songwriting and relevance culturally. He wants a band that alternates between 7/4, 9/8, and 15/4 needlessly just to show how good they are at their instruments, while failing to write a good pop song.
Ummm what?
Landon Harris
>synthesizers can mimick any instruments or sound?
They can't.
You'll never get the sound of a live drum kit played in the basement of BC Studios with a DAW, Drum Machine, or Synth,
Drum Machines sound like utter trash compared to a real kit. Not that drum machines don't fit the aesthetic of certain kinds of music, but let's not pretend you're going to press a button and out comes Art Blakey's sound
DAWs and Computers aren't fairy dust. This is exactly why sampling is used so much. Synths can't create those sounds. Furthermore, once you manipulate that sample (i.e. a cello), then the tonality of it is lost. You want a real cello sound in your music? Hire a cellist and record them in a real space.
David White
That's literally what tonedeff did
Mason Sullivan
whats relevant even mean in this digital age though? How much of a pop audiance do you really give a shit about/
Ryan Ortiz
have you even looked at modern roland or yamaha music work stations?
they are pretty spot on and it would be hard to tell the difference between a real guitar and one of them
Blake Nelson
>Why is the genre being so "celebrated" lately as the most innovative thing in music since humans first banged a stick on a rock? Because it is popular black music. The fact of the matter is that black people invented almost all forms of popular American music, and in the past musical academia hasn't given them due recognition so now they're trying to be forward-thinking by examining what's currently popular with black people.
>Dem beats! It's true that trap beats and boom bap beats as well could get really boring and repetitive. They aren't meant to be experimental generally, it's pop music.
>>Dem Lyrics! Nice cherrypicking, there are tons of better bars by modern rappers. Not to mention it's not all about lyrical content, it's about delivery and the voice as a rhythmic and melodic instrument. Lil Yachty is trash but just look at Migos rapping a fucking children's book and making it sound good. youtube.com/watch?v=XX7JAHddY84
>>Dem banging basslines Yeah this is kind of true.
>>It's not bound by rules, and can combine music from multiple genres to make a unique and interesting collage! All those producers you named ARE hip hop producers except maybe Kid Koala.
Josiah Gutierrez
also your right he's probably a prog nerd
Colton Hill
>Seems like RELEVANT rock music is my reference point friendo
