So I was reading about the old Islamic world, about the Seljuk Empire specifically and...
How the fuck did they end up where they are now?
They clearly had a very liberal and developed society. Drinking and having anal orgies with sluts was deemed OK, wine consumption and general hedonism was praised by numerous Islamic poets of that time. Mathematics and physics were developing very fast.
So essentially at a certain point very long ago muslims were the today's Europeans and Euros were mad barbarians slaying each other.
How did muslims downgrade from a prosperous logical society into vermin? How? How did that historically even happen, given a muslim from back then would probably consider modern muslims to be barbarian-tier in terms of morals.
Mongols rekted the islamic world and alongside it baghdad and the baghdad university. They lost a lot of science and knowledge.
After this traumatic event did the religious authorities grow in power and deemed philosophy as unislamic and urged tge people to become more religious.
The final nail in the coffin happened a few decades ago with the rise of political islam and thus the rise of islamic terrorism spurned by wahhabi salafis and the iranian revolution.
Christian Sullivan
Buttsex orgies lead to societal collapse, is what I'm getting from this.
Hudson Gray
This is actually pretty sad.
If I were an arab/persian/turkic, I'd strive to recreate the oldschool secular Islam and industry/science in their countries. They have the potential and it sure would've done a better job at making Islam more popular, as they want it to.
Look at japs. Look at the amount of weeaboos and wannabe shintofags. It all happened, because Japan managed to reform itself in that exact way.
Iran has the most in terms of such a potential, actually.
Xavier Wood
i blame the jews. they are wrecking muslims just like they are wrecking christians.
>Iran has the most in terms of such a potential highly doubtful.
Samuel Lopez
Maybe the SA is to blame for the current state of the muslim world then.
As if they deliberately degrade their own kind by exporting backward ideology and at the same time hypocritically sucking the money out of adjacent muslim states.
Hunter Campbell
fall of ottoman empire, rise of Wahhabism, world war 1, etc. It's been a long time since the Seljuk senpai
David Butler
Islam was late to the game. 8 centuries behind in its origin, and still going through its dark age.
Ayden Ross
Well, I am more amused by the fact, that it started off more secular than it is today.
It's as if they are developing backwards.
Noah Reed
Seems like the likeliest shortcut to God.
Noah Williams
The iranian population is actually considered the least religious in the region despite living in a theocracy
>... no more than 1-1½% attend Friday prayers, and lots of those who do are dragooned into being there. Three years ago one cleric said that 73% of Iranians did not even say their daily prayers.[8]
>According to Zohreh Soleimani of the BBC, Iran has the lowest mosque attendance of any Muslim country; only 2% of adults attend Friday services
The only reasonable action to take is a SA travel ban and the bombing of Saudi Arabia by a coalition of world powers.
Adrian Brooks
sorry but omar khayyam was rekt by his own ruler who told him to stfu when he though the solar system was heliocentric
Liam Myers
Everyone was rekt then for assuming heliocentrism.
Relatively, the muslims were progressive as fuck for that particular point in time.
Levi Hughes
but only so much
Caleb Ramirez
>So essentially at a certain point very long ago muslims were the today's Europeans and Euros were mad barbarians slaying each other. Euros were arguably doing just as good.
John Wilson
The Crusades put the Islamic world under pressure with invasions in the 11th and 12th centuries, but a far greater threat emerged from the East during the 13th century: in 1206, Genghis Khan established a powerful dynasty among the Mongols of central Asia. During the 13th century, this Mongol Empire conquered most of the Eurasian land mass, including China in the east and much of the old Islamic caliphate (as well as Kievan Rus) in the west. The destruction of Baghdad and the House of Wisdom by Hulagu Khan in 1258 has been seen by some as the end of the Islamic Golden Age. Later Mongol leaders, such as Timur, destroyed many cities, slaughtered hundreds of thousands of people, and did irrevocable damage to the ancient irrigation systems of Mesopotamia. Muslims in lands subject to the Mongols now faced northeast, toward the land routes to China, rather than toward Mecca.
In the Iberian Peninsula, the Catholic Monarchs completed the Reconquista with a war against the Emirate of Granada that started in 1482 and ended with Granada's complete annexation in early 1492, which also marks, for some historians, the end of the Islamic Golden Age.The Ottoman conquest of the Arabic-speaking Middle East in 1516-17 placed the traditional heart of the Islamic world under Ottoman Turkish control. The rational sciences continued to flourish in the Middle East during the Ottoman period.
To account for the decline of Islamic science, it has been argued that the Sunni Revival in the 11th and 12th centuries produced a series of institutional changes that decreased the relative payoff to producing scientific works. With the spread of madrasas and the greater influence of religious leaders, it became more lucrative to produce religious knowledge.
Justin Walker
>Rise of European Empires >Fall of Turkic sultanates because of the above mentioned buttsex and drinking >ExecuteInferioritycomplex.exe >Leads to reforms towards political Islam > Collapse of Ottoman empire leads to rise of Tribal Kingdoms >Lack of Arab nationalism because of alliances towards tribes and not nations >This leads to revolts and unstable regimes >Revolutionaries take political Islam as a suitable ideology and fuck up the middle East and Europe.
Thomas Rivera
lack of money the discovery of the new world and its goods put the arabs out of business
the mongols helped ottoshit empire being a backwards nepotistic fuckfest helped too
Christopher Wright
someone feels my pain?
Ian Flores
>be turkroach >capture Constantinople >price gouge the Christians trying to trade with Asia bc what are they gonna do, sail to China >Christians sail to China >shit >Christians further hack the game by exploiting the New World >dar al-Islam becomes an economic backwater >400 years later Ottomans are FINALLY kill >Araps are utterly incapable of forming nation states and instead fight over tribes and muh imma >KSA-Iran war turns whole region into fanatic extremist clusterfuck
Evan Gray
More like Islam civilization has ended around the time of Mongol destruction. What we have now is just the carcass moving as a zombie. If you examine what contributions have they made since the XIII. century to humanity, it's fucking nothing.
Nathaniel Gray
With about a quarter of the global population, that's a big zombie.
Nathaniel Stewart
Yet they are still the best ally of yours. Not even on the travel ban.
Levi Davis
The poets and scientists weren't muslim
Oliver Powell
reported to sharia police
Jaxon Gomez
>The poets and scientists weren't muslim they mostly werent arabs but muslims
Logan Martinez
No they were Christian and Zoroastrian. The early Muslims didn't want converts so they could tax them more
I don't have the link on me but most of that was dubunked
Dominic Harris
>Drinking and having anal orgies with sluts was deemed OK Hmm
Benjamin Davis
>Sup Forums Science debunking history Lmao
Daniel Peterson
It is a book from a scholar
Austin Hernandez
something similar happened to Rus unfortunately
Connor Cruz
That's exactly the problem. There's the rotting corpse of a dead civilization sitting at the heart of the world and nobody knows what to do with it.
Nathaniel Carter
Really?
Kevin Torres
>yfw Iranians mean the same thing to Islam as the Greeks to the Roman Empire arabs=Romans? The only thing they were good at was military conquest and empire building.
Lincoln Young
said by Hungary of all people.
LAMO
Angel Taylor
The turks were much better at that than arabs desu. Arabs are just like the mongols: an one hit wonder
