Discuss

Discuss.

why the hell do you not use proper safety equipment then?

I'm scared of heights, but I'm no stranger to manual labor. Its easy if you are able bodied. I think it shows more commitment and intelligence to join the knowledge based work force.

seems like we should have machines doing this by now

/thread

I work from home, in my pjs, and make ~125 to 200K a year as a network security engineer

>pic related

>you will never sit eating lunch with your buddies hundreds of feet in the air
Fuck my office job, why even live?

thats exactly what office workers in skyscrapers do though.

My brother was an iron worker. Told me half the guys were high on weed while working, the other half were hungover or drunk.

>knowledge based work force

The picture is likely a response to women screaming about how hard their lives are.
And the knowledge based workforce is 99% fat women sitting at a desk putting numbers into a spreadsheet and answering phones. Very dedicate, much intelligence.
The reality is, if every office worker stopped going to work, things would get less organised but continue pretty much the same.
If every person who worked with their hands (that includes carpenters, electricians, plumbers, truck drivers, garbage men, pilots, police, the military and so so so so much more) society would collapse overnight. Fuck, even if just all truckers stopped western society would fall apart instantly.
The reality is, the truly valuable people in the knowledge based workforce make up a very small fraction of the whole (doctors/nurses, A FEW engineers). Most people are just one of 100's who are doing simple tasks that enable 1 or 2 to focus.
Me thinks you're an elitist, with no perspective on reality.
Construction workers build skyscrapers, not architects. Soldiers win wars, not generals.
Now, in realty I don;t shit on white collar guys, fuck, I am/have been one most of my life, but walking around pretending you're superior to someone who actually makes the world go round because you're in a little bubble of watercooler chats and inane facebook conversations about the weather is just delusional and fucking pathetic.

...

based user

Not the guy you were responding to but...

>Me thinks you're an elitist, with no perspective on reality.
What if you are an elitist with a firm grip on reality?

>Construction workers build skyscrapers, not architects. Soldiers win wars, not generals.
Sure, but their jobs still suck

>Now, in realty I don;t shit on white collar guys, fuck, I am/have been one most of my life, but walking around pretending you're superior to someone who actually makes the world go round because you're in a little bubble of watercooler chats and inane facebook conversations about the weather is just delusional and fucking pathetic.

I am firmly white collar and I KNOW that nothing I do matters but goddamn is it easy and it pays well. At the top end of my pay range I am in the top 2.4% of individual wage earners in the US. I don't have a college degree and I work from home.

Is it fair? Fuck no, but that's life.

Am I superior? No but neither are construction workers or janitors. But clearly my pay and the lifestyle it affords are superior. My choices have yielded superior results. But I don't find any nobility in hard physical labor anymore than I do in playing sports really well. Just because you have a shittier job than me does not mean I should respect you or kneel down and kiss your dirty steel toed boots.

I'm referring more to engineers and the like.
You dont even need a degree to answer the phone or work a front desk.
I'm not even white collar I work in a warehouse. I recognized my own disinterest and ineptitude in college.

I would love to compare a skyscraper made without any engineering input to one with it.
I would love to see a war fought between a group of soldiers without a general against one with.

The funny thing is both without a leader would fall.

You inferred things that were never said.

>Guy shits on people who are extremely valuable
>another guy points out you shouldn't shit on em, and points out why they are valuable
>you say you wont bow

wtf are you even on about m8.
The guy just said don;t trick yourself into thinking you're naturally better than people who make your lifestyle possible. He didn't say shit about grovelling. You think Joe Nailbanger wants you to kiss his boots? No, he just wants you to leave him the fuck alone to do his thing, and maybe stop pushing the narrative that secretaries are so valuable that they need a national holiday.

>I don't have a college degree and I work from home
>The stories and information posted here are autistic works of fiction and falsehood.
Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact.

Way too much text in this thread chill

>I'm referring more to engineers and the like
So a tiny tiny fraction of white collar jobs.

>You dont even need a degree to answer the phone or work a front desk
Who the fuck said anything about a degree? I know a guy with a BoS who works as a drywaller, and a chick with a BoA who delivers auto parts. Degree =/= dedicated, intelligent, aptitude, ambition, or even desire.

>I'm not even white collar I work in a warehouse. I recognized my own disinterest and ineptitude in college.

What's wrong with working in a warehouse? The world needs shit to get moved around, and those things need to sit in warehouses for a while sometimes.

wqer

>No buildings were built ever before engineering as a science

The people who build are perfectly capable of building things without a sketch, and the math just negates the need for trial an error. A world without structural engineers is a world of 3-4 story square buildings. A world without construction workers is a world without buildings.

>No wars were ever won or fought before military strategy

Soldiers are perfectly capable of making strategic decisions as they go. Combat would just be messier, and more chaotic, you know, like it was in era's past.
A war without generals is a messy chaotic mess.
A war without soldiers is a white flag.

So, did you like, have a point, or are you just really attached to classist elitism?

I dont get your point
its too hard to argue with you when you arent making yourself clear and arent clearly reading other peoples statements.

Next time: study

you also tell lies on the internet

well it isnt Sup Forums - Debate Skills

This is what happens when you're too lazy to get a fucking GED

Translation: I got nothing.

The whole point is just to point out who silly, childish, and ignorant of reality it is to shit on people who work laborious jobs.

Everyone has a niche they can fill.
Artists may need to be gifted and creative, white collar workers may need to be intelligent and committed, but laborers just have to be able bodied.

A war without soldiers seems like the most awesome thing i ever heard

You convinced me, fuck soldiers, give us the white flags

Still need a GED, pays 30+ on prevailing wage OT is nice

Okay. Without getting into the stuff you inferred about me

I will agree that I inferred some stuff from
ok?

However:

>He didn't say shit about grovelling. You think Joe Nailbanger wants you to kiss his boots? No, he just wants you to leave him the fuck alone to do his thing

This is a thing that HAS been happening. This deification of trades over technology jobs. It's a losing battle because automation is going to create a bloodbath in the job market in the next 25-50 years. First, unskilled labor and then highly skilled trades will be wiped the fuck out. What isn't will only be done by mexicans.

It's a fucking apocalypse on the horizon and despite what I said before I think it's going to be a bad thing for the country/world. It's just inevitable at this point.

If you are maintain/building the machines you will be a third class citizen, in pay and influence. If you are designing and programming the machines, you'll be second class, well off, but essentially powerless.

Only the the business owners/CEOs and executives will have any real power.

You see this divide already and it's only going to get bigger.

If you aren't in at least the 3rd class you are FUCKED.

So, what I am saying is, recognize that this is happening and plan accordingly instead of posting or creating the kind of memes that attempt to prop up a crumbling social and economic strata. Is it a goddamn shame. Yeah? It's also a damn shame that there are so many extinct animals. Memes and hope won't bring them back

Believing anything you feel is wrong must be wrong. Welcome to the Era of Trump.

we dont need soldiers, just unmanned mechs and planes and mad scientists coming up with the craziest weaponry that a soldier would be glad to have.

how does have a high mortality rate feel like?

You have like 100 years left to work.

What do you think of robots?
Ready for some Luddism?

I work in a warehouse that is 1 out of 6 of the entire united states to use an automated system that sorts things. It cost the company 25 million. It doesn't work right, can't keep up and still needs a decent amount of man power to run.
I hope this means automation is not all its cracked up to be.

>I hope this means automation is not all its cracked up to be.
For now, yes.

...

You went WAY off topic here.
We aren't even really disagreeing, but you're overestimating the progress of automation.
The question is, how long until we have fully functional AI and perfectly stable bipedal androids? Basically synthetic people. That's how long it will take for 90% of blue collar jobs to become automated. I'd say at LEAST 100.
And there is no deification of trades over tech, are you insane? If there was, why are the VAST majority of posts in this thread "shoulda been as smart and dedicated as them secretaries".
The media CONSTANTLY portrays tradesman as oafs with sub-par IQ's who are completely useless. If by deification you mean a push to get people to go into trades, then yes, because we don't have enough of them and they're fucking essential to sustaining our way of life. And as for Mexicans doing it, ok if you want everything in your house to fall apart, leak and break down. You'll never be able to pull a shlub off the street, hand him a hammer, and just expect him to be able to produce something that meets western standard.

TL;DR: I'm done bouncing around topics while you shift the goal post. Blue collar workers aren't less intelligent or dedicated, and are very clearly essential while the VAST majority of white collar workers are completely disposable.

>Believing anything you feel is wrong must be wrong. Welcome to the Era of Trump.

Calling out BS when you see it is too mean, much cries. Welcome to the era of snowflakes.

What really sucks is the company spent so much on the system that that is the reason why they run it. It isn't efficient, but they use it anyway.
Other buildings that use it might have better luck, but our work load is too much for the robots.

It's not folly. It's an investment in the future. A future without employees. A profitable future.

The workers it replaced were almost minimum wage anyway though
say it took 20 people to do the same job before, now it takes 10 and a 25 million dollar machine.

...

>You went WAY off topic here.
It's strongly related to the discussion from ops image but OK.
>We aren't even really disagreeing,
Ok
>but you're overestimating the progress of automation
I hope you are right, user. I seriously do. I don't think you are though. I think you are underestimating how fast tech is moving.
>The question is, how long until we have fully functional AI and perfectly stable bipedal androids? Basically synthetic people. That's how long it will take for 90% of blue collar jobs to become automated. I'd say at LEAST 100.
No man I don't think those things are necessary for 90% of blue collar jobs to be eliminated. But again that depends on how fast you thing automation is actually going to move.
>And there is no deification of trades over tech, are you insane?
Nah, but the OP image is what I was keying off of. The Dirty Jobs guy, This old House has a push going on right now.
>If there was, why are the VAST majority of posts in this thread "shoulda been as smart and dedicated as them secretaries".
This is where I think we are diverging. Secretaries are not REALLY white collar. They risk being automated out too but will survive a bit longer as a status symbol. They are essentially the waitresses of the white collar world. I would never argue that being a secretary is a better choice than a trade right now.
>The media CONSTANTLY portrays tradesman as oafs with sub-par IQ's who are completely useless.
I don't see this but I am not blue collar so I conceded that it may in fact be true.

Cont:

>And as for Mexicans doing it, ok if you want everything in your house to fall apart, leak and break down. You'll never be able to pull a shlub off the street, hand him a hammer, and just expect him to be able to produce something that meets western standard.
Now who's an elitist. Mexicans who are not day laborers do good fucking work. They guys who painted my house were top notch. The guy who did the tile/wood floor in my entryway was fucking awesome. The plumbers who rebuilt the stack coming up from my foundation fucking spent all day and fixed everything perfectly. The problem is, what happens to Americans who's skilled jobs the mexicans take over? They don't get paid as much as a white person.
> Blue collar workers aren't less intelligent or dedicated,
I was never arguing this. I called into to question how wise it is going into labor at this point in history only.
>and are very clearly essential
For now. That is my point.
>while the VAST majority of white collar workers are completely disposable.
Now who's a fucking elitist. Toss your phone and computer and bank account, etc etc etc. White collar drives the demand for labor. It's symbiotic. For now.

>The workers it replaced were almost minimum wage anyway though
>say it took 20 people to do the same job before, now it takes 10 and a 25 million dollar machine.
I know man, like I said, unskilled goes first then skilled. The machines are getting better RAPIDLY. Got a cell phone?