Wow really activated those almonds

Wow really activated those almonds.
Do Christians believe this or is this or is this particularly retarded?

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It's a bit more complicated than that but yes generally they do. Part 2 happened because man couldn't fullfil God's covenant for causing part 1. So god sent his son to die for man's sins, hence part 2.

The real hard to swallow shit is Jonah and the whale.

Spot on christfag.

The silly stuff like Jonah and global floods is just icing on the cake. The entire concept of substitutionary atonement is horrific, and in context it's nonsensical.

Not retarded to have faith atheistfag. You have faith in science no?

Yes christfags actually believe this. Don't bother attempting to point out the obvious lies and paradoxes, they'll just NOPE back to their hugboxes.

God is good and evil. Christians AND atheists can't wrap their heads around this.

>atheists can't wrap their heads around this
I should think not, since there's no god to be either good or evil, let alone both.

I have faith in both. Science for existence, God for subsistence.

In a universe of infinite possibilities every eventuality is inevitable.

Yes, they seriously believe God creates hurricanes and floods and earthquakes to punish humanity as a whole for tolerating gay marriage

You know this for sure? You don't?! How shocking...

Something that is actually impossible will never happen.

People used to worship the sun as a god which does cause these things.

This isn't even that difficult of a concept.

The second half shows his offer to rescue man, the first half being from one's own neglect.

"I ignore God when nothing bad is happening, but when something bad happens, I immediately blame him"

>the ultimate cop out
By that same coin, I'm currently assfucking your mom while using your dad's empty skull as a coffee cup. Oh, and I'm also god.

Good thing that's totally irrelevant to what we're talking about.

And how is the existence of a higher being and way of existence impossible? Shortsighted little earthling.

...

If the multiverse theory were true, then a universe in which the multiverse theory is false would have to exist.

Exactly my point you smug little shit.

Except that he's rescuing man from a system that he created with full knowledge that man couldn't abide by it, and the method he uses makes no sense (sacrifice himself to himself to create a loophole in his system).

Demonstrate that it's possible and then we'll talk.

All you need to do is a bit of reading. Humans have been ascending for millenia. The Kingdom is within.

I have done a bit of reading. Humans haven't been "ascending" at all. There's no evidence of a "kingdom".

That is false.
An infinite set guarantees all possibilities, but does not guarantee all impossibilities. To put it another way:
There are an ifininite number of whole numbers. Count as long as you like, you'll never reach the end of the sequence.
But no matter how long you count that sequence of numbers, you will never count to the letter w, the color blue, or the smell of chocolate. Even though the sequence of numbers is infinte, there are still things which are outside of that sequence. To assert that an infinite universe somehow guarantees that anything you can think of inevitably exists somewhere is to completely fail to understand what "infinite" means.

+1

Correct. Mathfag here, the problem is most people have an intuition for infinity meaning "all possible things"

ergo, people read "infinitely many universes" as "all possible universes" which isn't the same thing

infinitely many things != all possible things

so one rooted in reality, one to help you sleep better at night

so when they contradict.. which one do you listen to?
In the end.. is creating something made up to comfort yourself [and that you actually think is real] good or bad for you as a person?

...Yes, but the point wasn't 'would it perfectly work' but rather that people had a choice.

So God isn't perfect?

Yes, sadly there are folks actively repressing the real story.

That is we are here because of the sins of before not now.We are here to learn death hurts and murder is wrong.

Mercy was supposed to be the main result of sacrifice. We would decide not to sin rather than to have to sacrifice our very best lamb.

But instead religion became and abattoir. Sacrifice a bloody pursuit for profit. Prophets were ignored.

This is but the first lesson, and God was willing to do it as were you.Only Lucifer refuses.

Christ sacrifice was simply a reset that emptied hell and gave some souls a second chance.

Now you know what many men have sought for generations can you deal with it.

TLDR YOU ARE A CHILD OF GOD.

The simple fact that it's possible for you to do things he doesn't want you to should answer that. If God wanted everyone to be christian, and actually was omnipotent, we all would be. Even if he wasn't omnipotent, just omniscient, he would have been able to convince everyone without fail that christianity is the correct path. But instead he chose scribes who put their own twist on his word, resulting in dozens of inconsistencies and outright contradictions all through the bible, which directly cause people to not believe his story.

How does his decision to allow free will deny him perfection?

Someone doesn't fucking know the definition of "faith". Grab a dictionary you gullible shit stain.

>can you deal with it.
Since I have no reason to believe any of the babble you spouted, sure, I can easily deal with it.

Because it means that God is limited.

free will and omniscience can't mix. It's paradoxical.

How so? You're making no logical sense.

Checked

I find it very infrequent when they contradict. Of course it is good for a person. If not for that we are already in hell. Can you imagine a worse hell then being an intelligent being and knowing one day you are going to die, and spending every moment fighting the inevitable, knowing full well you can do nothing about it. Exquisite torture.

So if I have a way to escape this I can walk the earth like it is mine.

god is immune to paradoxes.
checkmate, atheist.

God lacks the power to make a perfect system that includes free will.

I dunno, some nigger rising from the dead is pretty unbelievable.

>Can you imagine a worse hell then being an intelligent being and knowing one day you are going to die
Sure, a hell where you are an intelligent being and never die.

Death is nothing to fear.

>God is good and evil

you're agnostic if you believe in that, because you are not describing the Christian God.

And yet here we are

>here we are
A world where Christianity is in decline.

Sure, immortality sounds good at first. But when you consider that one day the sun will expand and heat up, eventually swallowing the earth and/or exploding...immortality kind of loses its appeal. Who really wants to still be alive five quintillion years in the future when all the stars have burned out and there's nothing but a void of darkness with no one else around?
that's a fucking nightmare.

Ask me about that in a few thousand years and I'll make an informed decision. I don't want to witness the heat death of universe but everything is totally pointless otherwise.

here we are...what? Surrounded by a bunch of undead niggers?

No.They don't.
Suffering is bad from a human perspective, but it's in fact a part of the ever changing existence of everything, and might a be a good thing without you knowing it.
That's what the story about Adam and Eve is for: They eat the fruit from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. But humans have a very limited perspective on things, thus that knowledge lead to their fall – we only think we know that something is good. Or bad. But only God can really know.

Isaiah 45:7

So what if everything is totally pointless?

...

It is. You miss understand me. I had an epiphany one day. I can't explain why. There is an element of it called, you know faith.

The whale is a parable, someone made that up. Genesis is a parable. The end of the Gospel is a first hand account told by men who died in the most horrifying ways possible and died knowing full well if they recanted they would be freed. More than one witness and all that. Very different.

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>suffering not bad
I'm done

Then there's nothing I can do about that. It's Pascal's wager. If I'm right I win everything, if the atheist is right we both were going to lose anyway. No risk, all reward.

Besides if nothing else if people loved the way Christ and the early Christians tryed to we would have less issues. Now I don't mean the way the church says. Only the Jesus part not the hermeneutical interpretation crap.

Old testament vs New testament

That's what happens when you keep the jew texts on your religion

The gospels aren't first hand accounts.

This was a really neat read. Thanks for posting.

No, he has the power but chooses not to. Having a gun and not shooting it doesn't equate to not having a gun

>It's Pascal's wager.
Which is garbage. Your beliefs affect your life in the here and now, and we could both be wrong. What if there is a god, but it loves atheists and hates Christians?

>Besides if nothing else if people loved the way Christ and the early Christians tryed to we would have less issues
The morality of Jesus only makes sense if there's an afterlife.

Then God is evil.

youtube.com/watch?v=Pk90WKS8Opc

No, refusing choice is evil. You're terrible at arguing

No they were written about a hundred years after. But they were told by the disciples and there are historical records of thier existing. Some of the Gospels seem to share the same sources.

Just like reading a newspaper is a second hand account. I can trust more than only what's before me.

>You're terrible at arguing
Nope.

You are saying that God has the power to create a perfect system where free will exists, but instead chose to create an imperfect system where some people will suffer for all eternity. That's evil.

there could be (and possibly is) an entity that fits humanity's criteria for a god, but it being any of the gods for humans religions is unlikely.

Sure, that's a fair point but doesn't change how I play. Especially since as I believe we have received information pointing to the opposite. If Sithrak is our God then we're screwed no matter what we do.

>But they were told by the disciples and there are historical records of thier existing.
Sure. I have no problems with the disciples existing and telling stories. Getting from that to the stories in the Bible being accurate to reality is an extreme stretch, especially given the nature of the claims.

>Especially since as I believe we have received information pointing to the opposite.
Why?

No, christians don't believe this. If you're not christian, don't speak on behalf of christians.

Atheists always use the argument, "If God is a loving God, why are their starving children in Africa?" By that logic, why is there anything bad in the world? Why isn't the world perfect in every way and suffering doesn't exist? If you want the world to be perfect, then free will can't exist. Any little amount of philosophical knowledge would answer most questions about religion and vice versa.

>Do Christians believe this or is this particularly retarded?
yes

>If you want the world to be perfect, then free will can't exist.
Then God is not all powerful.

Jesus was essentially the most radical antiestablishment communistic (little c not big C communist) anarchist there was. I could do with far less greed, government, and church doctrine in my life. More fellowship and less hardship. Excepting this of course it makes more sense if there's an afterlife. That was kinda the whole point he was getting at.

Fuck if I know how the church perverted this gospel of the poor into an intolerant hate filled, wealth loving, BS pushed by the Christian right. Jesus preached to the least amongst us, more at home amongst murderers, whores and theives.

freewill? aren't we supposedly "created in god's image"? are you saying god is an asshole too?

yuo say deez things as if they haven't happened before
>implyink that the bible was documenting the last of the struggles between good and ebil
>what is revelations
of course, I'm not the most versed cunt, but I hope that makes sense to ya.

I don't have faith in science moron. I can sit down and reproduce experiments myself. Not to mention you can run through equations that have multiple applications and prove basic laws correct. The ONLY reason why someone would assume the same level of accuracy and validity from faith as science is simply because that person is too ignorant to understand basic math.

He creates a system in which people have the personal freedom to choose a path of love and peace or not to. He isn't evil; people are just willingly stupid, if we're using this analogy.

>Nope.
Yep.

>That was kinda the whole point he was getting at.
Exactly, which is why a good portion of his morality is naive at best if you don't believe in an afterlife.

The world would be a terrible place if people actually followed his teachings.

Because I had an epiphany and accepted Christ. I can't explain it any better than that. Sure I have questions and doubts. That's part of it too, having doubts and questions is natural, in our nature, and nothing to be ashamed of. We are asked to believe and to spread the word. That's it. We don't become doubt free saints when Christ is accepted. It doesn't get easier, it gets harder.

Well put dude. I was going to lay into him myself but I think you pretty much said it all.

Who gave us free will?

>Yep
Nope

Your response doesn't address my point whatsoever. You need to work on your debating skills.
>people are just willingly stupid
Because of the system that God created.

>Because I had an epiphany
What sort of epiphany?
>I can't explain it any better than that
Then perhaps you should rethink your position.

That's another very common philosophical theory. Again, a little bit a research would answer this for you.

If God is all powerful, can he create a boulder that even he cannot lift? There's many possible solutions to this. The most common answer is: God cannot create a boulder that he cannot lift. The reasoning is that God must be more powerful than all things. Meaning he cannot put any limitations to himself since that would be shown as weakness. God in our definition is a being of power more so than a being of weakness.
The requirement of "God" is a man-made concept. To us, humans, we cannot say God is "all powerful" or "all-knowing" because we're literally creating a definition of "God".

You know all a religious epiphany is? The physical sensation of losing your grasp on reality m8. You may as well be saying "life was too hard for me to grasp so I just remembered how great shit was when I believed in Santa and the tooth fairy. I think I'll apply the logic we used to trick children into behaving properly to my everyday life. Because I'm as weak as I am ignorant."

You're making zero connection to anything at all.

If I'm not 'addressing' your response, it's because you're making no response worth commenting.

Yes, God created that system. Meanwhile, Communism, one of the most controlling totalitarian governments is responsible for the most deaths and individual repression in human history. Maybe....just maybe.... control doesn't necessarily mean good.

Elaborate please...

He preached tolerance, charity, humility, egalitarianism, engagement and self sacrifice.
It is the near opposite of our greedy, fame obsessed, jingoistic and tribal world. It has been perverted by the Protestant ethos into the monster we have now. Don't even get me started on the Catholic Church.

Millions of years of natural selection. Free Will is just nature's attempt to determine the best OS for creatures to survive on.

Indeed, infinitely many universes could be an infinite number of duplicates of the same universe for all we know.

this
>be god
>realise that one can't exist without the other
>create good and evil
>create heaven, earth, sin, and hell
>in essence, the universe is a yin-yang fuckfest where everything depends on the opposite to have meaning
>tfw there is an incredible amount of beauty in the method behind the madness that dictates the universe that is often overlooked
>tfw I'm just deepthinking and probably just jerking off to my own ideas
>mfw can't stop me
tbh as a Christian myself I don't think that's the case
I think bad shit happens because it's just part of life, everything from natural causes to to war
I like to think that God leaves us to our own devices and the elements for whatever the fuck reason
But I'm also a wrongthink christian as well

>That's another very common philosophical theory.
I know. I maintain that the concept of "all powerful" is self-contradictory, meaning any god with that attribute cannot logically exist. The common out, "maximally powerful" is also problematic in that then God is defined by logic rather than the other way around.

> To us, humans, we cannot say God is "all powerful" or "all-knowing" because we're literally creating a definition of "God".
If you do not create a definition of God, then you cannot say that God does or does not exist, since the term would not have meaning.

>tolerance, charity, humility, egalitarianism, engagement and self sacrifice.
Which, when taken to the extremes he suggested, do not allow for a properly functioning society.

A physical response at my guy level to a sermon I just happened to hear driving into work one early as morning. Something clicked. Almost like an out of body experience or a psychotic kinda deal.

I believe in science, I am a man of letters. But there are things outside of my grasp that I accept now in the framework of faith better than I can accept them in any other framework. I totally get agnostics and atheists. I was one before. The experience felt very outside of myself. I think is what it is doubts and all. If atheist framework works for you, good on you for it.

What about Jonah and the whale, besides surviving inside a whale being absurd?

itt: pic related

That feeling you mention is simply the physical sensation of losing your sanity.

Exactly why people should not have absolutes, but it is fine with people of faith. People of faith literally believe in what they choose to (and to that, add their own explanations, even very logical ones, to their faith), but Atheists cannot claim anything about religion. To theists "God" is their own definition, but to Atheists it doesn't mean anything. You can't try to explain an unknown concept in human understanding. Atheists should accept that, but theists do not, and that's the whole point of being a theist.