Degenerate atheism

Christians are more trustworthy than atheists, and here's why.

Christians are forbidden to lie, whereas atheists are not. This causes the atheist to lie considerably much more. If lying is beneficial to the atheist, and he believes he can get away with it, what's stopping him? Lying goes from being a sin to being a useful strategy.

Yes, christians lie too, but not as much. Restrictions work, otherwise the legal system wouldn't (or any other kind of rules/norms for that matter).

The average atheist is the person who would see no problem lying in a job interview, on his CV, to the girl he's flirting with, to his friends when he'd rather stay at home than going out, etc. They lie literally every day.

Atheism is inherently immoral and this just proves it.

Other urls found in this thread:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Militant_Atheists
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

My pastor used to lick my butt hole.

Reminder that communist atheists killed nearly 200,000,000 people in the 20th century alone.

Reminder that, unlike atheists claim, they did in fact kill Christians in the name of atheism
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_of_Militant_Atheists

Atheists are disgusting.

This shitty bait thread again

So what ? Christians love to be killed in the name of Jesus, it brings new saints names to the calendar.

It's an argument with a logical basis.

No, it's just a bunch of shitty buzzwords that are designed to appeal to emotion. You Christians are almost as bad as Liberals with this shit

>No, it's just a bunch of shitty buzzwords
Except it's not, is it? Do restrictions not work? Do people not avoid doing certain things strictly because it is illegal? Or because it's not the norm?

What's stopping an atheist from lying? It's like I said in the OP. If lying has a beneficial outcome for the atheist, he has no reason to not lie. Now YOU may appeal to emotion, but that's irrational, since reason supersedes emotion. In an atheistic worldview only the self matters.

>What's stopping an Atheist from lying?
Other people, there are severe consequences if anyone, regardless of religion is caught doing something like that, as well as empathy, something that everyone has and Christians is a Christian trait only

*Christians love to believe is a Christian trait only

>there are severe consequences if anyone, regardless of religion is caught doing something like that
Severe consequences for lying? It's not even illegal (unless it's in court or to the government, funnily enough). Are there severe consequences for an atheist if he lies about liking his mother's food? Lying on his CV? No.

By this logic, Islam has the highest moral ground, because under Sharia law there is 0% rape and no alcohol or drugs. Just because a religion says something in its tenets doesn't mean that it's followers actually follow those rules.

>Just because a religion says something in its tenets doesn't mean that it's followers actually follow those rules.
No, but it means they have a predisposition to. I never said that christians don't lie. I said they lie less than atheists.

Atheists are morally inclined not to lie.

You're just proving my point on my "You're just as bad a Liberals on this subject" statement.
Once again I have to mention something called Empathy, which everyone has.
Besides, Immorality is subjective, what if the Christian Bible you read today is false and the real states that stealing and other "immoral" acts can be done with no consequences?

>Atheists are morally inclined not to lie.
Only if the outcome is negative for the atheist (i.e. high likelihood of getting caught). Otherwise, no.

>They lie less than Atheists
Got a scientific chart to prove that claim buddy?

>Once again I have to mention something called Empathy, which everyone has.
I'll say it again. Reason supersedes emotion. Atheists proclaim to be highly logical and rational people, it then logically follows that they would value reason higher than emotion.

If an atheist can get away with lying, he should lie. It's in his best interest.

>Got a scientific chart to prove that claim buddy?
Logic on my side.

>huurrr durr muh 2000000000000 stalin victims in the holodomors and gualgsss damn atheist

If the Bible said lying could be justified, would that mean that Christians who lie are on a higher moral ground than Atheists who lie that don't believe in said Religion?

>Christian arguments

Is it really that difficult for Sup Forums to believe in the existence of non-degenerate atheist?

No.

>Atheist argument
>MUH SCIENCE

You do realize that scientism is comparable to religion, right?

>morality = fear of consequences

Some people have this thing called a conscience.

>that image
are you even trying OP?

now thats a real troll

Have you even been following the thread? Reason supersedes emotion.

Reminder that filthy jews need not post in this thread. You all descend from Satan, the father of lies. You are the most degenerate people on this planet.

I wouldn't say forbidden, plenty of Christians lie, I'm a Christian but please avoid the no true Scotsman.

I don't lie, but that's for different reasons. I don't lie because I fail to see where I need to, I'd rather tell the truth, face the consequences and have it known you can always rely on what I say being the truth. This is all about personal characters > other's opinions, which if anything is a modernist revival belief.

And your reasoning is that the only motivation people can have for not lying is punishment by am omnipotent being nobody can see or prove exists

As opposed to say, basic fucking empathy

I forbid myself to lie, cheat, steal, and cause pain to others (without reason).

I am a far stronger authority over my agency than God, in both the Christian and atheist context, on account of my free will ordained by the bible and by a rationalist worldview.

I still like Christianity though. I'm not tipping the fedora. You guys are okay, unless you are Calvinists, or 90% of protestant denominations.

>In an atheistic worldview only the self matters.

Not if the atheists assign worth to other people, like I have.

I am on the surface no different to you.

>I wouldn't say forbidden
Not forbidden? Do you even know what the ten commandments are? And you call yourself a christian?

> I'd rather tell the truth, face the consequences and have it known you can always rely on what I say being the truth.
You can achieve the same result by not getting caught in a lie. That's what I'm saying. If an atheist can get away with lying, he has no reason not to lie (inb4 appeal to emotion again, even though we've been through this).

Think your fedora is on too tight, because that's not what I said at all.

atheism is fucking trash.
why would anybody think the very foundation of reality is based on nothing whatsoever? it makes literally no sense. either there is something metaphysical or reality wouldn't even be a fucking thing in any way. no creation without a creator. it also matters little if this is a sentient being or not. we all know that with life this creator gave way to intelligence and progress.

you don't even need to be religious in order to understand such an obvious notion.

i don't normally take into heart on Sup Forums, nor i take into heart in troll threads, but this is a double negative so i'm ofended. the pox on you!

>He doesnt just live by christian values
>He worships a dead kike on a stick
>Current year

>I forbid myself to lie, cheat, steal, and cause pain to others (without reason).
Then you're irrational.

>Not if the atheists assign worth to other people, like I have.
Just because you assign arbitrary worth to other people it doesn't automatically give them worth. The only thing that matters in a darwinian world is yourself, your own well-being.

Did you know I look Jewish and have a German surname? I find this hilarious, I'm honest by principal and antisemites never believe me despite it. I'll tell them the absolute truth and they'll believe the opposite, serves them right for not being able to distinguish an Italian with a German name from an Ashkenazi Jew.

Muslims are especially precious
>y-you're not Jewish??
Literally happened to me at uni.

Pfft, there are so few people that have came to the same realisation I have that I wouldn't hold deceitfulness against them, and I doubt God would either.

BTW, lies always snowball and unless you have an eidetic memory, your lies are always going to conflict. Deceitfulness is the philosophy of someone who welcomes complexity, honesty is for people who only need and only want one story to follow: the right one.

Because, like, I don't give a fuck what you think of me, have some more truth and I hope it stings.

...

Again it boils down to you being such a shitty person that you need the threat of eternal damnation to scare you into acting decent. A normal person doesn't lie because they wouldn't want to be lied to and they have a functioning sense of empathy. Judging from your 'logic' you're simply a sociopath who assumes everyone else is a sociopath.

>He worships a dead kike on a stick
Newfag?

>Then you're irrational.
No, it's mutually beneficial and does good things for me. It is ultimately selfish, but then again, so is subservience to God. Not only that but it is in my instinct as a human to value other humans. It is natural, and I have had it from birth. In the bible, it is said that it was thirteen on our hearts, but as someone who believes in evolution, social creatures had an evolutionary advantage in this regard.

>Just because you assign arbitrary worth to other people it doesn't automatically give them worth.

Yes it does, because I am willing to sacrifice commodities such as time and love to keep them safe and in a spooky way, in my possession.

You are looking at this through a thick and very unhealthy lens that is unbecoming of a christian.

Sadly true

>Reminder that communist atheists killed nearly 200,000,000 people in the 20th century alone.

That's a good quality to have. Should be the amount of foreigners and leftists in Europe at the moment.

>Again it boils down to you being such a shitty person
Moral universalism is nonsensical with atheism.
>A normal person doesn't lie because they wouldn't want to be lied to and they have a functioning sense of empathy.
And normal people tend to be irrational. What's your point?

Apparently you're caught in a feedback loop. I'm out

>muh 200 billion

he is an attention whore. what took you so long?

>I'll tell them the absolute truth and they'll believe the opposite
Pathological liars often believe they are telling the truth when they are not.

>Pfft, there are so few people that have came to the same realisation I have that I wouldn't hold deceitfulness against them, and I doubt God would either.
The "realisation" you follow is not a rational approach to life in an atheistic worldview.
>BTW, lies always snowball
No they don't. You watch too much television since this is a cliché quote from plenty of movies and series.
>honesty is for people who only need and only want one story to follow: the right one.
Universal absolutism is nonsensical with atheism.

The legal system doesnt work, you statist motherfucker. It only privileges some to the disadvantage others.

See for example divorce laws. Filthy statist.

>I'm out
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

> thread

>Yessss I hate Christians too fellow chosen one. Yoshua is so boiling in excrement right now amirite? ;)

I trust delusional people who believe in fairytales

This is a verry good infograph, it's not complete but making it so would make it prohibitively long.

I'll steal it for now

It doesn't matter whether it happened or not. All that matters are the memes.

I'm not an atheist and you're so committed to it your rationality has clearly been compromised. I'm the same Christian that says science should take precedent before theology.

>No, it's mutually beneficial
No, that's precisely what it is not. If you refrain from lying (when it could benefit you) for the simple reason that "it's wrong", then it's not beneficial, is it?
>Not only that but it is in my instinct as a human to value other humans. It is natural, and I have had it from birth.
So? It's still irrational.
>Yes it does
No, it really doesn't.

see thisThe fact is that you are so full of shit. In the bible it says that morals are written on ours hearts, so your are making an unbiblical assumption. Even without God those morals should stick.

Even from an evolutionary standpoint, we have an explanation for why the scenario doesn't fucking happen.

Such a shitty starwman and slippery slope in one.

no no no, if you want to be an attention whore on Sup Forums, at the very least you need to proxy as israel.

You're making the assumption that religion is the only source of morality (a sense of right and wrong) but there has been many secular arguments for objective secular morality and even its superiority to religion.

Most secular morality wouldn't consider lying necessarily as immoral, however they would consider fraud as immoral which is deceiving others at their expense to benefit yourself.

Not all lying is fraudulent, so for example if you ask me my favourite colour and I lie that's not immoral by more secular standards but if you ask me if my car works correctly and I lie and say yes, and then sell you that car, that would be fraudulent and immoral.

Interestingly I don't see many religions out there that make this distinction between moral and immoral lying, which is just 1 example of why secular morality is superior.

Ultimately belief in Christianity and the morals is becoming less in western society as atheism is on the rise and it's specifically because of problems with religious morality, it's not objective and there's no reason to believe in one gods so called word, than another, when you can't even demonstrate the god exists to begin with.

> I'm the same Christian that says science should take precedent before theology.
You're starting to sound like a heretic. Science not absolute truth. Scientific data can be fabricated and tampered with. Are you a catholic? You believe in evolution like your pope?

>a man who might as well believe in fairies is calling others irrational for putting value in human lives and values

You're using fucking muslim tier logic by devaluing human capacity for good by their own volition. And it IS rational because we're a community-based species which thrives by teamwork and not fucking your tribe over for short term benefits.

>argues in the guise of reason
>believes in a zombie Jew that sacrificed himself to himself so he wouldn't have to murder humanity with no evidence to substantiate such belief.

Top kek, Mohammed

Selfdivinisation - best thing mortal creature can dream for

>No, it really doesn't.
I've explained why it does. Because I pay a price, being my time, patience, and so on, to preserve and aid the lives of others, I have assigned them real worth. That is literally how worth is determined. They are worth my patience, love, and time, because that is what I am willing to pay for them.
>No, that's precisely what it is not. If you refrain from lying (when it could benefit you) for the simple reason that "it's wrong", then it's not beneficial, is it?
This isn't true. Lying has a risk associated with it, and it can cause damage even if it is potentially beneficial. I lie just as much as a Christian, if not less, because God can forgive sins. I don't believe in a God, and I know that some sins won't be forgiven by people.

>So? It's still irrational.
It is of benefit. If we work together, and their is a loving and caring environment around me, it makes me feel good, and sets me up for success.

Stop being a moron. Some atheists, perhaps even most, are morally depraved. I however, probably live more biblically morally than you do, because the real world might not forgive my sins, and I need to keep that in mind.

>Even without God those morals should stick.

Which morals?

You don't even know which ones one should believe in do you?

>You're making the assumption that religion is the only source of morality (a sense of right and wrong) but there has been many secular arguments for objective secular morality and even its superiority to religion.
I'll say it again. Atheism is incompatible with moral universalism, and moral relativism is nonsensical.

>Most secular morality wouldn't consider lying necessarily as immoral, however they would consider fraud as immoral which is deceiving others at their expense to benefit yourself.
See previous response.
>
Not all lying is fraudulent, so for example if you ask me my favourite colour and I lie that's not immoral
You're just proving my point.
>Interestingly I don't see many religions out there that make this distinction between moral and immoral lying, which is just 1 example of why secular morality is superior.
That's because all lies are immoral.
>
Ultimately belief in Christianity and the morals is becoming less in western society as atheism is on the rise
And that's one of the many reasons why western civilization is turning to shit.

Stop posting anytime Ahrckmed

>why would anybody think the very foundation of reality is based on nothing whatsoever? it makes literally no sense.

"Well, i believe in a desert cult myth of spontaneous creation because it's written in this book, see!?"

t. Christards

>And it IS rational because we're a community-based species which thrives by teamwork and not fucking your tribe over for short term benefits.
Yes, you stupid sand-nigger, and by lying in this "community-based" society (if it's beneficial to you) is the rational approach.

>it also matters little if this is a sentient being or not.

There is scientific proof for intellegent design. They could be right and we time travel to create ourselves, but the solar system has too many geometric properties to be anything other than a mathmatic message in our system.
Just watch the moon perfectly eclipse the sun. That's where it starts.
The ancients knew this and had advanced math.
Read
Who Built the Moon?
Christopher Knight

Thinking of this again.

My best friend isn't honest (but isn't deceitful, making him a bad liar) and I'm highly intelligent, I call him out on it all the time. If I were judgemental, I'd hold it against him.

Smart people know when you're lying. You think your opaque, but you're not. You're obvious. Liars are obvious as fuck, they're so obvious it's some of the reason I'm an honest person.

No, science isn't absolute truth but it (contemporary science) is the best representation we have and faith is only necessary for the gaps, I guess as a placeholder

I'm Trinitarian, but not authoritarian. I'll be married in a Catholic church, but I'm only as Catholic as my rationality allows.

Yes I believe in evolution, in fact I believe it is the will of God as God's own mind itself. Kind of complicated, but I feel the laws of the universe are a form of logic or natural programming that may very well constitute the mind of God.

Yes, I'm a Gnostic theist.

No, the pope is an authoritarian, cosmopolitan, crypto Marxist cuck. I'll teach my children my way, he can teach his his way.

The mutually beneficial tenets of liberty. Plus whatever social instinct tells us to do. Anything else and we would damage the delicate framwork of our society.

It is rationalized by it's merits as a system that works, which is why Christian nations that adopted it, as it was part of their religion, prospered.

The morals of the new testimate are largely the most reasonable for a society that considers everyone deserving of equal opportunity.

Not only are these systems evolutionary explained and effective, but they are also written on our hearts, or so you would believe if you were a Christian.

So it should be no surprise to you that and atheist who isn't a faggot, living in a christian society can be moral, even exceptionally so.

If you have any questions please ask. If I'm wrong I would love to know. I don't have any personal attachments to my ideas, because clinging to them would make me liable to being wrong, and it feels good to be right.

>Lying has a risk associated with it, and it can cause damage even if it is potentially beneficial.
That's where probability kicks in. If the probability is higher that you won't get caught, and the positive outcome is better than the negative outcome, then you should lie. That's the rational approach.
>because God can forgive sins.
This fucking meme, lmao. Repentence means you regret your immoral actions. It means you'll try your hardest to refrain from committing the same sin in the future. What does this mean then? That you'll try your hardest not to lie again.
>Stop being a moron. Some atheists, perhaps even most, are morally depraved. I however, probably live more biblically morally than you do, because the real world might not forgive my sins, and I need to keep that in mind.
Muh anecdotes. I am talking about the general population here. Stop being a brainwashed retard.

>stuff circles around other stuff therefore intelligent design

Really?

Top kek are you even trying Mohammed?

I'm theistic and incredibly moral. I've never stolen, I've never cheated on a woman, I've never lied for material gain, I've never attacked another person. I don't do this because of some karmic retribution, I simply do it because it's important to me to be a good person and have a positive impact on my environment.

Let's see some of this "proof."

>inb4 wacko links to Christian conspiracy site are posted.

>being a total fucking dickbag and lying is rational

If you're a complete fucking sociopath that doesn't give a fuck about the future of the community and you're only seeking immediate gratification, then yes. But if you're not a narrow minded prick and look ahead you'll realize you're basically fucking yourself as well. Lying, if caught, gets you ostracized from the community which is basically genetic suicide. If not, it fucks over the tribe for your own benefit which can lead to its demise which leaves you without a community to protect you when the wolves come. How very "Christian" of you to think like a sociopath.

>I'll say it again. Atheism is incompatible with moral universalism, and moral relativism is nonsensical.

Can you explain why? If you've already posted why just link me? Because this needs to be backed up with reason and evidence.

>That's because all lies are immoral.
Based on what reasoning?

>Ultimately belief in Christianity and the morals is becoming less in western society as atheism is on the rise And that's one of the many reasons why western civilization is turning to shit.
Belief in religious dogma and religious morals are on the decline because many of them don't make sense or cannot be reasoned from first principles, they have to be accepted as fiat from whatever god the religion holds as an authority. The problem is that people are starting to demand reasonable degrees of evidence for the existence of that authority and theists have failed to provide it.

Just the simple fact that there's many purported gods around the world and many of them fundamentally disagree on issues of morality, and they all claim to be true and accurate leads to paradoxical morality, it means that one thing we can be certain of is that not all religions can be correct, it's not logically coherent.

And when you increase your expectation for evidence that belief in any one particular god is true over any other god what you find is that all religions equally lack evidence.

FPBP

Or you can get a trip like me

Cómo va la venta de dólares de Del Caño?
Socialista y ateo hasta que se va a morir de hambre

>No, science isn't absolute truth but it (contemporary science) is the best representation we have and faith is only necessary for the gaps, I guess as a placeholder
Scientism, the post.
>I'm Trinitarian
Heresy.
>Yes I believe in evolution
Heresy.

Isn't the dead faggot you worship a Jew?

A norwegian should not be calling a swede "Mohammed". You're less white than us. Pic-related.

You mean what virtually all highly intelligent theists believe?

Heresy, maybe, but it's the religion of the new age. Science first, then whatever the fools have decided feels right.

>Lying, if caught, gets you ostracized from the community which is basically genetic suicide
Lmao. People lie every day, get caught every day, and it doesn't "ostracize" them from the community. Stop talking shit.

Trips can be filtered tough. staying anonymous is the way to go.
trips are for people who actually want to contribute (or everyone will filter them).

>The mutually beneficial tenets of liberty. Plus whatever social instinct tells us to do. Anything else and we would damage the delicate framwork of our society.

Define damage to society, then tell me why your definition of damage is morally wrong

>It is rationalized by it's merits as a system that works, which is why Christian nations that adopted it, as it was part of their religion, prospered.

Define "works"

>The morals of the new testimate are largely the most reasonable for a society that considers everyone deserving of equal opportunity.

Why is equal opportunity good? If it's because "it works", see the two replies right above

>Not only are these systems evolutionary explained and effective, but they are also written on our hearts, or so you would believe if you were a Christian.

That's just a description of facts, not an explanation for "why" they should remain in place and unchanged

>So it should be no surprise to you that and atheist who isn't a faggot, living in a christian society can be moral, even exceptionally so.

Define "being moral", give examples, then tell me why they are moral. If it's because they "work" etc., see the first two replies

>Can you explain why? Because this needs to be backed up with reason and evidence.
This was explained why over 2000 years ago. Get with the times you uneducated atheist.

>Based on what reasoning?
Based on the moral absolutism I subscribe to (i.e. the Bible).

>Just the simple fact that there's many purported gods around the world and many of them fundamentally disagree on issues of morality, and they all claim to be true and accurate leads to paradoxical morality
Just the fact that there's many pruported scientific facts around the world and many of them fundamentally disagree, and they all claim to be true and accurate leads to paradoxical science.

How am I a brainwashed retard? You've got nothing on me, faggot.

>That's where probability kicks in.
Just like any Christian, I will lie if it is in my interests without being against someone else's best interests. It is a defense mechanism. If the black panthers kicked down my door, I can tell you that I wouldn't show them that I browsed Sup Forums just for "muh morality".

Playing nice doesn't win against people who play dirty. That's why the second amendment is necessary, the government and criminals aren't moralist pacifists.

>I was talking about the general population
Maybe mention that. Don't lump me in to it when there is nothing at all inconsistent or problematic with my worldview, especially when I am respectful enough not you guys out on inconsequential rubbish.

I'd like to rest on the point that I believe an atheistic society can be entirely moral. There is nothing about believing in something as arbitrary as a deity that dictates morality. On the other hand, I will concede that Christianity does a better job and keeping social checks and balances than anything I can think of in most atheistic systems.

Sigh, read the thread before you post bullshit like this.

>Just watch the moon perfectly eclipse the sun
lol

>There is scientific proof for intellegent design.

Americans...

>Who Built the Moon?

>american education

That's because the prevailing belief is that not all lying is immoral. It might be a undesireable character trait in say someone you want to be close to or even intimate with. But there's nothing fundamentally immoral about lying.

If you want to claim there is then you have to demonstrate how you arrive at that conclusion, and if that reasoning is "there's a god and he says.." then you need to demonstrate existence of that god. This has been the single point of failure for all religion everywhere, it's just not a respectable belief anymore in modern society.