Jazz isn't its own genre

It's literally post classical. It's a sub genre

It's like trying to argue that grime isn't rap music

In b4 this is racist

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youtube.com/watch?v=AzbdBk6XQ6Y
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(u) tried

All music have classical influence

who's that guy

>implying everything isn't a rip off of Seikilos
t. pleb

its op

Of course but jazz is a straight up sub genre of classical music but gets touted as its own entirely seperate thing

Genres are a purely arbitrary distinction bourne from the human need to categorize. There's no objective classification for any piece of music.

Who cares

Drugs are bad, dude.

Me I'm a racist and wanna take as many black accomplishments away from the black community as I can

This is the first of many

Does it really matter though?

Yes, I want proper ownership

I want niggers to recognize they culturally appropriated my people

I want them to kiss chopins feet. The man who laid the foundation, the blue print

I want them to know

I think it's because, there's like a LOT of jazz.

Idk it's like metal, if we still just thought of it as a sub-genre of rock it would eventually get out of hand because it also has its own sub-genres

>grime isn't rap music
that's true

Always good to have a healthy outlook on music.

Well buddy now ur just retarded

This

Post punk isn't punk

Trap isn't rap

Metal isn't rock

Day it again primate nigga see what happens, weak botch

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deejay_(Jamaican)
Emceeing was there way before rap and it developed in GB separately from what was happening in the USA at that time.
I'm not saying modern grime is not influeneced by hip-hop, hip-hop is not the reason why grime is there.

Oi dummy ting. Shut the fuck up

lmao do you even know what separates jazz from classical other than their cultural origins/separations? If you did, you would know that your post is fucking stupid

Hip-hop's rapping/mcing was developed because people were hyping up the crowd during the parties by shouting some shit on beat
While grime mcing is a whole different thing, just read the wiki article I posted
It was a Jamaican thing, and people who are of the Jamaican descent influenced the mcing in GB which set the tone for grime.
It was there in the 90's and it doesn't sound like rapping at all. youtube.com/watch?v=AzbdBk6XQ6Y
>inb4 they are just rapping on the beat that's why it's hip-hop

Slight chord extension and even then literally every chord that was used in jazz was used in classical

They were just used in a different way

I'm Russian my man

I read it and you appear to be right.

Cringe

>I'm 14 so I cringe at everything
>can't provide any info or argue so just "cringe" at it
>probably american
Good

Oi batty boy man ting. Stop cultural ppropruatung us ya absolute plum m8

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Frederick chopin was writing "jazz" songs 100s of years before "jazz" even existed

youtube.com/watch?v=_hyAOYMUVDs
youtube.com/watch?v=ef-4Bv5Ng0w

Jazz being its own seperate genre is a completely redundant statement and people who think "jazz chords" exist are musically illiterate

You're a bloody plum bad ting absolute melon bruv

>Slight chord extension

bruh are you even a pianist

In what way are they more jazzy than chopins other pieces. Actual question desu my senpai.

OP's picture triggers me so hard. >:|

You obviously arent

The difference between a "jazz chord" and a "normal chord" is literally a single extra note

And even with that difference in mind classical was filled with "jazz chords" those two chopin songs are comprised entirely of "jazz" chords

The difference between a jazz song and classical song is jazz musicians used extended notes for every chord where as
classical music used them less so

People who no nothing literally think jazz created their own set of new chords but every chord that was used in jazz was used in classical 100s of years before hand

so you define genres by what chords are played? that's weird man

Also there is absolutely no such thing as a "jazz chord"

There's jazz chord progressions, but no such thing as a "jazz chord"

Nigga do u really think that anyone is arguing that jazz musicians wished new chords into existence. Anyone that thinks that not all chords and pretty much all possible combinations of chords have been used at least once before is unequivocally retarded.

Now.

What I wanna know is how jazz is a sub-genre of classical music any more than hip-hop is rooted in tribal chanting.

this guys videos show up on youtube for me and many have zero views. i cant watch them but i feel like id be missing something if i unsubbed

Jazz music is literally post classical. This is an objective fact. Jazz music is just classical music with a slight deviance of cadence and dissonance

No different from post punk being a slight cadence and dissonance deviation from traditional punk music or trap music being a slight rhytmic deviation from traditional rap music

And you're wrong plenty of retards think jazz chords are a real thing. Even you probably thought that until I folded you up

Notated = Classical.
Improvised (among many other characteristics) = Jazz.

Classical isn't a genre.

Nice b8 though.

>classical isn't a genre

This is so fucking racist man wtf not okay

It's only a genre if you're a braindead plebeian who thinks of movie soundtracks when he hears the term "classical." Classical Period is a genre, Romanticism is a genre, Baroque Music is a genre, "classical music" is not.

So does this mean that rock isn't a real genre either? Invasion rock and glam rock aren't rock music? If you wanna really nit pick I guess you could say that

But for what practical purpose? Keep nit picking my dude

can't argue with that

Thanks bruv

>sub genres aren't genres

so if we agree that jazz is a sub genre of classical what does that mean exactly? what use is it?

>Always good to have a healthy outlook on music.

I'm reclaiming it from black people who appropriated our culture and remarketted and redistributed it as their own creation

This comes from a place of pure and utter hatred and contempt and no black accomplishment is safe. I want the world to know black people have no contributions, none what so ever

Blues is up next because blues is just a straight copy of Irish folk music. Irish folk musicians literally taught slave niggers how to play the guitar

We killing all nigger accomplishments tonight

>no black accomplishment is safe.

I wouldn't say many black people are worried.

Does the fact that niggers probably invented music in the first place not mean classical music is an appropriation of black culture? Same with everything really since all humanity are descended from niggers at some stage we must have appropriated everything from them.

Wow these are really beautiful songs

Also to add to this, Irish people are just white niggers.

>black people invented music

WE

I'm not black. I don't even know any black people.

They're our potato niggers

WUZ

Always good to have a healthy outlook on music.

Always good to have a healthy outlook on music.

nice bait

This whole thread is bait.

that's the difference, he wrote it. The interaction with a band on stage with improvised melodies is one key feature of Jazz. Jazz is like classical music evading the responsibility to commit to something

>classical doesn't incorporate improv

Kill me

to a much, much lesser extent. from the romantic era most solists played written cadenzas anyway. you can't argue with the few world class ones.

respectable

Not an argument.

That face is really ugly.

lol you are completely clueless...

>Throughout the eras of the Western art music tradition, including the Medieval, Renaissance, Baroque, Classical, and Romantic periods, improvisation was a valued skill. J.S. Bach, Handel, Mozart, Beethoven, Chopin, Liszt, and many other famous composers and musicians were known especially for their improvisational skills.

Classical musicians created improv. Guys like Bach and wagner were improvising whole 9 minutes pieces from the earliest points in their career. Chopin wrote no.20 In C#sharp minor when he was 17 years old completely off the book the day his sister died

Please never speak to me again

Understandable, friend... Understandable

the pinnacle of music was still the written one. Mendelssohn, Schubert and Beethoven, from the top of my head, said that improvising publicly was 'senseless' and did it only when being forced to do so.
I'm aware of the fact that some improvising took place throughout history, but it was always considered a lesser form of music

I mean if you really want you can take a single quote from a single composer and use it to frame your narrative. But the reality is improvisation was a huge part of western traditional music from its earliest points dating back to the 9th century all the way through to the 21st century. This is an objective documented and undeniable fact

Blues harmony is what separates jazz from classical

you know there's a difference between music as art and music as part of the people's culture? there has never been an academic approach to improvised music until Jazz came about

>So does this mean that rock isn't a real genre either?

Yes

that's at least a big feature, you're right

Completely wrong, again. There is treatises dating back to the 9th century dealing with improvisation both Mozart and Beethoven left the sonatas which they published, and written out cadenzas documenting how they improvised. Infact it wasn't until the 15th century that theorists even began making a hard distinction between improv music and written. Every piece of musical theory before that (and after) delt with improv as a core component of western music

You are completely and utterly retarded and I never wanna speak to you again

please stop using the Discovery Channel as sauce for your bullshit

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jfc

There is no such thing as blues harmony. Every chord had been used 1000s of time prior to the invention of blues music no single genre can claim owner ownership over a harmony in the western system

Blues harmonic progressions exist but to say they had a more profound impact on jazz music than classical music is just not realistic at all and shows you have very little knowledge of music

Lastly blues harmonic progressions have heavy roots in Irish folk music and polish traditional music. both of which are direct descendants of western traditional music

Holy shit dude why are you doing this. I know niggera are annoying but just Le them have this one thing.... it's the one time they beat us

Niggers on suicide watch. All their genres gone

>black people are capable of making the best form of classical music
No matter how you phrase it, it happened.

Is it just me or is this the weirdest fucking thread rn?

ITT: white Americans trying to feel relevant to world culture

>jazz
>good

>this entire thread
You people are honest to god stupid as shit
>it it got duh similarities
Mother of fuck you people are stupid. Like fucking braindead

Are you too fucking stupid to then divide that from what Jazz was doing? All music produces sound, therefore It's all the same, going by your logic

There's a difference between having small similarities and sharing every single quantifiable element apart from a heavier usage of chord extensions, then attempting to tote a sub genre as it's own seperate influential sub culture and piece of African American history

The cold hard truth is jazz music is post classical music, Frederick Chopin wrote proto jazz 200 years before jazz and jazz isn't even close to being the influential genre white guilt cuckolds who have no idea about their own peoples history make it out to be

Jazz is rooted in the blues, are you actually fucking retarded?

...

>it uses theory extensively
>haha that means It's classical xD
Why type out all of that stupid shit if that's what you're trying to say

Jazz is a synthesis of African American folk music (blues) and classical music.

this thread is so obviously bait and if it's actually someone being retarded stop giving this person attention

Not in a harmony based sense. Blues harmonic progressions are very "normal" compared to even classical music. You'll find more complex chords in even your average folk song than blues. There is definite rhythmic blues influence in jazz but that's not what the man stated

You obviously didn't understand my post

I'm sorry if my iq is too high for you. I forgot I'm arguing with people who have a clear 30 point lower average iq than me on average

Yes, even in a harmonic sense, you just have really, really shirty ears. Blues progressions are also used in jazz. Retard(s) fuck off before I put you back in your cage

-292929020202/10
Exceptionally weak