Well, is it a right?

Well, is it a right?

Its a right as much as an internet connection is

Rights don't exist. But if they did, yes you would have to say that health care and good health were absolutely human rights.

Literally how does an internet connection (a luxury) compare to the well-being of a person's own body?

No if they can't afford it.

Fucking socialist scum

>healthcare is a right
>rich people have to pay for both their' sand other people's

It is an entitlement. I recommend reading about positive and negative rights.

No. Life is a right.

You do not have a right to someone else's labor.

Something being a right doesn't mean that you don't have to pay for it.
Doctors have to be paid after all

>Enslaving doctors is a human right
Ayy!

Wealth is a human right

Positive and Negative rights.

The former endows freedoms to do by simply existing, the latter requires taking away the freedom of others.

In this case the right to life as taxes are extracted from your wealth and income which is the direct consequence of your life, body and its labour.


You have the right to life, not the right to make someone else take care of it.

Objectively not a right. He's been criticized for saying it because it is an indefensible lie.

Then maybe fat people should stop stuffing themselves with so much shit that they need five bypasses in ten years.

You have a right to health care the same way you have a right to own a gun.
But you have to pay for both the gun and the aspirin.

>your wealth

its you're*

geez summer came early this year

Yeah, like all the enslaved doctors in other countries with sane healthcare

Sex is a right. Not just in the sense that you should be allowed to pursue it, but that you should be supplied with it no matter who you are.

No it's not

>Rich people can afford to do that

I agree with him on this point

What would happen if all the doctors decided to quit? Who would fulfill the rights of the people to healthcare?

rights generally involve you telling other people to fuck off.

healthcare involves other people doing work for you. that's the opposite of telling someone to fuck off.

so no, healthcare is not a right.

Then the salary of a doctor would increase, and then more people would want to become a doctor.

Not when active, healthy people are paying for some fatass to get his stomach shrunk.

Whilst I don't think it should be abolished, the NHS has many, many flaws when it comes to who deserves treatment and who should pay for it

Sure, just like guns are. The state isn't gonna give it to you for free. There is nothing hindering you from healthcare aside from yourself.

Too bad he's arguing the American Dream be taken away for it.

>Literally how does an internet connection (a luxury) compare to the well-being of a person's own body?

for one, neither is mentioned in the fucking constitution

>implying supply and demand still apply under socialism

Yep. Spain has free healthcare and last time I checked demand and supply still aplied, cause we are capitalists

I agree that's probably what would happen, but that's not the point I was making. My point is that if you take the statement "healthcare is right" to its logical conclusion, you would have to force doctors to practice medicine, even if they didn't want to. So, the "right" to healthcare trumps the right against involuntary servitude. I cannot agree with this.

Nothing is a "right". Healthcare for the poor is a generous gift from the rich. All these commies talk like they can create money out of thin air.

colleges and other frivolities should not be public, but primary care should be a right for everybody. how can allow someone to die from a easy to cure disease just because he didn't had enough money

>free healthcare
>capitalist

pick one

Define "right."
Define "health care."

>Supply and Demand
Do the doctors or the government call the shots on the prices?
If it's the government, then you're a retard.

If it's the doctors, then the doctors are still extracting taxes from the public through the government to whatever tone they want, because they have control of a literal monopoly.

Where's the competition?

everybody pay taxes ameridumb, and rich people most of the time don't

>how can you let poor people die

easy. don't treat them. nature does the rest.

You do not have a right to anything for free. He is wrong, as always.

In third world countries, it absolutely isn't a right. Bernie should focus on making America a proper first world country before he promises pipe dreams.

That's not really true, why do you have to force doctors to do anything? That's like saying that you are forcing people to become cops

>spaniards trying to show off their country's situation
HHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAH

bernie can believe health care is a right
bernie supporters can all believe health care is a right

but the people who control health care do not believe it is a right
thus health care is effectively "not a right"

welcome to the real world liberals!

cops get paid very little relative to importance/hazards of job

this

The government just copies the prices that private hospitals have, while trying to have a decent service.

That is because law enforcement is not a right, it is a duty of the state. You can argue that it is the duty of the state to provide some level of healthcare in service of keeping its citizenry alive and well, but claiming it is a right is a very different thing.

Free at the point of entry healthcare should only be a right to those who need the treatment through no fault of their own.

If you smoke 20 a day and develop a form of cancer then you should pay every fucking penny of the treatment. You stupid fuck.

life is a privilege. but it's not your right to force People to pay for your healthcare and shit.

Is somebody forcing them to become cops or what?

Ever since LBJ, Democrats have been the party of guilt projection and pipe dreams.

The promises were never meant to succeed. They were meant to fail so the next Democrat can follow up with more promises. This is what government looks like when the public has been beaten into dependence and forced to accept a corrupt school system where their kids get bullshit shoveled into their mouths each day like it's their job.

currently if you are suffering from a life threatening injury or giving birth for profit hospitals cannot turn you away even if you do not have insurance

it been like this since forever in america pretty much. obama care didnt force it and bernie must not know about it

>everybody pay taxes ameridumb, and rich people most of the time don't
this meme needs to end

Daily reminder smokers contribute 2x their cost to the NHS in added taxes.

I love how the left say that race, borders and gender are all social constructs (as if that's even an argument) yet they label things as "rights" willy nilly.

socialist health care works

America is literally a first world country... First world refers to the American/Western alliance during the cold war, 2nd world refers to the USSR, China, and the Eastern Bloc, and 3rd world are the countries too pathetic to be allied with either (Africa mostly)

Fuck no. Bernie doesn't understand the simplest aspects of economics.
There are not enough health care professionals to give everyone unlimited free health care. There are only so many trained doctors, nurses, and staff.
The supply of Practitioners is low, but the demand is high. The value of Practitioners is correspondingly higher. If Bernie implements universal free healthcare, we will have medical bread lines.

Just playing devil's advocate here.

What if you are paying for it?

Also what about the state that provides you with water and electricity? Are those rights?

Of course it is, you pack of third-world faggots.

if you really think that rich people don't evade taxes or create bank accounts on fiscal paradise to put all their corruption money, than you are a joo asslicker.

you already get emergency healthcare regardless of your ability to pay.

In America, electricity and gas are usually run by government contracted monopolies such as Commonwealth Edison and Nicor

Do we agree that life is a right?

>I'm paying for it
>the government gives it to me

Only one allowed.

Corrupt bureaucrats always hide behind a wall of false virtue from "providing" things right out of the public's pockets.

Doesn't matter. If you decide to do something that is unhealthy then you should pay all costs that come with it. People in the UK are happy to smoke, binge drink and eat until they're fat because they know that if they need medical care it will be free.

If you want to improve society and the population you do it by imposing financial risks on their bad decisions.

This.

>he's never taken a $1000 ambulance trip

Rich people pay more taxes than anyone and this colossal faggot want them to pay more. Wouldn't work anyways, as they would just move or hide their assets, fucking over our almost non existant middle class.

As long as you're willing to work for it, or have your family pay for it, or if you plan ahead and buy insurance.

Oh and as low nag as you don't try to steal my money to pay for your healthcare.

But then, after that, yes, you have a right to buy the best healthcare you can afford.

"Free health care" in US is a perfect example of what happens when the government rains free shit onto 'poor' people's heads.

Welfare mammys take their orclets to the ER for a common cold. Why? Because it's free!

Meanwhile, if you have a job then going to the ER because you got hit by a drunk driver will cost you tens of thousands. Why? Because LaQueesha's neglected kids being treated was free!

Taxes do not affect the "American dream", they existed at the inception of your nation, and your constitution discusses the government's ability to tax, to pay the nations debts, and for it's defense, and to provide for the general welfare of the people. But don't take my word for it, try reading it yourself. It's easy, you basically just do what you're doing right now, but to a different set of words.

Oh, and also, defacto universal healthcare because a right when Ronald Reagan signed off on the The Emergency Medical Treatment and Labor Act in 1986, which compels er's to treat anybody in need, regardless of their ability to pay.

You lazy little children need to remotely aquatint yourselves with basic aspects of the topics that you spew soundbytes about.

Rights confer duties.

My right to life confers a duty on others not to murder me, for example.

I don't understand where this meme of positive and negative rights comes from. Nobody talks about it in academia because it's fucking dumb. All rights confer duties on others because if you have a right others must respect that right, which is an infringement on their freedom to act. I am free to murder you, but if you have a right to life my freedom to do that is curtailed.

Rights confer duties. That's what makes them rights instead of wants. I can want you to not murder me but that doesn't mean you have to not murder me. Only when I have a right to life (or not be murdered at least) do you have a duty not to murder me.

Sup Forums needs to stop trying to understand philosophy desu.

Then it's not a fucking right you moron

>loose his job
>w-who will help me now
never forget 29 crisis and how liberalism fucked your ass

>My country has FREE healthcare
>It's so shit you're better off paying a private health company

You end rights by two ways:
crush them by government violence
or
drown them in government generosity.
Making everything a right is a way of killing the Constitution.

they dont evade tax they avoid them
big legal difference

On America they get it anyway so why does Bernie care? Its causing hospitals to hire less people and less qualified but will he say that? No just wants to give people muh bennies

fucking LEAF!

This is where liberalism's true face is exposed.

They confer upon others a duty to toil. Not for the benefit of themselves, nor for the benefit of everyone, but for the benefit of select persons whom the liberals choose to protect and empower.

It's a philosophy of theft and prejudice.

It's not? I have a right to a gun. No one will buy me a gun, but I have the right to buy one and own one if I can afford it.

This. Health care is available to you. It's not your right to have someone else pay for your shit.

The right to self defense and self preservation is legitimate. The right to make other people aid you in self preservation is not. If you give up your right to self preservation to be a part of a state, that does not imply that what you get in return, the state's pledge to protect your life, is a right as well. It's a duty of the state.

No life is a privilege. So is creating life. For too many years we've let the lesser races go on populating themselves unchecked.

But why the fuck goverment exist, if the citizens should do all the shit on their own?

>be russki
>sudennly appendicitis
>dying from pain
>go to hospital
>have surgery
>free medicines and food for one week
>your bill: 0$

Thank you based goverment.

Classical liberals included.

All rights confer duties, even the right to bear arms confers a duty on people to suffer the consequences of Cletus bearing his arms.

Your rights are a tyranny on others. That's how rights work.

Freedom is the enemy of civilisation. Go read about the state of nature.

I'm sure it was a lovely hospital and your Dr was extremely competent.

I agree with this.

Take healthcare away for fatties.

But it's a completely different matter. A gun is somewhat "dangerous" and has certain implications. Or would you say that you have the right to buy pizzas? Cause if the answer is yes we may not be on the same page

Doctors have rights too, and they should be able to charge for services rendered.

According to who?
What gives the poor the right to demand anything from the rich?

You seem to know very little about how healthcare in our country works.

Yes doctors are forced to work for people even when public healthcare does not cover the costs.

Japan has nationalized healthcare and everyone is covered, and in my experience it is good but not perfect.
But it is not a "right" in the sense of being an inalienable human right.

>everybody pay taxes

Only 47% of American pay any income tax at all.

Yes :^)
I was extremly surprised, my doctor was super polite and have sense of humor.
But you won't belive me, cuz "hurr durr, stupid russia is shit, tv told me so"

Bernie is a joke and we don't need free stuff otherwise there'll be more military cuts.
Hilary is a lying cheating cunt trying to escape the past and deny wrongdoing.

Trump is all right.

Honestly this whole election is a joke. The adults act like children nor do they planned ahead of time. Humanities studies, planned parenthood, any government funding that isn't necessary, shouldn't exist.

Sure. That doesn't for even a second mean that someone must provvide it for you though. I feel as though the confusion between rights and entitlements is a major point that needs addressing.

It's a stupid statement.
Something is a right only if the government enforces it. If we all agree that health care is a basic human right it means nothing. It means absolutely nothing. Only when you tax people and use that money to give everyone health care then it's a right.

To figure out whether or not health care is a human right you need to figure out whether or not the government is going to pay for your healthcare.

It's all about the framing. Instead of addressing the criticism he has recieved he is framing the issue as if all he's doing is defending a basic human right, and everyone hates him because he dared to say people deserve health care. It's the same tactic feminists use. Feminists do a lot of crazy shit, and when they get criticized they say ''huh, why do people hate us? We're just saying that women should be treated as well as men''. It's a dirty tactic. Pure mental gymnastics and language rape.

>positive rights

Tell me, why aren't you people so adamant at cutting all funding for roads, public schools, the military, a wall, police and fire protection, etc.?

Those are positive rights as much as universal health care. If you don't think health care should be a right because it's a positive right, then there's a very long list of government services you should be against. By your logic, a police officer is as much of a "slave" as a doctor under a universal health care system, especially when you consider police officers are forced to patrol black neighbourhoods which, in America, are far more trouble than they are worth. You could argue that inner city teachers are "slaves", again, according to this logic.

Even national defence is a positive right. The right to defend yourself and your property is a negative right. The right to a tax-funded, government-controlled military isn't.

Now, if you are in favour of cutting all those services, then there's nothing for me to argue about, since you're following a coherent, logical argument.