Now that the dust has settled, what's Sup Forums opinion on this space kino?

Now that the dust has settled, what's Sup Forums opinion on this space kino?

I really enjoyed it and though It was a good movie, but I'm unsure if I should like it or not and why. Any help?

It's mediocre, too much pandering to the nostalgia crowd. They should have created something new and fresh instead of New Hope 2.0.

The lead is extremely weak as a character and an actress, Especially when you have good actors around her (Isaac, Driver etc). Poe should have been the main character in my opinion.

6/10 at best

Solid 5/10

It's on pair with AoTC in shittyness

It's a great film and exactly what Star Wars needed to bring it back. People who say it's a "rehash" are generally unintelligent people who can't engage with a movie beyond the most superficial aspects.

Star Wars was N E V E R E V E R original anyways, it shows how culturally bankrupt our society is when people act like Star Wars was this completely unique stroke of genius when it was just a mish mash of the adventure serials Lucas liked as a kid and the Akira Kurosawa movies he watched in film school.

It's decent but nothing special. Maybe that Rogue One thing will be better.

b-b-b-but it copied ANH's plot and that's the only reason people like it
because that plot is so fuckin genius and was what made ANH great

not kino, just your average sjw wankfest.

The Good
-Return of Han and Chewie. I could tell that Lawrence Kasden wrote the bulk of the dialogue in the freighter sequence re-introducing Han and Chewbacca. This was the best part of the entire movie by far. It was playful and fun with smugglers and monsters, scum and villainy.

-Maz Kanata's castle. The scene started out great, a worthy successor to Mos Eisley cantina and Jabba's Palace. I don't recall a scene like this in the prequels with a bunch of aliens hanging out in a bar-type setting, but it's a highlight of Star Wars and while this is not quite on their level it's still good.

-Seeing the broken down AT-AT Rey called home.

The Bad
-Whiny Kylo Ren. Clearly he inherited his temper tantrums from his granddaddy. God it was stupid watching him slam his lightsaber down like an angry child with a baseball bat destroying things because he didn't get a cookie. And they did the scene not once, but twice. He is not an interesting villain. The setup for his character is poor (but I'll get to that later) and his motivation is preposterous. Why did he turn to the Dark Side? Unexplained. I'm guessing Luke told him about Anakin's fall and that's who the kid decided he wanted to emulate even though his living family (Uncle Luke, Mommy Leia, and Poppa Han) triumphed over Vader and the Emperor and thus you'd think they provide a better example, but hey, this trilogy apparently needed to copy the original by having a father-son, light/dark divide and it would have really killed them to create a new character for that to happen.

>cont

>not liking Brat Vader
opinion discarded

-Starkiller Base. I have a lot of gripes about this wretchedly inane plot point but I will put them all here under a single bullet. First, I get that if you're going to make a new Death Star it has to be more powerful than the original (of course there is always the question of why you need a new Death Star, but I digress…), but how does it make any sense that instead of blowing up planets it blows up entire solar systems? The whole point of these weapons, as explained by Tarkin, is to elicit fear to keep systems in line. Why is that any scarier if it can blow up several planets instead of one planet? It's killing you either way. Second, the Starkiller apparently uses a hyperspace weapon so it can destroy planets from across the galaxy, which should be idiotic enough, but when it is used to destroy the Republic capital world(s?) (and shouldn't that have been Coruscant?), Han et al. see the laser beam from whatever planet Maz's castle is located on. If the laser beam was travelling through hyperspace, wouldn't it not be visible in regular space? But more importantly, why in the name of the Force would they see a laser beam on the other side of the galaxy from the surface of a distant planet with their naked eyes? And why did they know what it was? Finally, as I mentioned above, the attack on Starkiller Base is really boring and just replicates exactly what we have seen in previous Star Wars films. Additionally, I would add that there never felt to me a sense of danger for our heroes during the battle and I thought the sequence was poorly edited together with no good balance between the dogfights above and Han and Chewie attempting to set the detonators below.

>cont a fucking again and again since 2000 only

It was good. It erased the shit that was the prequils and continued the next generation of star wars.

T. Some gen X cunt who grew up with this shit and takes it way too seriously.

-Rey's quick grasp of the Force. So despite having had no training and not even believing Jedi were real, Rey not only knows how to do a Jedi mind trick, but she can do it to a Stormtrooper ten feet away and not facing her? And she can fight and defeat a trained dark side acolyte in lightsaber combat (it has been argued to me that she clearly knew how to use that staff at the beginning, but I still don't buy that she can take on someone who is supposedly a powerful dark side user). Oh, and the little matter of her stealing the lightsaber in the snow from Ren really angered me. In Empire, Luke had had a little bit of Force training from Obi-Wan but when he attempted to free his lightsaber from the snowpack in the Wampa's cave, he did so with great difficulty, but here a character who has no knowledge of how to control the Force, easily swipes it and then keeps it from a powerful Force wielder. I don't buy it for a second. This leads me to my next point.

-I don't think JJ Abrams understands how the Force works. Mostly this pertains to Kylo Ren. Early on when Poe shoots at Ren, the latter holds the laser blast in the air for the remainder of the scene while he interrogates Poe. It's kind of neat until you realize that using the Force requires great concentration and Ren's focus switches to his prisoner almost immediately. My impression of the Force is that you're reaching out as if with an extra hand to move things or hold them, whatever the case may be, but you can't just hold it there forever because you're not creating a forcefield or something and using the Force is work; even Yoda has a little trouble lifting up that X-Wing and he sure doesn't hold it up for very long. When Darth Vader deflects laser bolts, he does just that, he doesn't hold the plasma in midair. Later when Ren holds Rey in the woods, I had a similar impression that he was simply doing more than the Force really allows. I don't buy this interpretation of the Force.

-Snoke. So wait, he's a hologram but still has to be giant? Why? Because they wanted to mimic the scene between Vader and Sidious from Empire? Or because he's over-compensating for something? My guess is that when we meet the real Snoke he will actually be tiny, like 3 inches tall or something. That would be sort of interesting, so it probably won't happen. I was also disappointed by his look. I had heard that he was going to be someone with interesting facial features, but he was basically a person with a scar, a tiny mouth, and no nose. You have all the CGI in the world at your disposal and that's the "interesting" character you devise? *yawn*

-BB-8. I known others were charmed by him, but count me among those who didn't like him at all. First of all that design makes no sense. If he's rolling around, how does he make sure the right hatch is facing where he needs it to be? Answer: he doesn't. Second, that name is awful. And third, hearing Oscar Isaac say things like "Hey BB, buddy, come here" made me sick.

-The death of Han Solo. I always knew this was going to happen, but one of my friends convinced me that maybe they'd go a different way because after all, if Disney wants to get people excited for this new series, killing off a beloved character at the end is probably not the way to do it. But they did. Of course the second he gave Chewie the detonator, you knew that was it for him. It was almost as if the writers knew the scene's conclusion wouldn't work if that didn't happen. I'm angry about this scene because Han goes out like a chump, killed by his own brat kid. Is having Han Solo for a dad really such a bad thing?

He has the fastest space ship in the galaxy and a dog that you can talk to! He's like the best dad ever! Not good enough for this little brat though! And Han's speech to try to get Ren back is so bad. I feel pretty confident this was Abrams writing for Solo, not Kasden. I cannot see Kasden having the fast-talking Solo say something as self-defeating as "Snoke is using you for your power and once he has what he wants he is going to crush you." How exactly is insulting both your son's intelligence and his strength going to convince him to give up the dark side? This was an infuriating scene. Finally, I did not feel that Chewbacca properly mourned Han's death. These two have been inseparable for decades so I would have expected Chewie to be despondent late in the film, bu nope, he just flies away with Rey.

-"Bring our son home." Closely related to the last point is Leia's admonition to Han that if he sees their boy to bring him home. I'm sorry, but Kylo Ren is a war criminal and a murderer. It's not as if he dropped out of college to join a rock band. He has been killing people, lots of people. I know that Luke redeemed Darth Vader from the dark side so it's not as if this isn't a recurring theme, but Darth Vader also had to die to pay the price for the crimes he had committed. The idea that Han would bring Ben home to his mother and then go back to being a regular guy is so stupid as to be laughable if it wasn't ruining this once-proud franchise.

-The map. I get it, it's a MacGuffin, but shouldn't even a MacGuffin make sense? (Not in a JJ Abrams movie! See Star Trek and Star Trek Into Darkness.) So Luke went off into hiding, but he left a map? Why would he do that? And why did the Empire have part of the map? And if R2-D2 was so depressed that Luke had left that he couldn't get out of bed, why didn't he share the map he had with his pals? I understand that it wasn't complete, but I have to think that if they searched just that empty space, Leia probably could have used her Force magic to hone in on him.

-The final shot. Star Wars movies end with group shots of the surviving cast, not helicopter shots of Luke standing on a cliff like a moron.

You guys do know that they are going to kill Luke right? TFA was just a test to see how much of Luke they can get away with not showing. Turns out it's the entire movie. He will die in the next one just like Yoda without completing her training.

And they need a better fucking villain because being BTFO by a Sue Jedi in your very first meeting is disgraceful. Kylo was built up really well to begin with but by the end was just a pathetic weakling. I don't care he was injured. He had zero excuse losing that fight which was basically 1v1 even if he had a handicap.

He was far too subservient.

Han Solo's death needed to happen, but the way it was set up was just so blatant and groan inducing.

fuck star wars. a couple of them were good but not really worth the acclaim. and this version sucked. the characters felt shit, and the plot wasnt compelling.

im not a nerd who feels like the saga has been tainted cuz i never gave a shit about this sci fi trash to begin with but empire strikes back and episode 3 were certainly a fuck ton better than this shit.

-Luke Skywalker's Fate. Well, I get now why he wasn't in any trailers or on the poster. JJ Abrams took my favorite character in Star Wars and turned him into this movie's worst character, a giant pussy who fucked over the entire galaxy and then washed his hands of the affair. So basically as Han tells us, Luke was training Ben Solo and the kid turned to the Dark Side, so Luke blamed himself and went into exile. What JJ Abrams has done is turn Luke into an even more pathetic version of Obi-Wan. He has taken the greatest hero of the Rebel Alliance and turned him into a miserable failure. Except Obi-Wan at least tried to clean up his mistake before going into hiding to wait for the new hope who would restore balance. After Anakin's fall to the Dark, Obi-Wan and Yoda made a last-ditch effort to defeat Sidious and Vader. They failed, but like R. P. MacMurphy, at least they tried. Goddammit, at least they tried. The only Jedi left, Luke knowingly left the galaxy on its own to deal with a half-trained dark side user and the Snoke guy who had seduced him to the Dark Side. What a hero. This goes completely against the Luke Skywalker we met as a young man. Luke was someone who took responsibility and sought to help others. --

>I need Sup Forums to decide if this was good or not

Fucking plebeian way to distinguish quality

But for that it's worth TFA didn't do enough to differentiate itself from the other films. It relied waaaay too much on extant imagery and aping elements from the original Star Wars, like on a 1:1 plot point basis. Star Wars has never been an innovative series in terms of story-telling but I expected the plot to go a little more out there, at least have the balls to rip off other sources. Ripping off your own source material just feels lazy and oddly incestuous.

But it has one massive structural failing that instantly puts it behind the original trilogy even when casting aside the familiarity of it all: Rey is a terrible main character. She's actually a Mary-Sue, and I don't mean that in the meme definition of "girl character". I mean her entire arc and presence in the film is virtually indistinguishable from that usually undergone by an author self-insert in a piece of fan-fiction. It's not even the excelling at everything she does without trying so much as all the important, per-established characters in the film like Han and Leia instantly embracing her and making her their most trusted confidant despite meeting her like 3 hours ago. She just shows up out of nowhere and all of a sudden the entire Star Wars universe bends backwards to revolve around her. She's like pic related. Everything's about Rey, and whenever Rey's not on screen all the characters should be asking themselves "Where's Rey?" She's like a supermassive black hole and all the other people in the galaxy are positioned at her event horizon.

He goes back to "complete his training" now that he has fully embraced the dark side.
So he'll probably come back stronger.

--When Darth Vader captured his friends he went to save them even though he knew it was a trap because they'd been captured on account of him. When Vader and the Emperor learned that he was on Endor, he could have run but he faced down and distracted two Sith Lords rather than abandon his friends, turning the tide of the battle as the Imperial army, without its leadership, fell into disarray. Luke Skywalker is a heroic character who would not run and hide while leaving his friends to face powerful enemies who would undoubtedly cause great harm to millions of innocent people. It cheapens the entirety of the Original Trilogy to portray Luke as someone who failed in his mission to resurrect the Jedi Order, instead choosing to quit upon the first sign of trouble

In sum, this was very much a JJ Abrams movie, and that's about the worst thing I could say about any movie.

I would never have thought that the old Expanded Universe would prove to be so much better than the first sequel film. In all seriousness, right now I have no desire to watch another new Star Wars film theatrically. (He says, knowing full well that he will go see this piece of shit once more just to be sure.)

The more I've thought about this movie since watching it, the more I hate it.

1/5

agreed

>per-established characters in the film like Han and Leia instantly embracing her and making her their most trusted confidant despite meeting her like 3 hours ago.
They did rush through it but their relationship made sense, she was Han's replacement for his lost child, and Han her replacement for her parents.

She didn't really have any relationship with Leia other than both sharing the pain of Han's loss.

Why did Leia completely ignore Chewie but hug Rey once she learned Han died? That was bs

Because Rey looked more upset?

cuz parents often replace lost children in 3 hours

Leia knew Rey for 2 hours. She knew Chewie for 30 years

Which is why I said they rushed it.

maybe he smelled like shit that day

7/10

TFA is fucking SHIT!

What the fuck did i just watch? no seriously, what the fuck?

i dont know where to start with this monstrosity of a flick. if it wasn't for the obvious faces and lightsabers it would just be the usual high budget flick with the thinking that fancy effects and explosions will make a 'movie' good. fucking wrong.

i couldnt tell if it was at the start, beginning or end due to the lack of structure and plot - infact im still struggling to see what the plot was? the whole thing dragged out to see some old fuck standing on the cliffs - greeeaat.

what really fucking me off was how they mocked the dark side to be a laughing stock. that pathetic joke making the clone troopers run away when kylo was throwing a tantrum.
-kylo was meant to be the evil sith boss but actually got KILLED by a girl using a lightsaber for the FIRST FUCKING TIME. the fucking dindu put up a good fight, they both have zero fucking knowledge in using one, let alone the force in general. what the fuck?
how can anyone possible criticise the prequels with pieces of liberal shit like this one? there were no characters in TFA with any presence, or something that made you think 'wow i like this guy'. the prequels had mace windu, anakin, obi wan, darth vader, darth maul, etc. what did this one have? the characters were fucking dull as fuck, im actually angry as im typing this i just cant get over what i just watched and i need to vent it somewhere.

trust disney to fuck up this bad. i dont even need to mention (but i will anyway) the obvious racism with the dark side being all white, and the 'goodies' being a melting pot of spics, chinks, dindus, females etc. how can this racism even be allowed?

sadly ticket sales determine the success of a film, and so people will feel obligated to think this flick was good but in reality it was tediously boring, which lacked a plot, characters with any redeeming qualities, and made the dark side a joke.

There's so much wrong with the movie from just the writing.

>rey has no agency
She doesn't decide to do anything in this movie. She doesn't even choose to go on the adventure until she's halfway across the galaxy on another planet and even then, she gets kidnapped right away.
>it can't follow the hero's journey storyline
The oldest fucking story archetype and the hack JarJar Abraham can't get that right? The story is told so out of order it doesn't seem like a story but a highlight reel.
>it's tone is all over the place
We start with an homage to a ww2 beach landing to comdey with Poe to a firing squad to implied torture to action comdey in the first 15 minutes. And of course there's the problem of our heroes enjoying killing people, all of whom we are told are brainwashed child soldiers.
>the plot completely loses itself
we start with the map to Luke. We have a bunch of chase scenes with the droid with the map. We then sidetrack everything so we can go destroy another deathstar to the point where our main character has to be knocked unconscious and dragged there so she can be in the final action scene. Then the last 5 minutes we return to the Luke map.

A fucking hack. How does he still have a job?

>but I'm unsure if I should like it or not and why

You should feel bad for liking it. It's soulles cashgrab that offers nothing new.

The more I think about Star Wars 7, the more it pisses me off.

It undid literally everything accomplished in the originals.

> There is no longer balance to the force
> The empire has still not been defeated
> There is a new, even better death star so Luke and Lando accomplished nothing longterm
> Leia is not learning to be a Jedi
> Leia and Han are not together
> Han is back to being a somewhat sleazy smuggler
> Luke is still learning to be a Jedi
> The prophecy of the originals was apparently meaningless, because Anakin's redemption apparently accomplished nothing.
> It even undid little things like Luke losing his saber, which was somehow recovered from falling into an abyss

> There is no longer balance to the force
> The empire has still not been defeated
> There is a new, even better death star so Luke and Lando accomplished nothing longterm
> The prophecy of the originals was apparently meaningless, because Anakin's redemption apparently accomplished nothing.
Yes let's just continue with a happy peaceful world without conflicts, that would make an interesting movie

> Leia is not learning to be a Jedi
You seriously would want to watch Jedi Leia?
That would be fucking awful
> Leia and Han are not together
> Han is back to being a somewhat sleazy smuggler
Which made perfect sense. Leia is too ambitious and busy leading the rebellion. Han isn't the type to commit. And they lost their child.

Do you seriously want to watch something silly like General Han and Jedi Master Leia living together on a farm or something?

> Luke is still learning to be a Jedi
He's learning to be a master and teacher. That's quite a difference

>Yes let's just continue with a happy peaceful world without conflicts, that would make an interesting movie
Yes, heaven forbid they make a movie without a Sith. That would be crazy, right!

>You seriously would want to watch Jedi Leia?
It would make far more sense.

>Which made perfect sense. Leia is too ambitious and busy leading the rebellion. Han isn't the type to commit. And they lost their child.
They shouldn't have lost their child. They shouldn't have even been in the movie. All it did was sour their relationship in the OT becasue we know they're going to have a son who murders billions of people and they are going to get space divorced. THey were only in the movie for nostalgia purposes, much like nearly everything else in the movie.

>He's learning to be a master and teacher. That's quite a difference
By abandoning the jedi academy and living on a rock in the middle of nowhere?

"Now that the dust has settled, lets have the same fucking thread we have every day!"

>Yes, heaven forbid they make a movie without a Sith. That would be crazy, right!
Jedi vs Sith was always the central conflict in Star Wars. It's pretty much a requirement for a Star Wars movie.

>It would make far more sense.
It doesn't make sense for her character at all.
She's a military leader, there's no point in her swinging a light sabre around.

>All it did was sour their relationship in the OT becasue we know they're going to have a son who murders billions of people and they are going to get space divorced.
Why? Because it doesn't end in a happy ending?
That makes a relationship worthless and uninteresting?

>By abandoning the jedi academy and living on a rock in the middle of nowhere?
That is the stereotypical thing for a wise master to do.

>She's a military leader, there's no point in her swinging a light sabre around.

being able to use the force would obviously help her as a military leader.

>That is the stereotypical thing for a wise master to do.
No it's not. Luke has no reason to go into hiding.

>being able to use the force would obviously help her as a military leader.
Yeah, it sure helped in the clone wars to be led by Jedi Council. Their vague visions were super helpful

>No it's not.
Yeah it is, it's such a common theme that an old wise master is living in solitude in bumfuck nowhere.

>Yeah, it sure helped in the clone wars to be led by Jedi Council. Their vague visions were super helpful
Their visions were clouded by Palpatine, who is dead by episode 7.

Who's to say Snoke can't do the same?

The Jedi had been keeping peace for a millennia before palpatine came to power and their vision was clouded, it is unlikely that another Sith Lord would have that ability just 30 years after his death. Anyway, the force is like another sense. Someone who can't use it is basically blind compared to someone who can

Why is that unlikely?
Maybe that's the first trick a Sith learns.

Before Palpatine the Siths were thought to be extinct.

>they didn't all live happily ever after
>the characters didn't live up to my infantile, childish idealizations of them therefore it's SHIT

You understand this type of fan was being mocked by Kylo Ren literally putting Vader on a pedestal, right?

Why the fuck are you even acting like the "prophecy" mean shit? It's entirely an invention of the prequels, which are ostensibly non-canon now, so who cares?

The fact that you think it's a good movie tells me that you don't know how to form an opinion for yourself. You are a whore. You are exactly what JJ Abrams wanted.

>samefagging this hard

Keep shilling bud, it doesn't matter. People recognize how shit Ep7 was, even reddit :)

>you don't know how to form an opinion for yourself
>but you better agree with me and the contrarian Sup Forums hivemind or else you're a whore

the irony

>not watching the unique ip counter

your samefag detection skills are laughable

nothing is original

but I did, and you pretending it changed won't change my mind

>reason and facts won't change my mind.
what else is new?

How autistic will Rian Johnson make her in Ep 8?

Unless Rey attaches/makes a light saber akin to the staff she was using throughout the movie then all creativity in star wars is dead. If the talking orange is in episode 8 AT ALL I will not be seeing it in theaters. Every time I think maybe I'll give force awakens another watch I remember that ear raping twat and lose all interest. Worst character / plot device in probably any movie ever.

>arm locked straight out (to be fair lasers might not have recoil)
>opposite eye closed of arm
>EYE CLOSED AT ALL
do actors just not get taught anything when it comes to firearms?

God no.
Spare me stupid new light sabre designs like the double-edged one, or that dumb crossguard.

Keep it classic.

Why are people so triggered by Maz? I just don't understand how that character could be offensive, she's such a minor part of the movie and I don't see how a warm grandmother-y type role would annoy people, but then again this is autism central

>or that dumb crossguard.

Kylo Ren's lightsaber is actually a stroke of genius that informs the character. It's not a dumb new lightsaber design for the sake of selling toys like Darth Maul.

Kinda fun for a first watch but really if I get an inkling for some star wars why would I not just watch new hope instead of this. It's just a remake.

How does the crossguard do that?

That the light stream was kinda uneven was good and fit his personality but what did the crossguard add?

Fuck you I'm sick to death of the fucking death star.

His hilt is a ratched, janky design with exposed wires everywhere, the "crossguard" are vents used to let off the excess energy because he couldn't contain the blade properly. This is all showing that his saber is jury rigged and amateurish, and it's a deliberate perversion of the standard lightsaber design to show that he's a pretender and doesn't actually know what the fuck he's doing.

And as you said, the uneven fiery nature of the blade visually informs his unstable nature.

it was good enough. better than the prequels. its not something ill ever watch again but i dont regret taking time to watch it either.

Is that actually made explicit in the movie? It's news to me that those are supposed to be exhausts.

The Starkiller base is used for a thematic point about the nature of overused superweapons in star wars as a franchise, but I won't bother explaining it because you're just going to use some meme response like

>hurr durr it was intentionally shit!!!!

and refuse to even engage in debate so there's no point

The ligthsabre staff was badass as hell

Not that user but go on, I'm genuinely interested

>The Starkiller base is used for a thematic point about the nature of overused superweapons in star wars as a franchise

There were 2 of them in the universe. That is not overused. 3 is taking the piss and if you think there was any thought beyond 'hey, this will make them nostalgic' in the film you are deluded.

Friendly reminder that rey is actually anakin reborn.
He got reborn to fix all the wrongs he did in his life, from destroying the remnants of the empire he helped create to helping foster a new generation of jedi after luke (to counter the order he ended). He has to do this by reliving ket points of his past.

This is why shes on a junk desert planet in a slave like living situation
This is why when she touched anakins lightsaber, his best friend, mentor and brother, obiwan, talked to him and no one else
This is why she was able to do high level force moves (like the jedi mind trick) with no training (she already knew it).
This is why she could handle a lightsaber fight and her fighting style was like anakins

This even goes along the lines of the biblical shit they tried to psudo throw in.
What makes it worse is you know their going to use the reveal that shes actually anakin as they huge 2nd movie twist ala "no. I am your father" and the 3rd movie climax where luke resisted the dark side and realized he truly was a jedi and not his father will be redone in the sense of her coming to terms that her past is not her future and her destiny isnt written by the past life she led (and that whole fucking speech of "I am my own person and I make my own destiny" bullshit).

Also, you can see their going to zuko ren and his turning point will be when his arch nemesis (rey) turns out to be the person hes idolized for his entire teenage life.

About a 7/10 for me, I enjoyed it. Starkiller base plot and Rey Sue was lame though.

Take a look at the First Order as a whole. It's a Star Wars movie, there HAS to be a big bad empire, right? Even for all the talk of """""""originality""""""" in the Expanded Universe, the idea of some incredibly centralized Imperial organization, usually led by a dark sider, is CONSTANT. Galactic Empire, KOTOR-era Sith Empire, Darth Krayt's empire, etc etc. So here we have the First Order. The First Order is NOT a rational organization, they're a bunch of shitty children of the Empire's rejects who are literally just pretending to be the New Empire to make up for their own insecurities, and a feeling of clinging to the greater glory of those that came before will make them feel better about themselves.

The First Order is led by a prissy little armchair general wannabe Nazi and his fagboy twink wannabe Darth Vader, and they think the best way to prove themselves as worthy successors to the Galactic Empire is escalation, so the nu-Empire builds a BIGGER and BETTERER version of the Death Star with no practical usage whatsoever because they're desperate to mimic the Empire and building unwieldy, overcompensating superweapons is what Star Wars villains do. The actual battle to destroy Starkiller base ends up being only a footnote in the climax, because the real power of Star Wars is in the characters, not the spaceship battles. Though normies may get their Star War, the true spirit of the series, characters you care about building relationships with each other to overcome evil, will always remain the central focus.

Seriously, TFA is fucking patrician and a commentary on the nature of Star Wars itself, but the faggots who complained about having to analyze literature in English class refuse to engage and just assume it has nothing to say.

that's actually a pretty interesting

I think the mary sue shit is a bit too heavy but that could still justify it all

it was worse than the prequels. At least they tried to do something ambitious, this was boring schlock with plot holes everywhere

>because the real power of Star Wars is in the characters, not the spaceship battles.
If this is what it was trying to say then I feel it failed, because I didn't think the characters were anything special.

It must be great being a Hollywood exec. DUDE LETS JUST COPY ANH, THE FANS WILL LOVE IT AND AUTISTS ON Sup Forums WILL SAY THAT IT WAS AN ARTISTIC DECISION

>If this is what it was trying to say then I feel it failed, because I didn't think the characters were anything special.

>dude Kylo Ren wasn't badass enough lmao
>dude why did Finn kill the stormtroopers trying to kill him? I thought he was a pacifist lmao
>dude MaREY Sue lmao I'm so clever

You're a douche and probably stupid. Why did they fail for you?

I don't know, considering the movie received almost unanimous critical acclaim from people who are paid to analyze film, maybe the problem is with you, and you, in fact, are the autistic one?

>inb4paidreviews
>inb4shills
>inb4criticsarecorruptbecausetheylikewhatidon'tlike

It's very bland and forgettable, gets worse on every rewatch

5/10

The prequels were filled with memorable moments, the only one I remember clearly in this is Harrison ford dying because it makes me angry that they pissed away the best character in the franchise for a cheap shocker

>wahhhh I want to be just like daddy!!!

First Order in a nutshell. Bland.

literally the biggest piece of shit poached on a stick I have ever watched

A villainous organization that playfully subverts conventions of Star Wars is more creative than insipid bullshit like Sheev's revival, Luuke Skywalker, Mary Tzu literal Art of War Man and the Yuuzhan Vong.

>dude Kylo Ren wasn't badass enough lmao
I think he comes off as too petty.
The literal Darth Vader wannabe is an interesting angle. It fits well with your analysis of the film and is a pretty interesting concept. But I think he fails just a little too much for it to really work. If he really wanted to be Vader-lite, he should have kept his mask on outside of the interrogation scene and he should have been able to win at the end. He needs to be able to balance the menace with the tryhardism, but by the end of the film it's too skewed.

>dude why did Finn kill the stormtroopers trying to kill him? I thought he was a pacifist lmao
I don't have many problems with this character. He wasn't a bad character, but I didn't find him as likeable as I hoped. He's just OK.

>dude MaREY Sue lmao I'm so clever
You've already heard all the criticisms so it's worthless for me to reiterate them. What do you think makes her a good character?

She's just useless. Except she's not. She's this major shift in the story that comes out of nowhere and is played off as "a story for another time" which as we can all guess will be a side movie in the coming years. That whole scene was awful, just a "we need a bunch of aliens aliening around" scene with no revisited species. As for me personally maz or whatever was just annoying as shit from her first words. I don't know if her loud voice or "soft sweet" one was worse and I don't care to ever listen to either again

FUCKING DISNEY

WE WILL NEVER EVER HAVE MOVIE ABOUT YUUZHAN VONG

>DUDE UPSIDE DOWN CROSS N KILLIN MUU DAD SO HARDCORE LAMO
kylo was gay dude

Not that guy, but:

Kylo was fine. Him being a twisted in-universe Vader fanboy was really the only part of the movie's attempt at building on the original films I thought was handled well (i.e. taking something old and putting a new spin on it as opposed to just ripping old plot elements wholesale).

But Rey and Finn have some real characterization problems, the former especially. Finn's willingness to kill his former comrades out of self-defense is fine (he can't really help that); it's his outright glee over shooting them out of the sky that's just so bizarre and off-putting. But at least, that bit of weirdness aside, he was mostly inoffensive wallpaper. Rey was awful though, she genuinely is a Mary Sue (or at least displays a great deal of Mary Sue characteristics) and it's exceptionally difficult to empathize with those sorts of characters because - by default - they're incapable of growing as characters and the universe constantly bends itself in contrived ways to assert their importance. Rey's whole arc and motivation needed some serious overhauling.

>But I think he fails just a little too much for it to really work. If he really wanted to be Vader-lite, he should have kept his mask on outside of the interrogation scene and he should have been able to win at the end.

The point is that Kylo is desperately trying to sell himself this meme that he can be Darth Vader 2 because he thinks Ben Solo is too weak, even though deep down he hates himself and knows he's become a monster. He thought killing his Dad would make his conscience finally stop and make his pain go away, but it only made it worse.

The Dark Side has never been meant as a rational or "cool" alternative to the light side. Making Kylo Ren a successful Vader wannabe would have been much less interesting, and pretty much an unironic copying of ANH. The only reason why I accept TFA's recycling of certain conventions is because it does so for the sake of ultimately subverting them.

>What do you think makes her a good character?

I don't think Rey is particularly complex (no star wars protagonist is, really, they're meant to be escapist characters for the audience) but I liked that she was kind of Luke's opposite, in a way. Luke hated living on Tatooine, and he jumped at the call to adventure. Rey wants bigger and better things, but is afraid to leave Jakku out of a delusional hope that her family will return for her, even though deep down she knows they're not coming back. She doesn't want to leave her comfort zone and move on with her life because the uncertainty of change is scarier than staying on Jakku and attaching herself to the lie of her family returning for her. It's only with Maz's counsel and the love she finds in Finn and Han Solo that she finally accepts her true destiny as a Jedi.

Rey's introduction is fucking kino and we learn so much about her without her speaking a word of dialogue. It's great storytelling through visuals.

>it's his outright glee over shooting them out of the sky
Isn't that after he just shoots some turret, that possible didn't harm any person?
And he's simply happy about mastering a weapon he never used before?

It looked great, apart from that yellow Yoda woman, and I generally enjoyed its humor and the characters. Rey isn't the most interesting, but I liked BB-8 and the Edgy Darth fanboy. Not a huge Star Wars fan, but it was a fun popcorn movie with some great effects and set pieces.

Better than any of the prequels.

>Rey's introduction is fucking kino and we learn so much about her without her speaking a word of dialogue.
This.

They were great and not only tell you a lot about Rey but also 7's world.

>The point is that Kylo is desperately trying to sell himself this meme that he can be Darth Vader 2 because he thinks Ben Solo is too weak, even though deep down he hates himself and knows he's become a monster. He thought killing his Dad would make his conscience finally stop and make his pain go away, but it only made it worse.
This is true and all that is there.

>The Dark Side has never been meant as a rational or "cool" alternative to the light side.
It was always supposed to be tempting and easy to give in to. I think the portrayal of Kylo struggling against his conscience and wanting to choose the dark side is a little backwards, even though it's a good concept that you can do a lot with.

>Making Kylo Ren a successful Vader wannabe would have been much less interesting, and pretty much an unironic copying of ANH.
If he was only a Vader clone that would have been boring.
Intentionally making the character a cheap Vader wannabe is an interesting idea, but I don't think he replicates enough of Vader to really make it work.
If he showed those cracks in his armour only briefly e.g. in the interrogation with Rey and the scene with the Vader skull but maintained the facade otherwise, I think it would have worked a lot better. As it stands, it's a little too comical.

>Rey's introduction is fucking kino and we learn so much about her without her speaking a word of dialogue. It's great storytelling through visuals.
That's all true. Everything between meeting her and getting in the Falcon was golden.

Jesus Christ you're retarded

>She's this major shift in the story that comes out of nowhere and is played off as "a story for another time" which as we can all guess will be a side movie in the coming years.

No, it was a mockery of you autists who need literally everything explained to them.

Some douche picked up Luke's lightsaber in the air ducts of Bespin and Maz bought it. She was guided by the Force, whatever. Who cares?

>Jedi vs sith is a requirement for a Star Wars movie

Better call up Disney and cancel rogue one

t. JJ Abrams

While you're here, can you tell me why Finn was surprised that the Force is real if he saw Kylo Ren wreck Poe's shit the day before?

When was Finn surprised?

doesn't match up to episode 3