Americans

Americans,

Tipping bar staff.

Why do you do it? How much do you tip per drink? And how much is a pint of lager or a mixer over there?

I'll tip a buck per drink. Opening a bottle or pouring shit isnt difficult

Ok. But why tip them at all? Why isn't there boss paying them right?

And for reference, what is a pint costing in the US of A?

Anywhere from $4 to $15.

Wow, serious?

You'd pay $15 for a pint and still tip the bar staff?

Tipping is a bribe. You're smart if you go to a bar, flash a twenty and drop it into the tip cup when your bartender first gets to you, you'll be first served most of the night.

Thats mainly at those shit craft beer bars.

I always tip my bartender, but it depends on the service entirely. If I just order a beer and don't really talk to them then I dollar or two. If I'm in need of recommendations, talkative, and/or help me throughout my order then I'll tip 20% or more. I don't tip per drink, some cocktails take a bit to put together. If they make a cocktail request from off the menu and don't make a fussy about it, then I'll be inclined to tip more.

I won't tip much if the bartender only makes stuff from the menu, only opens beers, and basically does the bare minimum of effort for their job. Keep busy, entertain me, and you'll get good money. I used to be a waitress, so I understand the job.

for a shitty mostly water beer it's like $2 for a pint, if the pint is $10+ you're probly in a ritsy area, or it better be a fucking amazing beer. ... I pay about $8 for a this awesome double IPA I like, but it's 10% abv.

tipping is around b/c in america we for some reason don't pay our waiters a livable wage ... this started a long time ago, and was never really remedied, not sure why we don't force them to do it, but we don't. So you gotta tip 'em.

I meant like a decent strength German lager.

Tip $0, im not their boss so im not paying their wage. They arnt my friend and i dont owe them any money.

I already pay for the drink, their wage comes out the profit margin for that, even if it doesnt, not my problem lol

Sounds like Surly Brewery. I have their seasonal Abrasive, double IPA, 9.2%

Unless you go to a specialty place, you aren't going to find a bunch of European beer. You frankly have a hard time getting local beer outside their state of production

i bet you get great service

there's no law saying you have to tip, just makes you a dick. Probly don't let your friends find out you dont tip. If any of them was ever a waiter you'll get an earful.

my fella. I prefer Bauhaus and Indeed though :D

Must be hard being such a faggot edgelord all day. You people make me sick.

I don't. I don't tip at all unless the service was exceptional

i do, tips come at the end anyway and i just never go back lol

its not a dick move to not give someone free money. Do you tip your dentist after he checks your teeth? or ur piolet when he lands the plane your on? No, because ur too stupid to question why ur told to tip waiters

and ill happily tell someone i dont tip when i ask, theres no argument they can say against it

German beer usually $6 for a .5L of what we can get. Spaten, HB, Hacker etc

I don't tip a dentist or a pilot b/c they make a livable wage. Waiters make UNDER the MINIMUM wage w/o tips.

should the law be changed to not allow that? absolutely. But as of right now, that's how it is. So yeah it does make you a dick.

>be britbong
>be working in New You
>one job. there for 5 days max
>2 of us arrive the day before
>nothing to do so we hit a bar at about 2pm
>go to bar order 2 beers
>pay and accept change (like you would in any fucking bar in the UK)
>finish beer
>mate goes to bar
>bar bitch ignores him
>mate just stands there
>she walks past him ignoring him
>looks at me
>wtf?
>fuck it and we leave
>explain it to guy in next bar
>he said it's cos we didn't tip

I get tipping. But this was a bar, next to a hotel in New fucking York. And we clearly weren't local. We just didn't fucking know.

I hate the entitled-to-tips bullshit that the USA staff have.

why should i care about someone elses wage, if they dont earn enough, they should get a better job.

If they cant get a better job, its their fault for lacking the qualifications

This. The fact that they expect it is what drives me mad.

nobody is saying you 'have' to do anything. you dont 'have' to care, but that makes you a dick... all there is to it.

i dont make a livable wage, can u send money to my paypal pls, if u dont, ur a dick

Yeah it's common knowledge. You should know customs of a country you're in if you're traveling there.

get good faggot

Tip depends on the service, like a dollar per beer, or if it's a mixed drink done proper that takes effort, then more like three dollars, and usually another five bucks before leaving.
One can't really get proper pints here in the U.S., for a somewhat decent 16oz, at least five dollars, for a decent mixed drink around ten dollars.

that's fine, I'll be a dick.

To my knowledge bar tenders do make a regular wage. We are just used to tipping because of the wait staff.

You tip cause in some states you get paid $2.35 an hour. Also we handle everything that you drink or eat.

no they don't, they do generally make more than waiters though. last bartending job i had was $5/hr., while waitstaff was @$2.50/hr.

tip is after the meal though, so unless u spit in everyones food it wont matter, unless they come back

I agree, but the US is the only place that really does this in developed countries.

Everyone else pays their employees a living wage and doesn't force customers to subsidize expenses required to run a business. If you can't pay employees a living wage, don't open a restaurant.

At bars I always tip usually a dollar or two dollars per drink. When I eat lunch at a bar I'll tip 20% or more if the service was good. I do it because thats how servers and bartenders get paid. They make their income off tips. You cheap bastards.

If you're sitting at the bar, start a tab and give the guy like 10% at the end of the night, unless you're ordering drinks that take more work than pouring a bottle or pulling a tap.

if you can't pay for goods or services and adhere to social norms, don't eat at dine-in restaruants.

we aren't the cheap bastards, their employer is.

>They make their income off tips. You cheap bastards.
If they're unhappy with how much they make tell them to talk to their employer and take their hand out of my pocket.

People usually go back to places to eat and drink. That Is why bars and restaurants are so popular.

>If you can't pay employees a living wage
It isn't about this, most servers make a living wage. Most make FAR more than minimum wage. If it was legislated that U.S. restaurants had to pay minimum wage, it would absolutely devastate a majority of restaurants, because while the restaurants could generally pay it, the servers would be taking a HUGE pay cut, and they would quit, because it isn't worth it, there is a lot to working in a faster restaurant that isn't shit tier--mid-tier and above you gotta know your shit and be quick and mentally capable AND able to take a fuckton of abuse from asshole diners. The industry would be replaced with minimum wage retards who don't give a fuck and can't get shit right and it just wouldn't work out, places would go under because they couldn't provide the same level of service. If a customer is spending 50-100 per diner, you think they are going to accept fuckups? Because fuckups are what minimum wage pays for.

The annoying thing is that the businesses claim they can't afford to pay a good wage for their staff when they easily can.

But it's better to let customers cover part of the wage, which is stupid because even if they don't get tips, the employer is still obligated to compensate them up to minimum wage.

Plus, most servers don't want a real wage with no tips. They bitch about being poor and getting shitty tips but are oddly silent during the busy season, because they actually make more than the normal wage at that time. I know a lot of servers who can't balance their incomes over the busy and slow seasons and throw away their money stupidly because it looks like it's raining money. Then they start bitching about being poor and not getting tips when the season slows down.

It's just annoying all around. If employers paid their employees a wage worth living for, the quality of service at restaurants would skyrocket and more customers would show up. I can't count the number of restaurants I've decided not to go back to even if the food is good because we get left unattended or the server is a fucking dick.

Then the owners understaff to save more money. There's just so much goddamn greed in the food and service industry.

seeYou should only eat at fast food restaurants until you learn that you get what you pay for.

You have obviously never worked in the service industry.

The hand is not in your pocket. It's customary...not mandatory. Every society has customs, and this is the custom in the US. You don't have to tip. You can eat at McDick's where no one expects a tip, or buy a six-pack at the store and drink at home. Tipping is part of the deal, and if you don't figure it into your cost when ordering, you are either a dumbass or an asshole. When my wife is in Riyadh, she covers her hair. Same fucking thing really.

>if you won't let us rob you just stay home

You guys do realize it doesnt matter if you tip (aside from service qaulity of course.)

yes, they paid below minimum but by law, if they make less money in tips than theyre supposed to have according to the hours theyve worked, theyre paid back in full. Most of the time they walk out with more money than they were surposed to make.

Cite: dated a waiter once. She told me all about it.

So tldr, you guys have no reason to keep this shitty bait meme going and theres no reason to keep arguing about it. But you will.

>tipping is part of the deal
>you're an asshole if you don't do it
>but it's not mandatory
do you know what a fucking retard you sound like right now? If you can't live on minimum wage don't take a minimum wage job. it's not my job to cover you when you're short on cash. you get paid by the restaurant, if it's not enough, talk to them.

>I'll greentext, maybe that will somehow make me not an idiot, and my statement not bullshit

yeah the law says the restaurant has to cover them up to minimum wage if they get shit tips, but if any waiter or waitress actually made the restaurant enforce that you might as well go into your boss' office and scream
>I'M TERRIBLE AT MY JOB AND NEED TO BE FIRED IMMEDIATELY K THX

No contradiction mate. Just because something is not mandatory, doesn't inherently mean you can't be an asshole if you don't do it. It's not mandatory to hold the door open for a frail old lady. But if you let it slam in her face, you are indeed an asshole.

I haven't. But I have a huge circle of friends who do and I never hear the end of it from them.

I've been to classy restaurants where you actually have a group of dedicated staff waiting on your table. That's worthy of tipping.

These run of the mill restaurant servers think they deserve to be tipped is asinine. Yes, people can be dicks, but if you take the order right and the cooks do it right, there should be no problem. All you are doing is writing down an order and filing drinks.

"If you can't afford to tip, don't eat out."

Then raise the price of the dish 15% pay them with that and kill tips. Tipping shouldn't be an incentive for people to do well at their job. It's called work for a reason.

If owners were forced to pay employees more then everything they sell would cost more and is already too expensive

This user is 100 percent correct, if you search the FLSA Fact #15 sheet (government document) it clearly states that if an employee does not meet the state minimum wage the employer must make up the difference.

Funny how you never hear any servers say anything about this law though. The reason for this is because the vast majority of servers make well over the minimum wage, they just like to spout the "I only make 2.15 an hour" or "my paychecks arent even 100 dollars every 2 weeks" meme to get uneducated idiots to sympathize for them and tip them even more. And if there are some servers that are getting stiffed less than minimum wage then they only have themselves to blame for not holding their employers accountable.

Actually, it does. Having worked in the service industry, it depends on where you work. Your gf most likely (from your description) works/worked an a chain restaurant, where there are considerably more checks and balances and regulations (no fed law governing wages with tip based allowances). And even then, the restaurant is only required to pay in the structure you described within accordance to their employment contracts (which are incredibly rare in most server positions). Most servers make roughly $2/hr in states that aren't CA/NY, and have to rely solely on tips as their primary revenue source; the trade off/gamble one makes when working in a cash based/tax free (if cash) payment system.

Long story short, tipping 20% on less than a $10-$20 meal is a pretty dick move, as you're paying $2-$4 to a person doing just about the same amount of work than would for a $60-$70. If they did a good job, 20% is decent (and if they were terrible, then fuck 'em; bad servers don't deserve jobs as servers). If 20% is too much to tip for you, don't go out to eat.

>Waiters make UNDER the MINIMUM wage w/o tips.
no, if by some miracle they dont guilt enough people into tipping to meet the state minimum the employer is still compelled to pay the difference so they never make less than minimum, if anything it is always more because of retards like yourself being guilt tripped. women especially since good looks + flirting = good tips

It would be no different than needing to pay tip. If most peyote pay 15-20% tip and that's enough for the servers, then just raise the prices that amount and pay them a standard wage

They literally are not allowed to pay you less than minmum wage unless you signed some kind of contract like you were talking about in which case that is completely their own choice/fault if they don't get tipped.

So how do restaurants in the UK and Europe manage to keep costs affordable and pay their staff properly?

see

I'm ignorant on their laws and private business regulations, so I have no idea.

And to be clear, I never opined that servers weren't being paid a fair wage. I was just stating that it's a fast and loose system due to the fact that it's cash based, of which there is a definitive cost/benefit gamble an employee makes in accepting the jib, as they're basically completely disposable (and basically free) labor, coupled with the fact that many of them are wildly uninformed on labor law, the legal code, and the economy in general. They're just trying to get by.

It's built into the food cost. The customer pays it one way or another. In Europe, you just don't have the option of withholding pay for shitty service.

thats not how it works, tim. the boss has no fucking say in it. but please, keep getting arsefucked you guilt ridden pissant

bet youre ashamed of being white too

You still don't get it, even though you said it yourself...The service denotes the tip, also you are oblivious to the servers having to tip out everyone else (cooks/bartenders/hosts/bussers) If you're going to Applebee's you think you're going to get the same service as an actual restaurant?
> All you are doing is writing down an order and filing drinks
Yeah, that sounds simple right? Now multiply it. Most people can't multitask for shit. It's pretty simple: If they are average, give them their 15%, if they are better give them 20% (which is pretty much the new standard), if they suck, tip accordingly or not at all, and stfu, as opposed to coming to Sup Forums to whine about how your shitty friends annoy you.

But it doesn’t change the fact that customers are footing the bill for greedy employers.

I have no issue with tipping if somebody has gone that extra mile in any job. But tipping a percentage simply because it’s a certain industry is ludicrous.

Restaurant owners must be laughing their cocks off over there.

non topical

clueless

Oh, I don't disagree with you. I see the benefit (big time) to employers. I just see what it does to these servers whom are by and large just trying to get the bills paid, half of whom (the women, I mean) are single moms (in my experience). But if they're shit, tip 'em accordingly (or not at all). Restaurants should be charging less for food, as their overhead isn't largely employee based, in which case they'd get more customers, turn tables faster, and retain better servers. But they always choose to keep prices higher, keep a mediocre to bad wait staff (as the good ones whom have a rudimentary understanding of good work, self worth, and business acumen invariably leave), which leads to an uninterested and unengaged workforce delivering shitty service to a dwindling amount of customers whom will get a bad taste in their mouths about servers and their wages.

I haven't done the math but it seems to me that an increase in pay by 100% for all of an employers employees will create much higher food and drink prices, resulting in a higher cumulative total, than adding fifteen or twenty dollars to a hundred dollar tab.

is that even legal? What state?

That still wouldn't even get them close to minimum wage. The biggest part of a restaurant's overhead isn't from labor, not even close, even if they tripled it...

yes it's legal (TX) but pretty much every state is similar.

Why though?

We don't pay anymore to eat out in the UK than you. And i can imagine overheads being higher due to increased gas costs and our lack of space adding to higher rents.

There's a saying here: "One for the drink, one for you"

It means that if we pay $10 for a drink, we have to tip $10 to the barman. We're not communists after all.

Explain why I'm clueless.

You've been conned into accepting tipping to be normal and necessary at the expense of you and not their employer.

Most other countries manage to run these types of business fine and pay their staff accordingly.

The only argument for tipping is to make up the servers wage. How the fuck has that responsibility fallen on the customer?

I work at a bar as a bareback
Its relatively upscale scotch and whiskey bar
I make 5 $ an hour and go home with about 60-100 in tips on sunday-thursday

True, delivery drivers make less than that too.

t. ex-papa johns driver

So when you buy a car, you buy the dealer one too?

I know it's a crazy analogy but where does it end?

see

But there's a fundamental difference between going to a high class restaurant that has a dedicated group of waiters on your table, versus MOST other restaurants where the server acts as an intermediary between you and the kitchen. The former actually services the customers. The latter is a mind numbing exchange.

I'm saying tips should only exist in the gourmet style restaurant because the service structure is fundamentally different. If a group of me and my friends go out and order $150 of food, the server in no way did $35 dollars of work when they are running around attending to 12 other tables. Their work is not worth that. Even if they were attending just to us, still did not do that amount of work.

That's half a days work on minimum wage, in tips, for one meal. That person didn't do half a day's work over the course of our hour meal.

It's not a crazy analogy, it's called a false equivalency.

dude, their job is already shit, and to add onto it they hardly make any money.
i think you haven't ever been close with anyone who has ever had to take a waiter job to make ends meet, because if you did you would realize that those tips literally make or break their monthly bills alot of the time.

tldr: dont be an edgy shit, even just a dollar can go a long way. if they make you a mean ass mixer, give em like 5 or whatever suits you best. just dont be a prick for no reason

in what world does a car cost as much as a drink

That's exactly how it works. The second you start to under perform the restaurant will find any reason to fire you. Next time you're five minutes late or drop a dish you are gone.

Tip a dollar for a 5 dollar beer? No thanks

Bullshit.

How do some of the best Michelin starre restaurants in the UK an Europe manage to provide the best sevice and food and not rely on customers to pay wages?

You've been cucked mate. You even tip taxi drivers for fuck sake. they literally rip you off with the fare and you silly cunts give them even more.

Since your so hung up on minimum wage, and you seem to be unable to grasp the concept of a standardized rate for services, you should stick to fast food.

America is fucking hilarious. Literal 3rd world country. They're so fucked and mind controlled by corperations that they actually feel guilty about not paying other peoples wages themselves while employers laugh at them and make all the profit. Top fucking kek, Americans. Just mass shooting yourselves out of existance already.

>That person didn't do half a day's work over the course of our hour meal
It isn't half a days work for them, einstein.

So basically you're saying you tip simply because that's what we do here.

Anyone doing a job should be paid properly by their employer. Why would you willingly pay twice for a service?

No, because the guy selling me the car didn't make it. But if I buy a homemade sweater, I usually just double the price.

ive never heard of people tipping taxi drivers, thats probably a big city thing where theyre vital to peoples daily routines.
however the comparison is still invalid because a 15 mile taxi fare isnt the same price as a beer lol

As a bartender...
If youre just ordering beers, tip a buck every 2-3.
If youre ordering cocktails or a round, tip a dollar each.

This is where people like you stop looking at how the rest of the world works. The ~$10/meal price is how it is internationally and no other place does tipping like we do. It's actually an insult in Japan to tip because you are communicating that they look poor and need charity.

You have this veil over your eyes like the system won't work without tips. It does. It does everywhere else. And they all make a living wage. And business aren't collapsing. And the prices are still normal. And people aren't fleeing their jobs.

I don't want to tell the brave job creators what they can or can't do. If we do that, we'll end up with Stalin Mao being reincarnated by the end of the year and we'll all die because we're good Christians who love CAPITALISM!

Nailed it

do you want me to lay some math on you real quick or are you gonna stop talking like you know anything about the real world from behind your computer screen

>Muh Europe and UK
Hey fucktard read the topic. This isn't about European restaurants.
>You've been cucked mate
And you've just outed yourself as a fucking retard, 'mate'. Are you seriously unable to grasp the concept that different places are different?

Don't tip people for doing their job. Its their job. If it cannot support them they should leave. their managers will have no workers if no one can live off it.
if they need workers they will have to increase how much they pay if literally no one will go for it due to it not paying enough

people need jobs more than employers need workers. we need them more than they need us.