Any sport: who is the greatest coach of all time?
Any sport: who is the greatest coach of all time?
Alex Ferguson
Ernst Happel
He never had any impact on the evolution of tactics, never proved himself at international football, racking up trophies in a shit league does not make you the GOAT
is horse an coach
then no ones the goat. anyway, ill take a manager who dominates with darren fucking fletcher over some goof who lucked into something new and milked it for a few trophies.
>innovation is luck
Probably Bowman. Dude was just an absolute genius with Montreal
well unless youre american. then you can just invent something 30 years after someone else, patent it and pretend its yours.
Tom Landry
no one's the goat, that's right
>ill take a manager who dominates with darren fucking fletcher
you think Ferguson is the only one who won with mediocre players? clueless
Are you an American in Italy that started watching football in 2012?
The EPL used to be a pretty strong league.
Ottmar Hitzfeld
between Heysel and the mid 2000s it was worse than the dutch league and that's where most of his trophies come from
>Ferguson is the only one who won with mediocre players
where did i say that you moron? he is the only one who did it for 20 years though.
not true
Popovich, Guardiola, Retegui and Wenger
From 2004 to 2011 the EPL was the strongest league.
Those are 8 seasons. In 4 of those seasons, Manchester United won the league.
compelling argument
make that 05-09
besides, extrapolating 4 years at random and basing all of your opinion on those 4 years only is dumb
same as yours
>guardiola
>wenger
couldn't find more exposed managers famalam? why stop here, say Mourinho and Ranieri too
good one
Bill Belichick
Popopvich and Belichick
I obviously suffer from bias by selecting someone from recent history but
>Mike Babcock
>Leafs miss playoffs perennially
>2 seasons
>make playoffs
>He never had any impact on the evolution of tactics
All the people who have end up tied to that one style and fail when the game moves on. OP didn't ask who had the biggest impact or who the best technically was, he asked who the greatest was, and to be great you need to win no matter what else is going on around you.
Fergie is literally the only manager to ever dominate in one of the big 4 leagues for over 20 years. Whatever new meme flavour of the month manager came over with their fancy new ideas, within a season or 2 Ferguson was winning again.
>make that 05-09
Ok, then.
He won 3/5 of the titles when the EPL was the strongest league in the world. The other two were won by one of the greatest teams ever.
no shit, he managed in that league for so long he knew it like his pockets
and if he's the only one who dominated a top league for 20 years it's because he never left it, but that doesn't mean he's inherently better than those who moved for other challenges, on contraire it makes him look worse for never leaving his comfort zone
And innovating tactics is not equal to being tied up to that system only, many managers innovated than moved on with the times
John Candy from Cool Runnings
Gary Neville
he also choked a title to fucking Mancini, we're talking about an entire career m8 not just some years
if you only count 4-5 years of one's career than Clough or Sacchi are the GOATs
>no shit, he managed in that league for so long he knew it like his pockets
If it's so easy why can't everyone do it?
>than those who moved for other challenges
lmao, managers almost never "leave for other challenges" they leave because they get fired in almost every case. Fergie is one of the few who was unfireable.
>many managers innovated than moved on with the times
And still won the league less than him with more money.
UNBELIEVABLE
You said he won in a shitty league. He didn't. He also has a couple of UCL trophies.
>he also choked a title to fucking Mancini
I don't know if you realize this, but other than early-career Mourinho there is no coach that wins all.
Waldemar
>If it's so easy why can't everyone do it?
because, despite not being the goat, Ferguson was a fucking great manager and the only one who tried to emulate his feat is fucking Arsene Wenger, not the best of the adversries, wouldn't you say
>lmao, managers almost never "leave for other challenges" they leave because they get fired in almost every case
yes, they do, like Lippi leaving club football to prove himself with the NT
>And still won the league less than him with more money.
don't even know who you're talking about here, Mourinho? he was never as good as Ferguson
>choked a title to fucking Mancini
No. He barely lost the title (and still beat both Chelsea and Arsenal) with owners who refused to spend against the most expensively assembled team ever at that time. And then he won the league the next year with 2 of his starting 11 retiring and City spending even more money.
This
>don't even know who you're talking about here, Mourinho? he was never as good as Ferguson
Literally everyone who has ever been a manager, who else has won a major league 13 times.
>yes, they do, like Lippi leaving club football to prove himself with the NT
Congratulations you can cherry pick. Tell me who you think was better than Fergie and he'll have been fired at some point I guarantee, Ferguson never.
1. Gregg Popovich
2. Bill Belichik
3. Rinus Michels
>who else has won a major league 13 times.
Winning manuwinslol with ManU is a feat now?
Manuwinslol only when he was there, not before and certainly not now. A far more expensive united team can barely make top 4 now.
>dominating the league is a bad thing
the rest of the league is much better and ManU is much worse tho
And yet I always see people saying winning bundes with Bayern and Serie a with Juve are free trophies but if it's Ferguson doing it it's the greatest achievement ever
when you make it ManUwinslol and it all goes to shit when you leave, yes.
yes because those clubs do it with different managers whereas united are shit now despite having had numerous so-called top managers
>ManU is much worse tho
hmmmm, I wonder what it was that changed to make United much worse. I reckon it might be that the GOAT manager left.
ManU were the only english club with some sort of financial power at the time, any good manager could have turned the league into Manuwinslol when they are the only one that can spend big money and attract good players
They put Ed Woodward in charge of transfers and expected Moyes to be as good as Ferguson
Scotty Bowman, 100%. Ask Chicago
So, if
Ferguson
Mourinho
Clough
Sacchi
are not the best, who is?
You will likely call Pep "Fraudiola". Ancelotti is good in Europe but bad in league.
Or are you going to say Zidane, since he own the last UCL?
...
I don't know m8, there has been so many great managers that I don't think you could name a single, objective GOAT. More so because quantifying managerial skill i pretty much impossible
You could talk about a list of some of the best ever and of course those four are up there, as well as Pep and Ancelotti
In my opinion the "ideal" greatest ever should check at least these points
-he must have had a success, that's a given
-said success must have been prolonged in time, not just 4-5 years, and in many differents competitions
-he must have proved himself at both club and international football
-he also must have left a print on the evolution of the game and tactics
In short, there's no goat, maybe my standards are just too high? who knows
Also, I think the one that comes closest to this definition is your fellow br Zagallo
>no chapman
>no meisl
>no pozzo
Pre war managers should get more recognition in my opinion, they were pioneers and shit
Joe McCarthy
bull fucking shit. several clubs spent more than united during that period without ever coming close to their dominance.
I was talking about the 90s, not the 2000s
if you count it from 90/91 to 99/00 six teams spent more than united in that period
Angelo Dundee
but could they attract great international players like Cantona and Stam?
No because no foreigner wanted to play in England at the time unless it was for ManU (and Arsenal after 97 or 98)
lmao this thread
>people rating Pop but not Jackson
and im sure that had nothing to do with ferguson, right? cantona was a moody lost cause who 'led' the french attack to zero wins in 92 euro and the only reason he became anything worth a shit was ferguson. if it wasnt for him he'd be remembered as balotelli tier player. by the time staam made it england there were lots of foreigners there, even if you dont count the other brits.
Ivan LJubicic
Werner Lorant
Rosario Martinez
Edmond Tarvedyran
>poop
>one of the best ever
lmao might as well throw luis enrique to the list, luigi
Helenio herrera maybe? Too old but inventing catenaccio surely changed the games and he won some impressive trophies with different teams
Not even the cops can with him
>answering anyone besides Scotty Bowman
Poorball plebs detected.
>ctrl f
>no big sam
THE GOAT
this, and it isn't even close. 3 straight finals with an expansion team in his first 3 years as a pro coach 4 straight titles with Montreal, 2 straight with Detroit, and 9 in total
Came here for this.
>pic related
People have already said it but pop and bellicheck are by far the greatest american sport coaches.
Don't know about yuroball coaches
HEAD MOVEMENT
CLINCH
legit lol'd
>Moyes
>ManU were the only english club with some sort of financial power at the time
You're right here desu
Tarverdyan: Move, move, move! Clinch, clinch, clinch, clinch, clinch, clinch!!
Nunes finishes Rousey, makes the shushing sign as she walks triumphantly around the cage.
Tarverdyan: NO! NOOOOOOO! NOOOOOOOOO!! NOOO!! NOOO!! NO! NO!!
Nunes makes her way to Tarverdyan and says a few things before popping her head out of the cage to say a few more bon mots. Edmond remains quiet during this part.
Tarverdyan: (as Amanda walks away) Move, (unintelligible)... move! Fuck!
Belichick, not even close
Bill belichick
...
SAF or bellycheck
of course, but that goes against Romania's fantasy world where Ferguson always won with shit players, as the underdog against all odds, and always won against the best of the best with his measly team of frauds who did not know how to kick a ball before they met the great SAF
Not Phil Jackson
Texasfag here, Poppovich is the best. Not only have los Spurs dominated for the past decade+ he's also based in interviews.
NFL: Lombardi
CFB: Saban
Pop and Belicheck
Can't say about soccer, but as for other sports I would say Pop and Belichick, baseball maybe Joe Torre?
Phil Jackson never was, is, or will be a goat coach, he got godsend players everywhere he went
Popovich, Lombardi, Belichick, Ferguson, honorable mention for Coryell's contribution to NFL offenses
>implying coaches actually have any effect
...
>darren fletcher was a bad player
this meme needs to end.
>Phil Jackson never was, is, or will be a goat coach, he got godsend players everywhere he went
Molding 18yr old Kobe into the greatest player in the world isn't the sign of the goat coach
>4 scotsman on the list
WE STRONK NOW
Parcells and Ferguson
...
Quenneville, Clough, Auerbach.