Was the dropping of atomic bombs on Japan justifiable to end WW2?

Was the dropping of atomic bombs on Japan justifiable to end WW2?

Provide real facts and reasons why it was/wasn't justifiable.

Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Downfall
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_mutilation_of_Japanese_war_dead
youtu.be/VfyNNVuLCn8
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

>war
>having to be justified

America needs to fucking apologise for this shit.

Shut it ya manlet nerd

This guy, everytime

I'm amazed they were able to rebuild with all the radiation.

of course it was.

we feared many millions of lives to have been lost on between both sides and an occupation to last several decades including an occupation army of at least one million.

America proud of being the only nation pussy enough to use nukes.

Justified? Not really. But it's explainable. The reasons were more political than military. The US needed an unconditional surrender RAPIDLY. This was the best way to get it (without a precipitated invasion that would have caused many losses).

trump should nuke africa middle east india detroit and londonstan

Should have dropped them on germany desu

Yes. Look up operations Olympic and Coronet.

The US war department manufactured 500,000 purple heart medals in anticipation of the campaign. We are still giving out medals from that same production batch today. That tells you how serious it was. You thought Saipan and Okinawa were bad? This would've been a level of carnage that wouldn't have seen an equal till Vietnam at the least

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Downfall

They didnt need fancy bombs to flatten Dresden

Cities were already being erased with firebombing, were the Japanese really forced into submission by a city being destroyed by one bomb rather than 5000?

>bombed dresden
>krupps,vw,siemens not bombed
gg

Saving a lot of lives qualifies as "justified," to me.

otherwise wwii would've just kept on going
those japs just would not give up

Firebombings? I thought no bombers had reached Japan before the Enola gay and co

Are you serious...

Yes. Ended the war. QED

The krauts didnt need to bomb the Coldstream Guard's Officers Chapel. But they did

Alls fair in love and war; remember that cuck

Bah, you shouldve leaked more intel to the allies for more accurate bombings

Fuck off leaf.

You WILL fucking apologise. I'm going to get a Twitter hashtag trending this week so expect to be hearing more and more about this you fat burger retards.

It was justified because we won.
I fail to see why this train of thought needs to continue any further

They don't need to apologize for the bombs.

They need to apologize for not having left the war after Japan surrendered.

This thread again?

>was it justifiable
No. But it's war. Shit happens to everyone.
If you want to quibble over the specifics: Hiroshima was """justified""", Nagasaki was not. The latter was just an excuse to see what a plutonium bomb would do and scare Uncle Joe.

>we feared many millions of lives to have been lost on between both sides
lmao as if America gave a fuck about how many "Jap monkeys" they killed. And as for the "million American lives saved" meme, that number was never supported by a military debriefing. The original figure of speculated (American) casualties from a full-scale invasion was about 20-25K.

...

>What is the Doolitle Raid
>What is the Firebombing of Tokyo
>What is the destruction of Shuri Castle.

Canadian """""""education"""""""""

The bombs were air burst, which means most of the radiation was in the rain that fell. Ground burst causes a lot worse fallout.

Really? I was born and raised in NS and even I know that's not the case. The Tokyo firebombings killed a lot more.

I beg the day this happens.

>I'm going to get a Twitter hashtag trending this week so expect to be hearing more and more about this you fat burger retards.

>I thought no bombers had reached Japan before the Enola gay and co
Sup Forums is for 18+ of age, get out.

Wasnt, the nukes are pretty much all I ever heard about nips getting bombed. Ive some catching up to do on the pacific war

This was a lie IIUC. They could have waited it out. Continued air raids would have prevented them from rebuilding. Japan was broken. It could no longer sustain war.

But the US couldn't wait for other reasons that didn't have much to do with Japan.

We dindu nuffin wrong

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_mutilation_of_Japanese_war_dead

Let's draw the line saying war is hell, okay?

Who cares? The Japanese didn't comply to the Geneva convention so there is no justification to hold it's enemies to them until after hostilities.

>The Tokyo firebombings killed a lot more.
Yup that they did. Got a paper my great grandad kept from the war mentioning all the "Rice Cripsies"

>They could have waited it out
Sure, if the Soviets weren't breathing down Truman's neck. Truman actually considered giving the Japanese an ultimatum and a warning: the first would tell them that they can keep their Emperor (part of the reason why Japan wouldn't surrender is because they thought we would execute Hirohito) and the second would warn them of the atom bomb. Both were scrapped because of reasons.

>Nuke Detroit.

I'm pretty sure you'd improve the living conditions so go for it.

HOW ABOUT ENGLAND KILLED MORE CIVILIANS IN ONE CARPET BOMBING MISSION OF COLOGNE THAN AMERICANS DID IN HIROSHIMA?

Pic not related.

Maybe.

>The Japanese didn't comply to the Geneva convention so there is no justification to hold it's enemies to them until after hostilities.
By that logic we should be able to glass the desert ISIS occupies but we have a bunch of bleeding heart cucks in office

Rice Crispies!

lol correct, goddamn typo

What did they call Dresden? "Early Oktoberfest"?

I though Hiroshima and Nagasaki were
Catholic cities of the Middle East.
Definitely kike's plans. Of course it's not justificated.

>of the Middle East
>justificated
Go to bed Argie you're drunk.

Christianity was partially allowed after the Meiji Restoration (after a total ban), but was cracked down upon as an enemy religion during the build-up and to and during the war. The movie "A Boy called H" shows about this, if you can get a copy of it.

Yeah... that's what I gather. But they often presented it as a "military necessity", which is misleading at the very least.

The soviets were coming for it. They had been the worst allies throughout the war. Helping when they shouldn't have. Not helping when they should have. Waiting things out; never being at the right place at the right time.

And Japan knew that. They knew they had been beaten, but also that the Soviets would be coming to "help" the US soon.

IF they could wait out long enough for the soviets to get there and invade, then they would have had more leverage when surrendering. Things would have had to be negotiated between the US and the Soviets.

It's a bit like trying to survive a lion chasing you by running towards another lion and hoping they will start fighting for their meal.

The US knew that as well and wanted to avoid it at all cost. And it wanted an unconditional surrender too. Japan wouldn't be what it is today if the US didn't succeed.

ISIS is not a recognized nation so no sadly. Would be equivalent to Nuking the home nation they're in and targeting non combatants. So you'd get massively sued as well as the bleeding heart protesters. However because ISIS members are non lawful combatants they're not really covered by POW laws, so invest in car batteries.

Were Japanese civilians trained basic fighting to kill our allied soldiers if they invaded Japan?

/thread

also

FOOKA YOO DOLPHIN AND WHALE

Instant sterilization of all hazardous homes and cheaper real estate would really revitalize the area.

I'm liking this.

"Civil Defense Corps", similar to what Britain was doing. Also shown in the "A Boy Called H"

Epic Reddit meme, Leaf.

Imagine the smell though...

So basically they used cuck bombs rather than something truly devastating.

>US wanted an unconditional surrender too
What cracks me up about this is that people believe that happened, that America got an unconditional surrender out of Japan. Instead we played nice and said 1) Japan can keep their Emperor, 2) we won't do away completely with Japan's military industrial capabilities like we said we would, and 3) Japan will fork over their considerable intelligence on the Soviets.

Sort of. Kids were trained with bamboo spears at schools. I don't know about the adults; most men and boys of fighting age were already at war by then.

>flag
Every time.

hold your head high nip, hiroshima and nagasaki today are in better condition than many american cities that didn't get nuked.

It was mainly to stop Russia, show off their new weapon, and for the propaganda value at home/all around the world. That's why largely untouched cities were chosen.

They trained with rifles as well, mainly old rusty surplus.

Ottawa too, IMO.

That looks disgusting

go do your fucking homework

Contrary to popular belief Japan doesn't eat whale all the time. Whale dishes exist but they're super rare delicacies. I had some whale sashimi once and they were pretty good but not worth the price.

Really good. Eaten raw, practically melts in your mouth. Good deep fried or as shashimi too.

*sashimi.

No

Next you're going to say you wouldn't want to see a fully powered nuke on Saudi

My dream is to see the liberal-progressive crowd go ape on the Saudis and their Sharia law. Sadly it will never ever happen.

>justifiable

Don't attack us.

That is the only justification we need, and the only explanation anyone is ever entitled to.

>But don't you think this was overkill?

Don't attack us.

>Couldn't they have found another way?

Don't attack us.

>Shouldn't you at least apologize a little?

Don't attack us.

Three words are need to respond to any of this. We need explain nothing else.

Don't fucking attack us, period. End of discussion.

The nip savages had it coming, and I'm pretty sure the rest of Asia, especially the Chinese, who were subjected to their brutality on a genocidal scale, we're just fine with us nuking them.

Personally, they had plenty of opportunities to surrender, but kept trying to setup a scenario where they could get one big win and then sue for peace with honor.

See, what you faggots nowadays don't understand is that you don't fight wars for a high score or to "win", you fight wars to destroy the assets, personnel, culture and, ultimately, the future of your enemy. Only through total defeat and utter humiliation can your enemy be subjugated and remade as you wish. When you are fighting such a war, you use all weapons at your disposal and you use them until your enemy surrenders unconditionally or is entirely destroyed. This is the nature of total war and it is an ugly business.

The libs are massive hypocrites who really just hate the West, that's why the worst of offenders abroad are never condemned but microaggressions are pursued relentlessly in our countries.

Someone's been reading Clausewitz.

>and, ultimately, the future of your enemy
wew

That pic looks pretty good, the other pic looks like 90% fat

...

Truth

It is, it's whale bacon, not the regular meat. Pretty good, in small quantities.

>Strengthens your democracy!
More like made them kawaii uguu~

Some homes cost less than a hundred dollars

Crack a book sometime.
Japan wouldn't surrender, it wasn't in their culture, They only have themselves to blame.

The Yalta Declaration required that within 3 months of Hitler's downfall that the Soviets would HAVE to be in on the invasion of the Japanese home islands.

That would have meant a DIVIDED Japan, much as Germany was divided and as Korea is divided to this very day.

The Atom bomb provided the Americans a way to beat the clock and totally exclude the Soviets from the stand-off that later descended onto all of Europe, totally dominating the politics there.

The Japanese understood that sticking it out against the Americans would later bring Soviets who would insist on killing their Emperor, the same as they did the Tsar 30 years before.

The Japanese did not actually surrender due to the bombs --they surrendered because it was far better to lose to America than America AND the Soviets.

Incidentally, the Soviets did still take TWO Japanese islands which to this day have not been returned.

Not by a long shot, we were bombing them on and off for a while.

The immediate effects of the firebombs were probably worse than the nukes. You didn't get instantly vaporized, you burned to death. Of course the nukes did more long term damage.

I dare anyone to refute this
youtu.be/VfyNNVuLCn8

Yes

Actually, people misinterpret him, he never argued that war should be fought in said manner, as he believed that political objectives should and would temper "pure" and unrestricted warfare.

He was, like so many Prussian militarists, a fucking knob who saw the world through the aristocratic 19th century notions of limited warfare. 20 minutes March with General Sherman through Atlanta would have sorted him out.

This is criminally unknown.

VE Day= May 8th

USSR agreed to declared war 90 days after,

USSR attacks Japan's mainland forces on August 9th, same day that Nagasaki was bombed.

What do you think of Walzer's "Just and Unjust Wars"? I think he makes some good points despite ultimately being a huge moralfag.

At that point of the war, the atomic bombs were probably more about putting the fear of god into the Soviets than convincing the Japs to surrender. Their army was already fucked and we had free reign to bomb the shit out of them conventionally, after all. If it took much longer the Russians might have started their own invasion, and that wouldn't have been good for ANYONE.

No.
"Do not use force against an evil man."

Alright japan, what do you think about the 2 nukes on your country?

Jesus......

this meme of homes being less than a hundred dollars is true but its not what you think. The houses that are literally just painted wood with nothing inside of it.

Oh.

That's not much better.

This. If you kill your enemy, they win.

I'm a Canadian living here, but pretty much all of the war gets's written off as being a war. I've talked with old people who lived through it, and most just see it as the end result of their country's aggression (which is taught in school). This is why most Japanese people are so fierce defending Article 9 of the constitution, which says they'll never start a war again, and only fight in defense.

Also, 78% of the A-bomb survivors polled before Obama's Hiroshima visit said they didn't want an apology, and picture related was on the front page of most newspapers the next day.

tl;dr, War is Hell, let's not.

I think you said it just right "a huge moralfag".

See, attempting to assign justifications for and ethical restrictions on war is like trying to contain and limit the destructive force of a supermassive black hole - you are outside of normal rules and behavior. That's why war is bad and you try to avoid them; real all-out wars are generally catastrophic events that, when left uninterrupted and fought to their logical conclusion, result in one side being totally destroyed. Ethics, justifications and rationalizations are swallowed whole and lost beyond the event horizon of defeat.

Technically it was heat as well.

There's no winning.

That's actually funny. Good job.

>There's no winning.

Then there's no losing, either.

Absolutely. Those fuckers pulled Pearl Harbor and murdered 20 million Chinese/Korean civilians (not including rape, experiments and torture). They deserved many more nukes.

Not really, they got the message and they're all good now.

Depends on how you qualify losing. I think going to hell is losing.