Also, LEARN THE GOD DAMN CIRCLE OF FIFTHS! A few tips to get you started... -Going clockwise in Fifths from your root note gives you (you got it!) a 5th! (ex: C-D-E-F-G). -Counter Clockwise gives you!... a 4th! wat (ex. C-D-E-F). *So right away we see in the key of C, our 4th is F and our 5th is G... but it gets better! *This also tells us that F and G are MAJOR! So right away we know that C = I... F = IV... and G = V.... the capital roman numerals meaning major!
Looking at the minor section we see A minor under C... because it is the "relative minor" of C... C Major is C-D-E-F-G-A-B..... A Minor is A-B-C-D-E-F-G... no sharps or flats!
It's also the minor sixth of the C Major scale!... the D and E minor next to it are also in the C Major scale. A = vi... D = ii... E = iii...
And for those of you wondering, just go clockwise of E to get your 7th scale degree of B diminished... but we probably don't care about that.
So just GLANCING at the circle of fifth tells us right away 1) all the notes in a major scale 2) all of the triads/chords you can make within that scale
In a matter of seconds you know ALL of the diatonic chords of a major scale... this is just the tip of the iceberg of how useful the circle of fifths is! (more to come)
Shut your goddamn hole. Diatonicism is a tired meme. Its all about symmetry now
Zachary Reyes
Highlighted the appropriate areas to show the relation better...
So once again using C major as our example we see that C - major I chord D - minor ii chord E - minor iii chord F - major IV chord G - major V chord A - minor VI chord B - diminished vii chord
This highlighted area works where ever you move it.
It also works for the minor keys...
Using A minor as our example A - minor 1 chord B - diminished ii chord C - major III chord D - minor iv chord E - minor v chord F - major VI chord G - major VII chord
this is just the beginning my friend! dont you worry
Alexander Phillips
people should understand how to diatonically... is that a word?... create music before learning how to break it!
Noah Jenkins
Soon ITT: gatekeeping from people who have never written anything of substance
Ian Barnes
I don't think so. I started by writing music using the 12 tone system of Josef Matthias Hauer and its produced fascinating results.
I mean... it sounds cool and all... and i guess if the only thing you want to write is non-function harmonies and melodies, you got it down. But I enjoy playing with chord functions and expectations and resolutions so... different strokes my friend. I prefer the challenge of learning how to break the norm rather than just randomly doing shit and hope for results.
anyways, back on topic!
Jackson Miller
Once again referring back to the circle of fifths... you can also use them for learning the modes of the major scale very easily... lets start by arranging the modes properly in terms of brightness/darkness
Taking Lydian as the example... you see I noted that its +1 note brighter than Ionian. So if you rotate the C major scale (using only the outside ring) 1 note clockwise, you'll see that it changes from F to F#. Making our new scale the C Lydian. For the other modes, rotate the outside circle COUNTER CLOCKWISE what ever the number is.
Want to play is C Dorian? Rotate 2 notes back replacing the B and E with Bb and Eb, giving us C Dorian!
Bentley Smith
Maybe you're right but I cant shake the feeling that diatonicism is an incomplete picture of the puzzle and therefore somewhat arbitrary. I'd say those mostly don't go anywhere because they were a couple sketches I made as a proof of concept where the second one was truer to form in that the melodic line was derived from the chords (which in turn shared no common notes). I think the theory can easily be applied on a larger scale by someone more talented. Dallapicolla for instance.
I mean why conform to 12 notes... why not go microtonal while you're at it? or why even instruments... especially instruments with fixed intervals! fuck! lets just not listen to music because it's conformist!
Just make a song of someone coughing on a loop and break a few pieces of glass then listen to grass grow! BAM! MIND BLOWING MUSIC!
Pick the most likely scenario for that youtube song you posted... It was written with: A) no knowledge of music theory B) an absurd amount of music theory
Quit shitposting...
Carter Parker
I actually would if it were a) practical in a DAW and b) I had the inherent musicality to hear microtones and understand their function. At any rate I can attest to their potential.
The answer is "B". I never questioned music theory. Stop being such a defensive cunt. Even my initial post was mostly humorous. I'm not that upset about adherence to the theory that produced over 3 centuries of superlative music. However I think alternative systems are viable. The most important thing is that someone is systematizing in the first place.
Isaiah Ramirez
sounds like an old modem trying to dial up at christmas time. I'll pass on that lol.
It just seems like noise for the sake of making noise to me. Don't get me wrong, I'm not AGAINST the idea, but it doesn't seem well composed (this is obviously subjective.) The whole song just sounds like unstable rubbish that doesn't lead anywhere... and that seems to be the ONLY thing people like this can write with a more complicated system. Once again, I feel like its a compositional problem more than anything.
MY whole point is that you learn the system so you know how to break the system.
Tyler Evans
if you want someone that know so much theory he can break it and still make beautiful music check this guy out
>calling a piece of orchestral music a "song" >writing off a piece based on its instrumentation >can't handle the polyphony
Yeah, you're the true musical one here user.
Jayden Russell
other than the format, how exactly is this orchestral it doesn't appear to contain any real instruments in this recording, maybe it would sound fine with real instruments instead of the shitshow it turned in to in that video lol
So yes... I think you can easily write off a piece of music as garbage by the selection of instruments or lack thereof
the problem isn't with the dissonance or polyphony specifically, but the fact that the whole piece is nothing but dissonance... and once again... that seems to be the only thing that CAN be written by people interested in things like this
I find it ironic and humorous that using a more structured system like standard music theory actually yields more unique outcomes than the garbage that comes out of microtonal systems that all sound the same, even though they have far more musical options
Joshua Garcia
its not but the other thing you called a song was literally called "Variations for Orchestra"
Kevin Walker
where should I start if I want to learn music theory?
Blake Taylor
grasping at straws man... grasping at straws... you're quite pathetic lol
Lucas Brown
reading what i posted here will help
joining the discord chat will help even more.
Lucas Cox
Wow an actually useful Discord didn't think that was possible
Hudson Mitchell
I don't know what the fuck any of that means. I need a start.
Ryder Nelson
lol then you should probably join the discord... also what instrument are you learning?
Leo Murphy
so you're going to say this utilizing modes of limited transposition
If you think that then you need to spend less time theorizing and more time listening to a wider range of music
Brody Gonzalez
bump
Luke Mitchell
I don't know what y'all are talking about this is beautiful
Tyler Cook
see now... that second piece is actually very well orchestrated. there's a clear sense of feeling there and it DOESN'T sound like garbage...
also, you need to spend less time trying to force your idiotic views down other peoples throats... get over it faggot, i play music with 12 notes. (i mean, this is Sup Forums still, so I'm obligated to call you a fag)
Logan Lee
Very nice explanations, keep it up! Will there be more parts to this thread?
Luis Robinson
You know that guy who actually becomes imaginatively stifled by music theory, that anti-theorists use as an excuse to never learn music theory? That's OP
Zachary Walker
Only one thing I posted is microtonal. Are you tone deaf? Holy shit dude.
Camden Roberts
I was under the impression you were showing me microtonal videos and given that 2 of the 3 pieces sounded like ass, i assumed they were
I was more impressed with the 2nd video on here thinking it was microtonal
I'm trying to think of what else to post... asking questions in discord is probably easier if you're looking for specific information
David Nguyen
>it doesn't appear to contain any real instruments in this recording, maybe it would sound fine with real instruments instead of the shitshow it turned in to in that video lol It was recorded using a synthesizer purely for practical reasons. Saying you don't like the sounds isn't really critiquing the composition. The composition is excellent.
Cameron Jones
>and once again... that seems to be the only thing that CAN be written by people interested in things like this someone's not listening
also 16 equal in particular is quite weird; if you don't like it or understand it, that's not an indictment of microtonal music as a whole. maybe if you took the time to understand what intervals were available in 16 equal, you'd understand why it sounds the way it does. it's not purely dissonance, but many of the expected intervals aren't there
Elijah Clark
if you can't immediately tell the difference between microtonal music written in highly unusual temperaments and dissonant or atonal music written in 12 equal, maybe you're just dumb
also if you see the name Messiaen you can be pretty sure it's not going to be microtonal
Joshua Diaz
How do I write city pop instrumentals on synth
Gabriel Thomas
lots of jazz chords
Jaxson Howard
Not to mention how can you not be swept away by those ethereal chords. He's considered one of the most important composers of the 20th century for a reason
