Modern Classical hate thread

Why does modern classical sound so ugly and dull compared to the likes of Mozart and Bach? How did classical end up like this? And how do we fix it?

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>mozart

>Modern classical
>New
>Classic

There's your problem. We need to stop making it.

Because people don't have appreciation for what sounds good.
They would rather do whats easy or do whats unique.

If you want good compositions pick up a text book and start learning. Don't be a retard that acts as if they know music because they can play piano.

You leave that little sweetheart alone, she's going to make us all happier.

she's gonna become Eric Whitacre 2.0

further proof that mozart is underrated

Someone is jealous of her genius! That's not how we treat the smart people!

Modern classical is the best kind though, fuck you

1) Seh will become the aural equivalent of Kinkade.
2) You need to go back to facebook.

Deutscher's melodious music may help to change the prevailing attitudes in contemporary classical music and inject a new life into the world of opera, by steering it back towards melody

In February 2017, Deutscher herself made a statement about her style, her love of melody and her musical aesthetics, in a message to a press conference of the Carinthian Summer Music Festival in Austria. She explained that some people have expressed to her the view that one should not compose beautiful melodies in the 21st century, but that music must reflect the complexity and ugliness of the modern world. "But I think that these people just got a little bit confused. If the world is so ugly, then what's the point of making it even uglier with ugly music?"

Maybe I will, more intelligent conversations with my friends than you retards on here.

While I agree with you, if the talent isn't fundamentally there no amount of studying or practice will help you develop it.

People still compose in old styles but it's generally for games or film or whatever. From an artistic standpoint everyone got super bored with it.

Making kitsch doesn't inject new life into anything.

What you're calling talent is really potential, and it's not discovered until you make a very serious effort. No one is innately a skilled composer. Child prodigies learn quickly but they're still learning.

Damn... nice dubs...

she's an idiot. Who can listen to these and say they aren't beautiful. Adherence to diatonicism has nothing to do with beauty.

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>Why does modern classical sound so ugly and dull compared to the likes of Mozart and Bach?
because the kike academia decided the world shouldnt know happiness or elating art ever again because the (((holocaust))) happened. its true look it up.
>How did classical end up like this?
because of kike academia influence.
>And how do we fix it?
we must erradicate the kikes. they are caustic to any culture. they think we should live immersed in this eternal soup of ironic culture thats heavily nihilistic in essence. they want our spirits to be dead, so we must kill them to be free again.

talent/potential the word doesn't matter. If it isn't fundamentally there it never will be. That's why some people can't write songs to save their lives but some can figuratively shit out songs and they're amazing and well written. I get what you're saying, but again if there isn't something there to grow there never will be.

>everyone got super bored with it
why would everyone get bored with making beauiful music??.....so stupid

Yeah but calling it talent is assuming that you'll never be able to do something that you can't already do. As though you're born able to do it and don't earn it through effort. That's retarded. The only thing you're born with is intelligence and aptitude. Not talent.

youtube.com/watch?v=5AsaCNqfRAE

youtube.com/watch?v=gd0dMs0MTg8

Translation: Its hard so I won't try

>why do people get bored
I don't know, were conditioned to have attention spans or 30 seconds now a days vs back then when you'd have hours and hours of next to nothing so a 4 hour opera wouldn't seem like an eternity now a days. I don't feel that way personally, but it's more society's fault then our own.We need everything now, we can't wait.

Because at some point during the early 20th century, we realized that obtaining the achievable goal of "happiness" was simply impossible. We realized that to appreciate and enjoy like far more we needed to be in tune with all of our emotions rather than aiming our lives to silence them... Not to mention two world wars in the span of half a century kind of kills all the notion of possibility and optimism, leading to new forms of expression and artistic mediums, sound began to be explored challenging our previously ingrained understanding of beauty, doubly so in painting/sculpture.

An artist who just does something that's already been done without contributing anything new is a hack. And by the beginning of the 20th century there wasn't much left to contribute to "beautiful" music.

Any avant garde composer can always be a hack. They studied counterpoint and common practice tonality like everyone else (save for people like Xenakis who came from other backgrounds). They're just not interested in going that direction.

>modern classical
I don't think you know what "classical" means.

>two world wars in the span of half a century kind of kills all the notion of possibility and optimism
not for me, i live pretty far away from your "world war" territory (which was confined to a very tiny space) and its pretty damn chill here and has been forever. you shouldnt universalize your bitterness.

well I shouldn't say nothing to do with it, or maybe I shouldn't call it diatonicism. But if you ask me the 20th century certainly produced the ugliest music we have but it also produced a great deal of the most beautiful music that we'll ever hear.

you already know where I'm gonna ask you to go but anyway

this is complete nonsense and doesn't address the previous comments at all

Just sounds like a bunch of messy shit.

even /classical/ calls modernist works small "c" "classical" for the sake of convenience. Right here buddy

>if you try hard enough you can be good at anything
What you said was retarded. I agree, if you teach someone something enough you can be able to write music as if Mozart, Bach, Beethoven or Wagner never died. But I wouldn't consider doing something in the style of as talent. Talent in composing very much includes your own voice. If you can write like Mozart, great, but we have Mozart so you are pointless. If you have elements of Mozart but a bit of Wagner, Bruckner and hints of Brahms in there with stuff that is you, and the pieces work, that's something that can't be learned. It can be brought out of you, but if it isn't there it can never be learned. also some people are naturally driven people some are not, it wouldn't be completely retarded to say that there are other things some people have that others don't. The world isn't Rudy buddy, it's cruel and sucks. I don't give a fuck about this kid or her compositions, and she might have the potential to be a genius composer down the road. But if it isn't there fundamentally, it never will be.

>even /classical/

>I am tone deaf the post

Go back to your fruity loops, knave

When is Hiroshima going to build a wall to keep Sup Forums emigrants from shitting up other boards?

And /classical/ is retarded. It's not convenient. It's wrong. Classical means old.

Why should I care about your own retarded attempts at defining 'talent' and your beliefs about growth/cultivating a skill?
Save your gay ass nigger faggot words

I'm a pianist. Listen to bach and you'll notice it as structure. The music you posted is a bunch of messy rolling around on a scale bullshit. If you want good contemporary pieces, take a look at Debussy or Satie.

Ok? Your point user?
Wouldn't you be pretty depressed if two world wars happened in the span of a half a century in your continent? one of which containing the most heinous war crimes ever committed? Would you be all cheerful and want to right "beautiful" pieces, no wonder composers were drawn to atonality, it perfected summed up the feelings of an entire generation.

t failed composer

turbopleb

if anything it's a less stupid term than calling it art music or serious music

but then "Classical classical" is retarded too

classical doesn't mean old, it means the highest point in the aesthetic development of some discipline.

>contemporary pieces... Debussy or Satie
>Satie regardless
you are retarded

Shit is that image accurate? If so, good for her, I hope she continues with that mission unabated by time and the pressure of others.

>reee pol
not an argument. well the whole academia was shamed to fuck if they even dared to create uplifting music BECAUSE REMEMBER THE 6 MILLION GOY. can you deny just that fact?

its like thinking the 2000s as "post 9/11", just burger delusion. why everyone should share americans paranoia and cultural bitterness, just because they got fucked in the ass once?

that has nothing to do with what I said, you're moving goalposts

if anything, having a unique and interesting artistic vision isn't related to proficiency/training or even basic aptitude. they're completely different

it's not 70s anymore, no one really gives John Adams shit for composing accesible music, pseudo romanticist saccharine shitters just need to believe serialists are still usurping academia to have an excuse why no one cares about them

>implying music from the 20th century isn't contemporary
>implying satie is bad because he's popular

>hurr durr life is shit lets make life shitter by composing shitty sounding music

this is you

People can make the music they want.

If you think Mozart is bad you're crazy.

If you think Schoenberg is bad you're equally crazy.

If you think Stockhausen is bad you're equally crazy.

nice bait, i'll give you that homo

it's literally not and satie is shit

wow, sorry your view of the world is so narrow, you're really missing out on a lot

Your post is a mess of words. Try to give it some structure.

eh, the thing is, the ball was rolling on that shit already before WW1 (Wagner, Edvard Munch, etc.) and Europe had suffered through previous things that were at least as bad (bubonic plague or whatever). It's not a fitting narrative. You could say war/violence inspired certain things (Guernica) but not all of it

kek

dont worry the weight of the world will crush her soul soon enough

JIDF is seething

he's not shit but he's not one of the greats either; he wrote a handful of good things but quite spotty overall, and doesn't compare well with Debussy, Ravel, Scriabin, etc.

>when someone calls you Sup Forums it's le Sup Forums boogeyman and not an argument
>when you call someone JIDF though that's okay
Le angry polman pls

You're right, telling you to fuck off is not an argument. it's telling you to fuck off. please fuck off.

yeah, academia is pretty open to lots of stuff, cherry picking stupid Boulez quotes doesn't mean he speaks for everyone

user... children understand the concept of embracing emotion better than you do.
Watch Pixar's Inside Out, it will clearly teach you a little something about living a more fruitful and balanced life.
Also
>reddit spacing
I never said all of it, with technology on the advance in the 20th century it's clear to see why it had a more profound effect on art than say a plague would or did.
And yes, a majority of the early 20th century music was Neoclassicism/Romantic, however some of the biggest and most influential movements in the 20th century were Impressionism, Minimalism, Expressionism and Postmodern music etc. And the biggest techniques being Atonality and the twelve-tone technique. All of which were considered by some to be natural exploration of musical language, while other site the World Wars as a core contributor to the growing Avant-Garde sty lings of the 20th century.

>I'm a pianist

Barry Harris would like to have a word with you

youtube.com/watch?v=HCG7RTblu1I

>Debussy or Satie

Now I know for a fact you don't know what you're talkign about. The impressionist milieu for one thing is in no way "contemporary"; its barely modern. Furthermore both of those composers scoffed at the idea of structure and it shows in their music. The latter was doing exactly what you criticized those masters of doing, noodling around on a piano. In fact Satie was an absolute diletante and Faure who taught him said he was the laziest student he ever had. Ravel was the impressionist Mozart, he took the idiom established by Debussy and


Furthermore I certainly wont deny that Bach has an architecture in his music that will scarcely be achieved ever again but how is that relevant? I listen to Bach often and with tremendous alacrity. Bach even has tone rows explicitly included in a couple of his compositions because above all he was of a hermetic disposition. The Bachian spirit is what predominated over the development of modernist music, experimentation as a matter of intellectual curiosity. Looking towards the natural world and its laws to evoke a beauty that would be different in kind and could not ultimately be found in the mere emotional manipulation of romantic period music.

*and perfected it*

>20th century isn't contemporary
Yes it is.

They didn't scoff at structure, they scoffed at tradition. Just because it's too slow for you to stay in time with doesn't mean it doesn't have structure.

You realize the Barry Harris video you posted is him complaining about pianists not understanding the structure of the music they're playing, right? He'd like to have a word with YOU.

>They didn't scoff at structure, they scoffed at tradition.
like Schoenberg?

>ugly

subjective

classical poptimists are the worst

>Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Schubert, Vivaldi, Brahms the list goes on xDD

To be honest, from experience classical composers tend to continue unabated if their goal and purpose is pure. Hence why there are so many great composers out there.

What does she say in the video that has you so incensed?

No, you're just a loser who isn't willing to put in the work.

Well you're the "professional" here. If you say that those sound like noise then you're just a poseur, sorry. I don't even really care what your level of technical proficiency is, that has nothing to do with your overall musical understanding or ear (which is clearly crap). You're a poseur, deal with it.

I'm not incensed, calling people idiots casually is board culture. I mean, strictly speaking, its probably more ridiculous to call her an idiot given her age. Anyway I just disagree with the fact that she conflates premodern with beautiful. Her favorite composer is Strauss ffs.

seriously, how can any "pianist" not like Rautavaara or Messiaen?

>I don't really care what your level of technical proficiency is
>You're a poseur
Pick one.

youtube.com/watch?v=YkJW-zX9pAY
i love this guy

A computer can play a bunch of keys according to what a score says. That doesn't involve any kind of aesthetic appreciation at all.

...

You think computers are poseurs?

I'm watching the video now, and it seems she just fell prey to bad teachers with malformed attitudes towards music composition. She then proceeds to make strawmen to illustrate her cartoonish enemies. She says "some people have told me" - who?

She's just a child and she's caught up in a paradigm of a musical world that exists probably only in Europe. American schools are far more open to anything and everything, including writing modal counterpoint and fugues. So she's just young and naive, she still has a lot to learn.

She's talented so let her have it. I do however hope that she outgrows this juvenile view of musical composition because there are a lot of elements of traditional compositional techniques and practices that have yet to be modernized. Who knows, maybe in her dissertation (she seems the type to make it to doctorate) she'll make some strides in this regard. We will have to wait and see.

Have you listened to her music? Her Violin concerto is childish, as you'd expect, and full of cliches and other classic errors. Some good things here and there, but hey, she's a kid. Let's wait and see.

LMAO top fucking bait right here lads, learn from it

you seem upset. Let me guess, you're Asian?

>race projecting now

damn this is indeed a top baiter

also not the same fella, sharpen your skills kiddo

no but computers that pretend to understand music just because they can play it really fast, which are called Chinese people, certainly fall under that categorization.

Kek, you caught me, /por/. This whole time I've been a chinaman. Ching ching chong you uncover my devious prot!

Okay, I think we can reach a compromise. How about we both just agree that you're an idiot?

How about I peepee in your coke?

lol Sup Forums is full of the worst inhuman morons. Pity them, make fun of them, never take them seriously.

If you admit you have 0 musical appreciation its a deal.

you're confusing classic and classical, two different words

How many musical appreciations can a person have at the maximum?

op you are dumb as a box of rocks. I do see your point. I'm doing my PhD in music history at a west-coast school and all the composers here are just new-complexity cucks who write music that is essentially unlistenable. Plus they all look like dwarves from Lord of the Rings. meanwhile, if I was on the east coast, it'd be the same thing but with cookie-cutter post-minimalism that could put an audience to sleep if they were on fire. But to say that 'modern classical' (end your life) 'sounds ugly and dull compared to the likes of Mozart, Bach, etc.' is just phenomenal cretinism. Anyone who wrote in the style of any of these composers today would be laughed out of the concert hall because they embodied and perfected their idioms to the point that it is not possible to improve upon them. the fact that many of today's composers are still searching for a sound that resonates with the audiences of today is a good thing - it's just that they haven't necessarily found it yet.

all of them

>beauty is subjective

it's true you dumb cunt
why do you think what is considered "beautiful" varies throughout cultures and history?

>Why does modern classical sound so ugly
Probably because all the beautiful pieces have already been written so to avoid being derivative modern composers just decide to go "le random xd" with it

>its a white people thinking elevator music is deep af thread
lmfao bruh

t Psuedo LARPing as a Music Major