Is this some kind of fucking joke?

Is this some kind of fucking joke?

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youtu.be/HXFKWBUFm-E
youtube.com/watch?v=_TGWdXJvFcA
bobostertag.wordpress.com/computer-music-sucks/
youtu.be/Omtbbs0QBWE
youtu.be/Nh7tVwcknb4
youtu.be/u81IGEFt7dM
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Your life is a fucking joke faggot

t. Ghost of Stockhausen

no. you know those shitty """"""""""""""""experimental"""""""""""""""" bandcamp accounts? he did it first.

Stick to the synthwave and hip hop mate

At least those genres are listenable

Sup Forums-males on Arca/Vektroid/OPN/Autechre
>wow this is so next level this will be the music we'll be listening to in 5000 years from now on how can other artists even compete?

Sup Forums-males on Stockhausen/Xenakis/Subotnick/Babbitt
>is this some joke

It's all fucking terrible.

stockhausen just makes bleeps for the fuck of it, then claims it's the only """""real"""""" music

ebin

Nice argument

Stockhausen was objectively a genius. go back to listening to your nu-male electronic music that is nothing more than a dilution of ideas Stockhausen set forth over a half-century ago

youtube.com/watch?v=zv-I-CNv3JI

Who cares if it has never been done before. It still sounds like shit.

Sounding good wasn't exactly the point. I mean yeah, you could treat it as some ambient piece and get a certain amount of enjoyment out of it. There are no melodies, though, so treating it as straightforward music would be the wrong route.

>tfw to stoopid 4 stockhousen

All those other artists are very listenable unlike those composers

I just said Arca sucks and so does Stockhausen. It's all fuckaround for edgelords.

Numale with permadry eye ball syndrome

>Numale with permadry eye ball syndrome
Wow you really got him good. How will he ever recover?

I appreciate the technicality of this, he was obviously very proficient at sound design. But it doesn't sound very musical. It evokes some emotions, but they all fade so quick cause it's ever changing that it's hard to tell what he as actually trying to do

>It's all fuckaround for edgelords.
>But it doesn't sound very musical.

self-portrait of a pseudo-intellectual, socially inept manchild?

m.youtube.com/watch?v=zv-I-CNv3JI

Mandatory viewing for plebeians who don’t stay open to or accept music they don’t like at first or understand

wrong
stockhausen is music for pseudo-intellectuals

>YOU DON'T GET IT
>IT'S SUPPOSE TO SOUND LIKE GARBAGE

>ugh like where are the sick drops lol. how am i supposed to put this on at the party

>DUDE FUCK THE LISTENER, LET ME STROKE MY EGO ON STAGE LMAO

I'm no expert on Stockhausen, but it doesn't take one to realize that the music is not meant to "sound good". It's most likely meant to explore the ideas he had about sound design.

you are what's wrong with this board, you slack-jawed fuck. go back to the starbucks drive through, you didn't put milk in my coffee the first time.

yeah what's with the analysis? It's basically about how he made the sounds, and how he combined electronic sounds with vocals. Innovative at the time, not so much in 2017

>drinking starbucks

Art isn't meant to coddle you, you stupid fucking pleb

>Innovative at the time, not so much in 2017
Stockhausen and Xenakis still sound lightyears ahead of Arca and OPN

take a xanax dude, i was just joking around. I kinda like stuff like this actually, I'm watching that analysis now

Lets talk about cute hipster girls instead...

you say this but there's a good percentage of Sup Forums that would mean it unironically

a challenger appears
youtube.com/watch?v=o7Gzy1hGDg0

what does Sup Forums think about the best composer of the 21st century?

hmmmm yessss, interesting, I totally get this on first listen, cause I'm sophisticated like that *strokes non existent beard*

The absolute state if this board, depressing.

GTFO, degenerate

Meh, I like Nono and Dockstaders work better

What, you want people to lick stockhausen's feet in unison? What do you expect from posting an album like that on a board with k-pop as the leading thread?

You sound like a little pseud bitch. Who do you think you are?

...

...

*blocks ur path

the thing is the reality I live in is even worse

...

well that's a party pooper, now let's get back to bashing stockhausen

Age?

>tfw to stoopid not to fall for b8
(You)

The tier list for electronic music, top to bottom, best to worst, goes:

Really dense computer music/granular synthesis from the 70s, 80s, and 00s (Dhomont, Truax, Nechvatal, the loads of 70s GRM comps, etc.)

(mostly) 21st century popular musicians who have been experimenting (Autechre, qebrus, in some ways OPN, Ryuji Ikeda, Fennesz, etc.)

The guys that actually know how to make electroacoustic/improvisation interesting (Keith Rowe, Otomo Yoshihide, Michael Pisaro, Kevin Drumm when he's making noisy shit)

Popular electronic music (Aphex, Kraftwerk, Daft Punk, etc.)

Early real-time granular synthesis guys from the late 80s into the 90s (a couple of the same names in the toppest tier honestly)

Guys who have no clue how to make electroacoustic/improvisation music interesting (all the other Japanese guys, Graham Lambkin/Jason Lescalleet, also Kevin Drumm when he's not making noisy shit, etc.)

Outdated 50s/60s primitive garbage electronic music (Schaffer, Xenakis, Stockhausen, Dodstacker, Nono, Subotnick, Varese, etc.)

Does industrial fall into tier 4 or 6?

4. It's experimental in nature, but not always electroacoustic, and always popular music by definition. I should've had Throbbing Gristle there as an example though.

I don't think anyone that matters actually holds these opinions

>quality is affected by time

what about graham lambkin and jason lescalleet don't you like?

>has 70s music as top tier
>still strawmanning that the tier list is about newer=better
Terrible troll, here's your (you)

lmao

I didn't do that, I criticized your use of "outdated". How exactly does time affect the quality of Stockhausen's music? Was it good at the time of composition? And then the passage of time magically made it bad?

If you come from a pop music persepective you won't really enjoy this album or realize why it's great

Decent system, but Mimaroglu breaks the mold. He's better than granular dudes even though he comes from boring ass Princeton Columbia scene.

>Novars salutes the birth of musique concrète, the Ars Nova of our century, by calling upon the resources of the computer. The intention is not to create a pastiche but, on the contrary, to testify that by the most advanced means a language has been passed on.
what exactly does passing on a language by the most advanced means mean?

time causes the context of stockhausen's music to shift in regards to modern electronic music. it doesn't make it bad, it makes it outdated. whether you believe outdated is "bad" is up to you (if you believe outdated is bad btw you're probably a close-minded idiot).
the passage of time doesn't make it bad, it just makes it harder for you to get into the mindset of someone listening to it when it came out originally. now that we've have decades of electronic music evolution, you can find plenty of artists using the same techniques to greater effect.

I listened to two albums. One where they do a "real life sounds" kinda thing, which pales in comparison to works like La Stazione and Supersedure as it doesn't work as well due to lack of cohesion in each piece and a lack of variety of other things happening which makes the whole work lose its believability. Then there's the other one with mostly piano which sounded like a lazy ass take on lowercase music.

Lescalleet's chopped n screwed track, 7, is top tier as fuck though: youtu.be/HXFKWBUFm-E
It hasn't aged well. At the earliest stages of electronic music it only becomes more obvious that these guys had very little clue about how the technology they are using actually worked, which limited the progression of the musical ideas they wanted to work with.

fpbp

its bad so i must be smart to listen to it

>At the earliest stages of electronic music it only becomes more obvious that these guys had very little clue about how the technology they are using actually worked, which limited the progression of the musical ideas they wanted to work with.
that's the point. they were experimenting with extremely advanced technology and the idea behind early electronic compositions is for the listener to think to themselves "how the hell did you make these sounds." it was also a challenge to other composers and musicians to use this new ground breaking technology in a more musical context. why do you think kraftwerk was such a revolutionary group?

He wrote his best shit in the 70s though, so he should be there with the top tier guys. Due to his approach to using synths, some of it can be considered computer music, too.

i'll have to check out La Stazione and Supersedure. Though i'd like to hear what you think of Lambkin's Salmon Run
youtube.com/watch?v=_TGWdXJvFcA

Yeah, and that's cool...until the gimmick of the timbre wears off in time. Like, none of that was cool anymore once more guys started doing shit like that.

> you can find plenty of artists using the same techniques to greater effect

than people like Stockhausen and Xenakis? Are you fucking kidding me?

One of Stockhausen's influences was twiddling the knob of his tranny. Well this was before trannies were even invented but whatever.

Hearing snippets of different radio stations washing up through the static and then disappearing again was often what he was trying to duplicate in his electronic works. This is also regarded as a kind of metaphor for the disorganised state of things, music, politics, society, during the 20th century. Although you could say that disorganised, conflicting voices is even more pronounced now in the 21st century the whole idea of playing with a radio in that was is certainly outdated now. Not only is radio less common, there is no analogue tuning these days.

>"""""listenable""""" means good

>primitive
>missing the point of electronic music this hard
>all that typing for nothing

Cool, I'll check it out. La Stazione is by Herbert Distel btw since it just means the station in italian.
All that shit talk with no real points in there. Why did you even post?

tape, modulation, and sampling? loads of electronic artists are using these techniques to make music nowadays, and are using them more intelligently than stockhausen and xenakis ever could have, given

*given the technological constraints they were working within

lmao at calling "really dense computer music/granular synthesis" top-tier while shelving Xenakis at the bottom rung. you're a fucking retard

Xenakis is MUCH simpler than that stuff, in every way imaginable. Like you can make an argument of course that "b-but Xenakis started it all!" but that's where it all ends, because later on composers managed to make far more dense, colorful, and interesting music than Xenakis ever could.

name 5 artists creating large-scale computer music at a level surpassing Persepolis or La Legende D'Eer. the fact is that computer music past the 80s is a conceptual dead-end. Xenakis completely exhausted the vocabulary the medium is capable of

here's a good piece by a noted electroacoustic artist on the subject bobostertag.wordpress.com/computer-music-sucks/

So what is the better, not-outdated equivalent of Gesang der Junglinge?

>loads of electronic artists are using these techniques to make music nowadays
yes
>and are using them more intelligently than stockhausen and xenakis ever could
no

sure but I don't see what bearing that has on the question.

The Ballad of Yeatman

>take a sample of Mala - Changez, distort and compress the fuck out of it so a manlet can rap over top
wtf I'm literally smarter than Xenakis now !

Xenakis' most dense work is either Hibiki Hana Ma or LLD (if on 8 track), as the earlier is done on 12 track and the latter is on 8 track. They represent the peak of Xenakis' ability to have tiny details through very primitive, early takes on granular synthesis.

Hibiki: youtu.be/Omtbbs0QBWE
LLD: youtu.be/Nh7tVwcknb4

Here's a work from the 80s in a similar realm but taken to the next level using computer music: youtu.be/u81IGEFt7dM

As you can easily listen for, the latter is far more detailed/dense/layered (if you're deaf you can measure out grains if you want), far more colorful, and is shown capable of being far more progressive within a shorter amount of time.

That article is shit because he wrote 1000s of words for literally saying "all this sounds the same to me so it sucks" when that can't be further from the truth in the actuality of what's happening.

Like, shit I was gonna post Shaman Ascending also by Barry Truax to show that it's not even the same sounding shit from the same damn composer, forget acting like the entire scene's that uniform. But I can't find an available version on the internet. Anyway it has a completely different structure from River Run up there with sounds that are inuit chant inspired rather than sounding like the flow of water in River Run.

Then there's Joseph Nechvatal's Viral SymphOny which creates an artificial life program to have the music's structure unfold like a Viral Phenomenon. The first movement here alone has more sounds than the whole of LLD by Xenakis, here's the 4th movement though cuz again not easily available on the net on places like YouTube: youtu.be/Zpekscwi0wQ

t Mahler is better than Mozart brainlet

>wordpress
opinion is immediately discarded

>not knowing who Bob Ostertag is
well you're not missing much anyway, it's retarded
tl;dr: >muh analog

>the fact is that computer music past the 80s is a conceptual dead-end.
You know that goes for like every application of Max/MSP ever, right?

Also, strictly speaking, Xenakis only made pretty unlistenable shitty computer music. You could say he paved the way for noise artists, etc. but he sure as hell didn't "exhaust the vocabulary the medium is capable of".

>the fact is that computer music past the 80s is a conceptual dead-end
elaborate on this?

Harsh....
but factual.

You managed to say nothing in this paragraph.

the article he's linking to basically just says that granular synthesis is overused in electroacoustic music, which is consequently sort of stuck in a rut. that's not totally inaccurate (although there are plenty of composers still making good music), but it doesn't follow from this that "computer music past the 80s is a conceptual dead-end". that's retarded

It hurts

well the first line of the article is literally
>“Computer Music” per se is, at least for the moment, at something of a dead end.
I think it's stagnant right now maybe but it's certainly not at a dead end

the thing is, it really isn't, and it never was, since everyone using Max or whatever is doing "computer music" just as much as someone at IRCAM or whatever

And really the article is dated now, it might have applied better in like 2008 or whatever, but things have moved on; academic programs are a lot broader than they were

Ostertag is just being cranky