So this whole movie is pointless now that we know the first order shows up later right?

So this whole movie is pointless now that we know the first order shows up later right?

No, because Star Wars has always been more about the characters than the space politics.

Not really. It's kind of like the end of WWI. Yes the war was over but a lot of shit was left unresolved and it led to WW2. .

Even without TFA, the death of the emperor would have meant admirals scattering their fleets and getting in power struggles, making it easier for a unified new republic to pick them off. Likely, you'd have remnants wanting to hold onto their might for as long as possible, and sneaking off into unknown regions.

No because anything that Disney puts out should not be part of your own personal Star Wars cannon

All the sequels are pointless because in the end everything we ever do, everyone we ever know, every memory of everything that ever happened will vanish into dust. Eventually all of our effort, our victories and defeats, loves and sorrows all come to mean nothing.

Wouldn't the Republic have put an end to the first order?

then why are finn, rey, kylo, and poe such terrible characters

Can you be in the next film, Werner?

>your own personal Star Wars cannon

No such thing unless you're autistic, and also,

>cannon

and building the largest weapon in the history of the galaxy (including the Star Forge, if that's even a thing anymore).

It makes perfect sense that there would still be remnants of the Empire. The Emperor and Vader are dead but the infrastructure is still in place.

What doesn't make sense is the "resistance", how can you be the fucking resistance if you're part of the Republic? Though I guess that one imperial officer said that the Republic was denying that they had anything to do with the Resistance, which is clearly horseshit considering it's being head up by Leia of all people. But none of that matters because the entire Republic government got blown up by the Starkiller.

The whole original trilogy is

How can antifa kiddos be rebellious when they're part of the establishment's status quo machinery? It's the same thing basically

Because it's a terrible movie.

JJ Abrams

>movie is literally called "Return of the Jedi"
>TFA comes along
>WOOPS guess they all died off-screen lol XDDD pls see the next movie

bad writing

Yes. The old fragmentation of the Empire was actually done quite well in the Old Eu. Now it's fucked up

So like everything else basically

JJ Abrams didn't really care/understand for any sort of sensible political situation. The "space politics" were totally gay in the prequels right? So he just made it Empire vs Rebels again and let the EU authors try to make sense of it.

So technically, the "Resistance" resists the First Order in the Outer Rim.

So how comes the remnants of the Empire are still this powerful?
It's been roughly 20 years by now. Is the Republic really this incompetent?

>personal Star Wars cannon
You mean your imagination?

t. RLM drone

yep. TFA is an insult to Lucas, really the entire original trilogy is meaningless now because we know there is just a bigger, better deathstar going to be built by a group of people with less resources and manpower than the original empire

pottery be damned, it's just lazy writing. Disney just wanted to make as much money as possible and they didn't give a fuck about original storytelling

Jedi is both the singular and plural noun user.

In this case of ROTJ, it's obviously referring to Luke (and perhaps by extension Vader redeeming himself, as the last of the original Jedi).

I consider RLM cancer if is true that this criticism has been so influential.

The setting of TFA is a nonsense.

"my dick is bigger than Lucas"
- J.J. Abrams

TFA is essentially this. Any deluded fanboy that thinks otherwise is rejecting this sad reality.

RLM didn't invent the hatred for worldbuilding in the prequels there was a simpsons ep that did the same thing in 2002.

But yeah I never had much of an issue with the space politics in the prequels but the lack of any sort of explanation for what was going on in TFA left me confused. Had no idea what was going on.

J.J. is just a fucking dolt who didn't care to spend any amount of time explaining the First Order for us, most likely because he didn't have a fucking clue, and because he figured the books/spin-offs/endless Disney shill machine would figure that out for him long after he was gone.

The First Order should not exist, or at least should not be in possession of a weapon the size of the planet, after so much hooplah was made about a weapon the size of a moon.

I liked Kylo, he was an arrogant brat and a nice change of pace from Vader and the Emperor.

Rey was simply too talented at too many different things to be relate able. She's a scavanger AND a talented mechanic AND capable of flying the falcon AND able to fire a blaster accurately for the the first time AND use the force AND use a lightsaber.

Finn didn't act like a traumatized former child solider at all, he was the old jokey negro sidekick stereotype.

>Setting in TFA is never explained or shown at all and is left confusing as fuck
>"Why is it still rebels vs empire" is all I can think about
>"wtf why is there a republic too. What is going on"
>"wait what's this planet that got blown up was it courascant? Looked like it..."
>"How did they get a bigger death star"

Yet the defense I got for this was the movie had to spend time on the characters and relationships and not the "boring" political setting. Yet Abrams wasted 12 minutes on that stupid tentacle monster rampage scene that didn't add anything to the movie whatsoever. Could have EASILY shown the political setting in those 12 minutes. Hell a passing sentence could have explained it.

I disagree with that, the movie was revolving around Luke having become a Jedi in his own right and the implication that he would take students of his own. Regardless of your interpretation of the title, the commonality between them is that the Jedi should have been present in some form following that movie, instead all we get is Max ranting about the force for a minute before dying.

We can talk semantics about it, but my point is that JJ fucked up by going down this route. Not just because it copies the original movie's premise (in a shittier way), but also because it disrespects the hopes of generations of fans that had been anticipating this new era of Star Wars since RotJ originally released.

No, in JJ's mind that retarded tentacle monster scene was absolutely paramount. He probably thought it was a great way to characterize Han.

JJ is so fucking mendacious, I literally would not feel bad if he got cancer of the rectum.

The only reason for the tentacle monster scene to exists is so Han Solo warms up to Finn and Rey. It's contrived as fuck but at least it's a way to reintroduce Han's character and quickly give him a connection to the main characters. It certainly could have been a lot shorter though.

What I thought was really contrived was the cantina planet. BB8 already knows where the resistance is, so why doesn't Han just fly them straight there? The only reason they go to that planet is so Rey finds Luke's lightsaber and then gets captured by Kylo Ren. So it's not because of any sensible character motivations, but because the plot demands it. Luke's lightsaber could have easily been in Leia's possession (and it would make a lot more sense than not-Yoda having it for unexplained reasons).

>We can talk semantics about it, but my point is that JJ fucked up by going down this route. Not just because it copies the original movie's premise (in a shittier way), but also because it disrespects the hopes of generations of fans that had been anticipating this new era of Star Wars since RotJ originally released.

Well, this I can sympathize with. Our only hope (hurrr) is that Rian Johnson will save the series, and the character of Luke. He has to right the ship JJ capsized.

I liked the idea behind Kylo's character, but he was made too damn strong for his own good in my opinion. Stopping a blaster bolt with the force is the first thing we see him do and that's completely above and beyond anything we've seen any Sith user do so far, even Darth Vader just blocked it with his hands. Then of course you have slaughtering all of Luke's students and defeating Luke, basically the most powerful living Jedi at the time, beating his ass so bad that he goes into hiding. But in the events of the rest of the movie, he's almost incompetent, he's practically a buffoon. Finn, a non Jedi, is holding his own against him in a lightsaber duel, he's defeated by Rey who just learned that the Force existed THAT FUCKING DAY, hell I'm convinced the only reason he was able to kill Han was because Harrison Ford actively wanted him to die. It's just inconsistent writing.

But they're amazing characters

look at this pig eating kike

>look at this pig eating kike

Sorry man but is true. "Star Wars is about the character" is what RLM drones repeat, because is what Plinkett says (understandably) in the prequel reviews, and is what the barely human Rick Evans implies when says that the SW universe cannot be expanded.

so "RLM drones" repeating that automatically falsifies the statement?

I said and I repeat it: TFA is two scripts merged. This is why Kylo's power level varies, this is why Han is so weird, this is why there is a Republic but a Resistance too.
And probably, this is why Finn is absorbed by Rey, other than, as people said in another thread, they want to sell movies to the Chinese and they have to tone down the presence of blacks.

RLM beginning the ideology that Star Wars can only be a small-scale quippy space adventure that's similar to the OT but also not is cancerous. The worst aspects of the Old EU were still better than TFA

F u poe and finn were awesome

you can keep thinking you have original thought buddy, I don't care. Now shut the fuck up, people are saying more interesting things in the thread, while you:
>But they're amazing characters
Can't stop being a retard.

Just shut up.

I was actually going to say something along those lines that it felt like a jumble of different scripts or writers with different ideas who didn't completely think things through.

Poe was saved "last minute". This gives you hints about how much effort they put in him.

Finn had potential (memes aside, I really like him), but:
- they gave him less conflict that was needed
- they suffocated him, turning him to quippy negro sidekick for the end of the movie
- he was absorbed by Marey Sue.

Disappointing.

>So this whole movie is pointless now that we know the Death Star gets destroyed later, right?

> a prequel to established role is the same thing that a sequel that shits on a finished trilogy and the character arcs of its protagonists

Let me guess, your mum call you "my special one", am i right?

No because the goal of the characters wasn't to destroy the death star in R1

Stop with this fucking anti-shilling

My big problem with Finn is that his backstory isn't taken seriously enough by the script. As soon as he hooks up with Poe he has no problem gunning down his former comrades. Not even a token gesture of hesitation or remorse. For someone who was supposedly programmed from childhood to be a stormtrooper, he turned traitor really easily.

No, she calls me her "little man", I fail to see what that has to do with anything though

>Bad guys keep building massive super weapons with obvious flaws
Poetry?
Will we get star killer 2.0?
Imperial engineers are Mexican intellectuals at this point.

Death Star 2 had no actual flaws in its final design. Which is why the rebels had to attack it before it was completed

Star Killer base having an even bigger and less defended vulnerability than the Death Star 1 was pretty dumb though.

>Yet the defense I got for this was the movie had to spend time on the characters and relationships and not the "boring" political setting

And that should be noted as a terrible defense because both ANH and ESB spent a around half an hour each with characters discussing politics, mainly the actions of the Empire and the ramifications for factions all around the galaxy. Just because the prequels had a lot of convoluted politics doesn't mean JJ had to eliminate basic exposition and world-building.

Yes, user.

You fail, indeed.

This is why is as if they wrote him in a previous draft, and then they cut him down.

I am seriously baffled by all those that think that TFA has well written characters.

R1 characters are shallow
TFA characters are hollow.

>no flaws
>not even finished
>shield that can be taken down by an army of koala bears
>have your leader and MVP on the vulnerable station
The imperials are so incompetent they deserved to slaughtered by the rebels.

>she calls me her "little man"
does she say it while stroking your cock and letting you suckle on her boobies

THIS

If you ask a normie about the Imperial Senate, they dont know what you're talking about. Its "the most influencial movie of our generation" but the nu-nerd culture doesn't even bother to watch the whole fucking movie.

I blame big bang theory.

1.) "Not even finished" is a nonsense argument. Everything has to be built. A sword that can pierce anything still has to be forged. The actual design when completed had no flaws

2.) The shield generator was necessary while it was under construction, not on the final product

3.) Emperor was dumb but final design was still flawless

ew, gross. go away, user

rude

Sorry but wasn't the second DS an elaborate ruse to capture the rebels?

The emperor would have destroyed the rebels and or/captured luke.
The worst case scenario would have been dead Luke plus rebels fleeing after dealing damage, and an operative battle station.

Just the hero won but hey, that's the story.

It was never complete so I don't really see your point.
The emperor and co. Set a trap for the rebels, they did so with an incomplete death star, it took han solo and a few koala bears to take down the shield and after that they were sitting ducks.
Wedge, a black pimp and a monkey managed to destroy the empire's finest weapon.

If the DS is complete, is not longer a trap because the vulnerability cannot be exploited.

So why set the trap and don't wait for the DS complete? Well, if happens, the better; if not, the battle is used to push Luke toward the Dark Side.

Come watch the original trilogy here

...

>implying that anything but the original 1977 film is canon

The Empire was struggling to get all that dilithium, how did those ragtags get enough to power the Starkiller?

A thought has to be original to be correct?
so you are a pig eating kike like i thought
kek

>kike
why kike?

>A thought has to be original to be correct?
No, but yours are neither original or correct.

Also
>kike
You are out of your containment board buddy. If you skipped R1 because of muh kike propaganda, you got it wrong.

I could even elaborate why the writers are the most hypocrite racist.
I could indeed admit that would have been better for them to re-read the script instead of twit politics bullshit.

>kike
>skipped R1
>irrelevant red herrings
kek

>neither original nor correct
>not original
that really triggers you doesn't it. that a non original idea can be correct and you dont' like it

I will never stop hating TFA the whole movie is just a way to shit on the end of RotJ and recreate the status quo. Luke is still the only Jedi , there is still a not Empire lead a not Emperor, the Republic is still fucked and only represented by a small group of not Rebels.

You are disturbing and unnecessary.

>that really triggers you doesn't it.
WHAT should trigger me? Your stupidity? I am entertained. I come here for people like you. You are the fun.

Now dance and tell some other bullshit, entertain me.

Kylo is good. I agree with you about the rest.
No. RotJ still completes a clear story that begins with the original and continues in TESB. These sequel movies were a mistake, and so were the prequels. We didn't need any of that shit. But here we are.

Just look in the mirror, you're doing quite the song and dance yourself.

you just don't like how "RLM" talking points feel to you and it has nothing to do with them being correct nor incorrect. Didn't need any help from me to show what a shitter you are

Honestly as someone who enjoyed the movie I have to agree the Starkiller is the biggest plothole in the thing, It just doesn't make any fucking sense, no matter how you slice it. You can say Mary Sue is too good at whatever but at least that's just overly convienient, and not physically impossible.

The Starkiller is not just "a stretch", it's really just flat out unbelievable. The size of the thing alone is insane. I really think Disney overestimated people's suspension of belief in regards to the size of it. It's just too fucking big and too powerful to exist. It's something I'd expect from another galaxy, like an advanced alien race's superweapon. Not something from the Empire's remnants.

Finn's great. Kylo's alright. Poe doesn't have enough screentime to make a call yet. Rey's the only character that isn't very good.

I maintain you are the triggered one, shithead.
I did show you don't have your own opinion, and you REEEEEEEE.

You are a pathetic little sack of nothing. Remember my words next time you will look yourself in the mirror.

You have no value.

No. see here

Starkiller follows the same old JJ Abrams rule that major plot devices need no more explanation than them simply being so, and doing what their plot mandated job is.

The 'Rabbit's Foot' in Mission Impossible, Red Matter in Trek, the statis torpedos and Tribble blood in Into Darkness, etc

>can't make your own argument
Nah, feck off m8

Hi Damon

two of these were mine :)
Now, is difficult to show in an anonymous board, but answer and I will write back.

I know it's kind of a cop out, but Star Wars isn't science fiction, it's space fantasy.

Like, if they had AI in the Star Wars universe, why didn't they just make all of their ships have AI to automatically target enemy ships? If C3PO can calculate the odds of surviving an asteroid field, why can't a ship's AI calculate the trajectory of enemy fighters and fire lasers at the perfect spot?

Finn is enthusiastically played by Boyega but the actual writing behind the character borders on incoherence. You're right about Poe, but Rey stinks for reasons this board has driven into the ground.

The only character that seemed to have any real thought put into it at all is Kylo's--and even his backstory seems a little contrived.

Everything I've heard about Rogue One sounds like it actually expands on the politics of the original trilogy which actually sounds pretty worthwhile and I don't hate Gareth Edwards so maybe I SHOULD go see it.

Fine enough, but we are not sure that the tech contained in the droids is good for the ships. SW has some element of "used future" or "schizotech", just not very strong.

In the case of the Starkiller tough, is something that is well established and central in the story. we KNOW that the Empire, in the moment of maximum reach and power, built a death star sized X. Seeing the starkiller just does't adds up, is really "meta", is J.J. winking at the camera and saying "we spare no expense" and "my dick is bigger, George".

Is yes another instance of J.J. remembering us, with a lens flare or with his lack of care, that we are watching a movie.

I don't need my own opinion because i was simply pointing out that you were triggered by someone else effectively echoing RLM's talking points

>you have no value
don't project. it's unbecoming.
fucking kikes

>Everything I've heard about Rogue One sounds like it actually expands on the politics of the original trilogy
It doesn't do much of anything with the politics. It's really shallow in both characters and world building.

>fucking kikes
ok, let's move on. Is on the terminal stage.

The Empire's evil is dispassionate rather than heavy handed Evil, and the Rebel Alliance is actually shown being an unstable, fragile union of peoples with a shared problem but non-unified approach to dealing with it.

The "used future" look of Star Wars is shown in mainly the original trilogy, and mind you this is because it focuses on the rebels rather than the Empire. Also mind you times are tough, there's a massive galactic civil war raging directly after a massive galactic Clone vs Droid war that raged.

A lot of the tech shown in the prequels didn't have that used future feel. The only time it did was when they visited a slave planet in Episode One.

"Schizotech", of course it did, because as I said Star Wars is fantasy set in space as opposed to Science Fiction. I think you could take Star Wars and put it in more of a medieval setting and still have the same outcome. Jedi are just wizards with magical swords, replace all the blasters with bows, and robots with elves or goblins or something. Darth Vader is just some guy in armor with evil Wizard powers. Replace all the space battles with battles at sea. The Death Star is now some sort of magical artifact that has the power to destroy a city-state.

You're just trying to ascribe things that you know would make sense in a Sci-fi movie to a movie that is actually a fantasy movie just set in space.

Meh not really. There is only like a five minute scene that ends how you would expect it to with a weak prep talk.

I was hoping for more personally

Its funny you say this because when I think about the imperial senate I just imagine lords of estates coming together at the kings table. Star War really is the 70s medieval fantasy story but in the future. The only thing it was missing is some kind of dragon character.

Fair point on the alliance and droids.

>You're just trying to ascribe things that you know would make sense in a Sci-fi movie to a movie that is actually a fantasy movie just set in space.

Fair point too, but I maintain that "power level" (sorry) of organisations (let's say, the ability of tap from a potential) should be kept coherent.

The Death Star is the Dragon.

Luke > The Knight
Leia > The Princess
Yoda/Obi-Wan > The Wise Old Wizard
C3PO/R2D2 > The funny loser characters
Vader > The Evil Henchmen
The Emperor > The Evil Wizard
Han Solo/Chewy > Idk