Daily Japanese Thread - DJT #1920

Cornucopia of Resources / Guide
Read the guide before asking questions.
djtguide.neocities.org/

Discuss the process of learning Japanese.

Previous thread:
Do it for her。

Other urls found in this thread:

wiki.wareya.moe/Stats
twitter.com/AnonBabble

Do it for Yukkuri!!
ゆっくりにほんごをおべんきょうしていってね!

正しくページの区切りを覚えてください

これは…きまりさんがわるいのぜ

ゆっくりよりのんびりにしていってね!

Do I need to learn the readings of the radicals?

No. You can find a table of regular on'yomi groups and study that, though.

ありがとう、ちよちゃん!

すれさんがさびしいさびしい、のぜ。
まりさがゆっくりまーきんぐさん、するのぜ。

When does いいでしょう get used?

>Use HelloTalk daily to converse with Japanese friends
>Left my phone somewhere and won't have access until next week

Is there an equivalent web version to meet with Japanese and talk, without paying iTalki for a 'teacher'?

>これ見ても台風嫌いとか言えんの?
What's the use of とか here?

etc.

>いいでしょう
"It's ok" maybe. But I'm not quite sure about the meaning of the phrase "get used" in your post.

>last thread 404'd at 309 posts

I'm disappointed.

オーストラリアくんが聞いたのはその発言の使われるところだ

It's something like "nothing wrong with that", "isn't that fine, though?", "don't sweat it, no problemo".

"When" と "What" は2文字しか違わないから、仕方がないね。誰でも間違えるよ、これは。
さて、
>いいでしょう
is likely to be used as "It's ok" in situations like polite person showing agreement, either the person is male or female.

I just came across a new word, does the average japanese know how to read 厭悪?

Telling you the truth, I didn't know (as Japanese average Joe). But I could assume it as "えんお" because the word "厭世観(Pessimism)" is very common on here.
Did you find it in some literature?

I'm reading 新世界より and it just loves to throw rare kanji and words at you

I also wrote down these words today
嬌声
破瓜
衣鉢

> 破瓜
> 2. 処女膜が破れること。

嬌声
破瓜
衣鉢

These three are actually kind of common words.
嬌声 is most popular. Any novel which is more than 200 page would contain this word.
衣鉢 is religious word, so very likely to have opportunities to know this in lives as Japanese. Just like as “communion” or so on for westerners.
破瓜 is rarely seen but specific symptom of schizophrenia is named with this word. And occasionally seen in old fashioned porno literatures.

I still have a lot to learn

おきばりやっしゃ

ファイト

Why is 八日 its own card in the 6k deck?

Does the 8th/8 days hold significance in Japanese?

because the deck is bad

Every number from 1-10 coupled with 日 is in the deck, and the reason is pretty fucking obvious, it's because the pronunciation is irregular for each one. Same with 一人, 二人, etc.

Nah jus bad dekc

七日八日?(nanka youka?)
What's up?

Time to go on a journey:

Japanese ぶどう/葡萄 "grape"
>Middle Chinese 葡萄 /buo-dâu/ "grape"
>Bactrian *bādāwa "wine"
>Old Iranian *bāta- "wine"

...

In all honesty, buticula is more likely to be a diminutive of buttis, from Ancient Greek πυτίνη "flask", from Proto-Indo-European *bʰeHw- "swell", which in turn leads to German Bütte. But I like my trail more.

徽章
笈
畠
琥珀
煤
煌く
汁椀
梯梧
抜擢
姪
平坦
咖哩
友誼
茉莉花
捷報
柚子胡椒
僻邑
矩形
栄耀
蜃気楼
杜撰脱漏
杜絶
稔性
肇国
倶梨伽羅紋紋

neat. mead and 蜜 also share an origin like that.

What are some good torrents for non-anime japanese content? nyaa comes up empty.
A lot of american movies and TV shows get japanese dubs, looking to download some.
In particular I'm looking for Stranger Things, I know for certain it has a JP dub, but I have no clue as to where to look for it.

Besides the ordering being off with the same kanji clusters and a few mistakes here and there, the deck is excellent. It provide a overall understanding as quickly and simply as can be, which is enough to then be supplemented by reading. If someone is looking for a great balance of effort/gain, the core deck strikes me as an ideal balance, same level as Tae Kim is when it comes to grammar resources.

>Besides being bad, the deck is excellent

ぶどう is from bottle?

The ordering and the few mistakes can simply be fixed in seconds. If you can't even do that, I don't think you can go through the process of learning this language. Even if you don't fix it, the few mistakes aren't numerous enough to fuck a beginner that bad, and the kanji clusters simply make retention harder sometimes and only for the few people that it affects.

I only know there's some japanese filesharing program called Perfect Dark

people who don't know japanese (who the deck is for) will not be able to identify and fix its problems

No, they just share an origin in Old Iranian *bāta (well, at least to the point of batioca, it's doubtful whether butticula continues from there, but I like the thought).

I just wondered why ぶどう was in hiragana, since Japan/China (as far as I know) was never big on wine production, so I considered whether the Portuguese might have introduced it, but I asked myself. "wouldn't it be ブドウ then?"

Cool, didn't know about that one. Thanks!

Fine, then they can simply not fix it, like I said it won't fuck them over that bad if they're reading a lot like they're supposed to. If it's really all that's wrong with the deck, then an advanced learner should fix it and upload it. Why would some moron create a new deck from scratch when the core deck is already pretty complete and only has a few glitches to fix? What's your alternative?

i never said anything about anyone making "a new deck from scratch" or there being an alternative

>will not be able to identify and fix its problems
Yeah, shit: they may end up becoming familiar with a bunch of Japanese vocabulary over a relatively short amount of time. Poor bastards.

Oh, I thought otherwise. So basically you were saying that ''it sucks, but it's the best we've got''. Fair enough.

never said it was the best we've got either, in fact i stated no opinions other than it being bad

Very cool.

Well if you think it's bad, and you say that you have no alternative, we have no choice but to logically infer that you believe it to be the best resource for mass learning vocab, even if you didn't explicitly say it. Either that or you're contradicting yourself, it's up to you.

not everything is laced with implications user
i do not know what resources exist, i cannot have an opinion on what's the best, i only know that this particular resource is bad given only itself as context

wiki.wareya.moe/Stats

Everything is laced with implications, the Japanese language being a strong candidate at that with its context dependent structuring. Also, you can certainly say that the core deck wasn't suitable for you, but your lack of other reference points makes your opinion about it being bad void and swiftly discarded.

bro none of that is topical

いい加減にしろ、自閉症児

You can certainly say that the core deck was suitable for you, but your lack of other reference points makes your opinion about it being the best we have void and swiftly discarded.

???

Core6k is full of words that are uncommon outside of industry-related writing and missing all sorts of subjective adjectives, adverbs, etc. that are very common in speech and literary writing. It might be perfectly fine in the grand scheme of things but there's nothing about it that makes it take a "relatively" short amount of time to learn words with it rather than alternative methods of acquiring vocabulary (like mining, natural exposure, assessment-oriented decks, etc). The only reason it's widely used is that someone managed to get example sentence and audio for every single card.

Hate to break to you user but using fucking visual novels as some sort of superior corpus as a criticism of what is covered in the Core decks is just laughable. The rest of your post is intellectually dishonest tripe. Fuck off back to /jp/.

Astelight Shuushuubako is extremely dense literary Japanese with almost no otaku or pop culture influence. It's a crystalline representation of the depths of the formal Japanese language. It giving Core6k a massive 7% difference in coverage compared to a deck based on fucking otaku writing is the most damning thing.

「今日はまだこちらへは、
ご挨拶と確認に伺っただけ。
こちらでも、私のお仕事はまだ他に色々と。
また、伺わせていただきましてよ」
Wow! So this is the power of "visual novel" Japanese!
───翡翠の眸の少女、大陸の中央からの派遣吏にして稀代の呪式の遣い手、駅の航宙港機能を凍結封鎖する為に遣わされたシラギク・Aは、ヒプノマリアとゼルダクララを知ったのである。
Incredible!

duolingo has Japanese now. worth bothering with?

no.

you're joking right?

This You're almost as bad as that Finnish retard who said he learn to be fluent in Japanese only by watching a lot of anime. Even if some words in core6k are less common/useful, it gives you a strong base vocabulary list, and gives you strong recalling abilities for said vocab in a very short (read optimal) amount of time. Saying you can learn and retain not only more pertinent vocab but also faster with VNs than with the core6k deck is ludicrous.

This needs to be argued, because it helps beginners to know what their best recourse is when they start out. This is what this thread is here for, providing resources, optimizing language study and helping each other with difficulties.

Learning Jap in just 5 minutes a day is fucking insane, what are you on about

See You are quite literally defending something solely because it's the thing you used.

>This needs to be argued, because it helps beginners to know what their best recourse is when they start out
I thought I already solved this, watch anime

thanks finnie

Not at all. I'm arguing that it is the most efficient technique to use to gain vocab, but of course this hinges on the fact that you're not brain damaged and that Anki works for you.

Oh! speak of the devil, the retarded Finn shows up when he's mentioned. How goes the delusion that you know Japanese?

Mining is more efficient than Core6k.

It's going pretty well since I seem to be able to communicate with Japanese people just fine and have no trouble following the stories in anime

Not when you're a beginner and you have no vocab, mining would be tedious and drastically inefficient to learn basic Japanese vocab. After core6k (and more importantly instead of doing core10k), then sure I agree with you.

Based Finnie.

The hero we need, but don't deserve, because we failed to chase off the loonies.

Based, or inbred aspie? the jury's still out on that one. Nah but seriously finnie, you're one of the good characters the scriptwriters wrote into this thread, never change.

By the time you finish core2k, you should probably be reading, and if you're reading, you might as well be mining instead of continuing to core6k.

Yeah that's not so bad, but I prefer the technique of doing core6k while reading, and adding words you encounter like you said, but check the core6k list and not add it if it's already in the deck and coming up eventually in your new cards.

It's definetly easier to watch anime until fluency

Yes, and watching Ted talks for you university exams is way easier too. Oh and watching cooking shows takes care of your hunger too.

I doubt Ted talks have anything to do with what you will be asked in univeristy exams and cooking shows won't take care of your hunger but they will teach you how to cook, just like anime being in Japanese teaches you Japanese. Humans are pretty good at learning from being shown how something is done

I would maybe believe you if your language was less distant from Japanese, but it's ridiculous to learn it ''intuitively'' through watch tv when its grammatical structure is so different from Finnish.

Well it's not like English is all that close to Finnish either and I was pretty much fluent when I was 13. Sure, I had classes in school but I learnt most of it talking to people online and playing games.

Japanese pronounciation is pretty close to Finnish too, outside of a couple exceptions

I guess, but I'll remain doubtful unless we meet in real life anyway. But doing that would remove all the mystique you have behind your layers of anonymous elitism.

what the hell is this autism posting about?

まいちゃはじへいしょうっさん!なんかじゃ、ないのじぇ!
にんげんさんったちのたいっせつなたいっせつな、おともだちなのじぇ!
おともだちのためには、せいいっぱいになってつくすのがあたりまえなのじぇ!おーじーあのんさんは、すぐにまいしゃにせいっしきにしゃざいして、やまとつまれたあまあまっのばいしょうをのうふするのじぇ!しゅぐにするのじぇ!

あにめのしゃべりかたは、にちじょうかいわとはぜんっぜんちがうのぜ?

That's what I think. He may have picked up a lot of things along the way, but his learning must be so full of holes that it would take a long time to fill those gaps with proper study. He's still more advanced than an absolute beginner I guess.

まあ、あめりかっのかとぅーんさんよりかは、すらんぐっやかんようくがすくないのぜ?
でもまあたぶん、あにめでつかってるたんごは、ぜんぶでせんごひゃくっもないのぜ。

かなだあのんさんはゆっくりとおはなしできてにほんごがおじょうずなんだね!ちせいときょうようにみちあふれた、いんてりっさんだね!ゆっくりしていってね!

Thanks I guess? And reading your posts is giving me a brain tumor, but it is fun to read them nonetheless.

こんなゆっくりしたあのんさんは、はじめてなのじぇえ!!

>まあ、あめりかっのかとぅーんさんよりかは、すらんぐっやかんようくがすくないのぜ?
>でもまあたぶん、あにめでつかってるたんごは、ぜんぶでせんごひゃくっもないのぜ。
わかりやすくおはなしすると、
あめりかのあにめは、すらんぐやかんようくがおおくて、わかりづらいのじぇ。
それと、にほんのあにめも、さくひんのなかでつかってるたんごは、たぶん1500ごぐらいしか、ないのじぇ。

おかしなはなしなのは、じっさいにくちとみみとでかいわするときは、かんじはつかわないのじぇ。ぜんぶひらがなじぇ。
でも、ここのあのんさんたちはひらがなだけでしゃべるゆっくりをさべつして、はくがいするのじぇ。
ゆっくりできないのじぇ。

It's just the lack of kanji that's the problem. Reading you is tedious, especially for non fluent people. It does make for good practice I'll give you that.

面倒くさいから、胴付きの姿でしゃべるよ。

カナダアノンさんは日本語がお上手だね。
ゆっくりの話がすらすらよめたら、日本語は黒帯二段ぐらいだぜ!あと
>ちせいときょうようにみちあふれた、いんてりっさんだね!
は、
>知性と教養に満ち溢れたインテリだね
って意味だよ。

あと、ゆっくりの言葉は今のところgoogle translateも満足に翻訳できないんだ。日本人なら小学生でも簡単に読めるんだけどね。

お勉強がんばってね!
ゆっくりしていってね!

Core is bad not because of some arbitrary coverage tests that its vocab base doesn't meet, but because everyone uses it as front: single word, back: english translation of word, sentence containing word. It would be better used with sentences on front, but the way the sentences work isn't ideal for a beginner because their difficulty is basically random and isn't based on any kind of grammar progression or anything, and sentence decks should ideally contain i+1 style sentences so that you're actually learning from them. Single word->single word anki cards are a waste of time and effort.

Probably a stupid question, but is the どーすんのよ on the left strip, last panel really どうするのよ?

Yes.

Suspected it, but wasn't really sure. Thanks