Are homosexuals "born this way"

Is a person born gay? If so is it because of genetics or developmental reasons? ((((Modern science)))) says it is not a choice to be gay. What evidence exists that homosexuality is a learned behavior? Is there evidence of ((((people)))) teaching children to be gay?

Other urls found in this thread:

yalescientific.org/2012/03/do-animals-exhibit-homosexuality/
youtube.com/watch?v=gXGlawiibK8
jaymans.wordpress.com/2014/02/26/greg-cochrans-gay-germ-hypothesis-an-exercise-in-the-power-of-germs/
insidehighered.com/news/2015/10/27/study-finds-race-growing-explanatory-factor-sat-scores-california
youtube.com/watch?v=150QBUAisoo
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

It's probably a combination of factors.

Toxoplasma Gondii turns them into walking disease vectors. They have no free will. Cats are an ancient Egyptian bio-weapon.

>Nobody teaches or encourages anyone to be gay, it's something that you're born with.

How would you refute this statement?

I am a zoosexual and I remember having these feelings since I hit puberty.

I imagine homosexuals and pedosexuals are no different.

Ridicule.

>It only teaches kids it is ok to be who they already are
Is it possible that something like this really doesn't encourage alternative sexual behavior?

Homos were born that way. And homophobes were born hating homos. No need for the government to get involved, making laws which oppose nature. And pedophiles were born that way. Who has the right to judge?

Xq28 gene

That's a good start, but I'm gonna need something else to back that up, something more evidence based, or at least anecdotal.

we're born gay

>Comparing a non-consensual pedophilic relation to that of two adults of the same gender together
>b-buh it's the same thing somehow..!
why is this shitty false equivalency in every faggot thread

it's a hormone imbalance in the brain, so yes. gay men are psychologically and physically similar to straight women.

Claiming that sexual deviance is OK because you claimed they were born that way is a TRUE equivalence. "I was born that way" can be used as an excuse by EVERYONE. Claiming that deviancy is somehow OK because you "were born that way" does not mean the behavior is acceptable. Keep sucking the dick, faggot.

Dude... Wut?

I think some are born gay and some turn gay

Except your point still doesn't stand. There's a reason your kind is dying out in the western world, moralfags are the worst. No one cares what your definition of "muh degeneracy" is and gays aren't going to not be a thing all of the sudden. Learn to live with it or stay bitter at them from the closet I couldn't care less. Care to elaborate on why two men or two adult women shouldn't be able to date or how that's any of your business?

There is neither evidence that homosexuality is learned or genetic. Lack of evidence for one position is not support for the other. The simple answer is that we do not yet know.

This. There's a fine line between an active sexual curiosity and actual sexual attraction.

I've met tons of girls whom claimed to be lesbian but then go onto sleep with numerous guys. A close friend of mine though is truly gay and has had sex with a man before and did NOT like it and was totally unattracted to him. She's married to a woman now and is quite gay.

It's less with gay/bisexual men. I'm bisexual myself but I've never slept with a man before. I've made out with one but never had penetrative intercourse with one. (I don't plan to since I'm a Christian now). The attraction though is still there for me. It could be that I was born this way, or two different homosexual interactions I had when I was a kid with other boys might have caused me to become this way. I'll never know for sure but I am who I am.

There's always different variables for a person being whom they are, I wouldn't chalk anything dealing with sexuality up to one piece of thinking.

which one happend to you?

Care to elaborate on why we should go out of our way to accommodate or sanction them in any way?

there is no evidence that they are born that way no. In fact, i think the most recent studies suggest that it is most likely the cause of environmental factors

Everything is genetic.
Knowing which genes is not important, just act after the fact.

Want to remove all criminals ?
Execute or sterilise all criminals as they get caught.
Want to remove all fags ?
Sterilisation, death.
Want to remove all poststamp collectors ?
Sterilisation, death.

The only thing needed is a selective pressure, evolution takes cares of the rest. Of course you need to apply it for multiple generation, though even just one will alter the population noticeably, statistically. The first three are the most important, the next are more maintenance work really ( mutations make sure the behaviour pop up again and again, the work would never be done ).

There's homosexual animal pairings observed in nature.
Examples: albatross, dolphin, swans, bonobo, killer whales, giraffes and penguins. Are you saying those animals chose to be gay or some environmental factor "turned" them gay?

I don't know what the fuck happened to me.

In my tweens and early teens, I was attracted to and fantasized about females.

At age 15 my sexual orientation suddenly switched. It was fucking weird, like something was instantaneously triggered.

I am sure that this is not a normal case history for gay people.

This caused me considerable consternation for many years.

I am abstinent and have never chosen to act on my orientation, but this was a bitter pill to swallow.

ITs not genetic that is for certain.

Someone literally just took the idea of chakras and repainted it with feminist drivel. Hilarious.

This. The obvious flamers are born that way. The weirdos on Sup Forums are just shut in and want to fuck so they start looking at twinks and traps.

It's a mix of both and depends on the person.

in reply to that

Turned kinda gay.
Only had a tiny (very tiny) attraction to 1 or 2 guys growing up.
I have had no meaningful relationship with girls and on a mental level can't relate to them.
Also cock is just great.

It's not directly heritable, which of course leaves the door open for justifying conservative social engineering.

dude no one can relate to girls on a mental level. They are for fucking, cleaning, and raising children.

Getting along mentally is what you do with your bros.

It is a lie that your wife needs to be your intellectual equal. As long as she makes you happy that's all that matters. In the past, men never even talked politics or social issues with their wives, they just listened and obeyed cause they expected their husbands to be right.

I don't really think it matters, sex between consenting adults should be allowed. But I would guess it's something like these:
More research needed.

Except there's no gay or criminal gene so your idea is retarded. Evolution will not breed them out and no one is gonna genocide gays in the western world anyway, approval rating is above 60% in most countries beside the odd one like Russia.

>there's no gay or criminal gene
Right, behaviour arise from the holy spirit, i forgot.

Maybe God really hate niggers and make them be niggers through the holy spirit, MAOA obviously have no influence on their behaviour.

I remember watching a video of some guy interviewing drunk men at a gay bar. They openly admitted they were mostly sexually abused from a young age. Some even remember such events from when they were 3 years old.
My personal anecdote: I actually used to believe I was just born this way. But then I had some repressed memories that I took for granted. Sometimes my dad would grab me and my brother and just openly jiggle my penis. I am not sure to this day whether he did it in an endearing way or what. But he would do it until we got an erection, then we would freak out , which is the response he wanted? This happened from when we were around 3 years old. My mom would watch and just laugh. As innocent as they both thought this act was, I'm pretty sure it scarred me sexually for life. Another event: My cousin who was a year older than I (I was 3 again) forced us to do a naked photo shoot. I guess she watched porn from a young age, I honestly didn't know what we were doing. But she forced me and my younger siblings to do it. Something in the back of my head was telling me this was naughty, but I went through with it. It was pretend. How could it hurt me?
I honestly don't remember if my sexuality was mature at the time. I didn't know what I liked at the time. But one thing is for sure, after these events, my sexuality started to develop by age 7.
Sexuality is something very tricky, and I am actually hurt when people say it is mostly a choice. I do not live a degenerate lifestyle. I only want a boyfriend in a monogamous relationship where we can respect each other and tear down the current gay culture. That would be the dream...

Easy to refute.

Watch and learn.

Everybody teaches and encourages everyone to be gay, it is something that we are not born with.

As you didn't provide any evidence, all I need to do is claim the opposite of what you claimed.

Ugh ignorant much? Haven't you listened to born this way it's 2011

I don't want to bust your bubble but that's not how genes work.

Genes by themselves can't do shit, the environment shapes them up (see OP picture), especially when you are still a kid.

You people keep talking about how black genes are inferior but get a black baby and give them to a white couple, watch the kid grow up with white culture. Now get a white baby and give them to a black couple in the hood, watch the white kid grow up with the black culture ingrained in them.

It is all about environment

Blacks and niggers aren't the same thing, just like gays and faggots aren't. You're clearly the one who doesn't know this. And no, there is no gay gene. Pretty sure scientists would know as you'd only have to look for a difference among straights/gays.

why are people so afraid to reply to me??

>make an absolute claim
>provide no evidence whatsoever
>"prove me wrong with evidence now"

You don't know how burden of proof works.

I can easily say "There is a teapot floating near Jupiter right now" and ask you to prove me wrong with evidence. You can't do that, can you?

Anecdotal and circumstantial evidence. Are you claiming the homo animals are only homo because they were molested? They don't even have a concept of that.
yalescientific.org/2012/03/do-animals-exhibit-homosexuality/
"Somehow human sexuality is different from animals despite us being animals" what a claim

No one is born gay or straight. Sexual attraction doesn't even happen until puberty. When I was a kid, I wanted to marry my dad. Nothing sexual about it, and I didn't turn out gay.

Being gay IS a choice, in the sense that liking the taste of broccoli is a choice. It's all about exposure.

its not a claim, its an anecdote. i already acknowledged that. all im saying is, not even im sure what causes gayness. the only answer seems to be is a variety of factors. factors mostly outside of the individual's control. im really good at analyzing situations and this is what i found.^ also i just thought my anecdote was a little to risque' and weird for straight people to discuss.

so then what causes a lion to be gay?

Sure, let's work this out

Do you agree with me that the natural/ideal state is to be heterosexual?

Human sexuality is widely misunderstood

The truth is that sexuality is incredibly fluid.
On old galley ships, hundreds of men were out at sea for months at a time with no women. The result was widespread homosexuality. These were men with wives and families at port, and yet when women were not available they went with the next best thing. We see the same phenomenon in modern prisons.

Before modern civilization, all across the world sex with animals was common practice. It still is in parts of Africa and the Middle East, stick around Sup Forums long enough and you'll see the videos for yourself.

Men will have sex with literally anything. Women, other men, children, animals, the aboriginals would cut a hole in your flesh and have sex with it, pic related.

This is why it's so important to mandate heterosexual relationships which are healthy, productive, and contribute to a positive social order. Rather than embracing degenerate sexual acts which breed mental sickness and social dysfunction.

Depends, animals like albatross have a beneficial boost to their survival if they are lesbian. Gays make more than straights on average and can adopt kids that would otherwise not have homes (regardless of what your personal belief is this is good from a populations standpoint)
Is it beneficial to humans to have gays? I would argue yes some, they're only a minor fraction of the population anyhow and overpopulation is an issue in some places.

If being gay is strictly a learned behavior what caused the first animal (non human animals have also been observed to be gay) to be gay (remember, there were no gays before it)?

I am talking about a biological point of view. Biologically speaking, nature aims for 100% heterosexual, right?

>It's probably a combination of factors.
This.

Genetics. Choice. Sure, environment too.

Yet people do have a genetic disposition toward a sexuality.

And we really shouldn't give two shits if someone is homosexual, choice or not.

They are protected by the US Constitution like everyone else.

...

Uh what do you mean by that? There's homos in nature so not sure what you mean by nature "aims"?

GTFO you libertarian shit

>free will
>real

You know exactly what he means you fucking imbecile

A homosexual is a genetic dead end. A waste of genetic material. The parents of a fag spent 20 years raising and nurturing a failure who will never pass on their genes to the next generation

Natural selection tries as hard as it can to breed fags out of the population.

What you are doing right here is called "playing dumb". In the face of a superior argument you simply pretend stupidity such that you have no comprehension of logic. "Nyah nyah nyah I can't heaaar you"

Fact 1: Nature aims for survival of the species
Fact 2: Reproduction is required for survival
Fact 3: Reproduction can only happen between heterosexual groups (if we are talking about humans at least)

Conclusion: Homosexuality harms the chance of survival of species like humans or just any mammals.

Fact 1: If homosexuality is not a choice, it is determined either by genes (before the person is born) or by the environment.
Fact 2: Genes are transferred during reproduction.
Fact 3: Homosexuals can't practice reproduction.

Conclusion: Homosexuals can't transfer their genes to the next generation.

How can it be genetic if we, in theory, all have 100% heterosexual genes? Any homosexual that appears will die without pushing their genes forward.

Then it is the environment. But is that really "not a choice"? It can, at the very least, be remedied.

what is this, brosience? am I on /fit/?

>Implying homosexuals cannot have children
Ah I forgot about that part they literally can't you're right.
Like I already told you, homosexuals are a minor fraction of the population and have been around since Ancient Rome/Greece in humans, possibly before. In certain species it helps by having that minor fraction. Google it yourself.

Gays were molested at a young ages, they felt guilty and felt their masculinity was taken from them so they turn feminine.

youtube.com/watch?v=gXGlawiibK8

Yes, mental illness, child rape, bestiality, necrophilia has been with us since the beginning of time
We're all aware of this

But embracing these things is cultural suicide

What caused a dog to fuck my leg if it was not born to fuck legs?
What caused a monkey in the zoo to wank all day long? did somebody train it to do that?
I've seen a video of a dog fuck a cat, a giraffe give head to a metal pole and many more, why did they do it?
Make a thread on Sup Forums called what have you put your penis into and see what comes up.

How many people who are in prison do you think were born gay?

Yes, homosexuals are a minor fraction in many species, just like many other aberrations. And no, I am not insulting them by using the term "aberrations", it is a scientific term for abnormalities.

You have insane people too. They are a minor fraction. Does that mean it is normal or natural?

The fact homosexuals end up being productive members of society means literally nothing to the conclusion that it is not a choice. It just means that your sexuality doesn't mean shit.

yea this is the video i was talking about

No scientifically sound study has definitively linked sexual orientation or identity with parental role-modeling or childhood sexual abuse.

The American Psychiatric Association noted in a 2000 fact sheet available on the Association of Gay and Lesbian Psychiatrists, that dealing with gay, lesbian and bisexual issues, that sexual abuse does not appear to be any more prevalent among children who grow up and identify as gay, lesbian or bisexual than in children who grow up and identify as heterosexual.

Similarly, the National Organization on Male Sexual Victimization notes on its website that "experts in the human sexuality field do not believe that premature sexual experiences play a significant role in late adolescent or adult sexual orientation" and added that it's unlikely that anyone can make another person gay or heterosexual.

Animals fuck when they're horny, it isn't that they have a sexual preference. Human homosexuals on the other hand show they they've been molested at an early age, by other homosexuals that probably experienced the same thing.

Anecdotal evidence. See:

nice try

I hate to be pedantic here, but the reason that homosexuality exists in other species is because of a lack of females. This is a favored argument of shirt-lifters, but all it comes down to, really, is if you have to bust a nut, you have to bust a nut.

>etic if we, in theory, all have 100% heterosexual genes? Any homosexual that appears will die without pushing their genes forward.
>Then it is the environment. But is that really "not a choice"? It can, at the very least, be remedied.


It is genetic obviously.

Somes studys claim that there is more chance to be homosexual if you have a lot of brother and sister.

That still means it is not normal or natural since it only happens when there is something wrong. It also supports the explanation that sexuality is influenced by the environment and therefore can be "treated" (such as by adding females to the environment)

Albatross and bonobo have significantly more lesbians. The female albatross run faster so f/f couples with children live longer. That's not true at all.

Read It can't be genetic if it is literally impossible for anyone to have homosexual genes since homosexuals can't push their genes forward since no reproduction

So you're not at all attracted to females and wanna fuck em? Or now you're just also attracted to dicks?

There are physiological differences in gay people that indicate that developmental factors r the big deal.

So there ya go.

>e to have homosexual genes since homosexuals can't push their genes forward since no reproduction

Stupid dumbo, heterosexual can have homosexual recessive gene.

Of course it's not normal or natural, to suggest otherwise would go against the very idea of evolution.

>therefore can be "treated" (such as by adding females to the environment)

Exactly.

>no criminal gene
wtf do you call niggers then?

The gay gene theory is highly discredited. The best model used just five of the methylation marks, and correctly classified the twins 67 percent of the time. “To our knowledge, this is the first example of a biomarker-based predictive model for sexual orientation,” Ngun wrote in his abstract.

The problems begin with the size of the study, which is tiny. So not only was it a small study, but it only worked correctly 67% of the time. That could be guess work at worst.

you have no idea how genetics works.

Here's a pure thought experiment example of a evolutionarily stable way for a gay gene to rise in the population: The mother births x% of gay children that assist in the rearing of her other children but do not become wasted resources for assistance when they ultimately leave the family to mate.

Not saying it's true, but there is certainly a way for this to be favorable in some environment.

It's a reaction to trauma spread by adults to children, to other children. They create a life style out of subconsciously reliving their abuse.
youtube.com/watch?v=gXGlawiibK8

That and Cochran's Germ Theory. I don't think it's a pathogen necessarily but he debunks the genetic idea quite convincingly.
jaymans.wordpress.com/2014/02/26/greg-cochrans-gay-germ-hypothesis-an-exercise-in-the-power-of-germs/

it's proposed as a different pathogen, the cat ones only affect rats.

the increase in homosexuality and all the propaganda and gay prides and other dumb shit

The real, deep down, the real question is:

Does it matter?
Why, does it bother you, or anyone else, if a man decide to have sex with another man?

Does he have sex in your bed? on top of you? if not, let it be, live and let live, the more gays the more women available for straight men.

They don't compete with you for any resource that straights don't already, they are not a threat, they are not an issue.

As overpopulation increases, the amount of homosexuals increases from epigenetic triggers during gestation, this is also why the more children someone has, the higher the chances their younger children are homosexual, the body knows, nature has failsafes.

Are you seriously going to be mad at a failsafe against overpopulation?

If anything be mad at cultures that heavily suppress it, that force men and women into hiding and pretending their entire lives to be something they are not, with families because thats what society expects them to.

We are humans, the pinnacle of evolution so far, yet some people are brain dead enough to hate something merely because it does not share the same behavior as them, or because some shitty polytheistic religion turned monotheistic in the desert told them so? Fuck that shit.

I see far more important things to deal with, such as primitive cultures invading our lands and week after week see them butcher our people in a way it has become normality, that is no longer shocking or unexpected.

That, is a far bigger issue that what 1-5% of men and women do in their bedrooms.

nope
white person here grew up around a bunch of niggers
nigs still nig while I have no crime record and a decent job
yes you might say I'm an exception but when I was in school almost no blacks were in my advanced classes even though I lived in a majorly black area. I was with the very few white and hispanic people and literally no blacks in my classes growing up.

insidehighered.com/news/2015/10/27/study-finds-race-growing-explanatory-factor-sat-scores-california

I used to think that poverty was the reason, but I grew up just as poor if not poorer than all the niggers around me. There's a reason I'm racist today, it's because there's actual reason to be.

There is no increase in homosexuality, the difference is that society is coming to accept it instead of lynching/jailing them, so people who are homosexual no longer need to hide in fear for their lives.

Don't be stupid.
A society's sole purpose for existing is to assure mutual protection of all its members, as long the individual(s) are not threating the lives of others, they have right to that protection, unless you think shitty african/middle eatern societies are an example to follow instead.

I never read that gene theory is "higlhy discredited">> source?

Yeeeee. I don't give a fuck if someone is gay. I just don't care

I'm really not sure about it all, OP. I am gay, but I never really questioned or even thought about it properly until my early twenties, when I realised I have absolutely no attraction to women and I found men to be better to get along with in a romantic way.

I honestly can't say if it is genetics, environment or choice. Opinions?

How can you have homosexual recessive genes if, at the very single MOMENT a mutation happens and a homosexual gene appears, it immediately stops being pushed forward??

Watch this (turn subtitles on) youtube.com/watch?v=150QBUAisoo and find some of the answers.

There is actually evidence to suggest that homosexuality correlates positively between identical twins, so genetics clearly has some role, it just hasn't been explored in depth due to ethical concerns.

I'm gay. I've read a lot of stuff about this topic and nobody seems to know for certain. I believe there must be some form of genetics involved somewhere as if it is learned behaviour I don't know where it is learned from. I was gay before I even knew I was gay. I remember getting erections in the swimming pool changing rooms but didn't even realise why until a few years later. I just pushed it to the back of my mind. I was the first and only gay person I knew. I was vaguely aware of the concept as it was a common schoolyard insult, but didn't know anything beyond that. I assumed I was straight.

>i have to leave to fuck my GF
>no time to explain
>go google scholar
>search homosexuality
>read studies
>go back to Sup Forums tomorrow and open a new topic

Just attracted to males. Like I said, weird.

How old are you now?

While it's possible for a tiny number of homosexuals to be the result of genetic mutations - we're talking 1 in tens of thousands - it cannot possibly be the case that a trait with 100% fertility reduction is selected for and exists at the rate it does in modern society. Hamilton's rule flat out disqualifies obligate homosexuality occurring at the 2-4% rate it shows up as.

Are you retarded? Criminals are a social thing you retard. There's no such thing as a "criminal" in nature, it's purely a human concept that only exists in civilization.

The things people do that make them "criminals" are all instincts everyone has, we just suppress them with our morals.

>Individual Choices

>Individual choices
No such thing.