Is it a valid interpretation of the double slit experiment that our conciousness experiences a superposition of two realities?
If so, is it a valid explanation of extinction collapse to say: when we observe the photon's path, the superposition is no longer stable and we enter one deterministic version of reality.
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Not sure why you're bringing consciousness to a discussion about the double slit experiment, but besides that it sounds good.
So don't look at it and it won't be real?
Ignore it and it will go away?
Consensus say yes, and consensus IS science.
It could be I guess. Than again, maybe not.
No, that's not a valid interpretation. The many worlds interpretation you're invoking would prescribe separate consciousnesses to the separate realities. That being said, you do hint at an interesting interpretation akin to dualism, arguing that consciousness is in some sense separate from the realities possible in the universe. The reason I say it's invalid is because physics and philosophy has mostly written off dualism. I'm not sure if there are mathematical frameworks that currently support it in agreement with observation.
Your wording in the second part doesn't make much sense to me. Extinction collapse? Wavefunction collapse isn't generally favoured these days, however, you're destroying information, so sure, call it extinction I guess. But superposition isn't really "stable", it's coherent. As it decoheres, information is lost to the environment. That doesn't negate the existence of multiple realities, merely that you'd now be in one of them. Maybe this is just semantic nitpicking. But to me stability implies you're in one state for a long time, then you lose that stability if you transition to a new state. Decoherence isn't really that. It's more like a smearing of a quantum system out into the environment.
Yes measurement gives rise to reality, as shown in current experiment, but the many worlds interpretation hasn't been disproven yet either. And if you think I'm a faggot, no, I think many worlds is bullshit. But still, hasn't been disproven yet.
>Is it a valid interpretation of the double slit experiment that our conciousness experiences a superposition of two realities?
no, quantum effects dont play a role on macroscopic scale
/thread
>I think many worlds is bullshit. But still, hasn't been disproven yet.
Yes they do nigger. Do some research
No. Your perception is irrelevant.
I'm allowed to have a belief based on intuition without complete proof you fucking nigger. If presented with data that overturns that belief, then I will discard it. That's called being a rational, educated human being you worthless fuck face faggot. Kys
The double slit experiment has NOTHING to do with conciousness.
it has to do with the uncertainty principle and particle physics.
False. If OP chooses to measure a system along the x axis instead of the z axis, for example, he changes the reality observed. And OP said experience, not perceive. Experience implies observation and perception, not just perception where in your mind you'd prescribe meaning.
What you've shown in pic related is the Young's Lunges experiment and it's the proof that light is a wave and not a particle as the effect of diffraction applies to light too. Basic physics
You're a close minded nigger. Kys
>i said some stupid bullshit that makes no sense and someone called me out for it
>they are just close minded, i cant be wrong!
lol
He changes the reality he perceives, not reality itself.
hapa logic
But he is part of the measurement apparatus, the classical system measuring the quantum system, so he does change reality.
Only solid answer here. Rest of you are various degrees of retarded.
Extinction was a typo for wavefunction.
Conciousness having some outside meaning which is effected in part by each of the "many worlds" is exactly what I was thinking about
Will read up on dualism. Any references for the physics/philosophy debunking part?
He doesnt consciously percieve two states. He perceives one state. Period
But OP didn't say stupid bullshit. He may have used poor jargon, but addressing the philosophy of quantum foundations, specifically interpretations, is a very active and critical field in physics. Ignoring the impact of consciousness in physics is close minded. No physics researcher will write a paper about consciousness lest they damage their career, or get shat on by retarded neuroscientists, but how the observer decides to prepare the experiment and execute it determines the reality observed. You are the problem and so you should kill yourself.
>double slit experiment
All this shows is that light is a wave
End of
if the physics researcher found an actual link between the 2 he would not get shat on.
but untill he does, we have no reason to believe there is a link.
and saying that im close minded for not accepting somehting with 0 evidence reminds me of a religious person guilt tripping me for not listening to only his bullshit but not the bullshit of others.
>consciousness
suggestion double plus ridiculous verging pseudoscience
You guys are pretty smart, arentcha?
/thread
Light is a wave function.
But if I overcomplicate it and build this wild mathematical fabrication i will seem really smart and earn the respekt
Bs.
All it shows is that light acts like an electromagnetic wave just as everything else in the observable universe.
Conciousness plays no role here its the measurement devices that change the result not you looking at it.
Consensus is not science, science is based on objective data and evidence. It doesn't matter if every single scientist agrees on something or not.
>Any references for the physics/philosophy debunking part?
Don't give up on dualism, OP. Again, I really don't like the many worlds interpretation at all, but if I did, then since I'm a dualist, I'd like your idea quite a lot. To get started on dualism, read Descartes' Meditations. To read on the "debunking" part, this is something I've read over the years. But I believe the first time I actually read that, paraphrased, "dualism is generally rejected today", was in the Mind's I:
en.m.wikipedia.org
enjoyed reading this/10
>measurement gives rise to reality
No it doesn't, measurement changes wave patterns. That's it. Nothing fancy or metaphysical about it. Measuring an electromagnetic phenomenon with an electromagnetic measurement device influences the result.
Yes I agree with that. That's why I said his interpretation was invalid, that there'd be separate consciousnesses for the separate realities. But, taking OP's idea a bit further, maybe our subconscious is capable of weakly measuring a system?
There seem to be some knowledgeable people in this thread so I have something I’d love a bit of clarity on, though I’m not good with correct terminology so bear with me please.
There’s a statement I believe with quantum particles which spin two ways simultaneously that “when they are observed they will ‘choose’ a direction to spin and then their state is changed”, something to that effect. It seems what people take from that is that a consciousness ‘looking’ at the particle is enough to effect its properties, but as I understand it you can only ‘observe’ these particles, which means ‘measure them’ by bouncing a photon off em and it is that act which effects their properties? It’s misrepresentation/misunderstanding of what’s going on and leads people to believe it’s spookier than it is. Can anyone shed a bit of light in this please?
Yes, it does.
>newscientist.com
The wave function is real.
>nature.com
Quantum contextuality is the driving engine of quantum phenomena. And quantum contextuality is all about the observer preparing the experiment and executing it.
And who changes the measurement device?
no.
You got it right user. All of the spooky action at a distance shit is essentially explained as electromagnetic effects being influenced by electromagnetic measurement methods.
>but untill he does, we have no reason to believe there is a link.
Yes agreed.
>saying that im close minded for not accepting somehting with 0 evidence
That's not why I called you close minded. I never said to blindly accept anything. You completely dismissed the impact of consciousness in determining reality without considering any of the experiments that are continuing to suggest the role. Go check out the Li-6/Li-7 proposals for experiments:
quantamagazine.org
At least you're not retarded, like this faggot
wooo-wooo
>At least you're not retarded
on here thats a big compliment.
I never claimed wave functions aren't real and neither the experiment nor the article provides any evidence that contradicts what I said.
If the observer had any tangible influence other than measurement devices influencing the phenomenon you would see different results from different observers. wich you do not!
Correct. All these Deepak Chopra fuck face faggots are ruining any potential discussion for actual impacts of quantum on cognition. It vexes me.
Isnt this similar to the theory of operation ofa quantum computer. Is it possible that our brain has aspects similar to a quantum computer and the neuroscientists havent caught up yet
There's always that guy
You said measurement doesn't give rise to reality. I said it does. And you can see different results from different observers. It's called relativity.
Thank you anons!
Yes I think so. See the other links I posted earlier.
the double slit experiment is better to be interpreted as a suggestion that consciousness defines reality. when the experiment is left unobserved, the results show that the particle will travel through every possible existence. when we observe the particle traveling, it will only land in a predictable pattern. the experiment has been conducted several times since the 20s, using many different elements including photons. the funny thing with the experiment, particles and molecules that are not expected to travel as waves as a proton is, travel like a wave when unobserved.
I've heard the idea that the problem arises because in order to accurately measure the state of the particle you need information about the starting conditions of the universe, but you can't acquire this information until you measure it, and by measuring it you change the outcome since it's not a passive process.
>experiment
*photon is, travel*
typo
the collapse of a wave function is caused by particle interaction. by saying something is observed they mean something (usually an election or photon) interacted with the wave function.thats it. No conscience
we nearly understand the beginning of everything, but we still need to formulate gravity into the other 3 forces; strong rads, weak rads, electromags
we don't understand enough about consciousness to disprove its interactivity with the forces of the universe
Okay so what if you set up the equipment to measure the photon's path, but you dont look at the output? You only look at the screen. You will see an interference pattern.
OP sounds like Deepak Chopra. Leave Science alone and don't try to prove philosophical claims by using technical jargon!
What a stupid fucking idiot!
This
woke user confirmed
No, he doesn't. He asked us for input. He's the complete opposite you nigger
If you think that, then you don't understand the purpose of the scientific method you retard
You’re conflating conscience with telepathy lol
This experiment is literally proof of the opposite you dumb nigger
Im a PhD Engineer. Science literate. Studied quantum at university. Just an amateur philosopher in my spare time.
By the way you talk, do you think all of theoretical physics is Deepak Chopra. I'm just putting this idea out there.
Would be interested to read up on mathematical frameworks that might support this. Maybe they dont exist and it really Deepak Chopra shit. That's why we discuss.
Mah nigga
Consciousness is simply a biological adaptation that enables us to attach emotional responses with everyday experiences. Whether it be pain, sadness, happiness, that’s all it is. You can’t manipulate subatomic particles with your fucking mind retard. I could give a fuck what degree you have it obviously doesn’t mean shit if you can’t get past that
I'm a PhD quantum electrodynamic specialist and you have all caught the gay. Get help
ay just dont think about it lmao
no, its more observation of reality. the experiment suggests very crazy shit such as the tree does Not make a sound if nobody is around to hear it. user, science is weird, physics isn't fully understood anymore because we dove into the quantum realm and there's a lot of stuff we still need to begin to understand. one thing we do know for a fact is that science is observation, without any observation there can't be results. me personally, I relate quantum physics with hermetic philosophy, even tho quantum physics suggests a virtual reality existence, I still see the possibility that we are in a mental universe. have you ever tried to imagine "Nothing"? just pure nothingness. you really can't. you may think 'oh its blackness' or 'black holes' or 'nerve gas', but the reality is is that you can't imagine nothing, because even being aware of it makes you an observer, and your consciousness has literally put the nothingness into existence.
Our brain is a quantum computer. Hence, quantum shit DO play a role in what reality really is.
Consciousness isn’t as special or mysterious as you may believe. It is a materialistic phenomenon, it works off electricity and particles interacting within an ‘organic’ computer, which runs off its own software and external stimulus like sight and sound. Our brain recognizes and interpreters the stimulus most relevant to us like hearing crying or seeing faces. Also a person deciding on a choice can be measured before even the individual realizes they’re about to make the choice, giving further insight into the nature of how brains work and what ‘free will’ is. But don’t worry about it or anything, we can’t help but experience the world as human animals.
>BIGBRAIN
The concept is not that you change it. The concept is that you conciousness is capable of perceiving and processing two versions of reality at the same time. It would still be a passive process. Nobody is arguing that your conscience alters the experiment. Only that it may have an effect on which version of the story (or superposition thereof) we perceive.
Yeah, tell that to Bertrand Russell, the science nigger and Dawkins and all the other scientists that write books, give conferences, TED talks and make a big buck relating science with philosophy and ontology.
The nerve of these faggots, giving conferences with their completely biased point of view and knowing shit about other epistemologies.
Reminds me of those stupid medicine doctors discussing bioethics. Who the fuck told them that they knew shit about life and death?
Every STEM motherfucker has the right to get philosophical, but god forbid when others use their sacred scientific jargon, they seeth and squeal all over.
>Consciousness is simply a biological adaptation
False. That has not been proven.
>quantum titties
see
>817638197
Consciousness isn’t that special bud. Multiple realities?? Nahhh. It’s an advantageous evolutionary quirk nothing more. Stop reaching for significance. We are animals. Very smart animals that’s it
What's your email user? You're the first cunt to realize the power of nothingness on here. I like you.
>Is it a valid interpretation of the double slit experiment that our conciousness experiences a superposition of two realities?
>When brainlets read a popsci article
It’s difficult to get into whether or not it’s an ‘adaption’, as in it arose to overcome a specific environmental difficulty, but it did arise through evolution.
Your philosophy is brain washed weak from the biological sciences, the most narcissistic of faggots
ALOT more plausible than some of the retarded theories in here. You make an emotional response to a memory, especially a painful, sad or hurtful memory, and you get lots of connections between neurons and a strong long term memory that serves as a selecting factor for natural selection.
In other words, populations that learn from tough experiences (pain, fear, disgust, hate, etc.) especially developing fear responses to threats, survive better than those who don't.
Go fap to a trap then you worthless cuck
Yeah well, you can read Sartre's Being and Nothingness. Hopefully you'll understand anything he's saying, which is more or less what you're trying to say.
Agreed, in an objective interpretation of the universe.
This. Those cunts decided that life can be explained by counting pods.
If you're calling OP's theory retarded, then you are the retard. He asked a creative question. So it's invalid, at least he had an original thought instead of spouting off the same brain washed biology bullshit you are. Yes, biology is a solid theory. It makes excellent predictions. But then you bio faggots project it to all observation. Kys nigger
Butt mad because you’re wrong pussy? How bout you come suck me off instead
Have you read Sartre?
It’s a creative question but what does it matter if it’s baseless and wrong? Lol you faggots what this shit to mean so much more than it actually does. Sounds like you’re the ones who should kill yourselves
Of course. That's probably his hardest book to read.
But I'm not wrong. You're a close minded nigger. And unless you have a 9 inch penis, you're too small for me hun
“You’re right but you’re a fucking asshole for disproving a retard theory hurrr durrr”
Fuck you. I found your IP address. I am coming to gouge out your eyeballs and skull fuck you!
I found the writing to be thick unintelligible bullshit. But I only gave it 10 pages of a chance. Since you tell me it's his hardest, I'll try again. It's on my shelf still.
I ponder this shit all the time faggot. If I were close minded I would’ve closed the book on this a long time ago. It’s about fucking science fuck your stupid philosophical bullshit nigger
>le right/wrong dichotomy
The science's final frontier
Hahahahahahahaha
>OP's idea was wrong
>user thinks wrong implies retarded
You are the epitome of a nigger