Superhero Crash

Are we due for a massive superhero film crash?
It doesn't look like it will happen any time soon, and im sure kids will always enjoy them, however it looks like studios are becoming more and more reliant on them, large budgets, multiple planned films years in advance, long actor contracts etc, this is a lot of eggs in one basket and as soon as the general population gets tired of them, that they are seen as boring or uncool or whatever, they will go the way of the western.

The Marvel formula is crashing. They peaked with Avengers and have been on downwards projectory ever since. I just think people want good stories, regardless if it's a superhero film or not.

Disney has Star Wars as a contingency plan.

Its still printing money tho. We'll have to wait and see how Guardians of the Galaxy 2 and the new Thor film do before drawing conclusions. Their latest movies have been kinda weak, admittedly.

>on a downwards projectory
Explain.

marvel is crashing and Snyder films are gonna crash too, so this is the end for both marvel and dc

Already peaked with TFA. Now they're just going to exploit as much money they can from the IP before people get so sick and tired of it they'll beg for it to end.

Compare how much Avengers 1 did at the box office with Civil War, which also had a much larger cast of known superheroes.

MCU has already hit its peak. They're spending more and more each year earning less and less. They have a 4 billion investment to recoup so they must be getting worried by now.

> They're spending more and more each year earning less and less
Can you show me?

and live action adaptations of old Disney animated classics like the Lion King, Lady and the Tramp, Dumbo, 101 Dalmations, Bambi, Robin Hood, the Aristocats, the Fox and the Hound and so on and so forth.

the Avengers have been going down.

Avengers 1 made 1.5 billion
Avengers 2 made 1.4 billion
Avengers 2.1 made 1.1 billion

Kind of unfair to take CW into the comparison. It was obviously a budget-Avengers. Avengers 2 was shit, but going from 1.5 billion to 1.4 isn't exactly a catastrophe.

Marvel is to blame for the current state of cinema.

Their introduction of the "cinematic universe" has contaminated blockbusters - and it's not only superhero films that attempt to mimic this business model. King Kong vs. Godzilla, Universal's monster films (Mummy, Dracula, etc.), Star Wars spin-offs, rumors of a Hanna Barbera cinematic universe and Matrix reboot multi-film universe - it's everywhere. It's become an extension of what used to be typically trilogies at most (such as Nolan's Batman) and reflective of a TV culture (blockbusters as television episodes - "phases" of a cinematic universe as "seasons").

I think the 00s were an era where the genre was fresh and tried different things to establish itself. We are now in the "dark ages" where the genre has become McDonaldized and sooner or later people will get tired of consuming the same shit with slight changes. Once we hit that point (and it seems we are slowly getting there - I think the end of Marvel's Phase 3 will be it) there are two options: either the genre will die or the studios will be forced to experiment more (as Fox has done with "Deadpool" and "Logan") leading to a true golden age of superhero films.

The "cinematic universe" business model is flawed, though, as it is not welcoming of newcomers and who wants to sit through 20 films just to understand the new one. Look at the numerous reboots in the comic book industry just to gain new readers and streamline continuity. Studios make a big buck with the model now but it will backfire down the line. My hope is that soon films revert back to being trilogies or James Bond-like franchises with very loose continuity and emphasis on the character and story.

I hope so, but I think it will be a gradual descent. Meanwhile by then we will be at Transformers 15 and Furious 20.

>King Kong vs. Godzilla
Hey dumb-dumb, the Japanese had a cinematic universe for Godzilla for like half a century before the MCU was a thing.

>It was obviously a budget-Avengers.
yeah, with all the Avengers(minus Thor and Hulk) plus Spider-Man, Ant-Man, and the Black Panther. directed by the Russo Brothers who are also making Avengers Infinity. CW is an Avengers movie. and a better one than AoU.

True, but they're aproaching it as a superhero cinematic universe, with sequels programed with years in advance and post credits secret scenes and all that shit.

Did you stop reading my post there? Because even if it's one shitty example then it's hardly the core point I was making.

Cinematic Universes are cancer in that they are neverending and thus no superhero is ever allowed proper closure.

I really wanted Snyder to do his Superman trilogy. But now it seems they want the man in red and blue to appear in more non-Snyder films so obviously no closure there. Fuck Marvel for introducing this cancer. I want the age of superhero trilogies back.

The problem is not with Marvel, its with China.

Nope. The problem is Disney. China might save us as they consume more than just Marvel's turds unlike America.

Just admit you were wrong, it's not like you need to save face here.

Wasn't there like a Frankenstein vs. the Wolfman movie before King Kong vs. Godzilla.

How many movies did Hugh Jackman get as Wolverine before he finally did Logan? Let's see, there's X-Men, X-2: X-Men United, X-Men: The Last Stand, all of these 'X-Men' movies had him as the lead character with substantial character development. Then there are his solo movies like X-Men Origins: Wolverine, The Wolverine. He was also the lead character or an important character in X-Men: Days of Future Past and he had a substantial cameo in X-Men: Apocalypse, then he finally did Logan which was heralded as the greatest superhero by critics. It must be great to be a white guy. I so fucking hate Hugh Jackman and his character, Wolverine.

This gets me thinking, are there any characters in the Marvel Cinematic Universe that might get the same treatment as Wolverine? Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, I could even count in Blade, since he has his own solo movies, most of which were pretty good. However, Blade isn't part of the current Marvel movies. Oh shoot, I almost forgot Spider Man.

Maybe there can be another golden age of superhero films, but without Wolverine. Fuck Wolverine.

I think this is the year that starts the end of capeshit. GotG2 is already getting beat up in early reviews, Wonder Woman and Justice League look like garbage, Spider-Man looks awfully boring, and Thor 3 looks way too jokey for my liking.

Didn't Winter Soldier come out after Avengers? Winter Soldier is their best movie so I don't think you know what a peak is.

So how will the crash look like?
Will it look like a bluff between the two studios, each studio makes a movie bigger than the opponent's last then one day it crashes

Or it will be a decline of one remaining giant: one studio bombs two or three movies in a row and gradually winds down its series

Chinese market is the reason why movies today have flashy special effects, simple dialogue and simple easy to follow plots.

>MUH BUBBLE

I've seen this claimed every year for so long now. Retards just pretending they know economics.

If it makes you feel better, replace "King Kong vs. Godzilla" with "DC films". But my point regarding the cinematic universe model and predictions regarding the future remain.

Tony Stark is probably the biggest one:
Iron Man (established the MCU)
Incredible Hulk cameo
Iron Man 2 (expanded the MCU)
Avengers
Iron Man 3
Avengers: Age of Ultron
Captain America: Civil War
Spider-Man: Homecoming
Avengers: Infinity War

I don't mind the fact they used Wolverine as a focal character but I think they took it a bit too far - having him as the central character in an X-Men trilogy is fine but then standalone films and Days of Future Past, again, an over-saturation. "Logan" really worked because it didn't anchor itself to a direct continuity but was still aware of the audience's familiarity with the characters and their relationships (especially Logan and Xavier) for emotional connection.

Do you think there's any hope for a crossover movie like those one-off specials they used to do or are Marvel still pissy about that?

I agree but cinematic universe is not a creative problem created by marvel. It is a media format that can survive on Internet.

What we are seeing is the absorption of cinema by TV series and that of TV series by online series.
Internet killed cinema and Internet is now viewed with a TV viewing habit

Movies are now made to be viewed on a "binge" and "marathon" and multitasking mode. Movies are not watched in screening room for 90 minutes. (Not even for 2.5 hours.)
Movies are now watched at home for six hours a day, two or three days in a row. Movies are watched with many distractions and breaks.

TV soap opera is the ultimate form of cinema

Wow, the audience if familiar with a white guy... I mean character like Wolverine/Logan. You know what would be cool for Fox to do, use the X-Men films to advance the careers of other actors and actresses like they used Wolverine to advance the career of Hugh Jackman. Hell, people say that the first X-Men film is Hugh Jackman's breakout role. Why not do that for others. Anyway, it's gotten to the point where I'm just sick of Wolverine... Oh sorry, I meant X-Men films in general. At least Marvel Studios has the guts to focus on other characters, Iron Man may be one of their major stars, but they still do films for other characters, many of them weren't as popular as Wolverine is, and they still raked in the money.

The China Bubble will burst.
It's economy will collapse dragging the world down with it

Then studios will bankrupt in that wave. Nothing will stay

"Wow, the audience if familiar with a white guy..."

I meant to say "Wow, the audience *is familiar with a white guy..."

Even with a large cast, it's still an Avengers movie vs. a Captain America movie. Until Infinity War comes out, there's really no way to say this definitively.

Although Wolverine was the more popular character in the X-Men universe, let's not forget that the first trilogy also focused on Rogue and the relationship between Xavier and Magneto; First Class and Apocalypse only had cameos by Wolverine and Deadpool was a wholly standalone film.

As I said in right now is the "safe" era of superhero films. Now that Wolverine is done with, Mystique was crafted into a new Wolverine-like character to carry the franchise (though this somewhat failed, I think). Studios gravitate towards what has previously worked and try to recreate it. That slow-mo scene with Quicksilver in Days of Future Past was popular with audiences so of course they did another one in Apocalypse. They're just recycling things which only adds to the homogenization - and people are getting tired of it, as early reviews of Guardians of the Galaxy vol.2 seem to indicate (focus on the popular elements in the first film).

Trying to turn Mystique into Wolverine 2 backfired once the public did a 180 on its opinion of J Law.

hmmm

This. Ironically, even if DC movies underperform they all turn a profit and WB can call it a day anytime. Disney needs to squeeze Marvel as much as they can because after 7 years, they haven't made 4 billions in profit from theaters. Not even close. And they don't sell as much merchandise as Star Wars, (hence the Baby groot kind of characters). If the capeshit fatigue comes today, Disney will lose money on their Marvel investment (after 7 years and nothing but succesful movies)

Correction: everything will bankrupt. The least of our worries will be the quality of kino.