>I didn't think it would end this way. End? No, the journey doesn't end here. Death is just another path, one that we all must take. The grey rain curtain of this world rolls back, and all turns to silver glass. And then you see it... >What, Gandalf, see what? White shores. And beyond; a far, green country, and to a swift sunrise. >That's not so bad. No. No it isn't.
According to atheists Pippin should have started screaming YOU GOT PROOF BRO? YOU EXPECT ME TO BELIEVE FAIRYTALES WRITTEN BY ELVES 5000 YEARS? WHY SHOULD I WORSHIP A DEAD VALAR ON A STICK? BONE CANCER IN CHILDREN!!1!!!!1!
Ethan Reyes
I'm sorry but I don't think their ancient magical fiction world has any bearing on this one.
Ayden Rodriguez
He was talking to a literal angel and they were fighting against a literal lieutenant of hell. He also came in contact with several people who were there when the world began. There's no room for atheism in Middle Earth.
Jace Long
Gandalf was an angel sent by God to help mankind. Tolkien wrote LOTR as if he had uncovered an ancient tome and this all really happened in our real world history.
Jack Gutierrez
Pippin knew none of this. Only Elrond, Cirdan, and a handful of other elves + Aragorn even knew who Gandalf really was.
Wyatt Lopez
nevertheless Pipin shares the fate of men and doesn't go to valinor, which gandalf is describing here, so all of that was just bullshit.
Gabriel Morris
IIRC wasn't that part of the Gift of Men? That men were mortal and didn't go to Valinor like the elves but in return they were more able to effect their will on the world?
Carter Collins
It was, Men can operate beyond the music and not have to get all angsty about the world being shit like Elves do
Oliver Hernandez
>several people who were there when the world began Only Gandalf.
Jeremiah Hall
are you dumb? kys pippin was there when Gandalf died, why wouldn't he believe it
Easton Diaz
why even defend yourself against orcs if you will go to paradise?
Jace Barnes
Pippin saw Gandalf fall. And then he saw Gandalf alive later on and continued the journey. No where does it say that Gandalf told him "lol bro I'm actually an angel".
Adrian Ortiz
Because they used to have Paradise until some asshole spider ate the trees and it could very well happen again
Eli Reed
Fuk yu, Mithrandir. I ain't trust your douche religion. The very reason of my life is to smoke, drink, and breed little hobbits in the Shire.
Wyatt Brooks
>le reductio ad absurdum He fell to a chasm with a flaming balrog The only reason he tells him about the white shores is because he knew Pippin saw him die.
Wyatt Brooks
Gandalf is a "wizard" according to 99.999% of the population. He doesn't get outed as an angel for miraculous shit because people can just assume it was some magic spell he cast. The whole point of Gandalf looking like an old man is to be unassuming.
Pippin did not know he was an angel. Pippin probably didn't even know anything about deities to begin with as most of his life was spent being a carefree, mischievous Hobbit prior to that point.
Grayson Rivera
He actually tells the fellowship he was sent back because he still had a mission
Camden Gutierrez
>He actually tells the fellowship he was sent back because he still had a mission
When?
David Lopez
when he talks with the three hunters
Ethan Sanchez
How did Saruman dig Isengard in just a day? Where did he get the women for the interracial breeding grounds to create the man orc uruk hai?
Jordan Foster
The Uruk Hai aren't the man orcs
Cooper White
But what's his tax policy
Isaac Torres
yes they are
Jason Ramirez
No, they aren't
Jack Reed
yes they are who arent if not them?
Gabriel Davis
The Dunlendings who aren't really in the movie, this is basic Tolkien lore shit, Uruks are just Orcs specially bred for fighting wars
Christian Bailey
>Dunlendings no those are normal man
John Rodriguez
If this is where the good in middle-Earth go when dead? where do the Orcs and all the other evil guys go?
Juan Martinez
No, they have orc men and man orcs in their number, that's why when they show up in the shire is the only time you ever get a description of a half orc in Tolkien
Caleb Jones
Tolkien died before he could finish a full explanation of what the fuck Orcs exactly are or where they go when dead
Asher Reyes
It's almost as if Gandalf was trying to relax Pippin and reassure him so he wasn't so scared
Oliver Scott
Fun fact: that dialogue is actually what frodo dreams when they stayed with bombadil in fellowship in the books.
Wyatt Scott
He may not know his true nature as an angelic being but he clearly knows he not human and is powerful
Levi Robinson
Isn't there supposed to be some kind of vague afterlife for Men (and Hobbits I guess since they are Men also)? I haven't read Tolkien in a long time.
Brandon Torres
If god was real why would he let all those people die instead of fixing the problem he himself created
Dylan Phillips
how can anyone be so uneducated?
Samuel Rodriguez
It's intentionally vague, but supposedly they show up to sing the second music when the current world ends
Carson King
how can anyone think that knowing children's fantasy lore makes them educated?
Chase Powell
this has nothing to do with tolkine, you retarded ape
Benjamin Richardson
Allright, nice. Thank you user.
Brandon Edwards
except it has, maybe you are too stupid to realize it which wouldn't be a surprise, people that get this aggressive over these things have usually a low IQ
Hudson Perry
Im on iq levels you cannot even comprehend, kiddo.
Owen Myers
corrupted elves
Hudson Collins
god was never a hippie
Jonathan Rogers
Yeah, and then before that they were born of heat and had stone hearts or some shit, and then he changed his mind about them being Elves because to be fair that's fucking stupid and started writing about them being animals or even some sort of Maiar offspring
Adrian Brown
Dunlendings are the Sup Forumstards of Middle-earth. FRECA DID NOTHING WRONG. AVENGE KING WULF!
Gavin Allen
It's a lot easier to believe in the supernatural when you're living in a world with actual magic.
Angel Moore
yeah, I can't understand such subnormal levels, you are right
Alexander Ross
I don't think it matters much. Even if the pernickety old sod actually wrote a final or definitive account of their origins he'd only have started hemming and hawing again a few years later and revised that too.
Colton Gonzalez
>as if
Henry Davis
Or without it, as human history in any corner of this world attests.
Lucas Johnson
Are you telling me Pippin is an athiest?
John Allen
He also wasn't good at his job apparently
Kevin Fisher
So, Orcs go to Mandos when they die?
Benjamin Brooks
Yes. Tolkien also stared to explore the theme about orcs always being inherently evil. In one of the books frodo and sam overhear two orcs complaining about the war and the ringwraiths and how they should just desert and find their own caves to live in.
Zachary Bell
>End? No the income tax bracket doesn't end here. High income is just another path, one that NEETS cannot take. The red curtain of this bank account rolls back and all turns to black ink... and then you see it >See what Gandalf? >Tax deductibles and beyond
Jace Ward
That very guy in your picture is the one who is prophetized to return and kill Morgoth once and for all, in that final, second song.
Parker Powell
Im pretty sure treebeard was older than gandalf
Kayden Wood
What is this meme
Grayson Collins
It's either easier with or without magic dumbass.
Matthew Clark
Only gandalfs physical incarnation. Gandalf and the rest of the angels predate the universe and were with G-d outside of time.
Camden Garcia
Gandalf is an ainur, ainurs existed before the world was even a thing, and the vast majority of them never entered the world at all.
Treebeard is a descendant of the first trees Yavanna made. When she heard from Aule that his children (the dwarves) would need a lot of wood from the forests (and that elves would need some too), she got mad and went to Manwe to ask if there wasn't any way the forests could be protected. I think Manwe checked with Illuvatar and then the Ents happened. I don't recall all the details, there is a short chapter of the Silmarillion covering that, called "Of Aule and Yavanna" iirc.
Michael Smith
Only eldritch shit like Ungoliant is older than Gandalf
Robert Smith
Non canon garbage
Austin Allen
>there is a short chapter of the Silmarillion covering that, called "Of Aule and Yavanna"
Benjamin Rodriguez
>Aulë who is the great smith of the Valar, wishes to create life whom he can teach his craft to. His patience waiting for the Elves to awake gets the best of him and Aulë secretly decides to create the Seven Fathers of the Dwarves. Ilúvatar, also known as Eru (the One), soon learns of Aulë's actions and Aulë is forced to destroy his creations. However Ilúvatar now does not want to see the Dwarves destroyed, so he grants them life of their own. They must however rest until the Awakening of the Elves who Eru has chosen to be the Firstborn of the Children of Ilúvatar. >Yavanna, the spouse of Aulë, soon learns of her husband's deeds, she fears the Dwarves, or even the Elves and Men will harm her plants and trees which she loves. She goes to Manwë to seek protection. Manwë has a vision of the Song of Creation in which Eru tells him not to fear as spirits will also awake to protect what Yavanna holds dear.
Colton Wood
so im not even allowed to hate orcs now?
fuck this sjw culture
Jack Morales
Magic is blatently known to be true in this fairy tale universe with magical creatures and elves that are literally fucking immortal. Gandalf is a fucking angel and has spent presumably countless years living in Valianor which he's speaking about.
There are also hardly any organized belief at all in lotr. Only the evil assholes actually worship something. A figure that literally walked around and waged war on various races for hundreds of years. There are written accounts of this within the universe.
To compare this to our own reality is silly. If you believe your opinion right then surely you don't need to make straw-man arguments for the people who disagree. Perhaps realize that by doing so you're clearly just lying as to avoid hurting your pride from how wrong you are.
Jose Parker
>In one of the books frodo and sam overhear two orcs complaining about the war and the ringwraiths and how they should just desert and find their own caves to live in. Really? I don't recall this at all.
Leo Flores
Pippin knew he was living in a fantasy movie though
Lincoln Brown
The orcs hated sauron (and the feeling was mutual) but they were afraid of him. They're beings spawned from melkor's corruption, and when left to their own devices they were still shitheads, just not as well organized since they spent as much time slitting each other's throats as they did raiding the countryside at night.
Ryder Howard
Magic, elves' immortality, Gandalf's Resurrection and the nature of everything going on around them is plenty proof. He's not following some old religious text of the elves here, just actual shit happening infront of his fucking face. If only any religion would come close to this I'd accept it in a heartbeat, but its not comparable to the actual real world.
Christian Morales
Pretty sjre its when sam is wearing the ring and running around the tunnels after the orcs find frodo's body.
Brody Rogers
Hey. No rational talk here!
Jaxson Long
He was just a dumb hobbit.
Nolan Russell
They wanted to find somewhere else so they could be rulers themselves, raid and plunder a nice countryside of easy targets where they got meat and plunder easily. Just because they didn't want to be slaves doesn't make them good. Hate them all you like.