ITT: Cop Outs

ITT: Cop Outs

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Avatar season finale thread?

oh fuck you

ending of the manga/anime monster

jesus christ how anti-climactic

I've never seen Avatar, but I imagine them both screaming "WOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLP" in that screenshot.

...

It could have ended perfectly without the lion turtle thing happening at all, and just letting that spiral of elements kill Ozai.

But I guess that'd be too graphic. Aang should have pulled the oxygen from his lungs or made him blow his own head off.

Would you have been fine with the guru teaching him how to seal someone's bending through chi?

...

He's a pacifist

Or if they'd just set it up so that Ozai was overthrown and imprisoned. It's not like there weren't prisons for fire benders.

I think the stupider part was where Aang went around the world for three books trying to get strong enough to beat him by himself but then just used Avatar form anyway, which he pretty much could've done from the start. What was the point of the entire series? Just fucking around.

If it hadn't taken so damn long for them to air the episodes, it would have been better.
But they're not done with it yet, so we'll see

I hope that Yellow or Blue Diamond are so fucking evil that Steven is forced to realize that there isn't always a pacifist option.

It was actually totally silent except for a beam-like sound effect.

TWISTED
FUCKING
PSYCHOPATH

this is fine when you realize even with the huge buildup, the cluster was just a small subplot, the real important shit is the invasion of yellow diamond and the homeworld.

He couldn't control his avatar form or use the other powers effectively. Even in book 2 he kills flying things with his avatar state.

That's a little disappointing, but I bet they WOLOLOLOLOP

Remember that time Aang drowned an entire Fire Nation navy?

But he clearly rescinded on the "let go of Katara" thing, because he's in even more of a relationship with her in Book 3 than in Book 2.

You might not like it, but it wasn't a cop-out. Everything was set up beforehand.

The partially conscious nature of fractured Gems has been established.
The fact that bubbling can prevent Gems from forming a body has been established for a long time.
Steven's telepathic powers have been shown.

And, most importantly, we know about Steven's "let's talk it out instead of fighting" personality. That's his MO. It's been a major part of his character forever. Peridot, Centipeetle, Lapis, On the Run, etc. You should have known that he'd do something like this ever since the nature of the Cluster was mentioned.

To be fair, Steven has always had a Charisma of 25.

Eh, I can see them being irredeemable but not "no pacifist" option.

Like I can see the Diamonds fucking themselves over in their own anger. Like turning their subjects away from them and stranding themselves, or getting themselves shattered somehow.

But if you're talking about Steven smashing his shield on a gem like Captain America on an arc reactor, then no, I do not ever see that happening

That was a bandaid on a gaping chest wound. Something is going to pop that bubble and Steven won't be able to hug it back into place, at least not immediately

I think Aangs entire story is that of the quiet 15 year old who goes to get a tattoo behind their parents back. It's all excitement and fun until they are there in the seat and realize this isn't something they can do.

Aang was training to become strong enough to beat the Firelord because since he was unfrozen the Firelord has been the badguy. His been end game. His been the one cause of all of Aang's problems. It wasn't until he mastered all his elements and were training with the dummies did he realize that this is something he, as a person, as a member of the Air Nomads, couldn't morally do.

Also the Avatar state wasn't exactly something he could do from the start since he lost the ability to use it from that exploding face man.

Yeah, but if he ultimately only relied on the Avatar form and if the Avatar form was the only thing that mattered in defeating Ozai then what the fuck was the point in any of the rest?

Also, 'You can never use the Avatar form because then the cycle might be destroyed!' but then he uses it indiscriminantly anyway. And it didn't matter at all because Avatar form can beat anyone forever all of the time.

Avatar form itself was a really stupid plot device.

Excuse me, shitwagon, the point is that it cops out from the buildup of everything about dealing with it. Eight episodes half-spent pointing towards actually fucking fighting or destroying something, intentionally for once. And then naw, power of love. Fuck if that was established, they promised fucking action and copped out.

>Also the Avatar state wasn't exactly something he could do from the start since he lost the ability to use it from that exploding face man.
He lost it from Azula. And there's no point in him losing it if he gets it back through sheer luck as soon as he needs it.

I want Steven to fuse with Peridot.

The Cluster can't fight without forming and can't form without obliterating the Earth. What on Earth did you expect?

And we got a fight in SWI. Just be happy with that.

Nothing about that was a cop out
The gems had no plan to deal with the cluster after getting to it. There was nothing they could have possibly done to it even if all the gems were there and it choosing to bubble itself made the most sense. It wasn't some asspull like Steven grew a blade and cut the cluster in half either, as Steven has communicated with gems telepathically before.
It was a great stall or an okay ending to the cluster depending on how the crewniverse deals with it in the future.

>they promised fucking action
They never did.

SU has never been an action show.

>He lost it from Azula

Ah. Why did I think a rock was involved? Doesn't matter.

It wasn't sheer luck that he got it back, The Lion Turtle showed him how to bend energy (which got him his avatar form back) and essentially showed him how to cut off bending which gave him an option against the Firelord that didn't end in one of them dying.

>he clearly rescinded on the "let go of Katara" thing
Not so. He didn't have to completely let go of her, just the idea that she had to come before the rest of the world. Even when expressing how he feels for her, he still advances towards what is really important.

>but then he uses it indiscriminantly anyway.
Aang actually uses the Avatar State only three times per season, twice in the last and that was only in the final episode.

>And then naw, power of love.
>power of love
>naw
watch a different show senpai

>he thinks PUNCH PUNCH PUNCH is better than convincing a hundred million corpses of Earth's defenders to stay dead in order to preserve the planet they love
How is pubescence treating you, user?

>The Lion Turtle showed him how to bend energy (which got him his avatar form back)

Actually no. His Avatar form was still locked after that. It was only after Ozai blasted him spine-first into a rock that he got it back

Where did they promise any action or fight against the cluster? The gems never even discussed how to deal with the cluster after reaching it they were just winging it. Hell thank god Steven dealt with it and not the gems since they are fucking retarded and would have tried to fight it and woke it up. The gems are a bunch of screw ups who can't do anything but attack a problem head on.

>Why did I think a rock was involved?
>It wasn't sheer luck that he got it back, The Lion Turtle showed him how to bend energy (which got him his avatar form back) and essentially showed him how to cut off bending which gave him an option against the Firelord that didn't end in one of them dying.
You're getting your thoughts crossed. A rock to the back was what gave Aang the Avatar State BACK.

The Lion Turtle thing was ANOTHER cop-out that was equally stupid. ATLA's finale is so awful that I can't believe people still defend it.

Three times is pretty indiscriminant if it might cause the end of the world, man.

>The gems had no plan to deal with the cluster after getting to it.
except that part about drilling the fuck out of it and breaking/destroying it which would have made more sense of busting it up and then have them bubble each other

The ROCK!

It all makes sense now. Illuminati confirmed. I'll be back in 3 days brothers. This will be big

Yeah and then he spent all of season 2 being so afraid of the Avatar State to the point that it actually got him killed.

>It could have ended perfectly without the lion turtle
true. Aang could defeat him easily (and actually did) without energybending. I think the only point in showing it, is to finish explaining the energybending thing they have been talking about since S01.

You guys are all forgetting about the biggest cop-out in recent cartoon history.

Gruncle Stan getting his memories back after all.

I still love GF, but you're right. I forget, did they give a hand-wavy answer for that or no explanation at all?

Didn't they establish in an earlier episode your memories could come back?

The energybending was just there so he could defeat Ozai without killing him. Ironically it has done little to actually stop people from wanting to put Ozai back on the throne.

why getting hit in the middle of a fight is considered weird? getting hit in the same spot is hardly a stretch.

>I think the stupider part was where Aang went around the world for three books trying to get strong enough to beat him by himself but then just used Avatar form anyway, which he pretty much could've done from the start.
His Avatar State didn't have other forms of bending until he learned them, doofus. He couldn't have done any of the stuff he used to wipe out Ozai at the beginning.

That and learning to actually control his Avatar State, which allowed him to go into it after his chakras got fixed, and to leave it before killing Ozai.

I would have been way more ok with that if it had been slower. Like, while he's on the boat trip with his brother they sorta slowly come back

Could've meant something if she'd stayed dead.

>Implying Bill's curse didn't fuck up the memory wipe

It's that somehow getting thrown onto the exact outcrop of rock that one tiny piece of it hits a spot, and that somehow hitting that spot repairs his chakra when literally nothing else could. It kinda takes the thunder out of losing the ability to begin with if he can just get it back as soon as he needs it.

I'm forever fine with the ending to Avatar. The only part that was stupid was hitting that rock to reopen his chakra or whatever.

Er, no. The biggest cop-out?

>is to finish explaining the energybending thing they have been talking about since S01
That's bullshit. Throwing a few vague uses of the word "energy" around is in no way a builld-up to "You can magically take people's bending away".

>His Avatar State didn't have other forms of bending until he learned them, doofus.
Nah nah nah nah nah. I don't buy that shit. Avatar form has all the knowledge and clearly all the power of all the previous Avatars.

>And it didn't matter at all because Avatar form can beat anyone forever all of the time.
Didn't Azula fuck Aang up pretty badly in the season 2 finale when he was in the Avatar State? It's not invincible.

>

It's been years since I've seen ATLA but I think it was anti-climactic because it was implied Aang's block was more mental than physical (his chi points were obviously fucked up but if he reached some kind of understanding and acceptance they would open up again on their own). Like it's not weird Aang got hit by a rock, it's weird because it had nothing to do with what happened to him. He literally just got lucky. Arguably this was something LOK did better because Korra actually had to confront and accept what happened to her and ALSO had to go through the physical part of recovery by bending the poison out of her body.

It's more the fact that Aang's entire victory hinged on a coincidence completely outside his control, and so who he was as a person, and all that training he did, was completely irrelevant.

If you could find an episode to show that that includes bending forms, I'd believe you, but it doesn't seem to. In the beginning, Aang still only did air stuff in the Avatar State.

Also this. People keep saying there was buildup when it was only pictures of lion turtles every now and then which did nothing for energy bending and only built up that the turtle existed.

It was entirely out of left field.

>didn't know waterbending
>wrecked zuko's ship in ep 2

That wasn't the normal Avatar State. That was a one-time weird mediation thing Aang was doing.

The Avatar State makes you vulnerable because if you get killed during it, it ends the Avatar cycle. Aang fucked up because he spent too long floating there dramatically and Azula had the sense to actually try and attack him.

>Like it's not weird Aang got hit by a rock, it's weird because it had nothing to do with what happened to him.
Yeah it does. He had achieved the mental state by the end of Season 2, and then Azula fucked him up physically. If she hadn't done that, he could have probably beat Ozai even faster, as he would have had Avatar State abilities whenever he needed them.

>That was a one-time weird mediation thing Aang was doing.
What?

This is why Azula is the best.

>Yeah it does.
Thematically no it doesn't. The fact is if Aang had been off by a few inches he wouldn't have unblocked his chakras.

You mean when he deflects Zuko's fireball with air to make an ice cliff collapse on it?

You're right. It was luck. I'm saying that it had to do with what happened to him, because it was bad luck that he got his chakras fucked up because of a physical problem in the first place.

>it was implied Aang's block was more mental than physical
is inaccurate. He had already achieved the mental aspect.

>The energybending was just there so he could defeat Ozai without killing him
he defeated ozai without killing him Before energybending, using the avatar state. That's how he trapped him on taht rock. After that, Ozai is defeated. They could literally throw him in jail with bending that it wouldn't make a difference.

>that somehow hitting that spot repairs his chakra when literally nothing else could
he lost it by getting hit as well. Getting it back by hitting again sounds logical.

it is buildup for "the power exists, we just don't know what it does".

>it's weird because it had nothing to do with what happened to him
he literally lost the power by getting hit on that place. It has a lot to do with what happened to him.

getting hit is hardly a "coincidence"

> who he was as a person, and all that training he did, was completely irrelevant
if he did not train, he couldn't control the avatar state and would just kill Ozai.

No he very clearly didn't defeat Ozai until he took his bending away from him. Aang needed a way to beat him without killing him. Ozai doesn't know how to fight without his bending. Take away his bending = defeating him.

>They could literally throw him in jail with bending that it wouldn't make a difference.
They would have a way harder time doing it.

>he very clearly didn't defeat Ozai until he took his bending away from him
watch that part again. Aang kicked his ass, and then trapped him with earthbending. At that point Ozai couldn't leave anymore. He could literally just let Ozai there, or make him go through the ground until his neck.

>They would have a way harder time doing it
trap him in earth --> wait Sozin's comet --> he is a normal firebender --> throw him in jail

You keep intentionally missing the point.

the point is if Aang needed energybending to defeat Ozai. He didn't. He could literally just let him there with earthbending trapping his hands and feet. If he tried to firebend he would just burn his hands. Even if he escaped, Aang could kick his ass back to earth again, all the way to his neck. Energybending serves no purpose on that ending other than be there for the sake of showing it.

>They would have a way harder time doing it

Exactly why it's a cop out to just take his bending. That whole finish would've been fine had Aang detained him. That would be Ozai's defeat. He's not helpless sure but they can and have detained fire benders before. Being good and not "doing what is necessary" is fucking hard and it should be fucking hard. As is the ending has one glaring, unexplained moment that doesn't ruin it, but just kind of sucks some of the wind out of the sails.

The turtle was bullshit. The rock thing was explained.

>it is buildup for "the power exists, we just don't know what it does".
Which means it's not buildup at all.

>getting hit is hardly a "coincidence"
That's what it is. Something that happened by chance, beyond his control, with no relevance to his character.

youtube.com/watch?v=AXcD2hc2noM

>The rock thing was explained.
Having an explanation doesn't make it not a cop-out.

There's no point in taking the Avatar State away if they're just going to hand Aang back his insta-win mode, with no effort, as soon as he needs it.

It's literally impossible to kill you idiot.

Taking away his bending perfectly coincided with Aang's beliefs, why do you consider it a cop out?

The drills weren't doing shit except encouraging the cluster to form faster.

>eight episodes
That's not a lot, senpai. Especially considering that it's an 11 min per episode series.

Bubble your butthurt

>And then naw, power of love
Did you forget the entire episode dedicated to the message that love was the answer. It's not a new concept in the show.

Holy fuck does this trigger me.

If that rock wasn't in THAT specific are at THAT specific time in THAT specfic shape, Aang is unambiguously fucking dead.

The spiritbending is also a copout, but at least it's something that Aang actively chooses to do for reasons that fit his character.

Sorry for the meme text on the image, it's the only one I could find quickly and I didn't feel like spending that much time looking for one, but it also shows how fucking stupid the fans of this series can be that they find this kind of thing acceptable. It's the kind of encouragement that led Bryke to the conclusion that they didn't even need proper writers on Korra considering most of the retarded fanbase will apparently accept anything.

You mean that time a grief-stricken spirit hijacked his body so he could commit mass murder while Aang was helpless to stop it.

Delving past the surface. Xanatos declaring a truce and welcoming the Gargoyles back to their home because they saved his son from getting kidnapped by a spirit god was a major step in the wrong direction to take his character in the show.

It would have been better if Peridot had explained how those force fused gems were before instead of in that episode so it would have been some nice foreshadowing, but since it all happened at once I can see how it can look shitty.

This was my issue with it too, despite the people replying with justifications. It seemed too much like that guy from the beginning was right. Seeing Aang beat Ozai with techniques and advice from each trainer would have been so much more satisfying.

Really the Zuko vs. Azula fight was so much more entertaining and better executed.

This is probably b8 but as others have said it's thematically very consistent with the show. It's nice, I think. Not every show has to be edgy and SU is about empathy more than anything.

He wouldn't have been able to take down Ozai without using all forms of his bending. Do you honestly think Ozai would have willingly sat still to have his bending taken away? He was enjoying the power surge Sozin's Comet gave him, he wasn't fucking around.

You're missing the point of the show. It's not the destination, it's the journey. In this case Aang needed to travel the world to mature enough to handle the responsibility of being the Avatar and learn about the people he's supposed to help, even the fire nation people.

He needed that maturity or he'd have lost.

I agree it was kind of an anticlimax because after all that buildup, all Steven needed to do to stop the apocalypse was to ask nicely and it was over in a few minutes. A lot was accomplished with very little effort or sacrifice. Steven didnt learn anything, he was just confirmed to be right about using empathy over force. Garnet may have learned something and she put herself at risk, which is the best part about the episode, but she didn't really contribute to the resolution at the end, she just helped Steven to get there so he could solve the conflict in two sentences.

>Garnet
I meant PERIDOT wtf

Lmao, now defending yourself is considered edgy

Yeah, leave the world destroying abomination alone, the only thing preventing it from destroying the planet is its mental stability which is lacking.
But just ignore it, we don't want to be edgy tryring to claim that self defence is a good thing

Getting into a jam because of "chance" (aka the writers choosing that to happen) is a-okay. Getting out of a jam in the same circumstances isn't.