"All of this grows out of our larger philosophy that the comic industry is moving into a seasonal model...

>"All of this grows out of our larger philosophy that the comic industry is moving into a seasonal model, that isn't too unlike what you see with your favorite binge-worthy TV shows," Alonso told CBR in June 2015 when discussing "All-New, All-Different Marvel." "Every year or so, you offer a new story or direction that provides an accessible entry point to new readers that builds on the experience you've been providing current readers. Sometimes that change is subtle; sometimes that change is seismic -- depends on the character or where the story is going. Each year or so of publishing provides a wild ride that offers some sense of completion, but, of course, doesn't finish the story. That's where the next 'season' picks up."

Can't they just admit "If we restart again we get the massive number one boost."?

Is this "seasonal" thing REALLY what we're going for? Most of the All New books didn't have actual endings either.

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comicsbeat.com/marvel-comics-month-to-month-sales-march-2016-spiders-dont-live-in-a-cesspool-but-in-dead-pools/
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Wouldn't releasing one or two OGNs for a series per year resemble a "seasonal" model more so than relaunching every book every year?

but I guess they wouldn't get to put out 4.99 #1s if they did that!

>Every year or so, you offer a new story or direction that provides an accessible entry point to new readers that builds on the experience you've been providing current readers.

>New readers

>All of this grows out of our larger philosophy that the comic industry is moving into a seasonal model, that isn't too unlike what you see with your favorite binge-worthy TV shows,

This would be GOAT if they just dropped floppies and-yeah what this guy said , beat me to it while I was writing.

>favorite binge-worthy TV shows

why would they use this buzz-phrase when it literally makes no sense in comics?

Monthly comics are the LEAST bingeable things in existence.

>that isn't too unlike what you see with your favorite binge-worthy TV shows
Reading one issue a month isn't "binging", Axel. The seasonal TV binge model is the opposite of what you're talking about

Ok buy why are they using the same name again. Have they seriously forgotten that they already did Marvel Now? I'm concerned

And wasn't most of Marvel Now considered a sales disappointment? Why reuse the damn name? Especially so soon?

This is only going to make it more confusing.

You know comics don't get any easier to get into when you have like 15 #1s for the Captain America title. That's not accessible, that's confusing as fuck. ESPECIALLY when they all spin off an event.
Also this Reusing the same name for your relaunch is even more confusing.

NO MORE #1S.

Are you seriously questioning Marvel's PR and publicity department? They've been able to turn turds into gold, what do we know?

Why do they do this? How many #1 issues does one series need? They've already got a successful film franchise and are under the fucking Disney umbrella. How much of a boost could it possibly give them?

Yeah but they've also been able to turn turds into turds of the same value.

Invincible Iron Man #1 sold 279k thanks to 20+ variants.

It is now 40k-50k at #8.

Jesus this industry is terrible.

when everything is a #1 nothing will be

they're shooting themselves in the foot

Hey, they don't lose money.

Can't see the harm in that. They shot the entire industry in the head the day they said "We're gonna distribute our own comics!"

They're going to kill #1's being big sales just like they killed collecting comics and variant covers.

comicsbeat.com/marvel-comics-month-to-month-sales-march-2016-spiders-dont-live-in-a-cesspool-but-in-dead-pools/

Boy I can't wait for some of the relaunched books to sell even worse than they do now, just like what happened with ANAD

Better fucking idea because it works in Japan.

Not being a weeb, but its a genuinely good idea.

JUST DO WHAT THE FUCK SHONEN JUMP DOES.

Nobody wants to shill 3 or 4 dollars out for 20 page floppies anymore. The magazine style of compiling around 10 or so of them gives a massive incentive boost into buying it. You get more bang for your buck.

You could even compile multiple books together based on franchise.

Your "The Avengers" mag, your "Spider-Man" mag, your "X-Men" mag, your "Marvel Cosmic" mag, your a "What If?" mag, maybe 3 others.

I would buy the shit out of them. And, you automatically, 100% guarantee a sale on the comic since they'll HAVE to buy it to get access to another comic they're interested in.

Just compile the shit together god dammit. Its a win-win for LITERALLY EVERYONE.

This goes for Marvel AND DC.

DC actually does this in foreign countries now. They pick the best of the new52 and put them in an anthology book.

They should really bring back Marvel Premier, Strange Tales and shit like that. An anthology series with simple 12 page stories for a character that makes you want to read more about them.

So Sup Forums, what's your Marvel Now-er predictions?

>Thor Odinson gets a book a la Steve & Sam and Miles & Peter
>Gamora, Blade, Kate Bishop, Jessica Jones books
>Spider-woman, Star-Lord, Drax, Hellcat, Moon girl, and Squirrel girl are relaunched
>something with the new Quasar, new solo or new team book or something
>Bendis finally gets the fuck off of GOTG pls
>Marvel relaunches Vision and it's a massive critical and financial failure
>Loki book relaunched because election season
>at least 5 variants for everything, more like 20 for bigger books
>Bendis is still writing like 10 books
>#1 issues sell buttloads and suffer higher drop offs than ANAD did

I like the idea of western comics picking up with the way Japan deals with their manga. The only problem is that the west have a different relationship with their comics than the asians do.

Japan isn't everywhere dude

Nobody in America would buy that

Do these number ones actually do much at this point?

see
Sales are typically doubled or more from the last issue of the last volume so yeah

Even if most of them do end up the exact same or lower than where they were before

For like a month

02/15 Spider-Gwen #1 - 278,575
03/15 Spider-Gwen #2 - 107,070 (-61.6%)
04/15 spider-Gwen #3 - 102,234 (- 4.5%)
05/15 Spider-Gwen #4 - 86,586 (-15.3%)
06/15 Spider-Gwen #5 - 67,697 (-21.8%)
07/15 ---
08/15 ---
09/15 ---
10/15 Spider-Gwen #1 - 197,103
11/15 Spider-Gwen #2 - 62,209 (-68.4%)
12/15 Spider-Gwen #3 - 54,844 (-11.8%)
01/16 Spider-Gwen #4 - 48,664 (-11.3%)
02/16 Spider-Gwen #5 - 43,796 (-10.0%)
03/16 Spider-Gwen #6 - 46,060 (+ 5.2%)

Marvel spamming tons of variants is really helping their books too.

>105 - LEGENDS OF TOMORROW ($7.99)
>03/2016: Legends of Tomorrow #1 -- 18,753

This is true. Maybe they would if that's ALL that is available?

>All of this grows out of our larger philosophy that the comic industry is moving into a seasonal model, that isn't too unlike what you see with your favorite binge-worthy TV shows,

Stopped reading there.

That was Marvel Then. This is Marvel Now.

Why wouldnt they?

Thats a rather ignorant viewpoint. Your assumptions are based on the status quo, for innovation you need to look outside the box and into new methods of doing what you already do, in this case foreign, think why its successful, and replicate it.

It provides more incentive, more action per dollar, its simple business, if the consumer feels as if they're going to get more for their money, they'll be more likely to buy it. Announcing these books at around 7.99, 220 pages (10 issues), and advertising the hell out of it on social media, on the Marvel shows, and with the movie actors could lead to a boom in the industry and revitalize it.

Digitally, you could sell the same amount, the same 10 issues in a digital "booster pack", not unlike a card game or a steam anthology pack, where you get all 10 for the same price as physical or a little less, with each available after. Have an option to buy each individually for prices that, if all bought individually, add up to more than the pack would cause, this gives an incentive to buy the pack. It means more people see your product, more people buy your product, and more people read your product, as everyone who buys the pack, or the magazine, gets all issues, and is likely then to read it all, and will get more, perhaps tell a friend.

Learn to business, friendo.

The next step would be to remove the shitty writers and artists, undo the idiotic "Anger=Sales" tactic thats clearly failing, and instill a new, better, respectable editor in chief who can handle responsibility.

Its not fucking hard.

> Bendis gets off GOTG

You know this means he'll just find a new series to start bloodsucking, right?

Yes but hopefully it'll be one that I don't care about like Jessica Jones or Inhumans.

No because the reason it works in Japan, just to put it simply, is in part because of the creator-owned model they have. The entire industry just runs different from ours.

It also works when DC does it in other nations because the material is from their backlog.

I will say that a cheapo reprint magazine would probably be a good way to draw some new fans in though.

No one buys anthos.

No one also writes a competent and complete 12-page story, but that's another deal.

Yes, it will be Jessica Jones. Isn't it great? Who gives a fuck about Jessica Jones.

We're finally getting rid of the cancer. I'm already buying the champagne. And eager for the announcement. Hopefully they'll get Ewing for the main book and Duggan for Star-Lord.

>No because the reason it works in Japan, just to put it simply, is in part because of the creator-owned model they have.

Literally irrelevant in every way.

>Thor Odinson gets a book a la Steve & Sam and Miles & Peter
How much you wanna bet he becomes evil for controversy and so Jane can stay as the "good" Thor.

It's not because it's how the entire model stays affordable.

>7.99, 220 pages

A DC TPB is around 15 dollars for 150 or so pages for reprints. Marvel is 20 for one hundred or so. In what world is 220 for 7.99 ever going to happen?

Sounds like an awful lot of hypotheticals to me

Monthly ongoings keep the lights on though. And pumping out OGNs yearly sounds neat until you take into account how many books/trades are released by EACH competing publisher per month. Switching over would probably entail having to pump out several books each month just to maintain a presence. We'd just be getting shittier comics with more pages.

Does anybody even remember or care about the OGNs Marvel put out recently?

If people aren't going to pay 4 bucks for a comic, what the fuck makes you think they'll shell out 8 for an anthology?

I like the manga like magazine idea. It would have to be low quality paper and meant to be thrown out like the Japanese ones. I think that would be the hardest part for american comic readers in the transition.

That's higher than an iron man comic usually sells by issue 8

>Does anybody even remember or care about the OGNs Marvel put out recently?

Hey I remember them. They're clogging up my local BAM's clearance rack right now.

Wasp solo

And I'll still be salty if Janet isn't at least part of the supporting cast

>It's not because it's how the entire model stays affordable.
.99, 220 pages
>A DC TPB is around 15 dollars for 150 or so pages for reprints. Marvel is 20 for one hundred or so. In what world is 220 for 7.99 ever going to happen?

A world where they understand that a lower price is an incentive for more people to buy the product thus getting even higher output.

In any event that was a hypothetical, perhaps 15 would work just as well.

>If people aren't going to pay 4 bucks for a comic, what the fuck makes you think they'll shell out 8 for an anthology?

4 for 20 pages vs. double the price for 10 times the page count.

40 for 220? Different story.

8 for 220? People buy that shit all the time its called books

1 buck for 1 floppy.

The sooner you accept it, the sooner you don't die.

>It's called books
There ain't no pictures in those.

Floppies have more of a collector-market than Trades.

While hypothetically we can say "Okay well if you cut the floppy that market will have to buy trades to read so it all balances out." But that ignores the Variantfag that's buying one of each cover, and probably a second of the main cover so he has one to read since he doesn't want to ruin his other copies. If he's reading them at all. I know plenty of people who collect floppies as an investment and never read comics.

Okay.

Whats your point?

People buy 220 pages of nothing but text for 8 bucks all the time, why wouldnt they do the same but if there were pictures?

In fact why the fuck would you ever buy a regular book at that price if you could buy something for the same price but with cool ass pictures of spider-man.

I think the greatest advantage an antho would have would be that not every chapter would have to be 22 pages.

People buy Heavy Metal and 2000AD

>A world where they understand that a lower price is an incentive for more people to buy the product thus getting even higher output.

That lower price is unfeasible. DC/Marvel would not make a profit on it.

Shit I would actually like that. Depending on the creative team of course.

>That lower price is unfeasible. DC/Marvel would not make a profit on it.

Hypothetical price probably too low yeah, but adjusting it with the page count would be too expensive.

Im admittedly a little foggy on certain details in regards to printing and paychecks, but what do normal floppies cost to produce for Marvel and DC? Cant be much if they cost 4 bucks.

Actually Image has recently started pushing for variant trades.
>ahead of the game

Listen all fuckwits, about once a month there's a thread on Sup Forums where some wannabe casual is asking how-oh-how they can ever start reading up on the characters they want to read about when (omygawd) the series is on issue #562 and right in the middle of a convoluted storyarc...? With lots of references and plot-thread continuations too!
What do I say every time: Pick up a relaunch issue #1. Or at least look for a new storyline starting-point.
That's about the only way the industry can pick up new readers when they've had as much history as they've had.
Can you really blame them for making it more easy on the newbs? That's where their next paycheck is going to come from.

jesus christ, how horrifying

Trades with different covers?

I assume the trades, like shonen jumps mangas, have covers on the inside, and the variant trade has those covers exchanged with the variants.

I'll care when they start putting out alternate endings.

I tell them to pick up an indie book tbqphwymf

I think that what Marvel is trying to do is "technically" noble (that is, trying to get actual brand-new readers to read their comics), but it's clear that they haven't dived into what the real problems are and, rather, have just offered a surface solution.

"More #1s" makes sense in that regard. But it doesn't help new readers when:
1) They don't clean the slate as much as you'd expect, and instead are more-or-less just renumberings for things in the middle of runs.
2) They're the offshoots of big events. These events will, also, have lead-ins, be 5-12 issues long themselves, and have all sorts of weird effects that often make things not worth the effort.
3) They stick to the monthly, decompressed format. (this point is for *brand-new* readers, from movies and others) It's kind of difficult to con someone out of 4-5 bucks for a flimsy story, and then expect them to keep buying month after month. A brand-new reader has nothing to prove to anybody: they'll just give up and cut their losses.

I think new #1s technically work, and certainly they HAVE worked in the past (which is why Marvel and other companies relaunch so often. But I think Marvel is being too careless with how they're doing it, and the only effect that they're seeing is the boost from incentivized variants.

Not to bring company wars into things, but I think Rebirth is one way of trying to fix some of the problems. While #1s will still (kind of) be in the middle of things, there's a much smaller reading list before you head into the series. Read the big/cheap one-shot (which is still just 3 bucks online), then read your series. And for all the big-names, they're twice a month, 3 bucks a pop for 6 dollars total at 40 pages. Not ideal, but it's better than 4 dollars for 20 pages in an entire month.

The #1 gimmick has to have diminishing returns at some point, right? People can't just keep falling for this over and over again, right?

Oh, who am I kidding. Capefags are the dumbest motherfuckers on the planet.

I tell them to grab a trade.

They have these nice numbers on the side and they're really easy to get into. I also tell them to just ignore floppies because they're a waste of time and space for new readers.

>People buy 220 pages of nothing but text for 8 bucks all the time, why wouldnt they do the same but if there were pictures?

Because that means they need to do more work to have words and pictures and so the price would be higher.

If the recent post-SW launch is any indication, it's not working as well as they hoped.

Yeah. In that big conference where Stephenson bashed big 2 for putting out too many books and too many variants, he said something about trades with variant covers.

Im talking about consumers. Aslo bullshit "more work"

It'd just be a compilation of existing comics instead of all of them being seperated.

Wouldn't half the point of such a model be to get out from under Diamond's cancerous thumb and sell in supermarkets and book stores?

We've already seen the fallout of Marvel's incessant relaunches. The #1s sell about as well as usual, but the dropoff rate is increasing at an alarming rate - usually to the point that by issue #4-6 the book will be at or below the regular amount of monthly sales pre-renumbering.

Most #1s are selling less than the pvreious #1s

Sales for a lot of books are dropping 50%+ by issue 2 or 3, which used to happen more by issues 5 or 6

Sales for a lot of books are ending up lower than where they were before by issues 3-6.

Well, it's a start.

>Sales for a lot of books are dropping 50%+ by issue 2

50%? Try 75%

Just let the sales stay stable Marvel. Relaunch every five or so years.

They do sell in bookstores.

The problem with your idea is if such a model failed the comic book stores would be dead and they'd have no where to truly go. Bookstores carry their stuff but they're not going to be enough.

Because it costs more to produce? That's why the colour reprints (DC Archive, and Marvel Masterworks) cost more than their black and white counterparts (Showcase Presents,Marvel Essential).

The sales dropping 50% by issue 2 or 3 is mostly because of variants since only #1s get 5-20+ variants like marvel's been doing lately

>Because it costs more to produce? That's why the colour reprints (DC Archive, and Marvel Masterworks) cost more than their black and white counterparts (Showcase Presents,Marvel Essential).

We're not talking about the price difference between using colors in a print or not, but taking the existing printing process and just slapping two covers on 10 of those issues you just printed. How would it cost more than what they're doing currently?

See if your tiny lizard brain can comprehend this:

When you publish a book, you pay the writer.

When you publish a comic, you pay they writer AND the artist who does the line work AND a second artist who colors the pictures in.

No shit.

Yet despite this extra work, single issues cost 3.99 per month. Is asking you to think a little that hard?

Yep, go back to the old style and only go full glossy on books with art that warrants it. Squirrel Girl doesn't need it.

You seriously can't think $4 is still cheap for a single issue right?

When it comes to book printing, you have to consider factors like the kind of paper used for the cover and the inside pages. The size of the book, the page count, and the binding method (sewn, stapled, or glued). Take into account that offset printers have to print a minimum of a thousand or so copies, and that's a lot of money in the hole. We're taking at least a few grand.

Then there's distribution, publicity/advertising, advances, royalties... There's a lot of time, money, and people involved in making sure a book finds its way to a bookstore.

I've spotted the Season Ones on the clearence shelf elsewhere. $9.99 each, still shrinkwrapped.

Space on supermarket/bookstore newsstands is expensive in its own way though. There's a reason Marvel monthlies are completely absent from the stands at Barnes and Noble.

Also, Diamond has a bookstore distribution division.

Comics used to be weekly at a similar price and pagecount so no its actually a ripoff.

>muh black and white

Nobody reads that shit because visually you lose grips on it past the first few panels.

Go read One Piece and immediately you get fucking lost as to where characters are and what they're doing because there's nothing to catch the eye and differentiate who and what from wherever.

Seriously how do you even identify a setting in a manga? Half the time there's no background or the FWOOOSH thing

I don't understand user? You don't want new readers?

What the fuck does any of that have to do with what he said? He was referring to how its compiled you dumb faggot.

When was that?

Oda is a terrific artist but he does get very cluttered with his composition. With most Manga it's pretty easy to keep track of the characters.

>Marvel trying to kill the industry again
Bastards

>the comic industry is moving into a seasonal model
This is literally because Marvel keeps relaunching every year. Holy shit just fuck off. Didn't the recent relaunch end up being detrimental to sales?

isn't that what literally a TPB/Omnibus is? you just doubled up the Issues in it.

>accessible entry point to new readers
>5 Ant-Man #1s in 2015 alone

Janet is fucking shite, mate.

I think the best move is to just not read marvel.

There's the digitally colored version.

>"Anger=Sales" tactic thats clearly failing
But they're not.

It's pretty great that Sup Forums keeps trying to believe that tho

Fuck yes it is.

Compare their sales now to just a few years ago. Hell, they used to pull 6 figure sales not too far back, now they struggle to hit 20k max. Its pathetic.

It does and doesn't.

They get a huge spike of sales at the start, and then the sales start dropping at somewhat regular rates.

However, those sales keep dropping the further in time the line goes, unlike more stable titles that mantain numbers all thorough.

That's the real reason they relaunch every couple of months.

The initial burst of sales doesn't stick and they bleed readers as they go further down the path.