Is it worth arguing with the thoroughly 'blue-pilled'?

I'm referring mostly to those aged 40+. My father, while listening to the radio, recently exclaimed, (no doubt in reference to mine and my brothers frequent claims to the contrary) 'see! How can anyone claim that the BBC is biased!'.

My brother, when voicing an anti-EU and pro-Trump viewpoint, was met with the response, 'I have been alive much longer than you have. Have some respect and do not talk about your political views around me.'

Every time in the past that I have tried to use logical, formulated arguments to prove the validity of my points I have been met with, 'I can't believe I've raised two sons who are as right wing as you are.'

Logic does not seem to work with the left, which brings me to my question. How do you argue with them if not through the medium of logical, reasonable discourse? Is it worth it? Is it even possible to convert those who have held such baselessly emotive viewpoints for several decades?

With lead. The only argument that you can use to change their state of mind.

Not worth it.

Hang your father. He's gone.

self bump (sorry)

It's not worth arguing with them until you've popped their bubble of delusion somehow. Some times there's nothing you can do to pop it, you just have to wait for life to take it's course

what exactly does he consider "right wing"? Not wanting to destroying your country's demographic?

Redpilling takes time.

You can't argue, but you can show. You can put him into situations or opportunities to expose his errors. Show, don't tell. Find out what the closest to his heart foundational truth he holds and find a way to shatter it.

No arguments, revelations.

He's cucked lad. Sorry.

I used to be a leftist Occupy attendee

It takes a specific, innocuous but of info to break through and slowly crack the ideology apart. It only works if the person is actively curious about the nature of reality and has a thirst for knowledge

For me it was IQ denialism. That absurdity led me to HBD, then NRx, then to a world of right wing ideas

It was a breath of fresh air. The deep denial and narcissism required to maintain a left wing world view is exhausting

Your father is in effect saying... He's so intelligent he doesn't want to hear an opinion.

Wow. What a douche.

You cannot argue with anyone whose opinions are based on feelings rather than hard, factual evidence. The best thing you can do is point out this fact and then leave it at that. Anyone who can be converted will reflect on this point and those who can't be converted will ignore you and thus aren't worth your time anyways.

user, the vast majority of people are cattle. If you confront them with an idea that forces them to actually think or put any effort into anything, they'll just reject you and the idea and go back to being spoon fed whatever garbage the media is pushing. It's almost hopeless.

emotion. hit them in the feels with something that will absolutely terrify them.

Don't waste your time. As long as they don't continue to reproduce they'll die off.

You could add their name to list for the upcoming purge.

>I am so tough guys I'll shoot ur frikkin dad

I find it especially odd with friends and acquaintances. They are surrounded by Islamic violence, yet still claim 'muh religion of peace'. I can't speak my mind for fear of ostracisation and isolation. The fact that those who have only recently (last 5-10 years) become aware of and interested in politics and the world are so thoroughly desperate to cling to a 'cucked' view of the world baffles me. I do not understand it, and I cannot explain it outside of putting it down to low IQ and lack of critical thought. I know this sounds almost like fedora-tipping, but it's difficult to know how else to describe it.

I was full blown lefty retard 10 years ago.

Still a diversity rules libertarian retard until Bataclan.

This basically.
The majority of people aren't emotionally redpilled. They lack the intellectual integrity to repress a negative emotional response and won't analyze their beliefs based on the truth.
Emotion first, then logic.
Most people trust their emotional reactions more than their ability to analyze information.
If it feels right it must be right.

you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves in to in the first place

the only thing that might make blue pilled cucks have to face reality is if they were forced to face it without being brainwashed or coddled/groomed by the media and government

My dad (60) said he almost cried earlier when he saw the pope in Auschwitz, "1,000,000 dead son"
Told him he's wasting his tears no one was gassed or burned there where's the evidence?
"the survivors son" tell him about the rollercoasters and the masturbation death machines "it wouldn't surprise me those evil Nazi's" what the fug.

Credit to him for raising you both, but he sounds like a fucking moron.

Parents are humans, and as humans they are flawed. Don't let his ignorance poison your relationship.

Just drop your dad off in an Islamic part of your city. He'll see how welcome he is.

Yes actually. The change won happen immediately, it never does, never will. It takes months, mostly years for people to change their views, but you have to be persistent and constantly attack them. You may lose your friendships, etc. But if you know for a fact you're right, the truth will prevail. So in the long run, it's up to you to decide if it's worth it.

it really is pretty unbelievable. the party of tolerance resorts to "wow i cant even" every time they hear something they cant refute

I could understand if people believe that the figure of 6 million is highly over estimated for demographic reasons. But straight up denying that the holocaust ever happened is fucking retarded. You can see how malnourished and hated the jews were. You could also see the vast amount of hair that was shaved off of jews, etc.

Hitler was a horrible man. He had weird ass fetishes. He loved to get peed on.

>B..but I read mein kampf, he said nothing about meh world domination
If he didn't want world domination, why would he invade Russa? Why would he become a japanese ally? Why would he declare war on America?

>B.. but the jews use teh holocaust for their own advantage. I don't like jews!

Just because they use something to their advantage, doesn't mean it didn't happen, or it's a lie. People use tragedies and other shit to push their political ideologies all the time. It doesn't mean those tragedies never happened, or they were set up and faked.

>B.. but they would have had to kill 8k a day.

Again, I could see why 6 million could have been overestimated for demographic reasons. But the most powerful nation in the world could have easily killed 8k jews a day. Especially since they've been rounded up and segregated since 1933, for 8 years, making it easier to find them. And the jews werent just killed by gassing, every denier seems to disregard that fact, and choose to be ignorant of it in order to push their false ideologies. The jews were killed by malnourishment, disease, starvation, intense labor and other horrible living conditions.

Don't try to deny the Holocaust ever completely happened, you're being fed false information from people that dislike that the jews use it for their advantage. They have no facts to support their idea that it was made up besides blind accusations that stem from ignorance.

You understand that all of Germany was starving, right? Who starves to death first on that situation?

And lice. What do you do about that?

>I've been around longer than you
>I don't want to hear any views that contradict mine
The worst kind of person. Stays circlejerking for a lifetime then claims to have a lifetime's worth of knowledge.

As echoed in this thread, don't use logic, because leftists don't think with logic, they use emotion and feelings. (Hence why the vast majority of females are overwhelmingly liberal)

If you tell a leftist "We need gun control for self protection because it's a basic right" you'll just get back "NO U DONT NEED GUNS THEY'RE FOR KILLING!!"

Invoke words like "feel" and create emotionally charged scenarios rather than numbers and logic.

So instead ask, "how would it make you feel if you were unable to defend yourself if someone was robbing you and clearly intending to kill you afterwards?"

Your response will instead be a straight denial of reality. "That will never happen" "I'd just give them the money". Press the issue. "What if." Get them emotionally charged.

"You feel okay with that? Just giving them your belongings, waiting to die? What if they already killed someone in front of you to prove they're serious? The police won't get to you in time if you try to call them."

Of course they don't feel okay with that. Cognitive dissonance will kick in. They know they are wrong but cannot admit it.

At this point they'll try to shame you or attack you in ways like -

"Why, are you saying you're going to hurt me and rob me?"

To make you look like the bad person.

Stay on point, don't be distracted by their attempts to deflect. Express and assert clearly that you are a law abiding citizen and any means of harming others are only if your own life is in immediate danger.

Create vivid scenarios of their family weeping over their raped and bloody corpse. Odds are with enough emotion they'll eventually admit you "might" be right.

If not and they keep going on about how you're Hitler and going to kill people then they're not worth time.

Wouldn't killing millions of people leave tons upon tons of bone and ash as evidence though?

No. There is no point in arguing the 'thoroughly blue pilled', because these people do not want to debate, nor actually think things through. They're literally brainwashed. Certain words and phrases trigger emotional reactions which shut down any will to concentrate or self evaluate. My own father acts like this. You have to understand that they're like children when confronted with certain concepts, so they think primitively. To these people, if you want to change their mind they interpret it as you trying to replace their mind with your own, instead of widening their minds to new possibilities. They literally interpret it as an attack, and will engage it like it is an attack. I think the best thing we can do in this culture war is to study persuasion, like Trump has.

This basically applies for everything, not just gun control.

The trick is finding the right way to make them feel emotion for the given subject you are trying to sway them on.

Rather than showing them numbers of black on black crime which they'll instantly reject, instead make them feel some negatively about violence in black culture.

"How does it make you feel when you listen to music created by black people? All that rap about being gangsters and shooting white people and raping women and killing kids, does that make you feel safe around them?"

You can't argue with them until they have been exposed to something that at the very least puts a nice crack in their worldview, something they can't deny or ignore.

That crack is what gives you an opening

I have pretty much the same experience, with the very same arguments, with my mother.
"I'm older than you hence I know better than you what is good for us".
For some reason she doesn't even seem to acknowledge anything at all when I remind her that her father, my grand-father, who was in the military and hard-line right-winger was "older than her and knew better than her what is good for us".
The denying is real, the indoctrinment is real. the certainty that they're "on the right side of history" is real.
Even though there's been some progress on some things (I convinced her being armed was a necessary thing), she won't ideologically budge at all, or change opinions on subjects like immigration, anti-racism, things like that. She firmly believes we live in an almost fascist-like regime oppressing colored people.
So if you ask me if it is worth it to argue with them?
No it's not. All you will do is hurt yourself, hurt them, and make things awkward with family. Just let it go.

Germany wasn't starving after the 1940s though.

And yes, lice, that's true, that may have been the same thing the jews were told in order to keep them calm to make their executions easier. There's a reason why the jew's hair was used in industrialized products though.

There's plenty of ashes and mass graves that prove that jews were killed and cremated. There's a reason why no Nazi has ever denied the holocaust.

>its an "alt-right" episode

>fuck jews
>uck nig nogs
>fuck achme

There I don said it

Have you tried calling him a cuck?

The better question is what do we do with such an influx of redditor blue-pilled fucks that are swarming us do to election season?

Half the threads are garbage and the ones that aren't are filled with useful idiots that makes you just want to leave this board altogether.

He is emotionally connected to being progressive. Most white Democrats are. They need to feel that they are morally superior to others. It is a psychological addiction for many.

Most people have a dense layer of reactive personality that only grows thicker with age.
Your time is better spent corrupting the youth

No since thoroughly "red-pilled" consider than anyone who doesn't share their specific views on everything to be "blue-pilled" therefore wrong.

These people have a circuit in their brain which is basically "Things that (should) be true about people" That they learned as kids and never examined. All of these "facts" aren't based on the real world but color everything they say. They all feedback onto each-other and breaking one breaks them all. Much of it comes from childhood, I suspect originally lazy babyboomers says to get their kids to behave. Any moral stance that comes from authority.
For Example:
All people are (created) Equal
Stereotyping is always wrong & immoral
Minority groups are always oppressed
Being mean is bullying
Hatred causes all evil, so don't hate
Include everyone (in the game)
All religions are paths to (((god)))
Islam is, (therefore,) a religion of peace

You hear this, one girl at your school wears a hijab and you believe it, lumping it in with the other should's you believe about people.

Method for argumentation.
Basically you need to get the person to question one of their "should's".
Personally I prefer creating a hypothetical situation where the should is broken and doesn't hold true. Especially in a pre-civilization context. (aka tribal/native) which by necessity brings in human nature and evolution as the reason we are what we are.
basing the analysis of human behavior on the fact that humans evolved from apes instead of some constructed moral psudo-philosophy about what human beings "should" be is IMHO the way to go to redpill someone fast on these types of things.

Hope this makes sense.

> have been alive much longer than you have. Have some respect and do not talk about your political views around me.

My fucking blue pilled feminazi mother said nearly the exact same thing to me when I tried to explain how it was Hillary who was the rape apologist and not Trump.

It's not worth it, but I did cut off ties to her.

>Hitler was a horrible man. He had weird ass fetishes. He loved to get peed on.
wow nice kink-shaming there bigot

get outta here

watch documentaries with him. slowly buy surely ramp it up until you turn him.
remember you are trying to convince him that everything he believes in is incorrect. Think how you would react if you found out everything in thre right wing was a lie.

indoctrination has to be slow and steady.until he can't make excuses for it any longer

>Half the threads are garbage and the ones that aren't are filled with useful idiots that makes you just want to leave this board altogether.

This.

Nu-Sup Forums in a nutshell:

>most of Sup Forums hates Jews
>Trump supports Jews
>most of Sup Forums now claim Jews dindu nuffins
>most of Sup Forums is pro-anonymity and against the government spying on innocent citizens
>Trump claims the Internet needs to be tightly regulated and monitored in order to "weed out terrorists"
>most of Sup Forums is now anti-privacy and pro patriot act

etc etc etc

This is useful idiot: the board.

Heck. WTF is wrong with the west. I even successfully redpilled my parents about Brexit and the degeneracy of the West. They are very redpilled about Islam too.

it wouldn't prove how they died

>here's a reason why no Nazi has ever denied the holocaust.
yes it's because hardly any of them were there themselves and the jews won.

Yes. My blue pilled friend gets extremely angry in an basic political discussion. He is offended because he "has spent a lot of time researching his views" ... Okay friend, then why are you mad then?

They build their political views on their view of self, which is always "uniquely enlightened saint"

Oh, and who can forget:


>Sup Forums believes homosexuality is degenerate
>A wild Milo appears!
>GAYS DINDU NUFFIN PLEASE RAPE MY ANUS MILO PLZ

Yeah, I forgot to add that there is incredible levels of projection and a lack of intellectual empathy among the bluepilled.

By denying the holocaust ever happened you are being as retarded as left wing SJWs

no

Prepare yourself to have to fight in your lifetime to save the blue-pilled retards after they - yet again - vote their own demise into office, and sit by as their government is usurped by monsters.

there's a bunch of smart liberals, there's a bunch of dumb liberals, just as there's a bunch of smart conservatives and dumb conservatives. no one political ideology claims a monopoly on intelligence. the way I see it, the reason smart people could think so differently, and see the same world so differently, is that they are raised to have very different perspectives. where one group views Islam as inherently being just a group of normal people just like them, the other views them as a group of very different people with radical views that want to convert the rest of the world to Islam. in a way, they're both correct: Muslims are in fact Human, and if you are raised to belive that all humans are genetically equal, then there's no reason for you to hate them. however, Muslims are indeed very very culturally different from Westerners, and all the polls show that many muslims are extremely radical, support Sharia law, support ISIS, etc.

in order for a smart person to change their views and ideology, they would need to have a paradigm shift. or in other words, a shift in the underlying assumptions they have about the world. like for example, when liberals (like I was) go on Sup Forums, they think that all humans are equal, that all humans are inherently the same. but after seeing the evidence, after being forced to see the evidence despite the atrocious racism, you begin to realize that humans aren't the same, not in the slightest. you have a paradigm shift. and suddenly liberalism starts sounding really dumb, and conservatism starts sounding really great. perspective is everything, paradigm shifts change everything. idk that's how I see it, sorry for the rant. hope I made sense

SPBP

He must go OP

It is painful to change deeply held beliefs. The pain of reality biting them on the ass may be preferable to giving up those beliefs.
Better to leave them in their bubble of happiness.
Not impossible to redpill anyone though.
Give me a month and I could convert Dawkins or an ISIS muzzie to Christianity, or at least shatter their faith in science and Allah.

Admitting they were wrong means siding with the type of people they ridicule and hate.

>Give me a month and I could convert Dawkins or an ISIS muzzie to Christianity, or at least shatter their faith in science
you are a deluded cunt.

no more so than arguing with the thoroughly "red-pilled"

2016 still believing in (((god)))

Kek

Centrist Libertarian here, I'm considered "right wing" by my family

Arguing is NEVER worth it with anyone, it only makes them stubbornly hold to their position even more.

Instead, you should gradually help facilitate their coming to the right conclusion - in terms that don't seem contrary to theirs.

Eventually, if the data is real/true, and can speak to their needs and desires, they will start to discard their old definitions and sympathies for ones that suit their new outlook.

The dumb people on both sides are the reason the world doesn't easily change for the better.

The loudest majority of people are split between saying "Muslims are peaceful angels" or "No they aren't. Let's nuke them."

Generally, the people with power are slightly better informed, and only differ on opinion. Although the occasional loud dumbass does tend to sneak in and ruin things.

Congratulations. You now understand what it's like trying to have a conversation with a neo-conservative who's been spoon-fed cable news their whole life.

How about we, on both sides of the political spectrum, stop the fighting for a moment. Just hold hands, smile at our newfound unity and hope for the betterment of humanity, and then toss all the baby-boomers into the ocean.

Then we can get back to our usual thing, but in a significantly less ornery way.

>Putting God in (((echo parentheses))) as if Christianity and Islam are Jewish

Could you be any more fucking deluded