Should the minimum wage be raised?

Should the minimum wage be raised?

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doesn't matter

not federally. a 15 dollar min wage in buttfuck, nebraska means a lot more than a 15 dollar min wage in NYC

Yeah so the cost of everything else goes up and we'll be at the equivalent quality of life as we were at the previous minimum wage, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that, and the one before that.

As a small business owner . I don't know how I can do warehousing in CA. They want me to pay $15 / hour so that someone can pack boxes for me. I realize $10 ain't shit but I'm only asking you to put the part in the box and label it.

create some jobs first

Explain?

Here watch this
youtube.com/watch?v=Jku0bQ9VVGI

When people have to be paid 2x more, everyone doubles their prices to match it

>Democrats raise minimum wage
>Print an ungodly amount of money
No one benefits except exporters. Everything else including the average American and the value of the dollar itself is crippled.

If it worked like that, all wage raises would be for nothing, which is obviously not the case.

The true issue is that market interventions can only postpone the structural problems - the lack of jobs that allow to make a decent living.

Drumph's positions:
> wages should be lower
> you're fired

Hilary's positions
> wages should be higher
> you're hired

Who do you think would be the better candidate?

get a robot.

Also, Trump has called for raising the minimum wage to $10/hour.

Is this a good compromise?

wsj.com/articles/donald-trump-calls-for-10-hourly-minimum-wage-breaks-from-gop-position-1469647220

Hmm... Wow. I am a #HillShill now

Honestly I think Trump winning would actually cause a prolonged Brexit style recession in the markets. He is a wildcard.

>not federally. a 15 dollar min wage in buttfuck, nebraska means a lot more than a 15 dollar min wage in NYC
lol
why would you think that?

Nebraska has different exchange rates than New York. One Nebraska dollar can be exchanged for two American dollars.

Uh, no...

TRUMP:
“I would like to raise it to at least $10,” he said during a press conference on Wednesday. He also went on to say that “states should really call the shots” and that if he is elected in November, $10 will be “peanuts” compared to what people will be able to earn at the jobs created during his presidency.

a fucking leaf

You buy a box of shit. It's price consists of two things:
The salary of the guy who spent 15 mins of his work taking the shit.
The salary of the guy who spent 3 minutes packing it.

If you double their salary, the box of shit will have twice the price. Price level in general is very, very largely affected by the wage level.

Example: a main dish will cost you:
x euros in a super 3rd world country
3 x euros in eastern europe
6 x euros in western europe

because the guys who made it have higher wages.

Hillary's positions
>wages should be higher
Employer's positions
>you're fired

Pic related: the Trump campaign.

>If you double their salary, the box of shit will have twice the price

Huh, I always thought the cost of materials factored into price somehow.

Dumbass

well the poster seemed missing the point that the price level is connected to the cost of labour, and as a result, without increasing efficiency, or importing products made with cheap foreign labour, raising salaries will automatically raise prices

but educate me please

>Pic related: the Trump campaign.
A masterpiece?

I don't disagree, but:

>wages go up
>labor becomes more expansive
>businesses invest in labor-saving capital
>demand for labor in industries producing capital goods
>unemployment isn't affected that much

>You own a small warehouse with 7 workers and just break even each month
>You now have to pay them twice as much
But you can just invest in labour saving capital right?

Gov regulation wipes small businesses off the fucking map

Granted small businesses are still fucked. I was only talking about the macro level.

Honestly small business are fucked in every scenario, even without much regulation.

>People complain in Germany about minimum wage
>MAH FREE MARKET
>MAH SUPPLY AND DEMAND
>We get Minimum wage
>Nobody loses jobs
>Germany has the lowest unemployment since 1990

Like always, people who didnt even have a high school degree talking about thigs they dont understand

Supply and Demand is in some cases not working thats a fact

no, people should be paid depending on how hard there job is.

>people start their carreers on minimum wage
if you're starting on minimum wage you will be staying on minimum wage

So some nigger shoveling coal should be paid more than some executive faggot?

This should be a state issue since living costs and local economics dictate what a good wage should be, so yes and no depending.

Generally the minimum wage should be set by the market since setting it up artificially means less jobs and higher business costs.

This is what the $15 an hour crowd don't get. They will make more unemployment, causing an increase in taxes to subsidize the unemployed, causing workers and businesses to have less savings, meaning less investment in the economy and higher business costs which translates to higher living costs. Which screws over the low level working class and unemployed even more.

These people have no single reasonable concept of economics, and they will destroy themselves the people they want to help and those having to support them if they get their way. They are a cancer of democracy and the symptom like end of republics throughout history.

No. The opposite, in fact.
There's a lot of unemployment, at least in Europe, and that unemployment is frighteningly often long-term.

Minimum wage should be slashed, hard, and unemployment benefits too, until there's more or less only short-term unemployment, and not too much of that either.

(I might also want to be able to hire a maid, full-time)

Devoid of any real hardship

the fuck are you talking about?

Empty promise of cornucopia.

don't need to raise the min wage, just offer a government job guarantee at a specific salary (make people work instead of handouts) - anyone who wants to pay below that is free to do so, but they probably can't expect to have all that many employees

This.

I'm from a small town, about 7000 people, if I made $15 an hour there I could live like a god. Pretty sure all the small mom and pop stores would shut down though. Go walmart?

this was my exact first thought:
>businesses invest in labor-saving capital
true, but thus entry barrier is increased and weakens competition

Also, at many places, human effort is already very streamlined and optimized, think of the workflow in a fast food chain


On the other hand, to contradict myself:
People on minimum wage have very small amount of money they cand spend freely, or save. Assuming that a large portion of extra money will be spent right away -> profit margins get lower due to higher cost of labour, but volumes get larger which poses a countereffect

Bottom line:
>Fuck knows what would happen

Cost of living.

Differs massively by city.

Walmart actually like raising the minimum wage so it can drown out other businesses unable to compete. That's also why they pay pretty well considering the entry level jobs they have. They want to buy out all the good labor in an area if possible and take the best they can so other stores are stuck with more inexperienced or trouble labor.

we made a standard minimum wage here in Australia, and it strengthened our middle class and lowered our unemployment rate as the now stronger middle class was hiring more services and buying more goods.

the only major downside was that uni fees went up and out lower class is now very poor.

basically if you cant work a cash register you are fucked.

we also dont have a tipping culture.
that died with people actually getting paid well (enough) for good services.

enough to meet inflation I guess, maybe a little bit more

>basically if you cant work a cash register you are fucked.
Who the hell can't do that? It's not even basic math, just pressing buttons.

>that died with people actually getting paid well (enough) for good services.
That's actually not very good imo.

The minimum wage has almost no effect, since most people are paid well above it. And those who do not contribute little to the overall economic output.

Our "low" unemployment (it is still 7,5% if you count underemployed) is due to the favorable structure of the Eurozone.

more people will purchase from you now they have buying power,
raising the minimum wage also creates more connections within a society.
its good if the people recieving a higher wage use their dollars within the country that they earned it from, but horrible if they choose to buy cheaper from overseas markets

Incentivize new hiring and more efforts to lower sky high cost of living in certain parts of the country:

-tax reductions if you have X workers making at least Y monies. And don't half ass it so you get people doing cheeky cunt "ok since you say all my workers have to have health insurance if they are full time I'll make them work 29 hours :^)". Make sure they can't game it and it's a no bullshit "your lowest paid employee has to make at least Y monies".

-Work on bringing down astronomic housing/apartment prices in San Fran and NYC and other major centers. You can do either carrot or stick with the landlords.

-Adjust it on a state by state/city by city basis rather than a one size fits all. Added bonus is businesses now have incentive to move some of their employment to cheaper cost of living states so they can pay their workers less (But 15 bucks an hour is a princely sum in literally who south or midwest while it's not even peasant money in NYC)

I don't give as much of a shit about poor wages in NYC or San-Fran because that treats the symptom and not the disease of out of pace cost of living. And judging from my step-sister's wish to have lived in NYC but barely being able to when she tried to and so having to move back to delaware, when it comes to younger people who are able to move they can fucking move. If wishes were fishes we'd all be fishermen.

Trump has literally criticized American workers for making too much money.

He says whatever he wants because he knows his voters don't care.

Shouldn't exist

Is 30 hours considered full time in the US?

yea, its good for people who are willing to actually work, but if you were a sponge to begin with you now have absolutely no chance of getting a job.
its great.
make it worth peoples time to work and they will, but a bum will always remain one.
kill all doll payouts and strengthen the state run medicare plan.

since no matter what position you have if someone you love gets cancer there is no way you can pay for that shit (unless you are getting 150k plus a year) which not everyone will have due to the need for jobs that demand that amount of money for the workload.

basically dont pay doll but put that percent of saved revenue into public health whilst raising the minimum wage to something decent and you will see less shitfucks and more happy people that still only earn the bare minimum.

also tipping culture is fucked because im way more likely to tip a bar tender with big tits than i am a dude getting me my beer. tipping culture favours certain people over others, and the places that do receive tips in australia normally split the tips over the entire staff, and it basically equals to an extra 50 cents an hour, which is pointless.

>This should be a state issue since living costs and local economics dictate what a good wage should be, so yes and no depending.
Except those states would get in a war over who can lower wages fast enough to "attract jobs" and completely defeat the purpose of having a minimum wage altogether.

In any case, this economy is suffering from a lack of money supply and consumer confidence. This would solve both of those problems, just as it has every other time it's been increased. $15 is an end goal; you don't just jump to it right away - that would be too much of a shock to businesses.

40

I wasn't sure if it was 29 or 39 that they jewed workers to in order to avoid paying the full time medical insurance business. It may have been 40 hours is full time but 30 hours was randomly chosen by Obama.

Without even dealing with the debate of obamacare being good or bad I can't believe the idiots didn't consider that obvious fucking workaround when writing the bill.

hilary
>wages should be higher
>you're fired
>enjoy looking for a job forever

trump
>wages should be lower
>you're hired
>enjoy never moving past 3 bucks per hour forever

This is literally what happens when the people who write (and lobby) bills never have any work experience in the private sector.

>democrats raise the minimum wage
>Companys cant afford to employ most young people anymore
>young people forced onto welfare, and thereby forced to perpetually vote democrat
Literally perfection.

The purpose of a minimum wage is to make laborers able to invest savings into the economy to grow it at every level. States wouldn't be able to go into a wage war the way you think because it would cause certain states to see economic down turn.

And the minimum wage needs to be set in place of micro economies not macro ones as huge as the US. Living costs differ and need to be in sync with minimum wages in the locality of differing economies otherwise we will see major damages in places that aren't like other economies like the midwest in comparison to the California costs.

You're seeing way to small a picture to see why federal minimum wages are retarded to implement.

>If it worked like that, all wage raises would be for nothing, which is obviously not the case.
No, wage increases because of increased productivity work. Wage increases for the sake of wage increases don't.

Thinking in terms of

>"Should the minimum wage be raised"

is retard tier thinking.

The actual question should be: WHY should the minimum wage be set the way it is? This depends on what kinds of industries your country can compete at, what's it's natural resources, it's labor supply both skilled and unskilled, it's infrastructure, as well as it's neighbors.

Case in point, Canada can have a much higher minimum wage than America, because it's neighbors also have relatively high minimum wages, meaning that it's difficult to move labor intensive work just across the border.

America sets it's minimum wage to 300 percent the mexican minimum, and the result is a massive inflow of black market labor, and any company that can do so will move it's production across the border.

An increase in the labor pool is not necessarily a good or bad thing, mind you. It depends on your needs and economy.

Furthermore, Setting the minimum wage based on cost of living is ALSO retard tier thinking, because cost of living is strongly and directly related to minimum wage.

That practice existed before obamacare. Obamacare just made it a lot more cost effective, and therefore more common.

Minimum wage should be abolished.

Cost of living varies drastically in different parts of the country and even within different parts of the state.

That video game might always cost $50, that TV might always cost $800. But while a gallon of gas might cost $2.80/gal in the rich suburbs of NY ($.74/L) it'll only be 1.62/gal ($.42/L) in Birmingham Alabama. Same with groceries, same with rent.